Season Two - Nov. 4, 2014 9:00 pm

[Charlie P. (NY)]

Ahhh. And Nabisco Oreo is an anagram of Cariboo Nose; which is not the animal but the Cariboo Plateau - site of an 1858 Gold Rush along the Fraser River. Named for Simon Fraiser who first mapped the region and retired to Cornwall, Ontario. And if you draw a line from Turk's Nose (a mountain beside the Fraser River) through Cornwall Ontario and extended it East it PASSES DIRECTLY OVER OAK ISLAND! [That is all true, by the way - check it out].

Irrefutable proof that the Sleepless Knights buried two millions pounds of gold inside the Arc of the Covenant that was then placed in the missing sarcophagos of Menkaura in the swamp somewhere near the Money Pit where there will be a stone that bears the likeness of a rock.

 

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[CladGrabber]

Now this is getting humorous

 

[Eldo]

what I really have to laugh at is they really don't know where the Original pit is on the Island.

Their Drill bit is How wide ?

How long would it take to Drill holes all over the Island in order to find that
(Needle in the Hay stack ) original Pit ?

& since there has been digging for centuries, How do they ID the Original Digging ?

add to that they use that Little Drill Setup expecting it to turn a bit
at any real Depth this has to be staged just for the drama.

I'm starting to look forward to the search for Giants afterward.

View attachment 1079111

 

[bigscoop]

I still think Godzilla is coming out of those caverns! That's why it was once filled in! Geesh....this is like one of those horror flicks where they go in there anyway.

 

[Robot]

If the Lagina Brothers want to find the "Original Money Pit"?

They need to "Stop" thinking like "Treasure Hunters" and "Start" thinking Like "Freemasons".

The "Freemasons" set up each location with"Markers" triangulated from "Celestial Stars".

Each of these "Stars" were provided to them by their "Esteemed" past Grand Master "Sir Francis Bacon".

With their "Astrological" ability they were able to set each marker at the "Autumn Equinox" to coordinate with a particular "Celestial Star".

We can retrace these markers once again at each "Equinox" with "Resetting" them and "Cross Triangulating" them with the appropriate "Stars".

 

[Charlie P. (NY)]

But how do you correlate astral projections to Terran locations? They move in relation to time of day and time of the year.

Maybe they had a copy of Bowdich and a good chronograph and sextant and they took a midnight sighting on a specific day - and you know which day? Otherwise - you're just as close digging anywhere on the island.

Ever taken a star (or sun) sighting? If you get within 6,080 feet you're fabulous and meticulous and better than most. That's a one arc minute error using degrees, minutes and seconds of latitude and longitude. And for every second your chronograph is off or you delay the exact reading . . . tic, tic, 100 more feet off.

 

[Advocat]

Have been watching Season 2 -- and I'm wondering whether there have ever been any other "booby-trapped" treasure locations, anywhere in the world? Short of Indiana Jones, that is

 

[Dave Rishar]

Now this is getting humorous

It will doubtless get funnier as the dialog progresses. The sheer insanity that accompanies this legend is astonishing.

 

[Charlie P. (NY)]

Have been watching Season 2 -- and I'm wondering whether there have ever been any other "booby-trapped" treasure locations, anywhere in the world? Short of Indiana Jones, that is

Supposedly the Egyptians and Aztec/Incas/Olmecs knew of the tendency of certain caves to cause Histoplasmosis (without knowing what it was or how a virus worked) and deliberately coated the walls of tombs and caves with moldy bat guano to infect tomb raiders.

And that may just be a myth or coincedence.

Other than that I've never heard of a trap deliberately set in a tomb. As for buried treasure? Don't know whether that is a myth entirely and therefore totally lacking of trap evidence.

 

[Robot]

"Ignorance" is not "Bliss" when it comes to "Booby Traps"

S
And that may just be a myth or coincedence.

Other than that I've never heard of a trap deliberately set in a tomb. As for buried treasure? Don't know whether that is a myth entirely and therefore totally lacking of trap evidence.

"These" Freemasons based the construction of their "Money Pit" on "Enoch's Temple" which in their degree is called "The Royal Arch"

This included the "Nine" levels", "Keystone" "The Treasure Chamber" and the "Booby Trapping" of the "Shaft" along with the "Great Flood of Noah".

"An English translation of the Apocryphal Book of Enoch includes the following passages:

"89.2 And again I raised my eyes to heaven, and saw a high roof, with seven water channels on it, and those channels discharged much water into an enclosure. "
"89.3 And I looked again, and behold, springs opened on the floor of that large enclosure, and water began to bubble up, and to rise above the floor. And I looked at that enclosure until its whole floor was covered by water."

"Beware" of the "Final Trap" that was devised by "Enoch" for unworthy "Treasure Seekers"

 

[Robot]

Wanted - One 18th Century Person who can Survey and use Sextant with Mercury Trough

But how do you correlate astral projections to Terran locations? They move in relation to time of day and time of the year.

