OI: Tell us your What? Who? And Why? No proof needed here.

[ECS]

Speculation based upon manipulated information to fit ones pet theory which occurs quite often on these threads is NOT science, gjb.

 

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[Carl-NC]

The dominant view here seems to be that there's absolutely no point in doing science when you can declare that you know all the answers without having done it!

Science follows the evidence. Oak Island is a situation where there is absolutely zero evidence to follow. Nothing. Zilch. So, scientific-minded folks wait for evidence, and the evidence that is offered is... fabricated. A rock. A gold link. A piece of parchment. And stories that never stop changing.

After 200 years of this, some eye-rolling is probably justified.

 

[gazzahk]

Oak Island is a situation where there is absolutely zero evidence to follow....

At least Oak Island " MONEY PIT" is the most APPROPIATLEY named treasure search in the History of mankind.....



How much money has been poured down that hole in the last 200+ years...

 

[ECS]

Frankly, if I had the authority, I wouldn't allow the desecration of a grave based on the evidence you have provided, either.

After 150+ years in buried coffin, in what condition would these maps to 58 KGC depositories be?

 

[Charlie P. (NY)]

The dominant view here seems to be that there's absolutely no point in doing science when you can declare that you know all the answers without having done it!

If I say there's no treasure on Oak Island then there is none.
I say there's no treasure on Oak Island
Therefore there is none.

Nice!

I say there is none so far.

There is no science in making up a story and following it to no suitable conclusion. That's fiction. Science is observing a phenomenon and explaining it by testing theories. The only observation on Oak Island was a depression in the soil beside a tree with grooves on a branch. Everything after that was hype and hope. "Marks" became wood platforms. Unremarkable rocks grew codes 80 years after being unearthed. Hype.

 

[Carl-NC]

Science follows the evidence. Oak Island is a situation where there is absolutely zero evidence to follow.

While there is zero evidence for science to follow, there's evidence a'plenty for true believers to consider. The evidence that everything found so far is fabricated and planted. The evidence that the stories are constantly changing. The evidence that hydrogeology has been bitterly verified in every excavation made to date. The evidence that the legend continues today to sell television advertising. The evidence that the only evidence to be found in this ordeal is negative evidence.

When applying Ockham's Razor to Oak Island, even a very dull razor is sufficient.

 

[gazzahk]

A pretty good summary of the actual story and history (with photos)

https://www.historyinorbit.com/these-brothers-are-trying-to-solve-the-oak-island-mystery/

My favorite bit....

Rick Lagina started his career as a treasure hunter early. When he was ten, Rick discovered a huge granite boulder in Kingsford, his hometown. He recruited his brother Marty, as well as some of their friends, to move the rock. Underneath the rock, Rick found a massive stockpile of… dirt. Nevertheless, the treasure hunting bug had bit him.

Sounds familiar right...

 

[bigscoop]

Not on this forum! Optimism (choosing to do something) is wrong. Pessimism (choosing to do nothing) is right. It's a strange take on the philosophy pf science: knowledge is accrued by pontificating from an armchair, science moves forward by not raising hypotheses and not testing them. The dominant view here seems to be that there's absolutely no point in doing science when you can declare that you know all the answers without having done it!

If I say there's no treasure on Oak Island then there is none.
I say there's no treasure on Oak Island
Therefore there is none.

Nice!

You guys are confusing Optimism and Pessimism as being conditions of scientific fact, or conditions supporting actual scientific evidences, to which they are not. But even in one's own fantasy world where they were, Oak Island has yet to produce either fact or any actual supported scientific evidences in regards to treasure, Templars, etc., etc. So you're just desiring to believe on blind faith and blind trust alone, something science simply never accepts. Have you ever asked yourself why the show never discusses any perfectly reasonable alternatives and theories that don't include treasure, or Templars, etc., etc.? You should because there exist many. So why don't these men of science entertain such other perfectly reasonable answers with equal flare and unbiased objectivity? The answer should be really obvious.

But hey, it's their bait and hook and if you're hungry for that bait then bite all you desire.

 

[gazzahk]

This dude has SOLVED it...

