The Offer

[Sam 8]

Frank;

You don't know me from Adam. I am a new guy here.
I survived a career dealing with people. Survived is a key word here.(Rest assured I was on the right side) At it's core, people were my business.
For the sake of discussion let's take this thing apart.
What you have here is a guy who has something you want, and he has something you want. He has received a couple of emails from you, but beyond that, and perhaps a phone call, he has nothing to make him believe you, let alone trust you.
You have to change that.
You need to shift that paradigm, shift him over to believe that the prize exists, and that he cannot access the prize without you.
You need to make yourself invaluable to him.
I think it may take a little more work than just putting the ball in his court with the offer and waiting.
You might want to share some previous success stories with him, or use another tactic to make him understand that this isn't like some spam phone call offering free Pepsi for a year, or a Publisher's Clearinghouse commercial, this is a real opportunity that he has to evaluate. using non-critical or proprietary information you need to make him understand what is at stake, and how easily (from his side) it is to cash in.
If he is like most people in this country, he doesn't trust anyone he can't put an eyeball on, at a bare minimum.
This whole deal is about making him trust you, and then making him see that he needs you. Simple as that.
You are not going to do that without going beyond a phone call and an email.
Reverse the rolls, use what you know, and make him a believer.

 

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[Frankn]

Bbigscoop, If I walked up to you and said that I wanted to give you $50,000 would you say" no, not unless you tell me where you got it". I doubt it ! Frank

 

[Frankn]

Sam 8, you have some Valid points there, but I have found that when you first present a deal greed immediately sets in and what they visualize is MORE for me. My first reaction is to explane the situation in terms of work put into the project to justify the split. This is something that takes time to soak in so I let them think about it for a while. I know that this MORE syndrome has a tendency to taper off as hopes of making a quick fortune fade. At this point they are at a point where you can realistically talk to them . I think this is where your theory fits in. Frank

 

[bigscoop]

Bbigscoop, If I walked up to you and said that I wanted to give you $50,000 would you say" no, not unless you tell me where you got it". I doubt it ! Frank

You're "obviously" twisting things quite a bit. You didn't walk up to the land owner and say, "I want to give you $50'000.00". You contacted him and made him an offer of 30% of a treasure that may, or may not be, on his land. So, in reply to the theoretical offer you just made me, why don't you walk up to the landowner and say to him, "I'll give you $50'000.00 if you'll let me hunt your land?" This is what you really just proposed to me in your theoretical offer. With this in mind, however, as the land owner I would certainly consider your offer and efforts more seriously in light of the $50'000.00 cash advance you just proposed.

 

[Sam 8]

Frank

I don't want to get into what I would do or how I "feel" about the split, that ain't what you asked...so again, strictly from a problem solving perspective....

-Disbelief will be the first thing that sets in.
-Then, once convinced of the validity of the prize, greed and distrust will set in.

Your task is to work on the trust, which will, by it's nature, begin to suspend disbelief.
Once they trust you, they will come to believe you. This is the order you want those two concepts to take hold.
Belief without trust is of no value in your position.
As time passes while you work the problem, the greed will fade, this is the exact same reason civil actions take years in court. Attorneys know that the longer they can keep from writing the check the smaller it has to be to get people to go away.

 

[lookindown]

If you can find it, he can find it. It doesnt matter what catch 22 you know. If you can , he can.

 

[spartacus53]

Sorry I couldn't reply earlier, it was bedtime for this Bonzo

Again, my statement is not a contradiction, but a breakdown of the facts. There are those willing to make an offer, those willing take an offer, those that will understand your offer is not what they're interested in...

As mentioned by myself and others, there's nothing to stop him from looking now. If you can locate it, so can he.

Now is asked if I would dig up my yard to find $150,000... The answer is simple, NO... I might embellish on some details as to the value and sell the right's for $250,000 If you think this too is flawed, let's have a look at it

Any legend, or tale of treasure is only a guess of the true possible value. It may be more, or less than anticipated. The final figure of any negotiation is what you want to settle for. With this in mind, what if your find was only valued at $10,000 total, are you out $40,000 for having the opportunity to possibly make more, after all you seem to be paying this upfront...

Now here we are tearing up this mans land for something that may, or may not exist.

 

[poorhunter78]

How would this scenario work out.

If I Leased a piece of property, And was out hunting Deer on this Property.. And happened to stumble upon a pile of skittles, You know Red ones, green ones, orange ones, yellow, and such.. Since I am paying to lease this property, Are they my skittles or the rightful owner of the properties Skittles?

 

[dogpound]

i'd say the homeowner has a great advantage now..........he now knows there could be a possible cashe on his property and can persue it if he pleases or just pass it off as a folk tale........the homeowner lost nothing.... you and your partner lost hours of your time doing the research and could gain nothing by not taking the 50/50

 

[bigscoop]

Who knows, the landowner, or someone he knows, might even be following, or perhaps stumble upon, this thread? Now there's an interesting thought/possibility to maul over. I mean, you make him an offer, he jumps online to investigate treasure hunting.....and WHOOP! THERE IT IS! Talk about a potential huge loose end............

