Llanganatis Mountains: Valverdes Gold

[cactusjumper]

Re: Llanganatis Mountains: Valverde's Gold

Crow,......Oops, I see where that should have been Alaskan Adventurer.

I see your joke, as I don't believe there has ever been a case where the bears have attacked humans, of course if they ended up eating the occasional lost treasure hunter, who would know?

From what I have read, limited, I would guess your assessment of the Llangantis would be spot on. A guide who can swing a machete all day is a definite "must have". Beyond that, someone who has made multiple , documented, trips into that range might be helpful.

I know Paul has long dreamed of making such a trek, but I doubt the books we have read can do justice to just what a man-killer the Llangantis can be.

As far as the treasure stories go.......too many authentication problems for some of the basic names and events for me.

Thanks for your reply,

Joe

 

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[cactusjumper]

Re: Llanganatis Mountains: Valverde's Gold

One other thing concerning taking a trek into the Llanganatis:

The writer of "Valverde's Gold", Mark Honigsbaum. Prior to completing his expedition, Mark chose to quit the attempt. He opted to turn tail and head back to civilization. Keep in mind, he had made a shorter trip into the range as a kind of warm-up.

He had also heard many warnings of how hard it was to travel the Llanganatis, and how many others had died or disappeared there.

On the other hand, he wrote one #ell of an interesting book.

Good luck,

Joe Ribaudo

 

[Alaskan Adventurer]

Re: Llanganatis Mountains: Valverde's Gold

Crow,......Oops, I see where that should have been Alaskan Adventurer.

I see your joke, as I don't believe there has ever been a case where the bears have attacked humans, of course if they ended up eating the occasional lost treasure hunter, who would know?

From what I have read, limited, I would guess your assessment of the Llangantis would be spot on. A guide who can swing a machete all day is a definite "must have". Beyond that, someone who has made multiple , documented, trips into that range might be helpful.

I know Paul has long dreamed of making such a trek, but I doubt the books we have read can do justice to just what a man-killer the Llangantis can be.

As far as the treasure stories go.......too many authentication problems for some of the basic names and events for me.

Thanks for your reply,

Joe

In December we have a small 10 day expedition planned to check out a river that is very rich. According to one other person who made the trek, it takes about 3 days in and 3 days out and we have about 4 days planned for sampling a few parts of the river. The previous guy was pulling out about 1/4 gram of very course gold per pan and this was done by crevicing. We are hoping it is possible to pack a small dredge in, though it would be very, very difficult.

I had my own recent, insane experience a couple weeks ago involving a very large flash flood. This was about 5-6 km into the outer edge of the Llanganitis. We had a good one hundred feet of beach to sample during the day, and it started raining around 5 pm while we were finishing our cleanup. By 1 am we were scrambling to move our camp and basically save our lives. Keep in mind we had our camp set up at the highest point on the beach. We lucked out and some natives had cleared about an acre on the edge of the jungle above the high water mark. We moved our gear, which probably weighed close to a ton to this clearing just in time. That 100 feet of beach was completely under water. I have never seen such a devastating flash flood like that. You could here massive boulders rolling underwater. There are boulders in the area a good 20 feet high and they are quite a ways up on the beach. Absolutely amazing. Needless to say, our trip was pretty much put on hold until the waters receded. The rainfall last for about 3 days, and finally the river went back down a bit. Some of my laborers decided enough was enough and went back home. Quite the experience. Back in town there was a lot of flood damage, and town is a good 45 kms away. Massive storm system. Luckily only one sad fatality, which unfortunately was a little girl.

 

[Alaskan Adventurer]

Re: Llanganatis Mountains: Valverde's Gold

Crow,......Oops, I see where that should have been Alaskan Adventurer.

I see your joke, as I don't believe there has ever been a case where the bears have attacked humans, of course if they ended up eating the occasional lost treasure hunter, who would know?

From what I have read, limited, I would guess your assessment of the Llangantis would be spot on. A guide who can swing a machete all day is a definite "must have". Beyond that, someone who has made multiple , documented, trips into that range might be helpful.

