Simple solution to fine gold recovery

[johnedoe]

This was developed by Randy Clarkson, an expert in gold recovery designs.

A simple gizmo to help miners snag lost gold..... New gizmo could help placer miners snag lost gold | Yukon News

Also this by Randy Clarkson on fine gold recovery which is somewhat misleading in that this is mostly about commercial ops and 1" minus classification is considered fine....... The Clarkson Study Fine Gold Recovery

Here is a PDF presentation of the process....... http://www.geology.gov.yk.ca/pdf/141114_Nov1014_Grinding_for_Gold_Presentation.pdf ....... Thank you arizau for finding that PDF

Enjoy the learning.

 

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[Disfunctional]

Just letting anyone following this topic know, that I did get into town Wednesday but couldn't find the piece of 6" pvc i had. I hunted around and the closest i could come up with is 4" diameter ABS. Not sure if it will do the job as well, but i can try it.

Still looking for a wiper motor and should have one or two soon. I wanted to build a small jaw crusher powered by one of them. I started another thread that will cover both of these snd the heater i'll need to build.

http://www.treasurenet.com/forums/g...ineral-prospectors-diy-plans.html#post4491741


If anyone else is improvising a small version of this rod mill, I hope you'll let us know how your making out? I know I'll have to get to the city for some classifier screen if I can't find some in town. Hopefully I can avoid the 200km round trip.

 

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[allenkeeton]

I'm following this thread. Seems to me that if you are going to build this thing, you may want it to last. I would think that using plastic of any sort on the drum would eventually create scratches and craters on the inside from the tumbling action making it less effective over time. Perhaps a scrap yard may have some metal drain pipe available that could handle it better. and while your there, maybe look for a motor from an old electric wheelchair if you think you may need more power. Just a suggestion from the peanut gallery.

 

[Disfunctional]

I was actually wanting to see how well a cheap version would last. If a simple and light weight rod mill will last a few seasons before having to replace a relatively inexpensive plastic drum, that would normally be used as a liner in a retail version of a rod mill, then the steel outer shell may not be needed. As mentioned on the thread on another forum discussion about a highbanker, a 12" diameter PVC rod mill was built and used successfully. Scaling one down that has a continuous feed and discharge just seems like the next logical step.

As for wanting to use a wiper motor, they're just a lot more common than electric wheelchair motors. If a person wanted, they could use the hub motor off an electric bike, but that's way beyond my budget. It's whatever scrap items I can use to cobble together a working rod mill. If the plastic wears out, there's more durable plastics to be had. If my needs require using metal at some future point, I still have the motor belt, pulleys and frame to reuse.

 

[arizau]

I was actually wanting to see how well a cheap version would last. If a simple and light weight rod mill will last a few seasons before having to replace a relatively inexpensive plastic drum, that would normally be used as a liner in a retail version of a rod mill, then the steel outer shell may not be needed. As mentioned on the thread on another forum discussion about a highbanker, a 12" diameter PVC rod mill was built and used successfully. Scaling one down that has a continuous feed and discharge just seems like the next logical step.

As for wanting to use a wiper motor, they're just a lot more common than electric wheelchair motors. If a person wanted, they could use the hub motor off an electric bike, but that's way beyond my budget. It's whatever scrap items I can use to cobble together a working rod mill. If the plastic wears out, there's more durable plastics to be had. If my needs require using metal at some future point, I still have the motor belt, pulleys and frame to reuse.

Have you thought about the possible/probable(?) unintended consequences in a continuous feed system for this usage?

With increased retention time the already flattened/enlarged gold will become thinner and thinner. As new feed is added the coarse material can and probably will cut up the thinnest pieces of gold (overgrind) to the point that the now smaller gold will pass the screen with the waste material thus exacerbating the original problem. What you will end up with is gold in finer fractions than the original feed mixed with waste material making it even more difficult to recover. There are indirect references to this in the original presentation by Randy and you can re read it here. http://www.geology.gov.yk.ca/pdf/141114_Nov1014_Grinding_for_Gold_Presentation.pdf
I'm pretty sure that is why they stick with a small batch operating procedure.

