Red James Cash
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There are no clean hands in a war.Atrocities were committed by both sides.
Why dont Americans mark their Civil War like the British do WW2?
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There are no clean hands in a war.Atrocities were committed by both sides.
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... but the Union committed them on Southern civilians.
Red James Cash
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And the confeds committed them on northern civilians.
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Civilian describes pillaging near Gettysburg, 1863
A primary source by William H. Boyle
On July 5, 1863, Dr. William H. Boyle wrote to a fellow member of the local Columbus Lodge of the International Organization of Odd Fellows, Isaac McCauley, describing the devastation the Confederates had caused in Chambersburg, Pennsylvania, twenty-five miles west of Gettysburg. Confederate forces had been in Chambersburg as early as June 16 and had taken food, clothing, and other supplies, some of which was paid for with Confederate money. The pillaging this letter describes was what General Robert E. Lee had hoped to avoid when he issued General Orders No. 73 on June 27:
The commanding general considers that no greater disgrace could befall the army, and through it our whole people, than the perpetration of the barbarous outrages upon the unarmed, and defenceless and the wanton destruction of private property that have marked the course of the enemy in our own country.
Lee’s order was ignored, as Boyle reported:
The rebs have stripped this valley of everything. All the Stores – Book, Dry Goods, Groceries, Mills and Warehouses have been emptied. There is not enough left for the people to live on for two weeks. Both railroads are destroyed. All the new depot building are down. Many farms are destroyed by roads over them and encampments upon them. The telegraph lines are all destroyed. We are completely cut off from the outside world. . . . The outrages committed on private property and on individuals have been dreadful. Murder, rape, robbery and arson are the names by which you designate a few of their atrocities. Gen. Lees order to respect private property was laughed at by the vallains that compose his army.
The bulk of Lee’s army passed through Chambersburg on its way to Gettysburg, where over July 1–3, 1863, they met Union forces under the command of General George Meade.
A full transcript is available.
Transcript
William H. Boyle to Isaac McCauley, July 5, 1863 (GLC09180.02)
Chambersburg, July 5, ’63
Friend M’Cauley,
Having an opportunity to send a letter outside the Confed: lines I will give you a short account of our situation. The rebs have stripped this valley of everything. All the Stores – Book, Dry Goods, Groceries, Mills and Warehouses have been emptied. There is not enough left for the people to live on for two weeks. Both railroads are destroyed. All the new depot building are down. Many farms are destroyed by roads over them and encampments upon them. The telegraph lines are all destroyed. We are completely cut off from the outside world. We have had no northern papers here for over two week. We get our news via Richmond. I bought three Richmond papers from one of their newsmen on the street for 25 cents – for the three. The outrages committed on private property and on individuals have been dreadful. Murder, rape, robbery and arson are the names by which you designate a few of their atrocities. Gen. Lees order to respect private property was laughed at by the vallains that compose his army. They have destroyed our Lodge room – all the regalia has been carried off or torn up to get off the lace and bullion. Not an article of regalia is left. The lamp fixturs shared the same fate. When they took possession of the Hall I saw the officer in charge and begged of him to respect that room-he promised me it should not be disturbed and placed a guard over it. The guard broke in three times and plundered it. M L [illegible] and Stumbaugh’s offices are destroyed. The safes are broken open – yours among the rest – the book cases thrown down all the books carried of or scattered about, the papers strewn over the floor and tramped in the mud. Such a picture of ruin as the office presents you cannot imagine try your best. The town is one vast and nasty horse-stable. It smells so bad we can scarcely live in it. I am fearful of an epidemic. The country people fared worse than the town. All sorts of outrages were committed on their persons and property. This morning about a dozen of wagons with wounded from Gettysburg passed through here. They were followed and captured. The wagons and horses were run off and the wounded left in the Hospital which the rebs: have still here. The wounded say the fight was going against them up to Saturday morning when they left. If they retreat through here I fear they will destroy the town. I will write to you soon again if we can get a mail through. I send this to be mailed at Harrisburg.