Maybe they had a copy of Bowdich and a good chronograph and sextant and they took a midnight sighting on a specific day - and you know which day? Otherwise - you're just as close digging anywhere on the island.

Ever taken a star (or sun) sighting? If you get within 6,080 feet you're fabulous and meticulous and better than most. That's a one arc minute error using degrees, minutes and seconds of latitude and longitude. And for every second your chronograph is off or you delay the exact reading . . . tic, tic, 100 more feet off.

 

[Charlie P. (NY)]

That shows you North (in the Northern Hemisphere). North is a direction. Not a place. And go North starting from where?

Best you can hope for in the above drawing is a course from the box in some direction. Even then, the closer you get to the north pole the less useful it becomes.

Places require two or more coordinates. And with the earth spinning and it orbit around the sun a minimum of four coordinates to use stars (add time and date).

And the book of Enoch is your "proof" of a booby-trapped treasure in reality? Go fish.

Enoch, Chapter 2

"I observed everything that took place in the heavens, how the luminaries, which are in the heavens, do not depart from their paths, that each one rises and sets in order, each in its time, and they do not depart from their laws.

Actually they are relatively motionless and the Earth moves - but even Enoch noted the stars don't hold still and so make difficult "landmarks".

 

[Robot]

The “Importance” of being “Creative”

That shows you North (in the Northern Hemisphere). North is a direction. Not a place. And go North starting from where?

Best you can hope for in the above drawing is a course from the box in some direction. Even then, the closer you get to the north pole the less useful it becomes.

Places require two or more coordinates. And with the earth spinning and it orbit around the sun a minimum of four coordinates to use stars (add time and date).

And the book of Enoch is your "proof" of a booby-trapped treasure in reality? Go fish.



Actually they are relatively motionless and the Earth moves - but even Enoch noted the stars don't hold still and so make difficult "landmarks".

One needs to get off the “Chair” and get “Outdoors” to stimulate one’s “Imagination” and “Creativity”, even if it is to “Go Fish”.

The “Freemasons” did not have the “Modern Distractions” of the “TV” or “Internet” telling them what they could or could not do.

They used their "Imagination" to create a “Celestial Map” that would be “Indestructible” by “Man” or “Nature”.

At a "Set Date and Time" (Autumn Equinox at Midnight).

From a stationary positions on Oak Island (The Triangle) it is a relatively simple process of viewing a selected “Star” with its “Light Shining Visible” in a held “Mirror”, then changing the “Mirror” to a new “Set Degree”, proceeding towards that said “Star” on a set line, until it is once again “Visible” within the “Mirror”.

This new position for the “Star” marked on the land would become one of “Many Markers” the “Freemasons” would use to “Cross Triangulate” and “Mark” where the final resting location would be for their “Treasure Vault”.

The main "Instruments" needed was their "Sextant" and "Mercury Trough" which as "Navigators" they were very skilled in using.

 

[Charlie P. (NY)]

My "chair" was a 34 foot sailboat on Lake Ontario that we berthed up in Sackets Harbor. Not trusting electronics I made sure I could dead reckon with compass, clock, a sextant and a copy of Bowditch (American Practical Navigator - which is aboard all US merchant and NAVY ships) for the sun and celestial navigation tables and charts.

I get outdoors plenty.

But I agree - the autumn equinox at midnight (local or Greenwich or some other reference time?) would provide the "lock" on the celestial reference points. Or the Vernal equinox, the solstices or even the "Cusp of Aries" which was (and is) popular among the Tropic of Cancer trade routes. You would have to know which one was used.

If the treasure was, and was buried by someone who wanted to leave coordinates they would not have placed rocks or inscribed pictographs. They'd have left (or taken) a starting reference point and two or three intersecting bearings to triangulate the spot. How elegant would that be? The marks on a rock left near the site could then be meaningless just to confuse casual observers. The marks just being needed to identify the reference point (the rock itself) and the coordinates and distances were on a separate map or inscription.

But maybe that's a justification for why it may remain: they used celestial references and returned at a different time of year and couldn't find the spot again. ;-)

Since we were on scripture: observe the Parable of the Talents (Matthew 14:24)

He also who had received the one talent came forward, saying, ‘Master, I knew you to be a hard man, reaping where you did not sow, and gathering where you scattered no seed,25 so I was afraid, and I went and hid your talent in the ground. Here you have what is yours.’26 But his master answered him, ‘You wicked and slothful servant! You knew that I reap where I have not sown and gather where I scattered no seed?27 Then you ought to have invested my money with the bankers, and at my coming I should have received what was my own with interest.28 So take the talent from him and give it to him who has the ten talents.29 For to everyone who has will more be given, and he will have an abundance. But from the one who has not, even what he has will be taken away.30 And cast the worthless servant into the outer darkness. In that place there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.’

