17 Tons of gold in New Mexico

[audigger53]

Sorry I wasn't.<G>
I haven't been here that much since Marc changed the forum.
My fault, I know.
Seriously, grind up the gold, put the dust into 16 Oz. Coke or Pepsi bottles and start making a 'new' fence.
Using a powered post hole digger, go down an extra 12 inches every X number of posts. After all are drilled with the auger, come back at night and lower/drop a bottle in each of the "deep" holes. Fill in enough of the dirt to cover the bottle. The next day, put in all the fence posts.
When you "need money", dig down beside the correct post(s), and then take a trip out west. Arizona, Colorado, New Mexico, any of the Public Use Land States and go camping in the National Forset. Not National Park, but Forest. Dig a hole, pour your bottle into the hole, dig it out and go to the refinery.
You have to declare the State and County for taxes. You do not have to show a valid claim. A claim is to protect you from someone else stealing your mineral deposit(s).
There are places where what I described actually occured. All the gold dust was concentrated in a single pocket. They were called "Glory Holes". Once the gold was removed, there was nothing else there.
You just found a "Glory Hole" and cashed it in.
A "honest" refinery will charge you roughly 3% for refining it and 3% to purchse it from you. The 6% fee is "part of doing business" in the selling of gold. Some refinerys wanted up tp 10% to refine it. To heck with them.<G>
Check around on the Net and pick one that is fairly close to you and call them.
One bottle is about 277 Oz.s<G>

 

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[Oroblanco]

Greetings Roadquest, Roger, Gollum and everyone,
Sure wish I had read this earlier! What a great deal of interesting details and theories!

Roger I find your theories of visits in ancient times by Hebrews and Phoenicians very intriguing. (I am currently working on a book which is based on this very idea.) I am un-aware of the reports of the gold mask and sandal found in a cave however. There is good reason to believe it true however, because we already know of a site in New Mexico (near Los Lunas, the famous “Dekalogue” thought by some to be an ancient Hebrew inscription of the Ten Commandments, or alternatively a record of a visit by Phoenicians) and in any case it could well have been both, since under the United Monarchy of Israel, (kings Saul, David and Solomon) the most powerful state in Phoenicia, Tyre, was very closely allied with Israel and they entered into joint ventures such as the voyages to “mythical” Ophir and Tarshish. That much being said, without being able to at least see a photo or even a sketch of the artifacts found, it is not possible to say with any degree of certainty that the gold mask and sandal are Hebrew, Phoenician, Aztec, Mayan etc. There are a number of beautiful gold masks produced by Amerindian cultures now in museums, so simply being a gold mask is not a strong clue that it must be from a Mediterranean culture. It would not surprise me in the least if the finds were to prove to be Hebrew or Phoenician however.

I do disagree with your description of Custer’s expedition into the Black Hills in 1874 however. The mission was sent in by order of the federal government, and yes I feel very much the same way about this most powerful and dangerous government, but the geological exploration undertaken during the expedition was very limited in scope and size. The resulting discovery of gold there led to a “rush” of major proportions with desperate efforts on the part of the same federal government to purchase the hills, and thus avoid a war with the Sioux and Cheyennes. During Custer’s 1874 expedition however, there were NO attacks on innocent women and children, in fact the only Indians spotted by any members of the expedition (besides the Crow and Pawnee scouts who accompanied them) were a few individuals far off on the horizon and NO encounters, hostile or otherwise took place.

There is little doubt that Custer’s men did indeed kill some innocent women and children, in the assault on the Southern Cheyenne village of Black Kettle on the Washita river on November 27th 1868, but in such a battle many of these casualties may well have been un-intentional, unlike the attack earlier on the same Black Kettle by Col. Chivington and his “Colorado Volunteers” who took special pleasures in killing off the women and children, and mutilating their corpses. However it is even questionable how “innocent” all of the women and children might be too, since there are a number of reports from this battle on the Washita that women AND young boys were in fact taking up arms and fighting to defend themselves – it is hard to be condemning of soldiers forced to kill even a woman or young boy who was in the act of firing an arrow at them.

