TDI BeachHunter vs Surfmaster Dual Field

[Dechert360]

I currently hunt with a Tesoro Sand Shark and I'm looking for more depth and a larger coil to cover more ground. Having two little ones and going back to college again has taken a lot of time away from hunting so I'm looking to maximize my time out there.

I haven't been able to find much comparing the two and can't find the Dual Field on Whites site anymore. Is the TDI BeachHunter replacing the Dual field? Is the almost 400 difference between the two worth it?

I've used the dual field twice and found it would false as I would swing towards the water or when a wave would approach the coil, is that normal with the TDI BH as well?



Thank you in advance!

 

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[OBN]

OBN. "I believe the Fisher "AQ" is 7μS, now that will be interesting." (c) 100% not less than 10μS, especially with this coil!for 9μS or 8μS, a special coil with a minimum capacity and low quality factor is already needed, this is not what I see in the photo and video.


headphones you are completely right! here I completely agree with you
Ruslan.

Alexandra T is the man behind the "AQ" , https://www.linkedin.com/in/tartar-alexandre-b7131b99/

 

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[stavr]

OBN. I'm talking about real numbers on the ground and the answer is from real coils and goals (in the laboratory you can even 7)
you can write anything on the device ...., on my dolphin the PI was graded 5-6-7-8-9-10-11-12-14-14-16
when I was asked if your device is working at 5μS? I answered, I strive for this ....
PS: AQ -12.5” Mono Coil & 7μS ....
give the coil data or I don’t understand something in physics
even "correct" coils over 11 "do not want to work below 9μS
pss: we say: wait ...- see later ...
Ruslan.

 

[Terry Soloman]

TDI / GQAS / AS /GQ - has a delay from 10 μS
DF -has a delay from 15 μS
all small targets (earrings, thin rings) deep medium targets will not be visible to PI ... because the response from the target has already broken up and is not available for processing

There is a lot of controversy over "Pulse Delay," and its importance to depth and small target sensitivity. Unfortunately, most people don't understand that a setting of 10us pulse delay, can be very chatty and unsteady on wet sand. So even though you may be getting more sensitivity to smaller targets, you might not hear them.

Now, move your coil from the wet sand and into the water and you will have to increase your pulse delay to at least 15us to smooth out the threshold. By the time you have reached a depth of five-feet in saltwater, you'll need a pulse delay of about 20us.

Those who fault the Tesoro Sand Shark for running a 19.5us pulse delay, instead of a 15us pulse delay like the Dual Field, claiming it is less sensitive - or lacks depth are welcome to their opinion, but if you have used the different machines like I have, you know better. The pulse delay must be coupled with power to the coil, and circuitry that filters and reads the return signal. The performance of a machine is NOT based only on pulse delay. That is my opinion, and why I think I would rather have a set pulse delay of 20us, than 15us or 10us. Placing my flame ******ant long johns on now

 

[stavr]

There is a lot of controversy over "Pulse Delay," and its importance to depth and small target sensitivity. Unfortunately, most people don't understand that a setting of 10us pulse delay, can be very chatty and unsteady on wet sand. So even though you may be getting more sensitivity to smaller targets, you might not hear them.

Now, move your coil from the wet sand and into the water and you will have to increase your pulse delay to at least 15us to smooth out the threshold. By the time you have reached a depth of five-feet in saltwater, you'll need a pulse delay of about 20us.

Those who fault the Tesoro Sand Shark for running a 19.5us pulse delay, instead of a 15us pulse delay like the Dual Field, claiming it is less sensitive - or lacks depth are welcome to their opinion, but if you have used the different machines like I have, you know better. The pulse delay must be coupled with power to the coil, and circuitry that filters and reads the return signal. The performance of a machine is NOT based only on pulse delay. That is my opinion, and why I think I would rather have a set pulse delay of 20us, than 15us or 10us. Placing my flame ******ant long johns on now

1) for a beginner, your approach is logical.
2) for the average user, you can put up with 19μS
3) for the advanced, this is not acceptable, at least 12μS\ on.off ground balance \ fine tuning of the device \ alternative coils is necessary
4) for the Guru user- this is just ridiculous! 10 μS or less, \ turbo mode \ on.off ground balance \ subtle settings for all device parameters \ top quality op-amp, ADC, processor and DSP, coils / programming signal processing / working with soil and target databases ... etc.
ps: imho
Ruslan.