 

[Robot]

"Welcome Aboard - Captain"

My "chair" was a 34 foot sailboat on Lake Ontario that we berthed up in Sackets Harbor. Not trusting electronics I made sure I could dead reckon with compass, clock, a sextant and a copy of Bowditch (American Practical Navigator - which is aboard all US merchant and NAVY ships) for the sun and celestial navigation tables and charts.

I get outdoors plenty.

But I agree - the autumn equinox at midnight (local or Greenwich or some other reference time?) would provide the "lock" on the celestial reference points. Or the Vernal equinox, the solstices or even the "Cusp of Aries" which was (and is) popular among the Tropic of Cancer trade routes. You would have to know which one was used.

If the treasure was, and was buried by someone who wanted to leave coordinates they would not have placed rocks or inscribed pictographs. They'd have left (or taken) a starting reference point and two or three intersecting bearings to triangulate the spot. How elegant would that be? The marks on a rock left near the site could then be meaningless just to confuse casual observers. The marks just being needed to identify the reference point (the rock itself) and the coordinates and distances were on a separate map or inscription.

But maybe that's a justification for why it may remain: they used celestial references and returned at a different time of year and couldn't find the spot again. ;-)

Since we were on scripture: observe the Parable of the Talents (Matthew 14:24)

Charlie - You are very "Knowledgeable" forum member and I am confident you will be an integral part with the solving of this "Mystery"

The "Time" was derived by the Freemasons from their "Esteemed Member" Sir Francis Bacon from his "Clue":

"The specific hour of the autumnal equinox was midnight, expressed as "the noon of night," Shakespeare's "very hour of witching." (cf Hamlet III, 2, 405 Editor)"

The "Actual Local Time" could have been kept by "John Harrison's" "H4 Marine Chronometer Watch" which was just invented and used by these "Freemasons" as "Admirals and Members" of the "Royal Society of London"

“John Harrison (3 April [O.S. 24 March] 1693– 24 March 1776) was a self-educated English carpenter and clockmaker. He invented the marine chronometer, a long-sought after device for solving the problem of establishing the East-West position or longitude of a ship at sea, thus revolutionizing and extending the possibility of safe long-distance sea travel in the Age of Sail.
He proceeded to design and make the world's first successful marine timekeeper that allowed a navigator to accurately assess his ship's position inlongitude. Importantly, Harrison showed everyone that it could be done by using a watch to calculate longitude.[11] This was to be Harrison's masterpiece – an instrument of beauty, resembling an oversized pocket watch from the period. It is engraved with Harrison's signature, marked Number 1 and dated AD 1759.”

 

[Robot]

The (Untold) Story of The Oak Island Money Pit - Re posted for this Thread

The (Untold) Story of The Oak Island Money Pit

The Oak Island Money Pit was constructed by the “powers that be” that were and still are to this day, the secret force that controls the course of mankind on earth.
This organization is known as - The “Freemasons”.

The story of The Oak Island Money Pit begins in the 1760’s
It was conceived by a number of Britain’s high ranking naval officers, who were also Masonic degree members of the Freemasons and belonging to the Masonic “Premier Grand Lodge of England”.
These Masons were members of the Whig Party opposed to the next successor to the throne, the unstable King George III.
These members were:
Washington Shirley, 5th Earl Ferrers – Vice Admiral - Grand Master of the Masonic Lodge – Premier Grand Lodge of England
George Anson, Baron Anson – Admiral of the Fleet
George Keppel, 3rd Earl of Albemarle - Commander-In-Chief
Augustus Keppel, 1st Viscount Keppel – Rear Admiral – Brother to George Keppel
William Keppel – Lieutenant-General – Brother to George Keppel
George Pocock – Admiral – Commander of the Invasion of Havana
and
Benjamin Franklin – First Grand Master of Pennsylvania who met in 1760 with the Grand Master of England to discuss their plan.

The Mason’s plot originated after King George III’s destruction of the Whig’s political power with his redirection of this power to the Tory Party, and the Mason’s concern of the imminent invasion of England, during the Seven Years’ War, by the joint forces of France and Spain. Spain outlawed all forms of secret organizations, including the Freemasons.

The Mason’s plan was to redirect a fortune to the “New World” (North America), to enable the transfer of the Masonic organization, if and when these fears materialized.
Their plan entailed the capture of Havana in 1762.
Havana’s Morro Castle was the Fort Knox of Spain, holding the South and Central America’s gold supply prior to its shipment to Spain.
The invasion of Havana was under the command of George Keppel, with Admiral George Pocock and Keppel’s two brothers Augustus and William Keppel, commanding the actual attack. They were successful with the capture of Havana and Fort Morro and its unprecedented amount of treasure. They also captured a number of the Spanish Fleet, which was needed to accomplish their plan. Accordingly, Admiral Pocock returned to England with the main English fleet carrying a portion of the treasure, while Augustus and William Keppel along with their crew and Masonic engineers all sworn to secrecy, manned the 8 Spanish Galleons and the 2 British Man of War. This treasure was diverted to a small island off the coast of New England and Nova Scotia now called Oak Island.

