the everything site ...?

[the blindbowman]

let me add something to the last reply .. the clovis site in new mexico was the frist clovis site found its east of the chicomoztoc site .. the frist folsum site is also east of the chicomoztoc site . is this a matter of centering the cultures around chicomoztoc ...

if there is any chance what so ever we could find evidence at this site 4 that could support this theory . it will be priceless to our under standing of the events and how they took place at the time of those event and how these tribes reacted and how those actions saved their tribes .. we are nothing more then a nother large tribe IMHO .. we may even be at a greater risk because of our numbers and life styles of modern cultures ...

i guess my piont is that the distence to the clovis and folsum sites are with in range of the site 4 . i even question if there is a reason the chicomoztoc hunters would have gone west ,maybe hunting game or some other reason we dont under stand as of yet ...maybe the answer is at site 4...

let me put it in word anyone could under stand . if there is any record of the years between 13,500bc -9,500 bc at this site it would be the only place that kind of vidence has ever been found any where on earth ...fact .

so even if there is the slitest chance we must braing ing the speicalist and let them defind this site and find out if those evidences are here at this site ...

let me piont out one other thing i noted about the chicomoztoc site 4 ... look at how the valleys and gorges run north and south . this could have saved some of the catus and wild game in the aera and gave some kind of food sorce to a small tribe fiting to stay alive in a rough weather climate..

fresh water and food are needed to stay alive ...the southern climates could support the environments needed ...and this unique wilderness area has all of this at site 4

i also should piont out that few plants can with stand a wildfire ,but catus often do . and most specialist agree the black matt era may have been caused by massive wildfires ...between catus and rattle snakes and some isolated springs and streams the tribes could have surivied here ..

 

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[Oroblanco]

HOLA amigos,

Blindbowman wrote:

and i agree my skills are not normal or even excepted

Who says your skills are not normal? I was under the impression that at least some scientists are convinced that all human beings have some kinds of paranormal abilities, which are largely un-tapped and un-used. It would be abnormal to be absolutely devoid of any ability along these lines.

Blindbowman also wrote:

the clovis site in new mexico was the frist clovis site found its east of the chicomoztoc site .. the frist folsum site is also east of the chicomoztoc site . is this a matter of centering the cultures around chicomoztoc ...

Hmm, it may be making an assumption here amigo, since those sites (Clovis and Folsum) may be the first FOUND examples of their cultures, they are definitely not the oldest of their types. That would not necessarily serve to “center” them around Chicomoztoc. In fact the greatest concentrations of Clovis culture finds are very far east, in Maryland and around the Chesapeake Bay area. That would not really support the contention that the Clovis sites are in fact “centered” on the Superstitions (or as you propose Chicomoztoc).

Blindbowman also wrote:

let me put it in word anyone could under stand . if there is any record of the years between 13,500bc -9,500 bc at this site it would be the only place that kind of vidence has ever been found any where on earth ...fact .

Well I respectfully disagree on this point amigo, there are records of human habitations found all over the globe that date to this period and FAR earlier. Cave paintings in France, Morocco, Egypt, etc are as old as you mention or older, stone figurines have been found that date to 300,000 or even 500,000 years ago. (The TanTan Venus figurine) I think you are mistaken on this point.

(Suggested short treatment online at Wiki
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pre-historic_art )

I don't know exactly why you have linked Clovis and/or Folsom cultures to your sites in the Superstitions amigo, when I asked if you had found spear points you posted pics of stone points, but not Clovis or Folsom - is there more evidence of stone-age people living there? It would not be too surprising, but would be quite a find and well worth the arguments and effort to convince an archaeologist to go with you to take a look at them. Paleolithic and Neolithic sites are pretty rare in America, I think there are not more than a dozen known in all of Arizona.