 

[sandmartin]

OBN, to be honest ... then I don’t believe the Fisher"AQ"project (more precisely, I don’t expect anything extraordinary from them, it’s another dull md ...)
View attachment 1751587
I already see some serious mistakes that won't make a hit! IMHO of course
if this team is interested in my opinion, I will answer their questions with a glass of beer or wine ...
Ruslan.

Ruslan, what mistakes do you see?

 

[stavr]

Ruslan, what mistakes do you see?

I still see awkward things - outstanding for "promising prospects." I didn’t say it is impossible ... I’m just waiting for the result, which I don’t see yet.


I didn’t see anything serious (real oscillograms of working on the beach on a gold ring, device board, X-ray photo coil, coil parameters), therefore it’s too early to judge serious errors .... but as an experienced user and person who makes and repairs metal detectors for a very long time I see absurdities ... between photos and statements ...
Ruslan.

 

[Terry Soloman]

1) ...4) for the Guru user- this is just ridiculous! 10 μS or less, \ turbo mode \ on.off ground balance \ subtle settings for all device parameters \ top quality op-amp, ADC, processor and DSP, coils / programming signal processing / working with soil and target databases ... etc.
ps: imho
Ruslan.

Yes, in the gold fields with my Minelab GPZ, but NOT on a saltwater beach. You simply DO NOT NEED that kind of power or depth.

 

[OBN]

...Terry "Honestly" I need the depth..let me have it ..Please...

And Fisher..a two or three year warranty..Please

I do agree with Ruslan, We are going to need time on this one. But i'm willing to gamble ...

 

[Terry Soloman]

Of all the gold rings found in wet sand or water at the beach, how many were deeper than 12"? For myself, the vast majority of gold has been between 5" to 10" deep. My deepest was in the dry sand at about 16" deep. Most found with an 8" coil on a Tesoro Sand Shark.

 

[OBN]

Of all the gold rings found in wet sand or water at the beach, how many were deeper than 12"? For myself, the vast majority of gold has been between 5" to 10" deep. My deepest was in the dry sand at about 16" deep. Most found with an 8" coil on a Tesoro Sand Shark.

Seems they can be just about any depth here, several times I can get a spot where it is loaded with older coins and in the mist of checking the hole after digging them I find a gold ring on the wall or just deeper. A few times and just recently I've dug a deep wheaty, then there was another a foot away. They were in the area of 12 to 14 inch's, as I was doing my circle I got a solid hit, like a fresh drop..gold ring..in the dug sand I had thrown to the side. Then a few years ago, we had a spot that we wore out. Until we realized by just digging a hole we could find gold rings and silver coins, Mike and I called it mining. And just from hunting maybe 15 beach's in the last year 5 years, many times. I see a pattern...And remember this is in the water only, where sands shift...

On another note I had a honey hole this past july..37 gold rings in 32 days. All in the deeper water, chest to chin deep. Some how mother nature opened a area up, cleaned most of the sand out...targets where every where..but mostly just rings and most were gold. Since I have to play the tide games I was only able to get into the area 15 times in that 32 days..every hunt I found gold, shallow I would say..mostly 6 to 12 inch's (variations because the bottom/slope is not perfectly flat). Never had them that shallow before, Then Bam..A Northeaster came in for a few days... and filled her back in...Gone, covered..I can dig down about 2 feet and hit the crunchy shells that holds the gold...it's there I just can hear it...

I could continue with the stories but I can Honestly say, I know the spots I hunt very well, it changes I will noticed it.

I need deep...Please

 

[stavr]

Of all the gold rings found in wet sand or water at the beach, how many were deeper than 12"? For myself, the vast majority of gold has been between 5" to 10" deep. My deepest was in the dry sand at about 16" deep. Most found with an 8" coil on a Tesoro Sand Shark.

when you find a honey hole and you need to clean this place as deep as possible (while it is no covered with a layer of sand) every centimeter / inch of depth is important !!!
custom PI or Eric Foster in turbo mode lays the battery in a hour and you dig holes in 15-16 "but during this time the device can pay for itself ..., you just probably haven’t encountered such cases ..., they are not everyone year ... but it depends on the luck, experience, frequency of your hunts ...

 

[Octopulse]

TDI is a POS. Dual Field is same-same as the Shark. Step away from the PI and get the Minelab Equinox. You do NOT need more depth!