Yours W. H. Boyle
Civilian describes pillaging near Gettysburg, 1863 | The Gilder Lehrman Institute of American History
A primary source by William H. Boyle
On July 5, 1863, Dr. William H. Boyle wrote to a fellow member of the local Columbus Lodge of the International Organization of Odd Fellows, Isaac McCauley, describing the devastation the Confederates had caused in Chambersburg, Pennsylvania, twenty-five miles west of Gettysburg. Confederate forces had been in Chambersburg as early as June 16 and had taken food, clothing, and other supplies, some of which was paid for with Confederate money. The pillaging this letter describes was what General Robert E. Lee had hoped to avoid when he issued General Orders No. 73 on June 27:
The commanding general considers that no greater disgrace could befall the army, and through it our whole people, than the perpetration of the barbarous outrages upon the unarmed, and defenceless and the wanton destruction of private property that have marked the course of the enemy in our own country.
Lee’s order was ignored, as Boyle reported:
The rebs have stripped this valley of everything. All the Stores – Book, Dry Goods, Groceries, Mills and Warehouses have been emptied. There is not enough left for the people to live on for two weeks. Both railroads are destroyed. All the new depot building are down. Many farms are destroyed by roads over them and encampments upon them. The telegraph lines are all destroyed. We are completely cut off from the outside world. . . . The outrages committed on private property and on individuals have been dreadful. Murder, rape, robbery and arson are the names by which you designate a few of their atrocities. Gen. Lees order to respect private property was laughed at by the vallains that compose his army.
The bulk of Lee’s army passed through Chambersburg on its way to Gettysburg, where over July 1–3, 1863, they met Union forces under the command of General George Meade.
A full transcript is available.
Transcript
William H. Boyle to Isaac McCauley, July 5, 1863 (GLC09180.02)
Chambersburg, July 5, ’63
Friend M’Cauley,
Having an opportunity to send a letter outside the Confed: lines I will give you a short account of our situation. The rebs have stripped this valley of everything. All the Stores – Book, Dry Goods, Groceries, Mills and Warehouses have been emptied. There is not enough left for the people to live on for two weeks. Both railroads are destroyed. All the new depot building are down. Many farms are destroyed by roads over them and encampments upon them. The telegraph lines are all destroyed. We are completely cut off from the outside world. We have had no northern papers here for over two week. We get our news via Richmond. I bought three Richmond papers from one of their newsmen on the street for 25 cents – for the three. The outrages committed on private property and on individuals have been dreadful. Murder, rape, robbery and arson are the names by which you designate a few of their atrocities. Gen. Lees order to respect private property was laughed at by the vallains that compose his army. They have destroyed our Lodge room – all the regalia has been carried off or torn up to get off the lace and bullion. Not an article of regalia is left. The lamp fixturs shared the same fate. When they took possession of the Hall I saw the officer in charge and begged of him to respect that room-he promised me it should not be disturbed and placed a guard over it. The guard broke in three times and plundered it. M L [illegible] and Stumbaugh’s offices are destroyed. The safes are broken open – yours among the rest – the book cases thrown down all the books carried of or scattered about, the papers strewn over the floor and tramped in the mud. Such a picture of ruin as the office presents you cannot imagine try your best. The town is one vast and nasty horse-stable. It smells so bad we can scarcely live in it. I am fearful of an epidemic. The country people fared worse than the town. All sorts of outrages were committed on their persons and property. This morning about a dozen of wagons with wounded from Gettysburg passed through here. They were followed and captured. The wagons and horses were run off and the wounded left in the Hospital which the rebs: have still here. The wounded say the fight was going against them up to Saturday morning when they left. If they retreat through here I fear they will destroy the town. I will write to you soon again if we can get a mail through. I send this to be mailed at Harrisburg.
Yours W. H. Boyle
Civilian describes pillaging near Gettysburg, 1863 | The Gilder Lehrman Institute of American History
OP
OP
John Winter
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Does anybody remember what the catalyst was that started this new war?
ZZZzzzzzzzzzz
ZZZzzzzzzzzzz
Red James Cash
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Misinformation and denial
Number9
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It's a good thing for the North that they outnumbered the Rebs 2:1...
With even number of soldiers on both sides..
the South would have won the war in less than a year!
Yeah.. Only thing a Yankee can shoot is their big month!
Heritage? Another Southern Thang.. that you'll never understand!
With even number of soldiers on both sides..
the South would have won the war in less than a year!
Yeah.. Only thing a Yankee can shoot is their big month!
Heritage? Another Southern Thang.. that you'll never understand!
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Topic is why don't Americans mark civil war and it has been answered, we do.
