Opinion please

[magua]

Yesterday, while we were on site with the gentleman who was doing GPS (ground penetrating sonar) a local gentleman approached us to show us a couple Indian arrowheads that he had. We gave him our opinion, which I’m not going to list here because he didn’t like our opinion. I showed him the thread before I’m posting this, so he knows that I’m asking for an objective opinion from people who are professional and experts, and can identify these arrowheads by approximate age, details.

I will give a little history on the area which is south western New York State, within Indian reservation area which was a confederacy. It is a very high area of finding Indian artifacts, of course. We have found many arrowheads and pottery shards within the same piece of property. We actually located what we had believed to be a burial mound a few weeks back, and we’re verifying it with some GPS. In the exact area, we have already identified graves that date to anr 1850s and they are European settlers buried within “boxes”. There is also a Native American buried at a much later time, probable 1920s to 1940s, in the exact same area. The site that we are identifying as possibly a burial mound is far earlier.

Based on that little history of the area, this gentleman presented us with these two Indian arrowheads, and he believes them to be ”very, very old.”

Opinions to age, details, authenticity. And that’s the info he was looking to share and allowed me to share about the area, and he’s looking for objective opinions.

 

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[Charl]

I admit I don’t understand the posts claiming they’re not old, as in modern day points. There is nothing modern about them. Look like exactly what they are, good rhyolite points. I’m guessing those thinking “not old” are perhaps inexperienced with the lithics? Of course, no, they are not Pre-Clovis….

 

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[MAMucker]

Those are nice Northeast stemmed points. Good size too. Possibly Argillite on the fishtail looking stemmed point (left). Lamoka may be the type. I don't think the photos are clear enough to help bring out the workmanship or material. The one on the right could be made of rhyolite, but I think it has the weathered look of argilite..
They're likely from the late Archaic period.

 

[Normeleni]

For the record paleontologists can only put modern humans in North America 14,000 to 20,000 years ago. Prior to that glaciers prevented humans from walking across the Bering land bridge between what is now Russia and Alaska. There was no known boat technology either.

In addition, modern humans are at most 200,000 years old and agriculture only happened within the last 6,000 - 8,000 years.

Just a comment on the statement that agriculture only happened within the last 6-8000 years: I’m now sitting in Crete on vacation from Georgia USA. I went to the Heraklion archaeological museum here and was stunned by what I saw. Samuel Clemons once stated the difference between the right word and the almost right word is the difference between lightening and a lightening bug. I’m a coin shooter, jewelry metal Detectorist. I saw exquisite rings, earrings crowns and workmanship up to 4000 to 6000 years ago from the Minoans. I would be hard pressed to believe agriculture only began 6-8000 years ago. But, I’m just an amateur in all humility.

 

[Treasure_Hunter]

Just a comment on the statement that agriculture only happened within the last 6-8000 years: I’m now sitting in Crete on vacation from Georgia USA. I went to the Heraklion archaeological museum here and was stunned by what I saw. Samuel Clemons once stated the difference between the right word and the almost right word is the difference between lightening and a lightening bug. I’m a coin shooter, jewelry metal Detectorist. I saw exquisite rings, earrings crowns and workmanship up to 4000 to 6000 years ago from the Minoans. I would be hard pressed to believe agriculture only began 6-8000 years ago. But, I’m just an amateur in all humility.

I think he was referring to agriculture in North America, agriculture in the cradle of civilation in middle east goes back 20,000+ yrs.

First evidence of farming in Mideast 23,000 years ago

Until now, researchers believed farming was 'invented' some 12,000 years ago in an area that was home to some of the earliest known human civilizations. A new discovery offers the first evidence that trial plant cultivation began far earlier -- some 23,000 years ago.

www.sciencedaily.com

 

[nickndfl]

The Development of Agriculture

The development of agricultural about 12,000 years ago changed the way humans lived. They switched from nomadic hunter-gatherer lifestyles to permanent settlements and farming.

education.nationalgeographic.org

About 12k years ago on the planet. There were many societies that were seafaring living off the ocean.

 

[Treasure_Hunter]

The Development of Agriculture

The development of agricultural about 12,000 years ago changed the way humans lived. They switched from nomadic hunter-gatherer lifestyles to permanent settlements and farming.

education.nationalgeographic.org

About 12k years ago on the planet. There were many societies that were seafaring living off the ocean.

12,000 years is the estimated time of large scale farming, they have found evidence going back further in Israel.

From the link in my post above.


"Date: July 22, 2015
Source: American Friends of Tel Aviv University
Summary: Until now, researchers believed farming was 'invented' some 12,000 years ago in an area that was home to some of the earliest known human civilizations. A new discovery offers the first evidence that trial plant cultivation began far earlier -- some 23,000 years ago."

 

[Normeleni]

I think he was referring to agriculture in North America, agriculture in the cradle of civilation in middle east goes back 20,000+ yrs.

First evidence of farming in Mideast 23,000 years ago

Until now, researchers believed farming was 'invented' some 12,000 years ago in an area that was home to some of the earliest known human civilizations. A new discovery offers the first evidence that trial plant cultivation began far earlier -- some 23,000 years ago.

www.sciencedaily.com

That’s makes a lot more sense. Norm