 

[Stretch Da Truth]

The battery actually makes sense.
Used to power the light house so the Templar's wouldn't crash on the way to Florida to bury the treasure.
Unfortunately they crashed in Florida and the wreck washed up this week.
Does Marty have enough money to buy Florida?

 

[Tom Slikes53]

I say there is none so far.

There is no science in making up a story and following it to no suitable conclusion. That's fiction. Science is observing a phenomenon and explaining it by testing theories. The only observation on Oak Island was a depression in the soil beside a tree with grooves on a branch. Everything after that was hype and hope. "Marks" became wood platforms. Unremarkable rocks grew codes 80 years after being unearthed. Hype.

here's a fundamental mistake the forum makes and is the source for so much argument. There's not much to do with science on Oak Island, it's a treasure hunt, don't make it out to be more then that or it will be just a source of disappointment for you. Just sit back and watch (if you're inclined to) and let other people spend their money albeit how foolishly you may think it is, Stranger things have happened and there is a small chance that they will find treasure, Marty and Rick are very skeptical a lot of the time, especially Marty they aren't trying to fool people but yet people try to make this out to be so cut and dry and liken it to some scientific research.

 

[Carl-NC]

Good treasure hunting strategies are science-based. Occasionally treasure is found by pure luck, but the most successful treasure hunters heavily rely on research & science. I agree that OI has little to do with science (none, actually) and is "for entertainment purposes only." If it's all pretend, they may as well toss out the metal detectors and grab some dowsing rods.

 

[franklin]

Now you talking! From the research I have done and the research of others I have seen, I believe that the Knight's Templar did bury their treasures on Oak Island. Why the "Tree of Life" that was found by Fred Nolan. Why the compass pointing East. In the late 1500's to mid 1600's they did navigate by the Star in the East not in the North. Also, the Folios, Sonnets in Shakespeare as well as other early 1600 documents and literature as well as the KJV of the Bible say it was buried there. Whether it is still there? I do not believe it is. Most of it was removed by our Founding Fathers before the American Revolution.

Love to be up there with my dowsing rods or my Thomas Built rods.

 

[Raparee]

"Dowsing rods"...

 

[franklin]

Carl knows what I was talking about with dowsing rods. I did his double blind test. Could not find a ten ounce gold bar lying under one of six boards 12 in by 12 in. I know dowsing does not work but it is fun to play with to make people think you know what you are doing even if you don't.

 

[ECS]

... From the research I have done and the research of others I have seen, I believe that the Knight's Templar did bury their treasures on Oak Island.
Why the "Tree of Life" that was found by Fred Nolan.
Why the compass pointing East.
In the late 1500's to mid 1600's they did navigate by the Star in the East not in the North. Also, the Folios, Sonnets in Shakespeare as well as other early 1600 documents and literature as well as the KJV of the Bible say it was buried there. Whether it is still there? I do not believe it is.
Most of it was removed by our Founding Fathers before the American Revolution...

Shakespeare's FIRST FOLIO, sonnets, the KJV BIBLE, and other early 1600 documents and literature actually state that the TEMPLARS buried treasure on Oak Island?
Then is was removed by our "Founding Fathers"?
Is there any real documentation whether it was ever there beyond speculative "solved" cipher codes that may have never existed in the listed above?
With all the various sources of this information being concealed in ciphers of the "early 1600's, it stands to reason that many knew about this secret hidden TEMPLAR treasure at Oak Island.

 

[gjb]

here's a fundamental mistake the forum makes and is the source for so much argument. There's not much to do with science on Oak Island, it's a treasure hunt, don't make it out to be more then that or it will be just a source of disappointment for you...

Speculation based upon manipulated information to fit ones pet theory which occurs quite often on these threads is NOT science, gjb.

Science follows the evidence. Oak Island is a situation where there is absolutely zero evidence to follow. Nothing. Zilch. So, scientific-minded folks wait for evidence, and the evidence that is offered is... fabricated. ... After 200 years of this, some eye-rolling is probably justified.