(I lived for years near the Black Hills and used to hunt and prospect in the Bighorns, and have been to the Custer battlefield a number of times. I did a good deal of research on the subject, and yes there is even a treasure involved here – a tale of two Indian warriors who gathered up wads of the paper money they knew that the soldiers valued, then finding a steep canyon wall with a crack in it, standing on top of a pony’s back, stuffed the paper money into the crack far back out of sight. They supposedly intended to return for it when the war was over, but never did.)

It is politically-correct (and hugely popular) today to attack and denigrate poor old George Custer, with Hollywood turning out some highly biased and wildly inaccurate movies depicting him as a madman, coward and a fool – yet in truth he was a courageous man who died fighting for his country, and deserves our respect if only for that fact – let alone the fact that he made a strong contribution to winning the Civil War and ending that terrible conflict. A child-murderer? I find no support in the records for that accusation to be laid at his feet. Now Chivington is quite another matter!

What has this to do with seventeen tons of gold hidden in New Mexico? Not much! Back to the subject matter this thread is based on – the 17 tons of our favorite metal!

I did have that episode 191 of Unsolved Mysteries on an old VHS tape, which may or may not have made the trip here when we moved last year. Worse, some of the old tapes may have melted in the heat, even though they were in storage (found one box that this happened already) so I do not want to promise you I can get it, but I will make an effort to find it. I remember it well, it was very interesting and the flights were (according to that program) seventeen in number, one ton of gold being the maximum load. Finding where it was hidden is a major search with few clues.

Even worse, if what you say is correct (and I have reason to think so) then the gold got moved! This is the major reason why I generally search for old lost mines instead of buried treasures, as a buried treasure can have been dug up and recovered or simply moved to a new hiding spot, while a mine cannot move or be “taken” away. Just an opinion here, but finding this will require more luck than calculation, and a great deal of that luck too. I would not give up on it though, until you know for a fact that it has been recovered either by you or someone else, and don’t just take someone’s word for it.

Well the monsoon let up and it is still daylight, so I have to get off my butt and get some work done - very interesting discussion mi amigos, I look forward to reading more of your posts.

Oroblanco

"Recognize what is in your sight, and that which is hidden from you will become plain to you . For there is nothing hidden which will not become manifest." Gospel of Thomas 5

 

[boogeyman]

I'm probably a little late on this, but I've always been a little skeptical on the subject of dowsing until I was in Colorado. We had a pothole crew trying to find 2 pipes that were supposed to cross the road. Their pipe locator and water jets didn't find anything, and the locator companies two "best" locators couldn't find em. One of the old foremen told everyone to hang on. He went up to the contractors shack and returned with two L rods he cut from coat hanger wire. He found both pipes (within 3") and was almost on the money on the depth. He also found a phone cable that the locators and QWest didn't have a record of. Sure had a lot of us scratching our heads. Guess that blew part of my skeptical side all to h**l! I guess if you haven't seen it in action in our "If I can't touch it and feel it, it ain't so" world you can't believe it works.

On another note. I've heard there was supposed to be another stash of bars around the Cable Claims. Does anyone know if this is correct, or if it has already been located?

 

[Springfield]

Oro, I for one am interested in your book - is it anywhere near completion? Please keep us posted - I'd like to get a copy when it's available. Ancient contact by the northern African/Mediteraneans in North America is a quite plausible theory, IMO. If I'm not mistaken, there are a number of southwestern US cultural anomalies that might be residual - the Los Lunas decalog stone, other carvings, some Native American language similarities, Mimbres art symbols, etc. Of course, Roger's Ophir-in-North America claims are also intriguing to say the least. I've had a couple long discussions with him about the idea, which is hard to dismiss out of hand. This theory even provides some answers for the 'KGC' embracers who are constantly asking, "Who? Why? Where? and When?"

Custer? Megalomaniac. I'll defer to George Crook's opinion of him - they fought together in the CW and in MT.

17 Tons of Gold in NM? This pulp fiction story as told makes no sense to me. Beware of well-known TH stories. If you read about a lost mine/hidden treasure in a book, magazine or online, it's likely to be intentional or unintentional disinformation or some sort of coded message for those who can see (especially the old contemporary newspaper articles). Of course, these stories get a lot of people out in the hills enjoying nature and having adventures to remember, and this is a good thing in itself. I prefer the little-known legends whose details are guarded by a select few locals and otherwise unknown by the public. If you are seeking recovery of valuables, these types of projects provide much better odds of success if the story is true to begin with.

