Swamp Gold

[Jon Phillips]

Nice!

 

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[ECS]

ANOTHER CONNECTION TO THE CSA GOLD

CHARLES GREENLEIGH McKINNEY-b 08.08,1847 Danville ,Ga /d 10.16,1926 Everglades City,Fl
Served at CSA Fort Meade under CSA Capt Hendry and CSA Major Mornelin as a soldier,blacksmith & shoe maker.In later life,wrote a weekly south Florida history column for a Collier county newspaper.Could the original swamp gold story come from one of his articles?
Now for an interesting connection:
McKinney's daughter,Lilly Lee,married CHARLES CHRISTOPHER JOHNSON b2.21,1874,on 06.30,1904.
Johnson was an avid treasure hunter,claimed to know the locations of many buried treasures and shipwrecks in south Florida.Mel Fisher consulted him many times on locations.
One interesting scam Johnson was involved in,was coating silver dollars with GOLD,and passing them off at the local RR station.
PS: The CSA NAVAL buttons is a great find! Wasn't there a harbour at LEMON CITY in the 1860's?

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

I dont know. I would imagine Lemon City is connected to Biscayne Bay. I doubt the buttons have any connection to the Confederate gold but I just tossed it in because it looks good. I found the pouch in the rubble of a demolished old shack. There was about a dozen CW buttons in all. The CSN is worth a few thousand but didnt make banner because its not a recent find.. http://www.treasurenet.com/forums/m...sewife-lost-found-lost-found-again-today.html

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

CHARLES GREENLEIGH McKINNEY-b 08.08,1847 Danville ,Ga /d 10.16,1926 Everglades City,Fl
Served at CSA Fort Meade under CSA Capt Hendry and CSA Major Mornelin as a soldier,blacksmith & shoe maker.In later life,wrote a weekly south Florida history column for a Collier county newspaper.Could the original swamp gold story come from one of his articles?
Now for an interesting connection:
McKinney's daughter,Lilly Lee,married CHARLES CHRISTOPHER JOHNSON b2.21,1874,on 06.30,1904.
Johnson was an avid treasure hunter,claimed to know the locations of many buried treasures and shipwrecks in south Florida.Mel Fisher consulted him many times on locations.
One interesting scam Johnson was involved in,was coating silver dollars with GOLD,and passing them off at the local RR station.
PS: The CSA NAVAL buttons is a great find! Wasn't there a harbour at LEMON CITY in the 1860's?

I copied this so we dont lose it. I would like to read those newspapers. There was Collier County map printed in the 1940's that I would really like to see but I was unable to locate a copy.

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

I havent read the book but I see Lemon City does go back to 1850. Thats about the oldest settlement in Miami.

 

[ECS]

I copied this so we dont lose it. I would like to read those newspapers. There was Collier County map printed in the 1940's that I would really like to see but I was unable to locate a copy.

McKinney and Johnson still have descendants living in the same area. Check their genealogy site.
McKinney's articles appeared in the COLLIER COUNTY NEWS and were syndicated in northern newspapers as a column called "AMERICAN EAGLE".
I have yet to find an archive of either.
The Mel Fisher connection was a surprise,and I wonder where Johnson got the gold to coat the silver dollars,and if his direct descendants have additional knowledge.
Can it be coincidence that the daughter of a man who served at CSA Fort Meade married a man who had enough gold to coat silver dollars?

 

[Jon Phillips]

Not a coincidence. Fort Meade being the center of the cattle trade with Cuba, there was plenty of gold for all involved. In reading the two excellent books by Canter Brown Jr., they had so much of it, that they were somewhat careless with it. I know of at least two gold coins found in Fort Meade recently...one Spanish, indicating it was part of a Cuban cattle payment at some point.

 

[ECS]

Not a coincidence. Fort Meade being the center of the cattle trade with Cuba, there was plenty of gold for all involved. In reading the two excellent books by Canter Brown Jr., they had so much of it, that they were somewhat careless with it. I know of at least two gold coins found in Fort Meade recently...one Spanish, indicating it was part of a Cuban cattle payment at some point.

That is why I think the CSA gold story in the Everglades was from a cattle payment and not part of the CSA treasury as the legend states.

 

[ECS]

I would like to read those newspapers.

AMERICAN EAGLE NEWSPAPER-ESTERO,FLORIDA 1906-1946
Published by: THE KORESHAN UNITY
Charles Greenleigh McKinney used a pen name,"PROGRESS"
The Miami-Dade Public Library System and The University of Florida have these papers on microfilm.

 

[Jon Phillips]

That is why I think the CSA gold story in the Everglades was from a cattle payment and not part of the CSA treasury as the legend states.

Makes sense.

If I had just received a large payment for cattle from Cuba, and landed at Punta Rossa with it, and the news was relayed that the war was over...or about to be over...I would be thinking: "Well, the government that this belongs to no longer exists, and the government officials are fleeing this way...Union troops control most of the coast, and do as they please with the whole Fort Meade area...Maybe I'll just bury this on my way back...for safe keeping" Maybe in those hard times after reconstruction, when no one was looking for it anymore, I make plans to go dig it up...maybe I do, or maybe I get caught up in all the vigilante violence, and post-war retribution going on at the time, and never make it to the gold.

