Revolutionary War Button Found

nova treasure said:
It definitely is Different and with a later style. I can understand how one can get kinda upset when they think they got something finally identified, but than find more research that proves different.
It's always good to have 2nd opinions and it's good to have an experienced Detectorist like Iron Patch trying to help.

Nova Treasure
Sorry I am correct;
The history of Wisconsin encompasses the story not only of the people who have lived in Wisconsin since it became a state of the U.S., but also of the Native AmericanNative Americans in the United StatesNative Americans in the United States is the phrase that describes indigenous peoples from North America now encompassed by the continental United States, including parts of Alaska and the island state of Hawaii. They comprise a large number of distinct tribes, states, and ethnic groups, many of...
tribes who made their homeland in Wisconsin, and the French and British colonists who were the first Europeans to live there. WisconsinWisconsinWisconsin is one of the fifty U.S. states. Located in the north-central United States, Wisconsin is considered part of the Midwest. It is bordered by Minnesota to the west, Iowa to the southwest, Illinois to the south, Lake Michigan to the east, Michigan to the northeast, and Lake Superior to the...
became a state on May 29, 1848, but the land that makes up the state has been occupied by humans for thousands of years.


Pre-Columbian history


The first known inhabitants of what is now Wisconsin were called Paleo-Indians, who first arrived in the region in about 10,000 BC. They hunted animals such as mammothMammothA mammoth is any species of the extinct genus Mammuthus. These proboscideans are members of Elephantidae, the family of elephants and mammoths, and close relatives of modern elephants. They were often equipped with long curved tusks and, in northern species, a covering of long hair. They lived from...
s and mastodonMastodonMastodons or mastodonts were large tusked mammal species of the extinct genus Mammut found in Asia, Africa, Europe, North America and Central America from the Oligocene through Pleistocene, 33.9 mya to 11,000 years ago. The American mastodon is the most recent and best known species of the group...
s. The Boaz mastodonBoaz mastodonThe Boaz mastodon is the skeleton of a mastodon found near Boaz, Wisconsin in 1897. A fluted quartzite spear point found near the Boaz mastodon suggests that humans hunted mastodons in southwestern Wisconsin....
, and the ClovisClovis cultureThe Clovis culture is a prehistoric Paleoindian culture that first appears in the archaeological record of North America around 11,500 rcbp radiocarbon years ago, at the end of the last glacial period, characterized by a particular tool kit adapted to the hunting of large mammals...
artifacts discovered in Boaz, WisconsinBoaz, WisconsinBoaz is a village in Richland County, Wisconsin, United States. The population was 137 at the 2000 census.-Geography:Boaz is located at ....
, show that hunting was a primary occupation for these people. The Plano culturesPlano culturesThe Plano cultures is a name given by archaeologists to a group of disparate hunter-gatherer communities that occupied the Great Plains area of North America between 9000 BC and 6000 BC....
began to dominate Wisconsin around 7000 BC, as the last glaciers retreated from the state. During the Archaic stage, from 6,000 – 1,000 BC, Wisconsin was inhabited by the Boreal Archaic and the Old Copper IndiansOld Copper ComplexOld Copper Complex is a term used for ancient societies known to have been heavily involved in the utilization of copper for weaponry and tools. The Old Copper Complex of the Western Great Lakes is one of these. Great Lakes natives of the "Archaic tradition" located 99% pure copper in the area of...
. People during this time lived in small groups or bands, and continued to depend on hunting and gathering for their existence.