I see you're in Cochise County, AZ. I remember a job we had staking out silver claims in the Pedragosa Mountains north of Douglas in the 1970's. We saw some pretty strange things in and above those hills. Must have been black budget military activity IMO, even though MUFON didn't think so at the time.

 

[Oroblanco]

Greetings Springield and everyone,
Thank you for the kind words and for your interest, I hope to be finished soon with that book project and will be happy to let you know when it is to be released by the publishers. I did contribute a piece to a book that is on the market now, an anthology edited by Preston Peet titled Underground, The Disinformation Guide to Ancient Civilizations &c. you can find a copy on Amazon or Barnes & Noble or in most libraries - my own small contribution is titled The Secret Land, but there are articles included by many famous and popular authors including Erik von Daniken, Graham Hancock, Andrew Collins, Robert Schoch and others. I think it is a fascinating read (in spite of my own bit) with many interesting theories propounded, though some are pretty far out there. Enough self-publicizing! There is a bit more on the same subject (though a totally un-related thread) elsewhere on this forum, at:http://forum.treasurenet.com/index.php/topic,36420.msg325993

As to Custer, a great deal of information and official records are available on this most controversial of US military leaders - all sorts of points of view from those who knew him well, from high praise (winning medals etc) to terrible accusations (like having an affair with a black servant) all apparently with a particular bias. The truth lies somewhere in between all the claims, and we are all entitled to an opinion on him (most everyone has an opinion on him) but based only on the fact that he died fighting for his country counts for something in my opinion.

You are welcome to dismiss any or all of the old tales of lost treasure like the 17 tons of gold, but if you do I hope you have arrived at this conclusion based on having researched the matter thoroughly. I never take stories or claims at face value without doing research on the background of the story or claim, and back when I first started investigating I was amazed at how many of these old tales are TRUE. The facts of where the location of the treasure is, are most often garbled and incorrect - though the deliberate mis-leads are less frequent than you might expect. The incidences in which I found deliberate lies about the true location of a lost treasure or mine almost always occur when someone has FOUND it and recovered it, is working the mine, or has found it and has not yet had a chance to recover it - they have good reason to put out lies to mislead others, in order to protect their interests. So by all means, you are welcome to disbelieve the story of the 17 tons, that makes for one less THer that we (who may be out hunting for it) have to compete with, but I do hope your choice to disbelieve is because you have thoroughly examined the evidence. In this particular case, there are the letters of negotiation undertaken with the US government, that you can get copies of - if there were no other supporting evidence, we must wonder why these owners of the gold, would bother to go to the length of trying to negotiate with the government in a way to save themselves from prosecution for possession of imaginary gold. That does not make sense. Besides, it is a good habit to get into, if one is serious about hunting for lost treasures or lost mines, to always research the matter as thoroughly as you can so as to better increase your chances of ever finding any without trusting wholly to luck. We need only look at a sample of the successful treasure hunters who chose to believe those old tales and literally “struck it” such as the fabulous treasure ship Maravilla, found by Fred Marx (if my swiss-cheese memory is correct) the world famous Atocha, found by the most famous treasure hunter of all Mel Fisher, which ship produced over $400 MILLION before unhappily Mel passed on (his son and company continue to reap rewards from this seemingly boundless treasure) or the long lost mines like Tayopa, found by my good friend Joseph Curry, or the Breyfogle, which is today known as the Amargosa, to see that it can pay you off BIG time to follow up on even the most famous of lost treasures and lost mines.

Dang, never heard of UFO sightings in the Pedragosas! I live in the Sulphur hills so the Pedragosas are not within sight, but I would sure like to hear about what you saw! Whether US secret test aircraft or little green men from Mars, makes little difference to me, these mysteries are just plain intriguing to me - and here too we have people with all kinds of opinions on the phenomenon, and many of these said opinions are held, without the person having done any investigating of the subject whatsoever - simply taking a position based on what they saw or heard on TV or what some friend or relative has told them. Anyway, if you are not too worried about what some of the other members might have to say here, please tell of what you know of the incidents? I never worry about being branded a member of the Tinfoil Hat Brigade, as I have already been accused of being a member of the "illustrious" band of misfits, eccentrics and outright loonies. Besides if anyone dismisses your reports out of hand, without investigating the facts of the matter, it is similar to dismissing the old tales of lost treasures and lost mines without researching the facts. You know more about it than anyone who was not present.