Good luck in what ever you end up doing and keep us posted.

PS: The screens you mention that are in use in rod milling are probably scalping screens for mill overflow and that may be what you have in mind. The complication here is how do you ensure that the retention time of old feed is sufficient for proper grinding and flattening while continuously mixing the material with new feed?

 

[Disfunctional]

Re: "unintended consequences".
Over grinding may be an issue, but i'll wait and see. One person commenting on another forum mentioned a mine not far from here that used very large rod mills and there was a comment how they had to shut down and scrape the gold off of the rods.

This project is basically intended as something i'm doing because of my limited budget. Posting any progress or discovey i might make here, is intended to help keep others from repeating my mistakes. In the end i know i'll have something workable. Between now and then is the journey of discovery that makes it interesting.

 

[GoldpannerDave]

Reading through the latest comments, I have to agree that a batch process is probably better for starters. With PVC, you could always add the holes later to make it a continuous process. However, I think Arizau is correct, in that a part, perhaps a good part, of your first "batch" gets overground as the 2nd "batch" is fed into the mill. In standard mining, they don't care if the gold is ground to powder in a rod mill, but for this application we care very much.

Disfunctional also has a point about trying the low end first for materials and see how it works. Money is a factor for many miners, so if PVC works, that is great. For me and my rock tumbler, I have made no progress because I have yet to get to the south end of town (nearly an hour round trip without "shopping" time) to get iron or steel bars. We are in the last 2 weeks of class here at the Air Force Academy and there are lab reports to grade, finals to give and grade, course paper to grade and all the multitude of things that come due at the end of the term. Then some freedom! And I selfishly may hit the creek for a bit of gold before I hit the scrap metal companies for a bit of iron.

Meanwhile, I am watching carefully for progress reports here. Thanks to all who are helping with their ideas and critiques!

 

[GoldpannerDave]

I built a mini version of this using the paper handling mechanism from an inkjet printer (for free!). I used a coffee can as the drum and some random pieces of chain and rod as the crushers. It worked until the motor burned out in one of my experiments...next time I'll add a cooling fan for the electric motor!

I was pleased by how it made particles smaller except the gold which got flattened and therefore "bigger"... Certainly easier to see in the pan!

See pictures of the flattened gold; Kevin's Own Thread, under Prospectors Journals. http://www.treasurenet.com/forums/prospectors-journals/398263-kevin-s-own-thread-journal-but-feel-free-post-random-thoughts-51.html

 

[KevinInColorado]

Thanks for connecting the threads Dave...I had lost track of this thread. For your convenience here is a pic:

 

[mytimetoshine]

Which brings us to another point..... Do hobby/recreational miners really need to goto this extent to capture the small amounts of gold they get?
I sure as hell don't..... And yes I am a "hobby/recreational miner" it gets me out for some fresh air and exercise from my normally physically sedate profession.

Uhmm... Because its interesting,cool as hell and fun...

 

[johnedoe]

Uhmm... Because its interesting,cool as hell and fun...

... Well there is that I guess...

 

[Disfunctional]

Uhmm... Because its interesting,cool as hell and fun...

In my situation, I'd like to add that it could make even hobbyist level panning more profitable. Several years ago there was a story that originated with the British . Columbia ministry of mines, (if memory serves correctly), that said on essense; 50% of the gold in this province has magnetic properties. Or words to that effect.

Since hearing this, I've wanted a way to extract the extra, likely unseen gold. Obviously theres iron involved and i know that my current claim has some telurides. Whatever form it may take, I want all the gold I can get out of my cons. I'm picky that way.