By the time of the early Woodland periodWoodland periodThe Woodland period of North American pre-Columbian cultures is to the time from roughly 1000 BCE to 1000 CE in the eastern part of North America...
ice age that began around 500 BC, farming began to replace hunting and gathering as a means of supplying food. This allowed for the creation of permanent settlements. With permanent settlement came more advanced art and pottery. The first Indian mounds were built during this period, mainly for burial purposes. As the Hopewell cultureHopewell cultureThe Hopewell tradition is the term used to describe common aspects of the Native American culture that flourished along rivers in the northeastern and midwestern United States from 200 BCE to 500 CE...
emerged in around 100 BC, farming, art, and mound building were significantly advanced. The late Woodland period began in about 600 AD. The Effigy moundEffigy moundSites in the U.S. of similar history may be found at Indian Mounds ParkAn effigy mound is a raised pile of earth built in the shape of a stylized animal, symbol, religious figure, or human figure....
culture dominated Wisconsin during this time, and built sophisticated mounds in the shapes of animals for ceremonial reasons. The Mississippian cultureMississippian cultureThe Mississippian culture was a mound-building Native American culture that flourished in what is now the Midwestern, Eastern, and Southeastern United States from approximately 800 CE to 1500 CE, varying regionally....
began to expand into Wisconsin in 1050 AD, and established a settlement at Aztalan, WisconsinAztalan State ParkAztalan State Park is a Wisconsin state park located just south of the town of Aztalan, Wisconsin at latitude N 43° 4' and longitude W 88° 52', and established in 1952. It was also designated a National Historic Landmark in 1964 and added to the National Register of Historic Places in 1966...
. The Mississippian culture was replaced by the OneotaOneotaOneota is a designation archaeologists use to refer to a cultural complex that existed in the eastern plains and Great Lakes area of what is now the United States from around A.D. 900 to around 1650 or 1700. The culture is believed to have transitioned into various Macro-Siouan cultures of the...
people in around 1200 AD. This culture eventually evolved into the Siouan tribes known to European explorers. When the first Europeans reached Wisconsin, the primary inhabitants were the OjibwaOjibwaThe Ojibwe or Chippewa is the largest group of Native Americans-First Nations north of Mexico, including Métis. They are the third-largest in the United States, surpassed only by Cherokee and Navajo. They're equally divided between the United States and Canada...
, Ho-ChunkHo-ChunkThe Ho-Chunk, or Winnebago , are a tribe of Native Americans, native to what are now Wisconsin and Illinois.-Etymology:...
, MenomineeMenomineeSome placenames use other spellings, see also Menomonee and Menomonie.The Menominee are a nation of Native Americans living in Wisconsin. The Menominee, along with the Ho-Chunk, are the only tribes that are indigenous to what is now Wisconsin...
, Sac (tribe)Sac (tribe)The Sauks or Sacs from where their French and English names are derived) are a group of Native Americans of the Eastern Woodlands culture group.-Clan system:...
, and Fox.

French exploration

The first known European to enter Wisconsin was French VoyageurVoyageurVoyageur is a French word meaning "voyager" or "traveller".Voyageur can refer to:*Voyageurs, licensed coureur des bois fur traders in 17th and 18th century North America*The Voyageurs, a Canadian soccer fan club founded in 1996...
Jean Nicolet. In 1634, Samuel de ChamplainSamuel de ChamplainSamuel de Champlain, , , "The Father of New France", was a French navigator, cartographer, draughtsman, soldier, explorer, geographer, ethnologist, diplomat and chronicler...
, governor of New FranceNew FranceNew France was the area colonized by France in North America during a period extending from the exploration of the Saint Lawrence River, by Jacques Cartier in 1534, to the cession of New France to Spain and Britain in 1763...
, gave Nicolet the task of searching for a water route to China through North America. Accompanied by seven HuronWyandotThe Wyandot are indigenous peoples of North America, known in their native language as the Wendat. Modern Wyandots emerged in the 17th century from the remnants of two earlier groups, the Huron Confederacy and the Petun...
Indian guides, Nicolet left Canada and canoed through Lake HuronLake HuronLake Huron is one of the five Great Lakes of North America. It is bounded on the east by Ontario, Canada and on the west by Michigan, USA. The name of the lake is derived from early French explorers who named it based on the Huron people inhabiting the region.-Geography:Lake Huron is the second...
and Lake SuperiorLake SuperiorLake Superior is the largest of the five Great Lakes of North America. It is bounded to the north by Ontario, Canada and Minnesota, United States, and to the south by the U.S. states of Wisconsin and Michigan...
, and then became the first European to enter Lake MichiganLake MichiganLake Michigan is one of the five Great Lakes of North America, and the only one located entirely within the United States. The second largest of the Great Lakes by volume The third largest of the Great Lakes by surface area , it is bounded, from west to east, by the U.S. states of Wisconsin,...
. Nicolet proceeded to row into Green Bay and came ashore near the present-day city of Green Bay, WisconsinGreen Bay, WisconsinGreen Bay is a city in and the county seat of Brown County in the U.S. state of Wisconsin.The city is located at the head of its namesake Green Bay, a sub-basin of Lake Michigan, at the mouth of the Fox River. It has an elevation of 581 feet above sea level and is located 112 miles north of...
. When Nicolet reached land, he was greeted by several Ho-Chunk living in the area. Nicolet remained with the Ho-Chunk at Green Bay through the winter and established a trading post there.