As to the subject of dowsing - I too admit that I could not believe it could work. One fine day in Wyoming a number of years ago, a good friend of mine and I were looking at some properties (town lots) to buy. We could not locate the public water mains, so I said we will have to go to town hall and ask for maps - but my friend said hold on while he went and got a pair of brazing rods. He bent the brazing rods and started walking around the lot. I had to bite my lip to keep from breaking out laughing, as I really thought this was an exercise in silliness. A few minutes later, he stopped and called me over, and said here is the line, and using the rods he traced it to a spot where he then stopped and dug down a few inches, and showed me the shutoff! I could not believe my eyes, and I knew for a fact that he had never been to this place before, so he told me to try it myself. With more than a little doubt I sheepishly held the two rods and started walking around, and sure enough the rods reacted (crossing) every time I crossed the water lines! I instantly became a believer. As to how it works, there are theories out there including that it is psychic in nature but the one that seems to make sense to me is that it is an electric charge involved. Water carries an electric charge, and what convinces me that this is electrically motivated is that you get the exact same reaction from the rods when you pass them over electric wires (buried) as you get from water and water lines. the rods reaction, first crossing then forcing apart fits with the way two light pieces of metal react when held over an electricity source, first being attracted to it, then when the two pieces have picked up an identical electric charge (positive or negative) they are forced apart by the old law of physics that says opposites attract while like opposes like in both electricity and magnetics. Does it work with treasure too? I think so, if the treasure has metal in it, (not for instance gemstones) as most metals have a base electric charge. I have not tried this method for hunting treasure, but did do an experiment with some coins that were deliberately hidden in the yard, and sure enough the brass rods DID react for them when I passed over the coins, just as it did for water and electric lines. I do not think this method is fool proof however, as I can see no difference in the reaction between finding water or finding electric lines, or an old beer can versus gold coins. It seems it would be helpful, especially coupled with electronic tools like metal detectors and ground penetrating radar, but alone the method is an imperfect locating tool as it cannot differentiate finds. Here too, we risk being 'drafted' into the Tinfoil Hat Brigade if we are convinced the mysterious (to un-informed observers) method does work, as many folks do not believe it works at all. Here in Arizona, if you are going to drill a well, most drilling outfits will recommend that you first get a water dowser to locate the best spot - though they do not admit this publicly too often, it is small risk involved even if one thinks the whole business is nothing but superstition. The practice goes FAR back into history, you can even find what almost certainly is an incident of dowsing in the Old Testament, when Moses "taps the stone" with his staff to find water when the Israelites were wandering in the desert and desperate for water. A miracle from God? Or just a man wise in the ways of deserts who had learned the art of locating water using a witching rod? In either case he was successful in finding the water, which certainly impressed his followers.


Roy A. Decker - Oroblanco

"From the moment I picked your book up until I laid it down, I was convulsed with laughter. Someday I intend reading it." –Groucho Marx

"Outside of a dog, a book is man's best friend. Inside of a dog, it's too dark to read."
--Groucho

 

[Oroblanco]

Hello again,
A correction is in order, that link above to the post with more on pre-Columbian contacts between the Old world and New has been moved, the correct address is now:

http://forum.treasurenet.com/index.php/topic,36420.msg325936.html#msg325936

Sorry about that amigos!

Oroblanco

"I've got the brain of a four year old. I'll bet he was glad to be rid of it." --Groucho Marx

 

[Springfield]

Oro - no problem relating the Pedragosas story. There were four of us staking out a grid of about 100 silver mining claims in steep limestone bluff terrain cut with lots of narrow ravines, mostly covered with PJ and brush. My partner and I were following a line up the side of a steep hill when we noticed a brilliant point source of light floating straight down from the sky to the middle of a pasture about 500-600 yards distant and 300 or 400 feet vertical below us. It was clear, quiet and about noon. No aircraft were seen or heard even though we had a commanding view of the sky. The light was extremely bright and was pulsing from red to green to white as it fell. It landed in the pasture and spooked a half dozen deer which bolted full speed away from it. Of course we thought about going down to investigate, but it was in the opposite direction of our line, and since it was our last day on this week-long job, we needed to hustle to finish before dark so we could get home - so we noted the location on our maps and continued to the top of the ridge where we stopped for lunch. While eating, a jet cruised by at low altitude below us in the canyon we were approaching (opposite side of the ridge from the light). It was flat black with no markings whatsoever - military, obviously.