In reading accounts of the fighting back and forth between Confederate Fort Meade, and Federal Fort Myers...they seemed to follow the old Seminole War trails as, I think, BCH was saying. I think there was mention of some of the other fort sites along the Caloosahatchee. That route could have definately been considered "The Everglades" at the time. Judah P. Benjamin was hiding out at the Gamble plantation, and at a house across the river, before he fled. I think that area and the Port Charlotte area is probably about as far south as anyone was willing to travel. Benjamin had gold on him. There is an account of the wife of one of his hosts sewing pockets into his clothes to hide the coins.

I would just think that the route from Punta Rossa to Fort Meade would be the best bet for cattle gold to be buried. Gold is very heavy, and any decent amount of it is going to need a wagon, or at least pack animals to haul it....and I just don't see either of those making it very deep into the Everglades off of the established roads.

The part of the two hills rising like a camel's back, sounds like Indian middens....that might be another way of researching the location, if it exists. Look into Paleo, and "first-contact" sites of villages along the Calossahatchee area and south.

 

[ECS]

APRIL 19,1865-The remains of the Confederate treasury,gold & silver coins,silver bullion,and paper bills,along with CSA Sec of the treasury Judah P Benjamin and CSA Sec of war John C Breckinridge,were at the MARSHALL family plantation in Abbeville,SC.
NOTE:Benjamin was 2nd cousin to David Levy Yulee,Cottonwood plantation,Archer,Florida,where some of the treasury was captured in May,1865.
NOTE:The Marshall family also had a plantation,at SHARPES FERRY on the Oklawaha River-CSA Capt J J Dickinson repelled the last Union presence at this location,March 10,1865,keeping the west side of the ST Johns River in the control of the Confederates.
Benjamin and Breckinridge traveled down the Oklawaha River on blockade runner Hubbard Hart's JAMES BURT riverboat,arriving in Ocala,Florida,May 15,1865.Breckinridge stayed at the Ocala home of CSA Brig Gen Robert Bullock,while Benjamin stayed with Ocala relative,Solomon Benjamin.
NOTE:Both men had a partial amount of the Confederate gold and silver coins for theie escape.
Breckinridge was supplied a lifeboat by Capt J J dickinson ,which he had captured during the sinking of the US Columbine on the St Johns.Breckinridge head south to the east coast of Florida,and arrived in Cuba two weeks later.By Aug 21,1865,he arrivied in England.
Benjamin made his way to FORT MEADE,securing refuge with CSA COMMISSARY AGENT,Capt James McKay Sr (aka paymaster),stayed at the Gamble manison in Ellenton,where arrangements were made with Capt Archibald McNeil,blockade runner,to take him to the Bahamas.
NOTE: Benjamin set up the blockade trading routes for the CSA and had many contacts in the Caribbean.
Where Breckinridge and Benjamin pursued by Union forces,they were war criminals wanted by the US government?
That each had a portion of the CSA treasury,but I doubt that either of them buried it,as they needed it for their escape.
Benjamin remained in England,and sent money to his former CSA friends,including $12,000 to Jefferson Davis.
Breckinridge recieved amesty,Aug 21,1869,returned to Lexington,KY,and became a vice-president of a railroad.
Is the Swamp Gold Legend a combination of Breckinridge/Benjamin flight,Summerlin's penchant for burying his gold, Capt John Riley Bless McIntosh blockade runner,the little battle of Bowlegs Creek,and the raid on Fort Meade and surrounding homesteads?

Jon,I bumped this up from page 42 of this thread in case you missed my summery. I do appreciate your history imput,it has helped fill in some gaps.
Members of the 1st FLORIDA SPECIAL CALVARY BATTALION,company B,who aided Judah P Benjamin during his stay at GAMBLE PLANTATION:
CSA Lt Col Munnerlyn
CSA Major John A McKay
CSA Capt James McKay Sr
CSA Capt Leroy G Lesley
CSA Capt John T Lesley
Plant City has a monument to the "COW CALVARY",will all the members listed.
Another interesting fact:
Cattleman,MOSES BARBER,built a 10ft wide road with "crossties of heartpine over a saltwater bog and patches of quick"to Summerlin's dock at Punta Rassa.
Another piece of the legend?

 

[Jon Phillips]

That is referred to as a "courduroy road" There was one at the Confederate battery at Bayport, and some were built during the Second Seminole War on the way to the battle of Okeechobee. It was a common, and easily built, way of traversing swampy land.

I think John McKay Sr. was a blockade runner as well. I think he owned the Scottish Chief, and Kate Dale, that were scuttled in the Hillsborough River to avoid capture by Union forces. He was captured, I think, at Fort Brooke or Tampa, and had to agree to cease hostilities and help the Federals. It is all covered in Canter Browns book on Tampa During the Civil War....I would have to look at it again for the details.

