An example of asking "can I metal detect?"

[Tom_in_CA]

I read a story of a lady trying to sue a retail store. A retail store had run an ad in the newspaper that the first 100 persons to come into the store, on a particular day, would get concert tickets to some upcoming popular concert (it was some sort of radio station giveaway gimmick promotion thing). So a lady called the store, and asked if it was ok if she stakes out a spot there, on the sidewalk, in front of the store, the night before. The store told her something to the effect of:

"no, we don't allow camping or staking out spots, etc... The event starts tomorrow, not tonight".

So the next morning, the lady got there exactly the opening time of the store .... ONLY to see that an entire line of people were already there. And it was quite evident, that the persons at the head of the line had indeed been there many hours (if not over the entire night), so they could be the first in-line when the store opened. As evidenced by their lawn chairs, etc.... So the lady complained that she had specifically called ahead, and been told she couldn't do that. The store had nothing really to tell her, ... except that they can't stop what people do, on their own accord. This made no sense to the lady, because it sounded like a direct contradiction to what she was told. So she got no concert ticket, and was threatening some sort of legal action against the radio station or store or something.

Hmmm, is anyone else seeing the moral of this story? It kinda reminds me of well-intentioned md'rs, who go waltzing into city halls, park's depts, school offices, etc... asking "can I metal detect?" While it *sounds* like the logical thing to do (afterall, you can't be too safe), yet you can get odd-ball answers, that may or may not even apply, or be applicable, or no one may ever have cared or noticed (till you asked).

 

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[NJcigarman]

Right on good post

 

[63bkpkr]

Excellent example!

 

[Normsel]

That was a great post. That's Just like the city workers that kick you out of parks for metal detecting when in fact there is no ordinance against it. That happened to me and I apologized and left only to be told by a gentleman later there was no ordinance or law against metal detecting in that city. I have never been back to that small town. I don't want to irritate anyone and hopefully someone local will be able to hunt with no problems.

 

[Scooby903]

It's easier to ask for forgiveness than beg for permission

 

[cudamark]

Tom's example is the perfect lesson in why asking can be a problem.....not only for the one seeking information, but also the mindset of the one being asked. Suppose the store told her, "sure, go ahead and camp out" and then the lady gets hurt, mugged, or worse. Then the lady would be suing yet again but for different reasons and store might actually be liable even though it's technically a public place with no laws against "standing" in line. But since there ARE laws against loitering or camping, those could be applied here if anyone cared to enforce it. The moral?....if you're not doing any harm and there is no hard and fast rule against your activity, quit asking so many fool questions from people who probably don't care anyway. We got to stop allowing the government to run every facet of our lives.

 

[cudamark]

That was a great post. That's Just like the city workers that kick you out of parks for metal detecting when in fact there is no ordinance against it. That happened to me and I apologized and left only to be told by a gentleman later there was no ordinance or law against metal detecting in that city. I have never been back to that small town. I don't want to irritate anyone and hopefully someone local will be able to hunt with no problems.

Some friends and I had that problem at a local old park too. The park and rec guy kept telling us we had to quit detecting or leave the park even though we couldn't find (and he wouldn't state) any laws against it except for the typical "you can't dig or disturb anything" nonsense you get in all city rule books. Turns out, the guy likes to detect too and wanted the park to himself! We caught him one time doing it (and on camera to boot!). With that ace in the hole evidence in our pocket, we had no problems with that knucklehead after that!

 

[sandy shoes]

if i don't see a sign saying no MD allowed i do it .

 

[luvsdux]

I'm with sandy shoes, if I don't see a sign saying not allowed I also do it. Private property, of course is a different matter. I always try to bet permission then.
luvsdux

 

[BC1969]

I always try and ask first, just because there is no sign stating no metal detecting, does not mean you can, there is no sign out in front of walmart saying I can't do naked jumping jacks in the parking lot, but try it and see what happens lol.
I can't tell you how many times in the last 30 years somebody be it a cop/park ranger/parks supervisor/or just a DNR officer, tell me, that ignorance of the law is no excuse...thats all I have to say about that.

