Should we report treasure that we find?

[ivan salis]

oh I'm not a anglo phobe by far * my american govt also screws it folks as of late -- and I'm not pleased with that either --govts often by and large all to often tend to enslave the very people their supposed to be helping and looking out for , feeding their bloated ranks off money earned off the hard laboring sweating masses via various "taxes" imposed upon them.

I am all for good govt --thats only takes what it needs --leaving the bulk of the wealth and power in the hands of the people that earn it.

 

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[hogge]

This is the Obama style of government....statist/Socialistic/Communistic

If we continue our current path, we can expect the same absurdities, and loss of freedom in the U.S.

Britain has ceased to be a free country.

So stupid to always group socialism with communism, and capitalism is not all its cracked up to be.
And just for the record Britain is not a country anymore than North America is. Britain is part of a continent that encompasses 4 countries, England, Scotland, Northern Ireland and Wales. All 4 are as free as the USA


Gary

Well now Northern Ireland is............After England stuck it's nose out, and left.

 

[hogge]

First of all.....a hardy thanks to UK Stan for this "ongoing" controversial post. Second......You guys can look at the "positive" aspects of your governments laws and bylaws, and say it's good enough for me. The fact is, the few people that are making these laws up say it's for the common good. But is it coming from the moral majority, or the immoral minority that is speaking for you all? Seems to me, the "Monarchy" style of your so called "Democracy" is leading you into a "Socialist" style of government. I like you guys, and enjoy reading your posts and seeing the great coins and relics you find. But when I read the post of how this lady was treated over, what seems to be a rather insignificant find, I say . What's next on the agenda over there, censorship or book burning? Don't be afraid to speak up. Or are you afraid "Big Brother is Watching"? 8) (sometimes I even surprise myself)

You really do need to open your eyes and read your own news, my personal oppinion is that you are a biggot, nothing more nothing less.


Gary

I see in your avatar your only "detector" used is "Eyes, Ears, and Common Sense". Better add "Blinders" to that list, but they might be a little hard to put on with your head in your........... But then again, it may be easier than you think. Maybe that head is shaped like that narrow mind of yours. Remember, YOU threw the first slanderous remark.

 

[Peerless67]

oh I'm not a anglo phobe by far * my american govt also screws it folks as of late -- and I'm not pleased with that either --govts often by and large all to often tend to enslave the very people their supposed to be helping and looking out for , feeding their bloated ranks off money earned off the hard laboring sweating masses via various "taxes" imposed upon them.

I am all for good govt --thats only takes what it needs --leaving the bulk of the wealth and power in the hands of the people that earn it.

Quote Ivan November 2007

"ah my freind the differance is simple you are a "subject" of the crown thus the govt "owns" you --- I am a "citizen" of the USA thus "I" own the govt --- its really that simple as a citizen -- I have certain "rights" one of the being to own a gun -- with which to legally protect home and loved ones with -- you do not have that right ---one of the first things that britain attempted to do to control the american colonies was to stop supplying arms and powder to make us into "subjects" forever --we thru off the yoke of being a "subject" and thru force of arms became "freemen" or citizens ---the founding fathers knew that a govt can get "out of control" with power -- so the founding fathers made sure no future american govt would treat its "citizens" as "subjects" by placing the bill of rights in our govt documents -- "the right to keep and bear arms" -- (for legal law abiding --non felons) prevents the govt from turning us into "subjects" again and allows legal law abiding citizens to keep the riff raff from our doors and from attacking us or our loved ones -- Ivan"


Seems to me your postings regarding the UK have a running theme, IMO anglophobic, you keep harping on about "subjects"
Just for you I have photocopied my British passport and as can clearly be seen we are citizens just like you.




Gary

 

[Peerless67]

Well now Northern Ireland is............After England stuck it's nose out, and left.

I see in your avatar your only "detector" used is "Eyes, Ears, and Common Sense". Better add "Blinders" to that list, but they might be a little hard to put on with your head in your........... thumbsup But then again, it may be easier than you think. Maybe that head is shaped like that narrow mind of yours. Remember, YOU threw the first slanderous remark.

Maybe you could point me to my slanderous remark, if you are reffering to the biggot remark then one only needs to read your previous postings to realise that you are indeed a biggot.
Your previous posts prelude any chance of my calling you a biggot slanderous as you have proven in those posts you are a biggot. At least toward UK citizens.


Gary

 

[hogge]

Do you even own a metal detector ..........Or are you one of those "Do as I say....not as I do", kind of , "Know it ALLS"? I can see that in the 3 years that you have been a member, I see no finds of YOURS on this site, but yet you can comment on legal issues, and express opinions, of what someone else finds.

 

[Peerless67]

Do you even own a metal detector ..........Or are you one of those "Do as I say....not as I do", kind of , "Know it ALLS"? I can see that in the 3 years that you have been a member, I see no finds of YOURS on this site, but yet you can comment on legal issues, and express opinions, of what someone else finds.

Oh I see, by adding the name of metal detectors to your avatar means you own them, to answer your question "Do you even own "a" metal detector " the answer is no I do not own "a" metal detector I own 4. But my ego not being quite as large as yours does not require me to advertise the fact.