Good luck and good hunting amigos, I hope you find the treasures that you seek.
Oroblanco

PS If you are researching along the lines of Clovis era or even earlier - you will enjoy this article Blindbowman:

New Evidence Puts Man In North America 50,000 Years Ago
http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2004/11/041118104010.htm

<Forgot to add this earlier>
_________________________________________________
Also, those two little riddles I posted were quite simple, if you think outside the box;

5 + 4 = 1001...in binary, 1001 is 9.
8 x 4 = 20...in hexadecimal, 20 is 32.

I thought if you could spot that easily, I would have greater confidence in what you claim for the mathematical abilities of the people of Chicomoztoc. Either you simply neglected to answer or you did not know the answer. You did say that they were far beyond the Mayans with their base-20 system, but how exactly did you pick out what their math system was? Is it possible that you are granting them greater math abilities than what is the case? Thank you in advance...

 

[pronghorn]

i never said i value the human race...

if saveing data that could save the human race is not a real treasure what is ...?

i have had enough of the human race to last me a life time

humans talk a lot of sh-- !

good catch ,i missread the foolishness ... i guess we are all human after all ... well i am ...lol

any of you Arizonians been up to steal BB's site yet, it's been 3 days?

 

[pronghorn]

Some of us already have our own site or sites depending on the case pronghorn...So, why would we want to go out and take BB's site? LOL

Ed T

why, cause we mere humans can't be trusted and we have to prove it.

 

[Cubfan64]

I swore I was going to take a break from this, but when I saw the photos of BB's site I couldn't resist.

BB - would it surprise you to know that on one of my trips to the Superstitions I had more than one person point out your site 4 "hill" to me and mention that it's where "The Blindbowman" thinks something exists?

Your name came up in discussion on a couple occassions and during the trip where you told me to explore your "heart mountain," I was told that wasn't where you were looking, but that there (pointing to the hill next to the trail) where your photo's came from is where you've been looking around.

By the way - could you explain to me exactly what your point is in the photo where you're holding the ruler in front of the camera? You mention comparing scales, but without knowing how far away the ruler is from the mountain as well as how far the ruler is from the camera it doesn't say much of anything.

 

[somehiker]

Hi Cubfan:
Now you be careful not to break BB's feelings here.All those infinite navigational theories were solved using that there special scale.All the world's best explorers use the Mayez 10330 aluminum yardstick.Besides,at 36" in length,it also makes a great snake tickler for them what's to ornery to get outta the way.Handy too,that site #4 is not too far from Harvey's,in case us treasure hunters stomachs start a growlin.Sites 1 thru 3 probly ain't too far from grub either.Them aztecs were pretty smart,huh.

Regards:SH.

 

[Cubfan64]

Hi Cubfan:
Now you be careful not to break BB's feelings here.All those infinite navigational theories were solved using that there special scale.All the world's best explorers use the Mayez 10330 aluminum yardstick.Besides,at 36" in length,it also makes a great snake tickler for them what's to ornery to get outta the way.Handy too,that site #4 is not too far from Harvey's,in case us treasure hunters stomachs start a growlin.Sites 1 thru 3 probly ain't too far from grub either.Them aztecs were pretty smart,huh.

Regards:SH.

shame shame shame

 

[Real de Tayopa Tropical Tramp]

HI BB, I have forgotten, perhaps you can enlighten me. What is the defraction index correction factor for low altitude sun shots in the Antarctic?

Don Jose de La Mancha

 

[somehiker]

Sorry bout that BB.
Them gals at the crispy creem musta put too much sugar in my coffee again.
Regards:SH.

 

[somehiker]

BB:You should try putting up a photo of something like this.Then I would know,and stop kidding you about all this.
This is a shot taken inside a cave below a volcanic rock formation in the superstitions.This cave is also a little more than halfway to the top.Once you are inside about twenty feet,the ceiling climbs to about thirty feet above where I was standing when I took this shot.There are more tunnels like this inside,and bats too.

Regards:SH.

