✅ SOLVED WW2 German Item with Swastika

[SCDigginWithAK]

Does anybody know what this is? I didn't dig it but this is the best place I could think of to find out what it is. I was told it went to a WW2 German Panzer tank and tightened the track on the tank but don't know if that's right can anybody ID this?

 

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[SCDigginWithAK]

History of Valves - Industrial Valves - United Valve

Thank you for this. There is not a Single letter C on this piece

 

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[Mackaydon]

Green,
It all comes down to if YOU think it was a good deal at @ $30 based on what you've read in this thread. If you do, then you should be pleased. I've already given my opinion.
Don...

 

[AU Seeker]

Here are the actual "gas valves" at Dachau, this image was taken May 3 1945 during a Congressional visit of the concentration camp.

Photograph of American Congressmen examining the Dachau gas chamber on May 3, 1945

 

[surf]

Hey green,

Don't thank me just yet, as I'm sure your item has no connection to the Nazis.

So are these guys:

"Go here for more non-German swastika items." Non-German Swastikas

 

[SCDigginWithAK]

Ok I'll agree......... For now

 

[NOLA_Ken]

It is 100% ABSOLUTELY not Nazi related, nor is it in any way from a concentration camp. Period. Anyone claiming to be an "expert" who tells you so has no idea what they are talking about. It is from a gas stove or heater, and made right here in the US before WW2. If you paid 30 bucks for it, I'm sorry to say you paid about 28$ too much, and if it was falsely represented by the seller as a WW2 relic, you should demand your money back. I collected WW2 German stuff for several years and I've seen pretty much every piece of gear they ever used in that time, and I can guarantee that I'm right about this one. If you don't believe me, sign up on the Wehrmacht Awards Forum and ask there, I guarantee they will tell you the same thing. Wehrmacht-Awards.com

 

[nhbenz]

I completely agree that this is not related to the Nazi party, but it should be noted that not all Nazi swastikas were rotated 45 degrees. The Fuhrer's standard (flag) is an example.

 

[l2hunt]

I think GpSnoopy nailed it!!

 

[surf]

I wish there was a pic of the back. Mine was exact with the gas chamber one

Mister green,

Would'ya please post a link to wherever it is that you are seeing this?

Very old Burnham boiler​

 

[GpSnoopy]

I'm going to post what Snyder's site list as providence for the item in question and how it relates to the "gas chamber"

Do I think that this valve handle was manufactured by a German Company for the Nazis to use in a gas chamber........ NO

Do I think that this was a valve handle manufactured by Crane Steel in America...... YES

Do I think that the valve handle sold on Snyder's site was found in a concentration camp that happened to also have the gas chamber...... POSSIBLE

All I wanted to point out in this ID process, was that I believe there is enough proof to say that the Valve and valve knob was manufactured by Crane Steel, and then provided to other manufacturers for use in their products, and some of them invariably have shown up in other locations around the world. Perhaps there is extra value if there is providence provided that guarantees it was found in a Nazi concentration camp. That's up to the collectors themselves.

There are limited images to be found online, but I have found many text references to "molded valve knobs with a raised swastika" used on American fireplaces, furnaces, and heaters being used in the 20's and 30's, and that Crane provided valves for use in many different manufacturer's products and extensively used the swastika logo on most of their products during this time.

These are just my opinions based on what I was able to research sofar, and I am and will always be open to other ideas, provided substantial "providence or proof" is given

 

[cudamark]

My understanding is that most WW2 German concentration camps eventually had two types of gas chambers. One with poison gas to kill and the other with fuel type gas to cremate the bodies. Maybe Crane made furnaces used for the latter.

 

[clovis97]

I'm another one that believe that the handle in question has no ties to the Nazi party.

FWIW, our old local library, built in the 1920's had a connected swastika design on the border of the floor, going around the entire building.

But, then again, people will believe what they want to believe. This thread reminds me of another thread where a few posters believed that a poured modern concrete foundation was some sort of early Native American dugout.