Mike

 

[Treasure_Hunter]

I always try and ask first, just because there is no sign stating no metal detecting, does not mean you can, there is no sign out in front of walmart saying I can't do naked jumping jacks in the parking lot, but try it and see what happens lol.
I can't tell you how many times in the last 30 years somebody be it a cop/park ranger/parks supervisor/or just a DNR officer, tell me, that ignorance of the law is no excuse...thats all I have to say about that.

Mike

Do you also ask if you can throw a Frisbee, play a game of touch football, throw a stick for your dog to play with, play tag with your kids, sit on the grass and have a picnic or any of a dozen other things at a park.....?

Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk 2

 

[BC1969]

Nope I sure Don't Treasure Hunter. And I should NOT have to ask, but none of those things, under normal circumstances destroy or make huge holes all over the place, Which saddly is becoming the norm, just the other day I spotted a guy detecting in a local park, went walking towards him to see if he found any goodies, watching him swing it as I went, and what do you know, I stepped into a freshly dug coil sized crater, and fell flat on my face, yeah I read him the riot act alright, because of people like him, over the last 30 years or so, its the reason I have to wonder if I need permission to hunt a area, I sure miss the days when I could detect just about anywhere, but the lazy/couldnt care less crowd has ruined that.

Mike

 

[Treasure_Hunter]

Playing football damages the grass and ground as you fall down as does a dog running and many other activites you do at a park.........

Point is how do you know it isnt against the law to do those things at a park just because there are no signs...? I have detected many parks, never once called and asked permission, had park personel watch me as I recover targets and never said a word to me.... I do my own research online, go to the city and county park websites and read their rules, if they say nothing about prohibiting detecting I detect, I do not call some one and ask..........

 

[cudamark]

I always try and ask first, just because there is no sign stating no metal detecting, does not mean you can, there is no sign out in front of walmart saying I can't do naked jumping jacks in the parking lot, but try it and see what happens lol.
I can't tell you how many times in the last 30 years somebody be it a cop/park ranger/parks supervisor/or just a DNR officer, tell me, that ignorance of the law is no excuse...thats all I have to say about that.

Mike

Your examples are not the same thing. There ARE laws against public nudity and it's written down in official books. Signs posted at a park are for the most common activities. They can't make a sign for every single thing. Asking park employees or cops is not the last word either. Many of them don't know the law either but are willing to throw their weight around according to their own egos and whims, so look it up yourself. People who LEAVE holes or cause gross destruction deserve to be banned, ticketed, publicly flogged, or all three, but, leave the rest of us who don't abuse the situation, alone. It doesn't help matters any that the detector programs on tv show guys using picks, shovels, and mattocks to make a recovery. Newbies think they can use those in a park too.

 

[jeff of pa]

when it comes to "Public" places, The way I look at it,
Metal detectors are not these New Fangled items people see
& wonder "What The Heck is he Doing ?"

It is also Very hard to find "Public" places where detectors
have Not been used in the last 50 + years.

IF there had been a legit problem, Signs should have been erected.

They can always put up a Sign

Public Park STAY OUT !

 

[chip12977]

I always try and ask first, just because there is no sign stating no metal detecting, does not mean you can, there is no sign out in front of walmart saying I can't do naked jumping jacks in the parking lot, but try it and see what happens lol.
I can't tell you how many times in the last 30 years somebody be it a cop/park ranger/parks supervisor/or just a DNR officer, tell me, that ignorance of the law is no excuse...thats all I have to say about that.

Mike

Big difference in doing naked jumping jax and metal detecting.

State parks where I live allow metal detecting with a permit, but state parks are different than your everyday run of the mill parks in your neighborhood, those I wouldn't ask permission to hunt.

 

[BC1969]

Well I was just stating my opinion, all of you make valid points, and I respect your opinions in that matter, was not looking to start an argument, just adding my thoughts.
There are a lot of different reasons I try to ask if detecting is allowed or not, least of which is whether or not, I could get into trouble.
I really love talking to people, and in doing so, going and asking about policy at say public parks offices and such, has opened many doors for me by curious people about the hobby. Some of the best finds I have ever had came this way, by being asked if I could find somebody's lost childhood toy or what not, that opened even more doors to me.
I don't know about the rest of you, but when somebody invites me to come search their property with a beautiful Victorian mansion sitting on it, I don't hesitate to accept their offer.
Then again, asking HAS closed doors to me as well, when I could have just walked in and started swinging my coil.
Guess it comes down to damned if you do or damned if you don't.