 

[poorhunter78]

Who knows, the landowner, or someone he knows, might even be following, or perhaps stumble upon, this thread? Now there's an interesting thought/possibility to maul over. I mean, you make him an offer, he jumps online to investigate treasure hunting.....and WHOOP! THERE IT IS! Talk about a potential huge loose end............

Well, Theres always the "DELETE" Button!

 

[Frankn]

This is quick reply morning.
Sam8, In this case it was instant GREED. He shot back a reply of OK, but only at 50/50.

Lookingdown There are many reasons why he can't find it, like he doesn't know what he is looking for! When you talk about treasure, you use dollar amounts to describe it. I am working on one cache that contains negochable bonds, not this one. Do you think anyone could find it?


Spart, in this case, on the up side.

Poorhunter, you going to split those Skittles ?

Dogpound, If you follow that logic and looked for it and found nothing you would be out even more.
In treasure hunting it's a gamble either way.

Bigscoop, there is not enough info to tie this post to any specif location or cache, and that is international. I have avoided the fish hooks on purpose.

Frank

 

[N.J.THer]

I would say the potential of the land owner stumbling onto this thread is highly unlikely. There was not specific information given in this thread that a search would pick up on. There is also only T-Net user names not any real full names.

Sam8 hit on some great points and it is about trust and making them see you as indispensable. Greed does come into play when the land owner looks at it as he owns the property so the treasure is 100% his whether he knows about it or not. Now you offer him 1/3 and you keep 2/3s. He feels he is getting cheated. He may also feel that he does not need you. Every treasure hunter is going to say you can't find it without my help. It maybe true but I'm sure he thinks your full of it.

Do you ever watch the show Pawn Stars? I love when people bring in an item and they say I would love to get a certain amount for it. Then the shop owner brings in an expert and find out it is worth 20 times the amount they originally wanted. The shop owner makes a respectable offer which is much higher then what they were originally asked for but the item owner now wants full retail or in some cases even more the the experts value. The shop owner did the leg work of getting an expert to look at the item and will have to spend the time and money to sell the item but the item owner just does not get it and greed sets in. This maybe a similar situation.

Good luck

NJ

 

[Frankn]

N J THer, I like your pawn star example. It was very realistic. But when I made the offer, I was very clear in that this was really a 3 way split and I thought it should be equal. 1/3,1/3,1/3. I explained that months of computer time, on ground time and interviews with relatives of the original farm owner was involved and possibly months of on ground searching, whereas he had to contribute only his permission to search and recover the "item".ie I used the word item as a kind of air of mystery. Frank

PS: Hay, if you guys stumble into a cache location, you are getting a wealth of info on negotiating.

 

[dogpound]

Dogpound, If you follow that logic and looked for it and found nothing you would be out even more.
In treasure hunting it's a gamble either way

the difference is your the one that put in months of computer work, and interviews with past family members, and admitted it could take you additional months or searching the property. now that the homeowner has the most important detail (knowing about the cashe) he can take his sweet time and spend years if he wants to investagate it just for something to do, i'm sure he knows the layout of the property much better than you .......he's out nothing

 

[Frankn]

dogpound. when I got his reply of OK but it will be 50/50 That told me that he wanted it NOW, not years from now. As far as him researching it, I don't think so. Research is not just looking up facts, it is the personal deductions that you pull from the facts and this skill takes years to perfect. Look at it this way, if you knew that you had money buried on your property, how long would you want to wait for it.
There is supposed to be a cache buried on my farm with little in the way of details. I got the story from a nice 90 year old lady that lived down the road. She use to live on my property when she was a young girl and her uncle buried the cash from his business profits here, then died without disclosing it. It was never found, and I still am searching, so I can't picture this guy walking out and picking it up. Frank

 

[spartacus53]

Frankn, so you're saying that very few can deduce this information. How much do you know about the present landowner This guy may have been the Sherlock Holmes of his time, as a detective.. He may even have a family of world renown detectives by his side

As I see it, for every scenario you give me, I'll counter with 5

There are so many scenarios for this, that I'm getting dizzy.. I love it, you're keeping me busy

 

[poorhunter78]

Poorhunter, you going to split those Skittles ?

Yeah Frank, Since you asked.. Which 3rd of them would you like?
The Tropical Fruity ones? The Hawaiian punch? Or the Bananna?

 

[dogpound]

dogpound. when I got his reply of OK but it will be 50/50 That told me that he wanted it NOW, not years from now.

it tells me that if he wanted it NOW he would of taken the 1/3

 

[calisdad]

For 50% can we come and look for the one on your property?