LUE clue...the Obit of Hardrock Hammond

[Puff the Tragic Wagon]

You changed what I posted, yet kept it in quotes.

I made no changes inside the quote except highlighting the pertinent part I was replying to in bold italic for attention.

While I have your attention, perhaps you can clarify your statement above.

“He took it from a shadowy, even secret, realm into the public lie.”

Typo? Freudian slip? Or truth.

 

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[Old Bookaroo]

I made no changes inside the quote except highlighting the pertinent part I was replying to in bold italic for attention.

While I have your attention, perhaps you can clarify your statement above.

“He took it from a shadowy, even secret, realm into the public lie.”

Typo? Freudian slip? Or truth.

Thank you for pointing out my error.

Yes, you changed my words. The correct way is to either not use quotes or close with "Emphasis added."

 

[Puff the Tragic Wagon]

Thank you for pointing out my error.

Yes, you changed my words. The correct way is to either not use quotes or close with "Emphasis added."

You’re very welcome. And thank you for the lesson in quote etiquette.

Thank you as well for the clarification and correction. It changed the dynamics considerably.

I enjoy your informative posts and was curious when I observed the dissonance in your messaging. 👍

 

[sdcfia]

"KvonM" did more to build and popularize the sport of treasure hunting that exists today than any other figure. He took it from a shadowy, even secret, realm into the public light. His books remain just as valuable today as they were when they were written and published some sixty years ago.

I don't pretend to be neutral - I met him and worked with him and I continue to admire the man and his good work. I carefully watched him at a Tulsa treasure show decades ago. He was as kind and courteous to the four-flushers and blowhards as he was to the genuine, down-to-earth treasure hunters that, happily, comprise the majority. I very much doubt he ever came across a fellow who needed a helping hand who didn't receive help.

Good luck to all,

The Old Bookaroo

I completely agree. Treasure hunting for the vast majority is primarily a sport, a hobby, a pass time. Witness the deluge of books, magazines, videos, clubs and reality TV shows that showcase the activity. It's fun stuff. Yes, Miller has been a cornerstone in the business of treasure hunting, and he should be admired for his accomplishments. I have no doubt he was a stand-up guy and someone memorable to have met - I would have loved to have chatted with him. Who wouldn't?

IMO, the "shadowy, secret realm" is by far the most intriguing aspect of the topic, where a vicarious adventurer may find himself in a serious reality. This is where some of the less acceptable aspects of human nature take control. I suspect that Miller may have been in those types of situations, and if so, acted appropriately. I suspect he leaked out some proprietary info to some searchers in his time, but if so, I'll repeat what I mentioned earlier - he very likely kept the best cards up his sleeve, and his circle of true knowing partners did the same. As George Carlin said on a different subject, "It's a big club, and we ain't in it."

 

[sdcfia]

A prime example of Brandolini's Law.

Yeah, it takes more energy cleaning up a mess than it did making it. Even though most of the world's conspiracy theories are eventually accepted as the truth becomes evident, the problem in the TH world is that disinformation, by definition, can never become evident.

 

[Puff the Tragic Wagon]

Yeah, it takes more energy cleaning up a mess than it did making it. Even though most of the world's conspiracy theories are eventually accepted as the truth becomes evident, the problem in the TH world is that disinformation, by definition, can never become evident.

Yes, the whole ‘Big Brother Watching’ excuse precludes evidentiary confirmation. Convenient and keeps the peeps happily searching.

I disagree with “most” conspiracy theories though, as very rarely does the truth actually become evident. The ones accepted are more or less due to a preponderance of Beliefs.

Without Belief and Big Brother the TH community would’ve folded their tent long ago.

 

[Crow]

The world of Treasure hunting is a hard mistress to please. She seduces you. When you think you really know her? She stings you and then you come back for some more.

Crow

 

[cyzak]

The world of Treasure hunting is a hard mistress to please. She seduces you. When you think you really know her? She stings you and then you come back for some more.

Crow

That is the exact truth right there Crow. The only way is to locate it is get off your ass and hunt for it directly keeping to yourself and not getting anyone else involved.