This is a treasure hunting site as well as a metal detecting site, I have posted no metal detecting finds as I have never felt the need.
I have however posted some of my findings and research on a treasure legend which I have worked on for many years.
I do not see how not posting finds would exclude me from having an opinion on others finds, or on legal matters.

So now not only are you coming across as a biggot, but your ego makes you believe that if I do not disclose my finds I have no right to post on the forum.
If you could point me in the direction of the rule that makes you thinkI have to do that please feel free to post a link.
Those on here who I trust enough to share my finds with (including American members) have been privvy to those findings, that does not mean they did not happen, it means I am not prepared to share them with the likes of you.
Below you can find a link to the rules and I have highlighted the parts that apply to your biggoted posts.


Gary


http://forum.treasurenet.com/rules

TERMS, CONDITIONS, & GUIDELINES
Updated July 10th, 2009

Your use of this site constitutes your acceptance of the following terms and conditions.

TERMS OF USE

Most importantly, anyone found posting personal attacks, or hateful, or defaming, or racist comments, or other content in violation of our Terms Of Use WILL BE BANNED. Thank you for your help in maintaining a COURTEOUS, and family friendly atmosphere here at TreasureNet!

 

[hogge]

Do you even own a metal detector ..........Or are you one of those "Do as I say....not as I do", kind of , "Know it ALLS"? I can see that in the 3 years that you have been a member, I see no finds of YOURS on this site, but yet you can comment on legal issues, and express opinions, of what someone else finds.

Oh I see, by adding the name of metal detectors to your avatar means you own them, to answer your question "Do you even own "a" metal detector " the answer is no I do not own "a" metal detector I own 4. But my ego not being quite as large as yours does not require me to advertise the fact.

This is a treasure hunting site as well as a metal detecting site, I have posted no metal detecting finds as I have never felt the need.
I have however posted some of my findings and research on a treasure legend which I have worked on for many years.
I do not see how not posting finds would exclude me from having an opinion on others finds, or on legal matters.

So now not only are you coming across as a biggot, but your ego makes you believe that if I do not disclose my finds I have no right to post on the forum.
If you could point me in the direction of the rule that makes you thinkI have to do that please feel free to post a link.
Those on here who I trust enough to share my finds with (including American members) have been privvy to those findings, that does not mean they did not happen, it means I am not prepared to share them with the likes of you.
Below you can find a link to the rules and I have highlighted the parts that apply to your biggoted posts.


Gary


http://forum.treasurenet.com/rules

TERMS, CONDITIONS, & GUIDELINES
Updated July 10th, 2009

Your use of this site constitutes your acceptance of the following terms and conditions.

TERMS OF USE

Most importantly, anyone found posting personal attacks, or hateful, or defaming, or racist comments, or other content in violation of our Terms Of Use WILL BE BANNED. Thank you for your help in maintaining a COURTEOUS, and family friendly atmosphere here at TreasureNet!

WELCOME TO AMERICA---- In case you don't know what this is........A.K.A. The Bronx Cheer!

 

[HCW]

That's not really her. Somebody Photoshopped her head on another body.

Mike

Ya Think?

 

[ivan salis]

according to your "laws" you got no choice in the matter , so in effect you asking should we break the law? -- the answer of course must be no -- what you need tro do is CHANGE the law to a more reasonible and workible one.

 

[Aquila]

If I would be prosecuted I would keep silver coin myself. :P

 

[meteoritefinder]

"Should we report treasure that we find?"

The answer is no.

Corrupt governments enacting immoral and unethical laws to prevent sovereign individuals from recovering lost items through their own hard work and efforts... sounds right and good to you? Sounds like a criminal cartel to me. The mafia has nothing on these governments and politicians who enact these laws that enable them to steal from those who do no harm to anyone. Indeed, they provide a service by expending their own time, effort and abilities to find these lost items and recover them ... only to have them taken away and given "market value" as determined by those same crooked politicians and governments who made the rules to begin with.

Sound right to you?

If so, you are one of the gullible and blinded who take the pablum that those same governments dish out to keep their "constituents" happy. This country was founded on entirely different concepts that are largely forgotten today. Concepts of freedom, liberty, independence and self sufficiency are directly opposed to the tyranny, dependence and welfare of the governments of today.

So, again... the answer is... No.

 

[CRUSADER]

"Should we report treasure that we find?"

The answer is no.

Corrupt governments enacting immoral and unethical laws to prevent sovereign individuals from recovering lost items through their own hard work and efforts... sounds right and good to you? Sounds like a criminal cartel to me. The mafia has nothing on these governments and politicians who enact these laws that enable them to steal from those who do no harm to anyone. Indeed, they provide a service by expending their own time, effort and abilities to find these lost items and recover them ... only to have them taken away and given "market value" as determined by those same crooked politicians and governments who made the rules to begin with.

Sound right to you?