 

[clovis97]

I would like to add that just because someone says something about a provenance doesn't make it true.

I knew a guy that maintained, for years on end, that he was part of the 506th PIR, 101st Airborne, Easy Company. This was back in the early 1980's, long before the Band of Brothers was released. While he talked about being at Camp Toccoa, D-Day, Market Garden, the battle of the Bulge, and Hitler's mansion, he never talked about any real details, any friends he had, or went to any reunions. "No one would remember me at a reunion" he would say.

I've read extensively about the Band of Brothers, and spent a bit of time researching, but never once have I seen his name anywhere associated with this group.

Do I believe he went to a jump school? Yeah, possibly. Maybe. Maybe not.

Just because he said he was part of Easy company doesn't make it true.

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

Well here's where it all comes down I bought it for $30 is that a good deal?

No, not really. Its possible that you may be able to get your $30 back. You were ripped off whether it was intentional or not. There is no way possible that this could have been used to adjust a tank track lol. I had to use a huge breaker bar to adjust my tracked vehicle and it wasnt near as heavy duty as a Panzer..

Im going to mark this one solved. Evidence has been presented by Snoopy and others. Try not to rip anyone else off in an attempt to get your money back. Thanks for posting as we can all learn from your experience. I guess you could play dumb when you sell it but it wouldnt be right to rip someone else off. I dont think eBay will accept swastika like items even though its IDed as a Crane furnace valve..

 

[SCDigginWithAK]

I'm just going to take it as a learning experience as a young collector (I'm 13 and have been collecting since I was 9). It's a cool piece anyways and shows what the swastika was before it was evil related. I knew it probably wasn't nazi related but I was hoping it was to come out as a good buy. Thank y'all for the help. Same day I bought a WW2 German silver wound badge and WW1 dog tags with a original Navy photograph of the man who the tags belonged to.

 

[Mackaydon]

Green808,
Excellent attitude !! And at an early age and for a relatively small investment, you have learned the value of researching before you buy--and not 'buy into a seller's hype. You've got a great start to effective collecting.
Don....

 

[NOLA_Ken]

I understand that you are young and just really getting started in collecting these things, but I'm sorry to tell you that your wound badge is also a reproduction. It's most likely made in Eastern Europe (probably Poland) , or possibly China in the last 10 years. There are a number of indicators that tell me this, but the biggest is the pin attachment on the back, followed by the poor casting of the tips of the swords. WW2 German items are a really tough field to collect, which is why I got out of the hobby. There are so many reproductions, and outright fakes being sold on the market as originals that without years of knowledge and experience it's hard to tell the difference. This is compounded by the fact that for many badges, Iron Crosses being the most common, original dies have been bought by the fakers to produce their fakes. You need to educate yourself in the field, and be very careful what you buy. Never buy anything off of ebay especially if it comes from Eastern Europe, unless you know for a fact that it's a reputable seller. There are some out there, but you need to do the research before you buy. Having said that, be careful of American sellers too, people buy very good reproductions and falsely age them and pass them off as originals at a very high price. Look at this website... At the Front - Home They sell to reenactors, and some of their stuff is a high enough quality that with a little false patina and aging it can even fool experienced collectors. I know, I got burned a few times. My best advice is to join the Wehrmacht awards forum, Wehrmacht-Awards.com and learn all you can from the members there. They have a wealth of knowledge that is simply amazing, to the point that they can tell you who made an original medal or badge, and in most cases who made a fake one. I'm not saying all this to discourage you, but to warn you to be careful. There are a lot of "experts" out there who will take advantage of you for a buck. So have fun with your collecting, enjoy it, but be sure you learn as much as possible to insure that what you pay for is what you are actually getting.