 

[mdog]

"KvonM" did more to build and popularize the sport of treasure hunting that exists today than any other figure. He took it from a shadowy, even secret, realm into the public light. His books remain just as valuable today as they were when they were written and published some sixty years ago.

I don't pretend to be neutral - I met him and worked with him and I continue to admire the man and his good work. I carefully watched him at a Tulsa treasure show decades ago. He was as kind and courteous to the four-flushers and blowhards as he was to the genuine, down-to-earth treasure hunters that, happily, comprise the majority. I very much doubt he ever came across a fellow who needed a helping hand who didn't receive help.

Good luck to all,

The Old Bookaroo

Did Karl ever give you any information about the LUE. If he found a LUE cache, he might be able to determine who put it there and how long ago. It must be multiple caches planted by the same group. Also, if Karl said that locations are being worked, I would assume the hunters were trying to figure out the layout of the cache site. I’m interested in the history of the LUE.

 

[mdog]

“E” for Eugene?

That’s the first thing I thought about, too.

 

[sdcfia]

Yes, the whole ‘Big Brother Watching’ excuse precludes evidentiary confirmation. Convenient and keeps the peeps happily searching.

I disagree with “most” conspiracy theories though, as very rarely does the truth actually become evident. The ones accepted are more or less due to a preponderance of Beliefs.

Without Belief and Big Brother the TH community would’ve folded their tent long ago.

It's not the believing that's the problem. It's the human tendency of not accepting the possibility of judgement error that's the problem.

As far as Big Brother goes, an easy way of dealing with them is to assume everything they say is a lie. That narrows the field of possible true possibilities.

 

[Old Bookaroo]

Yes, the whole ‘Big Brother Watching’ excuse precludes evidentiary confirmation. Convenient and keeps the peeps happily searching.

I disagree with “most” conspiracy theories though, as very rarely does the truth actually become evident. The ones accepted are more or less due to a preponderance of Beliefs.

Without Belief and Big Brother the TH community would’ve folded their tent long ago.

I would suggest Mr. Johnson didn't go back because he knew he was very lucky to get out alive the first time - and didn't want to repeat the experience.

2.0 - It is also important to keep in mind that the Gold Act was enforce at the time of the find.

Good luck to all,

The Old Bookaroo

 

[Old Bookaroo]

Did Karl ever give you any information about the LUE. If he found a LUE cache, he might be able to determine who put it there and how long ago. It must be multiple caches planted by the same group. Also, if Karl said that locations are being worked, I would assume the hunters were trying to figure out the layout of the cache site. I’m interested in the history of the LUE.

Nope. We discussed a number of topics, including some of the successful treasure hunters remaining in the background during the show, but not the LUE. The event was poorly attended, which gave us more time to chat.

Good luck to all,

The Old Bookaroo

 

[releventchair]

Yeah, it takes more energy cleaning up a mess than it did making it. Even though most of the world's conspiracy theories are eventually accepted as the truth becomes evident, the problem in the TH world is that disinformation, by definition, can never become evident.

Truth seems evident enough when a lead won't flesh out. Who needs to be convinced usually isn't the one holding a rope with no mule attached expecting a free mule of any value.
sure they exist. Both.

I've collided with brute reality involving a lead just fine without the " treasure community's" input originating or peddling it. Taciturn contrary info from others afield /in the field doesn't get passed on far . Let alone to the public. And not in a book.( Though the finder of my file cards will meet with mostly dismay if they are pursued too far.)

Faith then is in pursuing the leads credibility. Not in it's origin or ending. Nor it's actual credibility. If you/I knew it wouldn't be a lead. And a lead is not a bird in hand until it is or isn't. Sure better odds might be predicated. Logic and common sense applies to most.


A lead handed thousands of people isn't going to stimulate much desire for me to pursue it in person.
I'm not nor expecting to be that good at research or in the field.
Like others before me though I keep somewhat an eye on some spots off limits and unproven in thier leads. Amidst reality nearby.
But the big ones floated in public like the LUE?
Certainly get attention. Even mine.
No I'm not throwing a free mule rope in the truck just yet. The hunted of regions alone being out of my scope. But for entertaining hidden stuff pursuits for the sake of pursuits? It still holds.
.