The next major expedition into Wisconsin was that of Father Jacques MarquetteJacques MarquetteFather Jacques Marquette, S.J., , sometimes known as Pere Marquette, was a French Jesuit missionary who founded Michigan's first European settlement, Sault Ste. Marie, and later founded St. Ignace, Michigan...
and Louis JollietLouis JollietLouis Jolliet, also known as Louis Joliet , was a French-Canadian explorer known for his discoveries in North America. Jolliet and missionary Father Jacques Marquette, a Catholic priest, were the first white men to explore and map the Mississippi River.-Early life:Jolliet was born in 1645 in a...
in 1673. After hearing rumors from Indians telling of the existence of the Mississippi RiverMississippi RiverThe Mississippi River is the second longest river in the United States, with a length of from its source in Lake Itasca in Minnesota to its mouth in the Gulf of Mexico....
, Marquette and Joliet set out from St. Ignace, MichiganSt. Ignace, MichiganSaint Ignace, usually written as St. Ignace, is a city in the U.S. state of Michigan. As of the 2000 census, the city population was 2,678. It is the county seat of Mackinac County. From the Lower Peninsula, St. Ignace is the gateway to the Upper Peninsula.St...
and entered the Fox RiverFox River (Wisconsin)The Fox River is a river in eastern and central Wisconsin in the United States. Along the banks is a chain of cities, including Neenah, Menasha, Appleton, Little Chute, Kimberly, Combined Locks, and Kaukauna...
at Green Bay. They canoed up the Fox until they reached the river’s westernmost point, and then portaged, or carried their boats, to the nearby Wisconsin RiverWisconsin RiverThe Wisconsin River is a tributary of the Mississippi River in the U.S. state of Wisconsin. At approximately 430 miles long, it is the state's longest river. The river's name, first recorded in 1673 by Jacques Marquette as "Meskousing," is rooted in the Algonquian languages used by the area's...
, where they resumed canoing downstream to the Mississippi River. Marquette and Joliet reached the Mississippi near what is now Prairie du Chien, WisconsinPrairie du Chien, WisconsinPrairie du Chien is a city in and the county seat of Crawford County, Wisconsin, United States. The population was 6,018 at the 2000 census....
in June 1673.

French colonization


French colonists were interested primarily in the fur tradeFur tradeThe fur trade is a worldwide industry dealing in the acquisition and sale of animal fur.-Russian fur trade:Before the colonization of the Americas, Russia was a major supplier of fur-pelts to Western Europe and parts of Asia. Fur was a major Russian export as trade developed in the early Middle...
, and established only a few small outposts. The first, at Green BayGreen Bay, WisconsinGreen Bay is a city in and the county seat of Brown County in the U.S. state of Wisconsin.The city is located at the head of its namesake Green Bay, a sub-basin of Lake Michigan, at the mouth of the Fox River. It has an elevation of 581 feet above sea level and is located 112 miles north of...
, was called simply “La Baye” by the French, and was started with Nicolet’s original trading post in 1634. A JesuitSociety of JesusThe Society of Jesus is a Catholic religious order of clerks regular whose members are called Jesuits.Jesuits are the largest male religious order in the Catholic Church, with 18,815 members—13,305 priests, 2,295 scholastic students, 1,758 brothers and 827 novices—as of January 2008, although the...
mission was established at Green Bay in 1671, and a fort was built at the settlement in 1717.

Nicolas PerrotNicolas PerrotNicolas Perrot , explorer, diplomat, and fur trader, was one of the first white men in the upper Mississippi Valley. Born in France, he came to New France around 1660 with Jesuits and had the opportunity to visit Indian tribes and learn their languages...
, French commander of the west, established Fort St. Nicholas at Prairie du Chien, WisconsinPrairie du Chien, WisconsinPrairie du Chien is a city in and the county seat of Crawford County, Wisconsin, United States. The population was 6,018 at the 2000 census....
in 1685, near the southwest end of the Fox-Wisconsin WaterwayFox-Wisconsin WaterwayThe Fox-Wisconsin Waterway is a waterway formed by the Fox and Wisconsin Rivers. First used by European settlers in 1673 during the expedition of Marquette & Joliet, it was one of the principal routes used by travelers between the Great Lakes and the Mississippi River until the completion of the...
. Perrot also built a fort on the shores of Lake PepinLake PepinLake Pepin is a naturally occurring lake, and the widest naturally occurring part of the Mississippi River. It is a widening of the river on the border between Minnesota and Wisconsin. The formation of the lake was caused by the backup of water behind the sedimentary deposits of the Chippewa...
called Fort St. Antoine. These were not military posts, but rather small storehouses for furs. A Jesuit mission and a trading post were also built on the shores of Lake SuperiorLake SuperiorLake Superior is the largest of the five Great Lakes of North America. It is bounded to the north by Ontario, Canada and Minnesota, United States, and to the south by the U.S. states of Wisconsin and Michigan...
at La Pointe, WisconsinLa Pointe, WisconsinLa Pointe is a town in Ashland County in the U.S. state of Wisconsin. The population was 246 at the 2000 census. Its name in the Anishinaabe language is Mooningwanekaaning, meaning "The Home of the Golden Breasted Woodpecker "....
at the end of the 17th Century.

None of the French posts had permanent settlers; fur traders and missionaries simply visited them from time to time to conduct business.