At the end of the day, on the way out of the hills, we were stopped by a forest service employee who grilled us about anything 'unusual' we might have seen that day. We related our story and he asked for our names and numbers, 'in case he needed more information.' A few days later, a UFO investigator called me and interviewed me at length on the phone. He also mailed me a questionaire which I completed and sent back to him. A second guy called a week or so later and we went through the whole thing again. These guys were very interested in this event because of 'prior incidents' in those hills. In my opinion, the whole thing was unexplainable, yes, but seemingly related to our military in some way. The investigators didn't agree, but also wouldn't offer any insight about their ideas, so I soon forgot about it. This was a strange deal, but I've seen much more compelling stuff here in New Mexico over the years.

Of more interest to me was another phenomena we noticed on the same job a couple/three days before the light came down. We were following our line across an open, grassy pasture about 100 yards wide. The grass had all been eaten to the ground by the cattle. Then we noticed a circle of grass that the cattle had left standing untouched. It was a perfect circle, 21 feet in diameter, of tall grass sitting in the midst of all the eaten-down grass. There were no fences, power lines, rocks, brush or anything else to keep those cows out of this area, but they avoided it completely for some reason. I haven't been back to these hills for nearly 30 years, but always have been curious about the stuff we saw there. No big deal, really, just some of the weird stuff you encounter in terra obscura.

 

[Roadquest]

Well, guys, I'm going to take one more shot at it. This time, I have the time to
spend there. I'd like to meet up with someone else out there that was intersted
in searching for this.

Clayton...Roadquest

 

[Oroblanco]

Clayton - good luck and good hunting buddy, hope you find that gold! Have fun too!
your friend,
Roy - Oroblanco

 

[gollum]

Well, guys, I'm going to take one more shot at it. This time, I have the time to
spend there. I'd like to meet up with someone else out there that was intersted
in searching for this.

Clayton...Roadquest

You go Clayton!

If you find the last bar in the area of the Mesa (it will be wrapped in red canvas and oilcloth), PM me, and I will see about putting you in contact with the people who found the others. Like I said to you a long time ago, that last bar is the "Golden Ticket to the Wonka Factory"

Just be careful. Don't go out by yourself at night (especially if any locals know what you are there for)! There are tons of folks that have spent the better parts of their adult lives looking for that gold, and are very sketchy about outsiders walking in.

Best,

Mike

 

[Springfield]

Say, Mike, I was wondering ... are "the people who found the others" out of Utah by any chance?

 

[gollum]

Say, Mike, I was wondering ... are "the people who found the others" out of Utah by any chance?

Can't say. Sorry

But I will say that there are a bunch of folks looking for that gold. It is probably the only REALLY modern documented cache of it's size in the United States. There's no wishy washy tales that are mostly BS. The negotiation documents are in the Library of Congress. The story is WELL documented and names, dates, and places are given (all verifiable).

You can count on three FOR SURE hard core hunters on this cache:

1. Family of the ranch caretaker who moved the gold in the fifties.

2. Other Pro Treasure Hunters (One moved to the area a few years ago so they could have eyes and ears there full time).

3. The United States of America! Uncle Sam knows the gold is there (and has since 1933) somewhere. You can bet your bottom dollar that they have some Secret Service or IRS Agents whos full time job is to keep an eye out for any developments out that way.

Best,

Mike

 

[Sir_Digs_Alot35]

Hey Road quest I live in New Mexico and have been following yalls chats on the topic..............Its very interesting and I would be happy to accompany you there if not for anything but just safety and knowledge. I have been researching this area and there is many interesting tales out here......Im in Deming New Mexico.......does any one know of any treasure tales about the Florida Mts or cooks peak mt. Range......Ive explored many Indian caves around here and got pics of carvings and Crosses carved here and there but the Indians wouldnt do crosses would they...or is that from Coronado or other spanish expeditions traveling through here

But if your serious about going Roadquest.........Im your Huckleberry!!

 

[Roadquest]

Sir digs alot

You bet your boots I'm serious, I'm in it for the long run. I will look and see what I may can
find on the Florida Mts. Cooks peak Mt. range.
Those carvings are interesting. I'd like to see them.