 

[Old Bookaroo]

The world of Treasure hunting is a hard mistress to please. She seduces you. When you think you really know her? She stings you and then you come back for some more.

Crow

'There is something in a treasure that fastens upon a man's mind. He will pray and blaspheme and still persevere, and will curse the day he ever heard of it, and will let his last hour come upon him unawares, still believing that he missed it only by a foot. He will see it every time he closes his eyes. He will never forget it till he is dead - and even then ...'

~ Nostromo, Joseph Conrad

 

[cyzak]

Wow some of the intellect on this thread, I can not even compete with I have actually had to pull the Webster down and look some things up.

 

[Puff the Tragic Wagon]

Wow some of the intellect on this thread, I can not even compete with I have actually had to pull the Webster down and look some things up.

I hazard a guess we’re all graduates of the same school, Cyzak. The School of Hard Knocks teaches some hard lessons. But you’ll learn more than you ever would by reading treasure books.

The hardest, but most useful, lesson I’ve learned is critical thinking. Once I learned how, the speed bumps and wrong turns slowing me down all disappeared.

Yet here I am, still learning, lol.

 

[Crow]

One thing in life you will experience in university of hard knocks many failures. There is no shame in failure. There is shame in never trying at all.

I am not ashamed my failure rate is about 95%. of my projects. But one thing I learned from those failures. Some things its your own faulty research or actions that lead to failure or circumstances beyond your control.

You can learn to be a better researcher and learn to be a better planer of projects. You cannot change things beyond your control. So no point beating yourself up over it. But with any successes wrestling the dragon can come with a sting in its tail. So when you have been down that path with "The Firm" You soon learn to never admit to any thing, you don't have to!

Crow

 

[sdcfia]

I would suggest Mr. Johnson didn't go back because he knew he was very lucky to get out alive the first time - and didn't want to repeat the experience.

2.0 - It is also important to keep in mind that the Gold Act was enforce at the time of the find.

Good luck to all,

The Old Bookaroo

By far, the most important fact to be aware of when playing this game. Not just the LUE game, but all significant treasure tales that happened to have surfaced in that era. We can debate all day on the LUE, but so far, IMO, mdog's mapping work that implies a Unified Treasure Theory is at the heart of it all - at least in the USA.

 

[sdcfia]

Truth seems evident enough when a lead won't flesh out. Who needs to be convinced usually isn't the one holding a rope with no mule attached expecting a free mule of any value.
sure they exist. Both.

I've collided with brute reality involving a lead just fine without the " treasure community's" input originating or peddling it. Taciturn contrary info from others afield /in the field doesn't get passed on far . Let alone to the public. And not in a book.( Though the finder of my file cards will meet with mostly dismay if they are pursued too far.)

Faith then is in pursuing the leads credibility. Not in it's origin or ending. Nor it's actual credibility. If you/I knew it wouldn't be a lead. And a lead is not a bird in hand until it is or isn't. Sure better odds might be predicated. Logic and common sense applies to most.


A lead handed thousands of people isn't going to stimulate much desire for me to pursue it in person.
I'm not nor expecting to be that good at research or in the field.
Like others before me though I keep somewhat an eye on some spots off limits and unproven in thier leads. Amidst reality nearby.
But the big ones floated in public like the LUE?
Certainly get attention. Even mine.
No I'm not throwing a free mule rope in the truck just yet. The hunted of regions alone being out of my scope. But for entertaining hidden stuff pursuits for the sake of pursuits? It still holds.
.

IMO, there is zero chance of discovery for the benchmark treasures. You know, the famous ones that everybody knows about, has been written about and searched for by thousands of hopefuls for the past hundred years or more. They are fun to ponder and debate, for sure, but when you figure how many degrees of separation you are from the "truth", if any, in the long run, these things are primarily sucker bets robbing you of time and energy.

If you're serious about digging up loot somewhere, find a target that intrigues you and has had little publicity. Chances are not great that you'll succeed, but at least the odds are not zero.