 

[mytimetoshine]

Rock & Gem Tumblers

Rock & Gem Tumblers

Featuring Lortone rock and gem tumblers and tumbling supplies.
ROCK, Gem & BLACK SAND TUMBLERS

These quality tumblers can be used by rock hounds to polish rocks; by a detectorist to clean coins, or by gold prospectors to clean and amalgamate black sand. These units have LORTONE patented molded rubber barrels with quick-seal closures. The powerful 110 volt motors are continuous duty and fan cooled. Each is quiet and simple to operate and provides excellent results.

Lortone, Manufacturers of Tools for Lapidary & Jewelry Artists



looks like this would work if your willing to drop the cash. On the goldfeverprospecting page they specifically state "to clean and amalgamate black sand."

 

[GoldpannerDave]

Rock & Gem Tumblers

Rock & Gem Tumblers

Featuring Lortone rock and gem tumblers and tumbling supplies.
ROCK, Gem & BLACK SAND TUMBLERS

These quality tumblers can be used by rock hounds to polish rocks; by a detectorist to clean coins, or by gold prospectors to clean and amalgamate black sand. These units have LORTONE patented molded rubber barrels with quick-seal closures. The powerful 110 volt motors are continuous duty and fan cooled. Each is quiet and simple to operate and provides excellent results.

Lortone, Manufacturers of Tools for Lapidary & Jewelry Artists



looks like this would work if your willing to drop the cash. On the goldfeverprospecting page they specifically state "to clean and amalgamate black sand."

Yes; when I first mentioned rock tumblers, I had one in the garage just stilling there but was thinking of using the rather large rods used by Randy Clarkson. I was afraid that the weight would be too much for the motor. However, Kevin used rather small rods and you saw the results up above in the picture. He used a coffee can, but I think a standard rock tumbler would work fine. I will be trying it just as soon as I can.

No need to buy a new one. I saw them as low as under $20 on e-bay.

 

[Duckwalk]

I have access to some motors from some IBM tape librarys here at work. These motors are made to be used all day everyday. let me know if i can be of some help.

 

[GoldpannerDave]

I have access to some motors from some IBM tape librarys here at work. These motors are made to be used all day everyday. let me know if i can be of some help.

Thanks for the kind offer.

 

[GoldpannerDave]

Thanks for connecting the threads Dave...I had lost track of this thread. For your convenience here is a pic:View attachment 1157272

You are most welcome. I just got 6 iron rods, 3/8" diameter, to use in my tumber! I cannot wait to try them out. However, I do have to wash the oil off of them first. They were scrap, and free, so I cannot complain. The guy even cut them (snapped really) to the correct length to fit in my tumbler. Then he polished the ends so I did not have to file them. I had told him what I what to do with them and now he insists I let him know how they worked. Wow, what a deal.

Anyway, about the machine he used to snap the rod. He set a depth stop, fed the rod in, hit a button or lever and "snap!" A piece of steel come down and snapped off the rod sticking out. The rod fell to the floor. He repeated it and soon I had 6 rods. Anyone know the name of the machine?

 

[KevinInColorado]

I have access to some motors from some IBM tape librarys here at work. These motors are made to be used all day everyday. let me know if i can be of some help.

Ducky, I will be down in Atl in mid June. I'd love to get one of the tape drive motors and more importantly shake hands with you! PM me!

 

[arizau]

Metal shear? https://www.google.com/webhp?source...spv=2&ie=UTF-8#q=metal shear to cut steel rod


PS: The rod charge on the original design was about half full if I recall correctly so you may want to take another trip if results are less than hoped for. Maybe a few of a larger size, as the design illustrates, too. The motor should be pretty durable since rock polishers are designed to run for days on end.

 

[Duckwalk]

Sent you a PM Kevin

 

[mytimetoshine]

I'm planning on either building or buying one of these. It's very interesting to me. I was at Home Depot today and looking for rods. They do have steel rods of the perfect diameters but no iron rods. Does it really matter if they are steel or iron? If so can someone explain it to me?

Also I'm still a bit confused on the process. So is this done dry or wet? If wet,it would seem to me, that it would be very difficult to remove the material.