 

[NOLA_Ken]

For some reason I can't edit my post, but I wanted to add that I got into collecting German war relics at about that same age, I think I was 10 or 11, when my uncle Dutch passed on and my aunt gave me all of the things he had brought back from WW2.... Helmets, rifles, pistols medals a couple uniforms and that's not even counting all the American gear, including a live grenade that we disposed of one Fourth of July...... That was over 30 years ago though, and the only source for these kinds of things were a few dealers at the local gun shows and a couple other guys I met in town. A little over 10 years ago I sold my collection off due to the influx of fakes and the fact that the internet had driven up prices so much. Believe it or not at one time I bought a full original named SS Panzer tunic for 400$ with all the badges intact. I sold it for 3000$. I still look at real estate sales though, and once in a while get a gem of a find, like an SA dagger a couple years ago for 25$.... The real stuff is out there, and occasionally for a sweet low price, so just learn what to look for and keep your eyes open. One tip, at estate sales, many people are reluctant to put anything nazi related out for sale, so don't be afraid to ask about war souvenirs if the person was a veteran, the family might have a footlocker full of them for cheap just to get rid of it all....

 

[SCDigginWithAK]

For some reason I can't edit my post, but I wanted to add that I got into collecting German war relics at about that same age, I think I was 10 or 11, when my uncle Dutch passed on and my aunt gave me all of the things he had brought back from WW2.... Helmets, rifles, pistols medals a couple uniforms and that's not even counting all the American gear, including a live grenade that we disposed of one Fourth of July...... That was over 30 years ago though, and the only source for these kinds of things were a few dealers at the local gun shows and a couple other guys I met in town. A little over 10 years ago I sold my collection off due to the influx of fakes and the fact that the internet had driven up prices so much. Believe it or not at one time I bought a full original named SS Panzer tunic for 400$ with all the badges intact. I sold it for 3000$. I still look at real estate sales though, and once in a while get a gem of a find, like an SA dagger a couple years ago for 25$.... The real stuff is out there, and occasionally for a sweet low price, so just learn what to look for and keep your eyes open. One tip, at estate sales, many people are reluctant to put anything nazi related out for sale, so don't be afraid to ask about war souvenirs if the person was a veteran, the family might have a footlocker full of them for cheap just to get rid of it all....

Ok once again I'm guessing $40 was not a good price for a repro. Looks like I'm not going to buy from the dealer any more.

 

[SCDigginWithAK]

I understand that you are young and just really getting started in collecting these things, but I'm sorry to tell you that your wound badge is also a reproduction. It's most likely made in Eastern Europe (probably Poland) , or possibly China in the last 10 years. There are a number of indicators that tell me this, but the biggest is the pin attachment on the back, followed by the poor casting of the tips of the swords. WW2 German items are a really tough field to collect, which is why I got out of the hobby. There are so many reproductions, and outright fakes being sold on the market as originals that without years of knowledge and experience it's hard to tell the difference. This is compounded by the fact that for many badges, Iron Crosses being the most common, original dies have been bought by the fakers to produce their fakes. You need to educate yourself in the field, and be very careful what you buy. Never buy anything off of ebay especially if it comes from Eastern Europe, unless you know for a fact that it's a reputable seller. There are some out there, but you need to do the research before you buy. Having said that, be careful of American sellers too, people buy very good reproductions and falsely age them and pass them off as originals at a very high price. Look at this website... At the Front - Home They sell to reenactors, and some of their stuff is a high enough quality that with a little false patina and aging it can even fool experienced collectors. I know, I got burned a few times. My best advice is to join the Wehrmacht awards forum, Wehrmacht-Awards.com and learn all you can from the members there. They have a wealth of knowledge that is simply amazing, to the point that they can tell you who made an original medal or badge, and in most cases who made a fake one. I'm not saying all this to discourage you, but to warn you to be careful. There are a lot of "experts" out there who will take advantage of you for a buck. So have fun with your collecting, enjoy it, but be sure you learn as much as possible to insure that what you pay for is what you are actually getting.

I see what you are saying about the pin that's a good point. It was my first time buying anything German. I'm a lot more knowledgeable in American pieces and can tell on fakes. Well maybe I can resell it as a repro and get some money back.