Mike

 

[Nickleanddime]

If there isn't a sign directly stating something is illegal then I do it. There are way to many laws and laws on laws to try and keep track of them. I stick to the obvious ones like, no stealing no theft stuff like that. I guess you could call them the commandments. But to me it's entrapment to bust you on something that isn't posted, how are you suppose to know?

As far as the lady during them for the tickets, yes she should. She was told that it wasnt allowed so anyone that is there before opening is loitering and breaking the law and what the store set as a rule. So therefore they should have been disqualified for the tickets. I know the early bird gets the worm, but rules are rules if the store told one no then all should be no. But I wish her good luck cause the suit won't stick, the store will deny it.

 

[chip12977]

*Dead horse* keep kicking*

I don't know how many if these thread's, topics I have read/commented on, the guys/gals that ask permission when not needed will always do so no matter what is said here, all we can do is hope that the park we were detecting yesterday doesn't have a no detecting sign up today from someone asking the wrong person. I personally wouldn't ask permission to hunt a public park, but that's me, so lets stop kicking the dead horse and move onto better things, or not.

 

[Tom_in_CA]

Nope I sure Don't Treasure Hunter. And I should NOT have to ask, but none of those things, under normal circumstances destroy or make huge holes all over the place, Which saddly is becoming the norm, just the other day I spotted a guy detecting in a local park, went walking towards him to see if he found any goodies, watching him swing it as I went, and what do you know, I stepped into a freshly dug coil sized crater, and fell flat on my face, yeah I read him the riot act alright, because of people like him, over the last 30 years or so, its the reason I have to wonder if I need permission to hunt a area, I sure miss the days when I could detect just about anywhere, but the lazy/couldnt care less crowd has ruined that.

Mike

Mike, mike, mike, .... first, thanx for chiming in with balanced comment. Yes, this is all just anyone's opinion for input. That's what forums are for afterall. Ok, to comment on your input if I may:

I think the problem is in your definitions of metal detecting, from the git-go. Ie.: your "premises". You say this:

" .........none of those things, under normal circumstances destroy or make huge holes all over the place..."

That indicates to me, that you presume metal detecting to "normally destroy and make huge holes all over the place". Right? Well why? Why is this your automatic definition that "md'ing = destruction and mayhem"? If that were true, then YES, ask away, by all means. But no, since when is that a "given" definition? If you are "leaving huge holes all over the place", then may I humbly suggest, on behalf of the entire forum, that you kindly repeat md'ing target recovery class 101. Because no, I, and most others here, do not go "making huge holes and destroying things".

Is that to say that some busy-body lookie-lou might not THINK you are about to "leave holes" ? No. Of course not. But since when do you are I let someone else's misconceptions rule your life? Since when is it my obligation to make everyone love my chosen hobby, and "please everyone"? It's simply impossible. I even had a lady tell me my detector bothered her dog once! (I think she thought it emitted a sound that only dogs heard or something). Am I under an obligation to satisfy her too? No, on the contrary, you and I avoid such individuals. For pete's sake can't you go at lower traffic times and avoid such mis-informed individuals?

Yes, the "sign" may not contain every single rule in that city. Granted. (nudity, etc..). Fine then, go to city hall or their website which often lists the entire city code, and see if there's anything there that says no md'ing. If not, then presto, it's not prohibited. Because by asking "can I metal detect", you risk getting a "no", when nothing really says that, and perhaps no one might ever have cared or noticed (till you asked). And worse yet, I've actually seen where laws/rules (or "policies" to be included in the FAQs) get INSTITUTED to say no md'ing. Gee, it was a "good thing those people asked" , right? All I can say is, I hope no one goes asking around my area, because things are just fine, so long as we use due-discretion, and don't "stick out like sore thumbs begging for scrutiny or sanction". Think of it like nose-picking: Not necessarily illegal, yet .... sheesk, you ... uh .... still use a little discretion in your timing so as not to offend people, right? Same for md'ing: You're never going to get the red carpets rolled out for you, and the entire world to love and approve of you. Sorry.