Roadquest

 

[Sir_Digs_Alot35]

I found the pics and had to shrink them to get them on here.......lol check them out see what ya think I got more......if ya need.

 

[Colorado Bob]

Hey Roadquest,

Just read your PM. Sorry it took so long, don't check in here every day.
I lived in that area for several years and did a lot of work over there. Wish I was there to take you on a fifty-cent tour.

There are several things of interest in the area as a whole. If you fool around the Waterflow area, you can go only a few miles west and you will be on the Navajo Res. and a few miles north and you will be on the Ute Mountain Res.. You have to be careful as most of those old roads on the Res. are one way in and one way out, if you get my drift. Just about a mile south and your also on the Navajo Res..

You may want to check the area North, Northwest of Aztec. 574 off 550. You won't be on the Res. until you cross into Colo., then your on the Southern Ute Res., but you don't want to hunt that far north anyway.

These are things in general that most everyone knows. There are a few things that I won't/can't post on here.

It's a good area with a number of things that are not related to the 17 tons. I have saw some pieces of Spanish armor, some large pieces of silver and other things. There was a pair of small gold spurs found as well as a piece from circa 1760 or 1770, which I believe was used in the baptismal ceremonies. Its mostly silver with a gold cross inlay. There is a standing offer of $30,000 for it.

I have since moved to Az. as I fooling around with a couple of things here.

As you start to explore the country you will find that there are hundreds of gas and oilwell roads all over the country, so you can drive to just about anywhere you want to go, especially to the east, south and north of Aztec. Be careful of rain as the roads are dirt, so if you get caught in the rain you will be in there for awhile, or until it dries out.

There are so many roads that its almost impossible to give directions to any one spot unless your familiar with the country.

Claton, there are maps of most of those roads and the roads are numbered, but I don't know if you can get your hands on one or not.

Good luck with the project.

Bob T.

 

[Zeitgeist_Xero]

One thing that really doesn't fit well with the 'treasurehunteruniversity' link posted at the top of this forum, along with some other things I've read, is the transport time via truck to the 'secret location.'

When five tons would accumulate, Trabuco would appear on the mesa. He would have it loaded on his truck, one ton at a time. He would leave the peons there by the Hogan site and travel in an easterly direction to a pre-designated hiding cave. It would take approx. 1 hour round trip. (excerpt from the article link on treasurehunteruniversity')

If Trabuco drove off by himself, it would take over an hour to empty that much gold out of a truck - even a lesser amount, let alone bury it or cover it up. Just food for thought, as moving that much stone, let alone gold, isn't easy.

 

[gollum]

One thing that really doesn't fit well with the 'treasurehunteruniversity' link posted at the top of this forum, along with some other things I've read, is the transport time via truck to the 'secret location.'

When five tons would accumulate, Trabuco would appear on the mesa. He would have it loaded on his truck, one ton at a time. He would leave the peons there by the Hogan site and travel in an easterly direction to a pre-designated hiding cave. It would take approx. 1 hour round trip. (excerpt from the article link on treasurehunteruniversity')

If Trabuco drove off by himself, it would take over an hour to empty that much gold out of a truck - even a lesser amount, let alone bury it or cover it up. Just food for thought, as moving that much stone, let alone gold, isn't easy.

Hey ZX,

You are at least one step behind the crowd based on your last post. Sorry, I didn't catch this earlier. Maybe you will still find it.

The gold was taken from the landing spot to a mesa on a nearby ranch (in 1933). You have to understand that the government has been on the hunt for this cache since 1933. You see, they know exactly how much gold is involved, and that it is most definitely not a "Treasure Story." The letters of negotiation between the Mexican Miners and the US Government are available, if you know where to ask.

Without going through all my previous posts on this subject, the caretaker of the ranch was one of the few people who knew the actual location of the gold. Sometime in the 1950's he got word that Uncle Sam was closing in on the cache. So, over a short period of time, he secretly dug up the cache of gold bullion, and moved it from where it was to it's current location. He kept five of the (about) 66 pound (30 kilos) bars of gold aside, and carved clues to the cache's current hiding place in them. He then wrapped them in red canvas and oilcloth, and hid them around the mesa on the ranch. You have to have ALL of the bars to find the gold. Even four of the five won't get you there. There is a group of gentlemen who have three of the five bars (this was as of over a year ago).