Further replies are to be limited to questions on celebrating the war and not the politics of the war..
Further replies are to be limited to questions on celebrating the war and not the politics of the war..
Number9
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"Why don't Americans mark their Civil War like the British do WW2?"
But we do.. every day.
The six flags over Fort Sumter.
Since 1970, the 300[SUP]th[/SUP] anniversary of Charleston’s founding, six flags have flown over Fort Sumter daily: the 50-star United States flag and five historic flags, representing a timeline of the two governments controlling Fort Sumter during the course of the Civil War. These five historic flags include two United States flags (1861 and 1865), two Confederate States flags (1861 and 1863) and the South Carolina state flag (adopted in 1861 and still current).
“Flags are powerful symbols,” said Fort Sumter National Monument Superintendent Bob Dodson. “The flags that fly over Fort Sumter not only help us to tell the story of the Civil War here, but also serve as reminders of where we’ve come from as a nation and who we are today.”
But we do.. every day.
The six flags over Fort Sumter.
Since 1970, the 300[SUP]th[/SUP] anniversary of Charleston’s founding, six flags have flown over Fort Sumter daily: the 50-star United States flag and five historic flags, representing a timeline of the two governments controlling Fort Sumter during the course of the Civil War. These five historic flags include two United States flags (1861 and 1865), two Confederate States flags (1861 and 1863) and the South Carolina state flag (adopted in 1861 and still current).
“Flags are powerful symbols,” said Fort Sumter National Monument Superintendent Bob Dodson. “The flags that fly over Fort Sumter not only help us to tell the story of the Civil War here, but also serve as reminders of where we’ve come from as a nation and who we are today.”
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Number9
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I was born at Stone Mountain, Georgia, but it's known for something much bigger...
The Confederate Memorial
The largest bas relief sculpture in the world, the Confederate Memorial Carving depicts three Confederate leaders of the Civil War, President Jefferson Davis and Generals Robert E. Lee and Stonewall Jackson.
The Confederate Memorial
The largest bas relief sculpture in the world, the Confederate Memorial Carving depicts three Confederate leaders of the Civil War, President Jefferson Davis and Generals Robert E. Lee and Stonewall Jackson.
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As I have already stated please keep politics of war out of thread, after my post posted previously below..
The topic is celebrating the anniversaries of Civil War. I don't think Johnny was aware of the number of state celebrations conducted.....
The topic is celebrating the anniversaries of Civil War. I don't think Johnny was aware of the number of state celebrations conducted.....
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Nugs Bunny
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That's what I was saying back on page two, there are many CW memorials and celebrations. The BBC must be unaware of the magnitude of the events and attractions focused on the Civil War. If you add them all together I would bet it's far more than any other Nation's attempt at "marking" any war. Georgia alone marks the CW far more than the UK marks WWII.
Thanks for the picture!
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Kayakpat, if you want to discuss politics join the Charter Membership and join the politics forum found there.....
I repeat keep thread on topic and keep politics on civil war and politics in general out of thread..
I repeat keep thread on topic and keep politics on civil war and politics in general out of thread..
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You should take your own advice!!
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I'm from Orygun and my wife is from Texas....I think Southerners are some of the most patriotic and well mannered people in the entire country!! 
It's a good thing for the North that they outnumbered the Rebs 2:1...
With even number of soldiers on both sides..
the South would have won the war in less than a year!
Yeah.. Only thing a Yankee can shoot is their big month!
Heritage? Another Southern Thang.. that you'll never understand!
Number9
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The 12 pound napoleon cannons are silent now.. 150 years latter, do we forget the 650,000 "Americans" who died by using words such as "racist" and "hate"?
I for one, don't think so!
Awhile back, I read part of a diary of a soldier that was in the Battle of Chickamauga, which said...
"The day after the battle, you could walk across the battle field by stepping on bodies.. and never touch the ground."
Chickamauga
I for one, don't think so!
Awhile back, I read part of a diary of a soldier that was in the Battle of Chickamauga, which said...
"The day after the battle, you could walk across the battle field by stepping on bodies.. and never touch the ground."
Chickamauga
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What part of no politics of civil war or current politics and staying on topic of original post is hard to understand. I asked multiple times. OP is not charter member so can't move it to politics forum, only choices left is staying strictly on topic, giving timeouts for ignoring mods or locking thread.
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