There are frequent demands here for proof, but no recognition that if something effectively cannot be proven then there’s little point in declaring it to be a fact, and no point whatsoever in demanding that others accept it as such. No treasure having been found on Oak Island in 200 years is not proof that there’s no treasure. That’s just a guess, and has no greater weight than the supposition that there may be treasure there. Saying it a thousand times doesn’t make it any more true.

Furthermore, the search for knowledge requires doing something. Doing nothing cannot possibly be construed as a search for knowledge. Stating that there’s no treasure on Oak Island may be correct, but it’s a declaration that you know all the answers without bothering to check if you’re right or not. God help anyone on trial with you people as jurors! Thinking there may be no treasure on Oak Island is fine. Stating that you know this for sure - something nobody can sensibly know - is not thinking at all.

When I research for likely Victorian dump sites I’m doing science. When I locate a site that I think has potential then I hypothesise that there may be something there. That’s doing science. To check this out I get out and detect. That’s doing science. If I find Victorian artefacts then I’ve proven my hypothesis. That’s doing science.

As detectorists we employ science all the time. As treasure hunters we do science. We research, we hypothesize and we get out and check our hypotheses. We learn from doing this, and we move on from what we’ve learnt. We gain knowledge by getting out and doing something. That’s doing science.

We don’t sit on our arses and do nothing - except, it seems, on this extremely cosy forum. We may decide not to investigate something, but for the most part it would be unwise to declare that investigation is pointless. What seems pointless is trying to get anyone here to see this.

I don’t know that there’s treasure on Oak Island, or if there ever was, but I’m intrigued by the engineering works and their possible purpose, so I believe it’s worthwhile trying to advance our knowledge, and to do that we don’t do nothing. We do science. We research, we hypothesise, we test. That’s what Rick and Marty are doing.

Declaring that there’s no treasure on Oak Island doesn’t advance our knowledge one little bit, but building a cofferdam at Smith’s Cove - that is, doing something - might.

As there’s no point trying to debate anything here, I’ll leave you all to congratulate yourselves on having driven yet another ‘believer’ off the forum. I take it that’s your objective.

 

[Curtis]

I am roughly Rick's age and read that Oak Island story in Reader's digest too! I have wondered about it over the years, then when started this Treasure hunting thing I did some real reading on it not long before Rick and Marty started, the things I found out made me very doubtful, but I watched as its a treasure story-right? The thing that makes me pause an scratch my head is the two human bones they found, and the parts of the book/books. Unless those were seeded I started believing there could be something there. The Templars would have had the experts that could construct the water traps and other items, they had time and probably labor to dig and construct, then back fill over what they excavated. The work could have been done on what was more or less a deserted island back then..who's going to see you? And if they come close you sail out and whack 'em! The Tree of life cross and such could have been placed there, rock carvings could be made and then acid applied to make them look old...lots of room for hoax to be made. But again there are those bones... and how far down were they? Hmmm

 

[ECS]

There are frequent demands here for proof, but no recognition that if something effectively cannot be proven then there’s little point in declaring it to be a fact, and no point whatsoever in demanding that others accept it as such.
...Saying it a thousand times doesn’t make it any more true.
...Stating that you know this for sure - something nobody can sensibly know - is not thinking at all.

gjb, the reason for "frequent demands" for proof is due to the numerous claims of pure speculation that is posted as fact.
As you stated, saying it a thousand times doesn't make it any more true, and stating that one knows for sure of something that no one can sensibly know, is NOT THINKING AT ALL.
...unless, of course, it is wishful thinking masquerading as fact in support of a pet theory.

 

[franklin]

No one can keep posting a thousand times over that there is no treasure on Oak Island either. Do you have any proof there is no treasure on Oak Island. The ship sails in both direction. Without treasure being found a claim of treasure being on Oak Island is just as valid as there is no treasure on Oak Island. Neither can be proven that is why the search has continued for 223 years and it will continue to be searched out. Why not let the Lagina brothers do most of the digging and searching while they have sponsorship of their work. Even if nothing is found all of their work is documented and someone can take that and just maybe one day find a treasure on Oak Island.

I have watched expert treasure hunters search a place until they were tired and did not want to return anymore saying there was no more treasure in that particular location. I have went back over their work searched a little deeper by not discriminating and found the larger silver and gold coins they had missed.