If so, you are one of the gullible and blinded who take the pablum that those same governments dish out to keep their "constituents" happy. This country was founded on entirely different concepts that are largely forgotten today. Concepts of freedom, liberty, independence and self sufficiency are directly opposed to the tyranny, dependence and welfare of the governments of today.

So, again... the answer is... No.

Wrong under the UK Law, try reading up a little.....

 

[gollum]

Crusader,

Under UK Law, you are correct, but the UK is one of a VERY few countries in the world that recognize any semblance of a fair Treasure Trove Law.

The US has anything but. It is a beaureaucratic nightmare. Depending on where the Trove is found, you have a multitude of different Federal Agencies that want to stick their fingers in the pie, as well as state governments that want something for nothing. Then you have to contend with with (and this is an approximate figure) 297 kajillion claimants to whatever you found because their grandfathers stableboy at some point in his life heard about your Treasure Trove, which entitles this douche to a goodly portion of your find (and he will find no lack of attorneys willing to take his case).

Take for example Mel Fisher. I believe the final Lawsuit Count is at 122. Its' amazing.

That's just in the US. In other countries it only gets worse. Corrupt governments. It has happened dozens of times that an exploration company enters into an agreement with some government for the rights to salvage a lost wreck, and when it appears the treasure is of some consequence, the government renigs on the agreement and confiscates the lot.

It has also happened almost as often, though, that unscrupulous types try and conceal especially valuable items from the governments they are in agreements with, in effect stealing and breaking their side of the contract.

Best-Mike

 

[CRUSADER]

Crusader,

Under UK Law, you are correct, but the UK is one of a VERY few countries in the world that recognize any semblance of a fair Treasure Trove Law.

The US has anything but. It is a beaureaucratic nightmare. Depending on where the Trove is found, you have a multitude of different Federal Agencies that want to stick their fingers in the pie, as well as state governments that want something for nothing. Then you have to contend with with (and this is an approximate figure) 297 kajillion claimants to whatever you found because their grandfathers stableboy at some point in his life heard about your Treasure Trove, which entitles this douche to a goodly portion of your find (and he will find no lack of attorneys willing to take his case).

Take for example Mel Fisher. I believe the final Lawsuit Count is at 122. Its' amazing.

That's just in the US. In other countries it only gets worse. Corrupt governments. It has happened dozens of times that an exploration company enters into an agreement with some government for the rights to salvage a lost wreck, and when it appears the treasure is of some consequence, the government renigs on the agreement and confiscates the lot.

It has also happened almost as often, though, that unscrupulous types try and conceal especially valuable items from the governments they are in agreements with, in effect stealing and breaking their side of the contract.

Best-Mike

Yes, I'm getting the impression the US is a nightmare for these things, just wanted to make sure we are fair when we speak of Government's.

 

[Silver Searcher]

The UK law is full of flaws and not as fair as you might think dwindling funds, and Goverment cost cuts in different departments have made the Treasure act a farse.
If the BM doesn't have enough money to buy something they want, they usually slap a export ban on it to stop it going abroad, they done this with a Gold Saxon Penny that didn't fall under the Treasure act, but they got a export ban placed on the coin untill they could raise the extra cash

SS

 

[CRUSADER]

The UK law is full of flaws and not as fair as you might think dwindling funds, and Goverment cost cuts in different departments have made the Treasure act a farse.
If the BM doesn't have enough money to buy something they want, they usually slap a export ban on it to stop it going abroad, they done this with a Gold Saxon Penny that didn't fall under the Treasure act, but they got a export ban placed on the coin untill they could raise the extra cash

SS

Not a very good example, as the BM paid double what it went for at auction & the buyer made a mint. Seems more than fair to me.

 

[Silver Searcher]

The UK law is full of flaws and not as fair as you might think dwindling funds, and Goverment cost cuts in different departments have made the Treasure act a farse.
If the BM doesn't have enough money to buy something they want, they usually slap a export ban on it to stop it going abroad, they done this with a Gold Saxon Penny that didn't fall under the Treasure act, but they got a export ban placed on the coin untill they could raise the extra cash

SS

Not a very good example, as the BM paid double what it went for at auction & the buyer made a mint. Seems more than fair to me.

The buyer won the auction fair and square, and was then unable to take it out of the country, what's fair about that. He actually sold his house to raise the funds to buy the coin, and then had to waite months for the BM to raise the money and buy it of him.

 

[gollum]

I can completely understand the government's side in that situation. If an object is exceedingly rare and of great historical significance to a particular country, then that country's government should do what it can to keep the item in that country and make a fair settlement with the finder, which I believe is exactly what happened in this instance.

It is sad for the buyer, but it would have gone into a private collection maybe lost forever.

Best-Mike

 

[Silver Searcher]

I can completely understand the government's side in that situation. If an object is exceedingly rare and of great historical significance to a particular country, then that country's government should do what it can to keep the item in that country and make a fair settlement with the finder, which I believe is exactly what happened in this instance.

It is sad for the buyer, but it would have gone into a private collection maybe lost forever.

Best-Mike

But they didn't make a fair settlement, the coin was bought fair and square at auction by a American buyer he out bid the BM, it should have been the outher way around..the BM out bidding the American.