The caretaker had a stroke and died in the mid eighties (I believe). He was never able to pass on to his family (or anyone else) the current location of the cache.

The family showed this group of gentlemen the depressions in the ground, where the gold was originally hidden.

Best,

Mike

 

[Oroblanco]

Hi Mike! (Howdee to everyone else too! )

You brought up an interesting point that I was never able to learn the answer to - who drove the truck, and was it one man doing the driving or two men in the truck? It might not be an important point but has puzzled me - if it were one man, for instance, what about the chance of his having an accident or breaking down, only to be discovered by a passerby? Two men could handle such a situation, with one running 'interference' to anyone who might happen upon them while the other man made sure the 'goods' were kept under cover well. Then there is the (admittedly low) chance that a single driver taking a truck load of gold bullion might have a stroke or heart attack - and these men were not wishing to attract any sort of government attention until they could sell their bullion for a huge profit, (which did not work out quite as planned as we all know) so would they have taken such a chance, however small?

Then there is the tale of the two men assigned to actually LIVE on the site where the gold was buried, and keep watch on it - would they have actually trusted two men to do this? What would be the insurance policy to prevent any employee(s), however trusted, from deciding to rob his employers (who were, after all, quite distant in Mexico and could not keep close tabs upon them) and make off with some or all of the gold? Personally I have trouble believing this version of having two men live almost on top of the gold to keep watch, it seems this would only serve to attract more attention to the site (people do wonder about men who seem to live without any sort of means of support, especially during depression years when nearly everyone was having hard times) and the fact they were apparently 'standing guard' would really peak the curiosity of anyone who lived anywhere around locally. Wouldn't you wonder about such a situation, where two armed men live in some out-of-the-way place, always keeping watch on the site, yet without any apparent means of making money, and yet are not ordinary "caretakers" as we find employed at non-working mines, summer homes for the very wealthy, resorts in remote locations etc since there was no such non-working mine, summer palace or resort at this location.

Just more questions and speculation on my own part, I suspect that there is no one alive today that actually knows the true location of where that gold is buried - the last chance of anyone recovering it was lost in the negotiations with the Treasury Department when the government refused to offer any kind of deal in which they would not press charges and at least pay some kind of remuneration for that mass of gold - some things really DO get carried into the grave it seems. For someone to find it today, is going to require a LOT of leg-work, research and most of all GREAT LUCK.

Sorry if that personal rant sounded a tad negative, I honestly wish good luck to anyone who is going after that gold and really do hope they will find it - now that the government won't be arresting the finder and he/she/they can legally own the gold (after taxes of course) it would be great for someone to finally recover it.

Oroblanco

 

[gollum]

Hey Oro,

ONE guy drove the truck and unloaded it from the landing strip to the temporary hiding place. I have not heard details about the trip to the first hiding place (but I assume it was the same guy).

The first permanent hiding place was on a ranch near Farmington, NM. I have never heard of TWO men guarding the gold. All I have ever heard was the ONE caretaker of the ranch. The family of the caretaker showed the group the depressions in the ground where the gold HAD been hidden until the fifties. I believe the caretaker was promised a full share as long as he guarded the gold, and kept the secret. I'm sure fear probably played a big part in him not trying to sell of the gold, as he knew the government was always looking closely at that area for somebody suddenly having gold to sell (also, private gold ownership of more than five ounces was illegal until the seventies).

The US Government had nothing to press charges against the miners for in 1933. The ONLY law they broke was taking the gold out of Mexico, which was illegal under Mexican Law. The USGov knew the Mexican Miners couldn't take the gold back to Mexico, and they tried to coerce it out of them. Since none of them knew the actual location of the gold (and the attorney only knew who the caretaker was), they were pretty safe.

You are wrong about it being nonrecoverable. Read this from my last post:

He kept five of the (about) 66 pound (30 kilos) bars of gold aside, and carved clues to the cache's current hiding place in them. He then wrapped them in red canvas and oilcloth, and hid them around the mesa on the ranch. You have to have ALL of the bars to find the gold. Even four of the five won't get you there. There is a group of gentlemen who have three of the five bars (this was as of over a year ago).

Best,

Mike