The British period

The British gained control of Wisconsin in 1763, and like the French, were interested in little but the fur trade. The first permanent settlers, most of them French CanadianFrench CanadianFrench Canadian refers to a nation or ethnic group of French descent that originated in Canada during the period of French colonization beginning in the 17th century. They constitute the main French-speaking population of Canada...
s, arrived in Wisconsin while it was under British control. Sieur Charles Michel de Langlade is generally recognized as the first settler, establishing a trading post at Green Bay in 1764, and moving there permanently in 1764. Settlement began at Prairie du Chien around 1781.
 

WOW!?So what does this have to do with the button?
People wear buttons......People travel.......People lose buttons.Are you now saying your button is Indian? :icon_scratch:
 

That is a Great History lesson and now with the Great help from a Experienced Detectorist like Iron Patch, you have a good Button lesson. :thumbsup: :thumbsup:

Nova Treasure
 

Montana, I understand where you are trying to come from. It does not matter how much history you quote. The fact of the matter IS.......Your button IS NOT Revolutionary War. Don Troiani is "THE" expert on this stuff. His collections go on loan to........The Smithsonian..........West Point Museum.......Penn. State Museum.....and countless others throughout the world. If you want his opinion I will give you his e-mail. It's unfortunate that it's not a Rev.War, (or French and Indian War), as it would be worth some good $. It just sounds like to me you don't want to take "no" for an answer. Some of the most knowledgeable people on this site, all say the same thing. I'm not a button expert, but I do know some. Good Luck and HH Hogge
 

it looks like to me that i p is right and you just copy pasted that big long paragraph from another sight
any how that is a cool button
 

None so blind as he (or she) who refuses to see...

...it's still a nice button but not Rev. War period.
 

romeo-1 said:
None so blind as he (or she) who refuses to see...


It's he, but an apparent avatar fetish of some sort keeps us guessing about who we're talking to.
 

Iron Patch said:
romeo-1 said:
None so blind as he (or she) who refuses to see...


It's he, but an apparent avatar fetish of some sort keeps us guessing about who we're talking to.
Do we have a lottarocks back under a sudanin :icon_scratch:

SS
 

Ok, I've sat back long enough. As far as I am concerned, Iron Patch is one of the top rev. war button experts in North America. He has access to research materials and hands-on experience that we could only dream of. He has personally FOUND more premium Loyalist and rev. buttons than anyone I know of. I'm not talking about buttons that were purchased. He does extensive research in the subject. He IS the man. Now if you were talking war of 1812 buttons..............
 

trainermick said:
Ok, I've sat back long enough. As far as I am concerned, Iron Patch is one of the top rev. war button experts in North America. He has access to research materials and hands-on experience that we could only dream of. He has personally FOUND more premium Loyalist and rev. buttons than anyone I know of. I'm not talking about buttons that were purchased. He does extensive research in the subject. He IS the man. Now if you were talking war of 1812 buttons..............


Kind words but I am FAR from an expert and it's true, I have found quite a few, and that is why I have the interest in them..... none of which have been French I might add. I would like to be an expert because it would save me from having to write the the real experts when I have a question. I use the same two guys quite a few other relic hunters use, I've just been able to cut down the really dumb questions I used to send them early on. ;D So yes, experience and a better understanding is nice, but I have a long way to go! (but I don't mind, it keeps it interesting)

PS.... My buddy the Cladman found an excellent Rev War French 74th about 7 years ago. The only French of that period I know of from around here.
 

I'm just joking around with you Iron Patch but don't underestimate how well versed you on on the subject of rev war and colonial buttons. I know for a fact that you have helped countless others id their finds (even if you did have to call a couple of guys to verify) If I ever needed some help id'ing something from that era, you would be in my top 5 go-to guys.
 

See what you can tell me about this one, its a button too. Is this a button hook from an old shoe. Do your books have coverage on these?
 

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Montana Fireball said:
See what you can tell me about this one, its a button too. Is this a button hook from an old shoe. Do your books have coverage on these?


Rev War Handi Hook Regt., 2205 patalion - Scarce coat size Captain's pattern (Captain Hook)
 

Iron Patch said:
Montana Fireball said:
See what you can tell me about this one, its a button too. Is this a button hook from an old shoe. Do your books have coverage on these?


Rev War Handi Hook Regt., 2205 patalion - Scarce coat size Captain's pattern (Captain Hook)
Must be a real good book.
 

Montana Fireball said:
Iron Patch said:
Montana Fireball said:
See what you can tell me about this one, its a button too. Is this a button hook from an old shoe. Do your books have coverage on these?


Rev War Handi Hook Regt., 2205 patalion - Scarce coat size Captain's pattern (Captain Hook)
Must be a real good book.


Yep, I have many. ;D
 

Montana Fireball said:
Is there a price value to this 2205 patalion button?
Is the test over?
 

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