At Oak Island the treasure was buried based on the Masonic “Royal Arch” (Enoch’s Temple) consisting of nine arches going down nine levels by way of a main shaft (The Money Pit) which was dug down to the bedrock. From the ninth level another tunnel was constructed which ran back up to a point above the known water level, roughly 20 feet underground and at this point an enormous cavern was built to hold the treasure. The treasure was carted down the main shaft and placed up into this cavern. To conceal their plot they had the 8 Spanish ships dismantled with all the wooden parts not used in the construction of the shaft, tunnels and cavern burnt and all the metal parts (canons, anchors and bolts) were placed at the bottom of the main shaft. Flood tunnels were built out to the ocean to booby trap any treasure seekers attempts to follow down the main shaft. A large stone was placed at the air lock (8th level) as bait to activate the flooding. This stone had strange engravings on it to entice any unworthy treasure seekers to pause and take the bait (stone) away for deciphering, thus allowing time for the tunnels and main shaft to fill with water and be destroyed forever. The Masons knew exactly by their calculated mark above ground where the treasure cavern below ground was located, and could access it by digging down 20 feet.

Once the treasure was secured in the cavern and all the evidence was hidden from the island, it was documented that the Keppels sailed back to England with 2 ships and a small portion of the treasure. They claimed that the remainder of the fleet had sunk in a hurricane on route.

The Masons left several markers on the island to relocate the treasure.
1 large triangle or more precisely a crude Sextant
2 drilled holed stones
1 large stone cross
These combined markers along with the Star Map are used to cross triangulate and a set degree on the sextant point to the “X” where the cavern is today located.

Is the treasure still in this cavern?

I believe it was removed in 1795

One of the three original discoverers of the Money Pit was Daniel McGinnis, who stated he was drawn to the island when he noticed strange lights appearing on the island just prior to his discovery.
These lights were made by the Freemasons when they returned for their treasure.
This Masonic party was headed up by George Washington, President of the United States – acting Grand Master of the Washington DC Masons.

The treasure’s vast fortune was used, as planned, to further the power of the Freemasons in their new world, with them becoming “The New World Order”.

 

[bigscoop]

It's pretty difficult to imagine that, given the amount of time, labor, prep, planning, and required bodies, that any huge task could be undertaken without it being noticed or spoken of. These are usually the crippling details to a lot of these magnificent treasure tales. I still think the show would be far more entertaining and enlightening if the devil's advocates were allowed to present their cases to challenge a lot of these wild and one-sided theories. But that's just me.....I like looking at things from both sides.

 

[Eldo]

I'd hate to speculate that the treasure was of english miners, or from the freemasons who were storing part of the pillaged Cuban stores.....

who steals a spanish boot and leaves it on the island?? and a pair of spanish scissors.

that seems more like a camp with grooming tools and personal items of soldiers who were there.....

they are finding Spanish coins that are of lesser value, used by the 'common' soldiers......not any gold or silver coins....carried by the Pirates and other sailors who had booty.

If the Freemasons pillaged tons of silver and gold, than how come they are finding common spanish coins? used in everyday spanish commerce amongst the lesser ranked?

the stars were not the treasure map, even though they stayed in the same relation in the sky. the whole map rotates and you have to know the exact time and date to find the alignment.......

your map is saying that the stars were in that alignment, according to the direction the boat is laid, and the direction the cross is laid on the island to form a segment of a star chart.

looking at the island I see the coincidence you mention, but which star it points at is a little hard to follow,

@ ROBOT.........what time and date does that make the stars line up to in that area?? you said you are able to find the star charts and find the date? I am just saying that you realize that 'star map' is only a time/date marker and not a charted course to the treasure right??

 

[Eldo]

What if this is all a hoax from the McGinnis Boy, and he and his friends did all this as a joke.......?

 

[Charlie P. (NY)]

Well Robot you have made a large connection if John Harrison was a Freemason. Certainly some of the sunsequent sea captains were. I read Dava Sobel's book "Longitude" and it was an excellent description of the problem of pre-chronometer navigation.

I may seem kind of snarky - and am a bit of a krank - but one of my jobs is to proofread engineering bid requests that can run 80 to 100 pages and I'm used to poking holes in cross-purpose specs and spotting misprints. Makes a mind critical. Most of my angst is the methods employed by the History Channel in the effort to make good TV rather than a scientific approach and historical research. That sites' bee raped so often there is no archeological approach to uncover what lies beneath. Or did before it was removed.