The total inaccuracy of the above statement by Terry Soloman is astounding......moderators should remove the above post for the benefit of newcomers and to maintain the integrity of this great forum. I have been using the TDIBH for just over one year and it is the deepest seeking detector currently available for beach and water work. If you want real advice then just PM me. I use both pulse and VLF detectors (over 20 years) and both complement one another depending on junk in the water and black sands.
Tony

PS.......I do agree with his views on pulse delays though......which makes his comment about the TDIBH perplexing.

 

[stavr]

I have been using the TDIBH for just over one year and it is the deepest seeking detector currently available for beach and water work. ..

except for devices from Eric Foster although TDI & TDIBH was made using Eric ...

 

[Octopulse]

except for devices from Eric Foster although TDI & TDIBH was made using Eric ...

TDIBH about a 1” deeper than Deepstar.....Made detailed records when a Deepstar was available to me many years ago.
TDIBH 2” to 3” deeper than Goldquest SS, Aquasearch. By deeper, I mean on typical ring or coin sized targets. My standard target over all these years is my 18K wedding ring. TDIBH also deeper than any Mineab SD/GP range of machines as these have been powered down for any beach work. TDIBH running a 14.8v battery pack for these results.
Tony

 

[dewcon4414]

Picking those tiny HIGH conductor on a beach proves very little if you are looking for gold in black sand. Even a chatty cheap single freq may get a piece of gold occasionally... but they arent the better choice, i think thats the point here. The uS rating a lots going to depend on the size of gold you are looking for...... if you are just ring hunting go for a higher uS...or setting. I have the Nox..... because it does well on various sizes of gold with the down side being those high conductors and tiny bits of foil. BUT .... im not into digging fish hooks at 15"....so i make that trade off and let you young guys dig the big ole holes while i cover more beach. I keep being told that 7uS just isnt going to work in the salt water.... but im not certain they said it would...... thus the pulse delay. NOW.... if it has to be increased to say 10 uS....which machine will win the depth match? Im thinking the one with the most power to the coil.....as far as the DF it lacks both power to the coil and sensitivity in this match.

 

[stavr]

TDIBH about a 1” deeper than Deepstar.....Made detailed records when a Deepstar was available to me many years ago.
TDIBH 2” to 3” deeper than Goldquest SS, Aquasearch. By deeper, I mean on typical ring or coin sized targets. My standard target over all these years is my 18K wedding ring. TDIBH also deeper than any Mineab SD/GP range of machines as these have been powered down for any beach work. TDIBH running a 14.8v battery pack for these results.
Tony

... I meant AquaStar

 

[BeachBunnyTRHunter]

Great Beach Detector - Garrett Seahunter II with an elliptical 10 x 14" coil

I have a Garrett Seahunter II with an elliptical 10 x 14" coil and I have had excellent success with this setup. I can routinely pull coins and small jewelry at depth - over 12" down in wet, beach sand. Pin pointing is now quite precise for me. While I know this is only a single- Channel plus induction unit, it does a pretty good job and I expect similar performance when I take it in the water. $450 preowned in like new condition. Mind you, I like the ATX but it's 4x the price of mine.

If "POS" means "pulse on steroids", I agree! I used the Dual Field for several years with great success in the wet sand, black sand and surf. I'm still learning the TDI but it seems to be more sensitive to smaller and deeper gold and performs better in the black sand (with proper settings). I have often referred to my TDI as the Dual Field on steroids.

 

[LawrencetheMDer]

The Nox can’t hunt black sand. I’ve got a lot of beach I can’t cover with the Nox due to overload. Even turning down sensitivity to the single digits.

I hunt black sand all day long and have no issues with my Equinox 800 running at 21-23 sensitivity on west coast Florida beaches. The black sand is often in layers and goes down more than a foot.

 

[dewcon4414]

I believe Terry early on didnt necessarily mean you dont need more depth. Depth is no good if you are digging trash...... and if you get into virgin targets.... there can be a lot. What you need is good disc for that depth. Maybe the AQ will give us that.... maybe not. Right now the Nox is taking beach hunting by storm because it can hit a gold 3 gram ring in very wet water at 12" and give a fairly good TID that its not iron. Ive got an MDT that gets a couple more inches..... but its all about having a good idea of what you are digging or you dont cover much beach and end up doing a LOT of "COMMUNITY SERVICE" as i call it. One reason why most dont use a PI..... they are time consuming vs the pay out. So most people loose patience when at the end of the day their buddy covered the whole beach and ended up with recent drops they never got to. Another thing to consider is ..... is your beach sanded in? If you have 3' of sand depth aint going to help you.... so dont waste your money or time on a machine just to dig SOMETHING.