 

[Oroblanco]

Ed T wrote:

Some of us already have our own site or sites depending on the case pronghorn...So, why would we want to go out and take BB's site

HOLA mi amigo Ed! You haven't posted any updates or news on your own explorations lately buddy - any new information you would like to share? (Assay reports, interesting ore shoots, signs of human habitation, tailings piles etc etc) You have been pretty quiet the last few weeks, so I must assume that you are too danged busy breaking up all the GOLD ORE and hauling it out to $$$$Sell, to be bothered with us! Thank you in advance,
Oroblanco

 

[Oroblanco]

Thanks Ed - sorry to hear that your in-laws are not doing well though. I hope things will turn around for them soon, and that you will get time to go out to your mine and get that thing into operation! The world needs more gold, silver and copper amigo and it is up to us to provide it!
Oroblanco

 

[Gossamer]

SH, that is so beautiful, it reminds me of the miner memorial in Superior, same gorgeous colors.
Thank you for sharing that. Was it a hard hike to the place?
Janiece

 

[somehiker]

Hi Gossamer:
The colors are way more brilliant in the photo,a result of my attempt to enhance the red color of the rock with a photo ed program,since the zenon flash of the camera seems to wash out the color red.This actually decreased the red and enhanced the green that streaked the tunnel in spots,but I thought that it was rather neat,so I posted it anyway.I have a sample of the rock,which varies in color from dull red in natural light to tan when under sodium lighting.It is also quite light in weight and easy to carve,which would have made a formation of this rock very easy to tunnel into.

Regards:SH.

 

[Gossamer]

So Geronimo did have caves and tunnels to disappear into... wow... There is so much blood between Super and Superior.
Janiece

 

[somehiker]

So Geronimo did have caves and tunnels to disappear into... wow... There is so much blood between Super and Superior.
Janiece

While Geronimo may have heard of this place,I doubt that he ever visited.He would more likely have crossed to the other side of the street.There is probably a good reason for the lack of any fire pits or smokestains or charcoal in some of these otherwise great places to set up camp.The Apache were known to have used the old Salado cliff dwellings as shelter from time to time,leaving many Salado artifacts within.Why then,would they steer clear of other useable shelter,in good locations with a view,unless of course,they were superstitious because of what they found out there when they first arrived.

Regards:SH

 

[Real de Tayopa Tropical Tramp]

K some hiker, mi buddy: Clarify on that beautiful blue/green ore. Cu, Ag., and what else? How rich? Obviously it extended upwards, what is it's general strike and dip? How wide at the upper level?

As they say, I have my plate completely full. But Oro, CJ and especially Djicy are greedy - heheeheheh -- so descrete information only is asked, not specifics.

Don Jose de La Mancha

 

[somehiker]

Real:
It really is just a big,dome shaped cave in a formation of rhyolitic tephra that is capped with about eight hundred feet of lighter colored volcanic rock.There may be some mineral in the cap but any removal of the red tephra was done to clear the floor and tunnels of debris and to make the cave larger,but not to raise the ceiling.I really need to go back with some serious candlepower,lightweight enough to climb with,before I can say more.

Regards:SH.

 

[Gossamer]

And what would it be? What were they afraid of?
Janiece

 

[somehiker]

Gossamer:
In answer to your question I would probably say,and it's just a hunch,that anything that they may have found when they first entered the Superstitions,in places such as this and with artwork like the image on the canyon wall that I posted previously in this thread,would have preyed on their superstitions.If they had discovered a human record of brutality such as that which was found centuries later by archaeologists at BeshBeGowa,for example,I don't think that they would have tossed the bones and moved in.After all,they certainly knew what their own victims looked like when they were finished with them,and that was bad enough.
It was not unknown for apache raiders to leave their victim with his heart removed,although rare perhaps, nonetheless a practice unique to my knowledge among the north american tribes,as well as the europeans.
I have wondered why.
Mummified human remains have been found in arid places throughout the southwest,and identifiable foodstuffs in sealed pottery as well,centuries old.
Is it not plausible that when the apache first migrated to this place,that they found ample such evidence left behind by those that had vacated those mountains? Evidence from which they developed their own brand of brutality?
Just something else to think about,I guess.

Regards:SH.