Lots of access to gold payments with all those guys!

 

[Jayong63]

It sounds interesting but not the same fort. The only thing he found in plain view was a flintlock and coral rock wall as far as I know. The story is eerily similar. I would imagine there are many runaway slave locations and the Indians also had fintlocks. I have looked at about 10 old maps and they all show Fort Harrel on or near New River which also matches Smallwoods story.. There were however many other temporary forts and supply depots scattered throughout the area.

As you know the US was unable to erradicate the Seminoles. They tried to defeat them by building forts and cutting off canoe routes but it didnt succeed.

BCH
The 10,000 islands runs from the Northwestern tip of Cape Sable north for 60 miles. The mouth of the Shark River is at Ponce de leon bay, Just North of Cape Sable. So, that map is actually correct.

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

BCH
The 10,000 islands runs from the Northwestern tip of Cape Sable north for 60 miles. The mouth of the Shark River is at Ponce de leon bay, Just North of Cape Sable. So, that map is actually correct.

Hello Jay. Do you live in South Florida? There is no way the Ten Thousand Islands come down to Cape Sable or even Shark River at Ponce De Leon Bay. From Marco Island down to Lostmans at the very most! Ten Thousand Islands - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

The Ten Thousand Islands are a chain of islands and mangrove islets off the coast of southwest Florida, between Cape Romano (at the southern end of Marco Island) and the mouth of Lostman's River.



Click on map to zoom in. http://www.us-national-parks.net/images/ever.jpg

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

Ponce De Leon Bay is incorrectly marked as the Ten Thousand Islands. http://www.acwv.info/1-files-seminole-indian-war/Fort Harrell - Ten Thousand Islands.jpg

Someone brought to my attention that this may have been purposely done to confuse readers of the historical site locations.

 

[Jon Phillips]

Sorry I havent had time to read all the posts and many thanks for the help. . Im being moved from the Indian Res to Monroe Station in the middle of nowhere and I was unfortunately unable to look over the area of "Cloud Mountain." For now it will have to wait.

Jon Phillips I read your post on the Pirate cache thread the other day and you said all the things I was trying to say but in a much nicer way apparently. I dont have the guts to post any serious comments on that thread anymore. I applaud your efforts of not being intimidated or afraid to post your opinions and for trying to help.

Thanks.

I just tried to show some of the problems with some of the story. There are just so many stories out there of people that "know" where all these famous treasures are, but they never recover one. I also have a problem with map dowsers knowing all these specific things about a treasure (what, and how much it is, how deep, who put it there, etc), just from swinging a pendelum over a map. If it is 100% psychic powers, why the material in the pendelum, and the map? Why not use a crystal ball? If there is some sort of science or physics to it...why all the details that a map can't show you? I know I'm preaching to the choir here......

I just tried to help him on the next endeavor with the state, as I'm afraid this one is over as far as they are concerned!
I also wanted to point out why there was such negativity towards him on that thread. We all don't accept mystical things as truth on a daily basis.

I don't post a lot...but I usually think out what I want say ahead of time, and gather whatever information I can, instead of just jumping in!

 

[Jon Phillips]

Ponce De Leon Bay is incorrectly marked as the Ten Thousand Islands. http://www.acwv.info/1-files-seminole-indian-war/Fort%20Harrell%20-%20Ten%20Thousand%20Islands.jpg

Someone brought to my attention that this may have been purposely done to confuse readers of the historical site locations.

I'm actually the reason all that stuff showed up on that website.

I had spoke with him when he lived here in Florida, and had contacted him on some things, and got his interest back up on Seminole War sites.

Several of those maps have some misnamed lakes, roads, etc. And some have the sites in out and out different places than the source material....but some are dead on....which I wish they weren't! I worked hard at researching, and payed a lot of money for research material and programs, etc., to find some places...now a good google search can turn some up!

 

[Jon Phillips]

Those bullets fired from Capone's men would be awesome to have! I would love to detect that property!

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

Those bullets fired from Capone's men would be awesome to have! I would love to detect that property!

I asked but was told directly and sternly without hesitation NO!!. They are good people and do not like any publicity but I dont think Im posting anything thats not already known. The tree died a slow death possibly from lead poisoning. He also has the shells.

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

I'm actually the reason all that stuff showed up on that website.

I had spoke with him when he lived here in Florida, and had contacted him on some things, and got his interest back up on Seminole War sites.

Several of those maps have some misnamed lakes, roads, etc. And some have the sites in out and out different places than the source material....but some are dead on....which I wish they weren't! I worked hard at researching, and payed a lot of money for research material and programs, etc., to find some places...now a good google search can turn some up!

I can see that its a very interesting site with cool finds. I was just a little worried that Fort Harrel was already discovered. Im hoping its not Fort Harrel.

I know its kind of a shame that all these secret sites are popping up on the internet for all to see. It makes me cringe. Actually the entire metal detecting hobby has gotten out of control.