I know Paul has long dreamed of making such a trek, but I doubt the books we have read can do justice to just what a man-killer the Llangantis can be.

There is a mountain village called Oyacachi that frequently has trouble with bears attacking their livestock. This is the new Oyacachi. The old one was abandoned due to frequent bear attacks in the area. I remember reading that the town was abandoned in the 1600s. Oddly enough, this is one of the few areas in Ecuador that was not raided by the Spanish conquistadors. Mainly due to its inhospitable terrain. One of the few other locations would of course be the Llanganatis for reasons we have discussed. Oyacachi itself is at 11,000+ feet elevation and is very windy and cold.

As far as the treasure stories go.......too many authentication problems for some of the basic names and events for me.

Thanks for your reply,

Joe

 

[cactusjumper]

Re: Llanganatis Mountains: Valverde's Gold

AA,

Keen Engineering used to make a very light wt. Backpack Dredge. Didn't use a lot of gas, and one porter could pack it in. On the other hand, you could pack in a number of very light aluminum sluice box's that would probably be worth looking at. I have one in my garage.

Where there's gold.......there's a way.

Let us know how it turns out.

Good luck,

Joe

 

[Alaskan Adventurer]

Re: Llanganatis Mountains: Valverde's Gold

AA,

Keen Engineering used to make a very light wt. Backpack Dredge. Didn't use a lot of gas, and one porter could pack it in. On the other hand, you could pack in a number of very light aluminum sluice box's that would probably be worth looking at. I have one in my garage.

Where there's gold.......there's a way.

Let us know how it turns out.

Good luck,

Joe

Yes, where there's gold, there is definitely a way...love it.

I am working on the designs for a project. I will post it in a few areas of Tnet, including the Inca gold section. Anyone reading this thread and anything else who finds Inca gold legends fascinating and exciting should check my thread out and give me opinions.

AA

 

[Alaskan Adventurer]

The last couple of days has been absolutely amazing. Two weeks ago I met this wonderful woman, and her stunning daughter in a new restaurant that just opened up here in Vilcabamba. We started talking about Inca history and she whispers in my ear that her very old father is a famous explorer and has made 61 expeditions into the Llanganatis after Atahualpas' ransom. Deep down, I thought to myself that this was too good to be true but I was hopeful. Two days ago, I met Andres Fernandez-Salvador for the first time with his wife and daughter, Andrea and we absolutely hit it off. The first night we chatted and drink scotch together for about 5 hours. He is genuinely the real deal. The book Sweat of the Sun, Tears of the Moon has many chapters about him and his cousin. He has more trips into the Llanganatis than anyone alive, 61 in total and his son is making a 62nd trip in September. He has lost friends and even family in the rugged region and rugged is an understatement. His group has pretty much traveled every square mile throughout the park, and they feel they are very close to actually finding it. He wants me to travel out to his ranch in Guayaquil in the end of June, early July to talk about some projects he is interested in.

Some of his accomplishments:

1. Black belt in Judo
2. Has the current world record for the one armed lift, below waist level, at about 155 pounds.
3. Almost won the 100 meter dash world record(I think i have this right) by 2/10s of a second.
4. Was the President of the Galapagos Island Association.
5. Is the President of the Cattle Ranchers Association and owns a huge ranch with 2200 head of cattle, hundreds of hectares of Cacao, and hundreds of hectares of teak trees.
6. Is a well known explorer with 61 personal trips into the Llanganatis after Atahualpas treasure and has been in involved with many other expeditions from the Tayos caves, to shipwreck salvage off the coast.
7. He is 88 years old, is in great shape for his age, and is very humble. All these accomplishments i pretty much got out of his daughter, and he verified.

I have never been more excited about meeting someone in my life and I am looking forward to this summer. I shared an idea with him about a website devoted to treasure hunting, gold prospecting and adventure in Ecuador with tons and tons of video showing in detail the beauty, mystery and danger of Ecuador. Every one of our prospecting trips would be with the end result of hoping to find a sizable amount of gold. Of course we would be leaving out the name of the river or region we are working for obvious reasons. He is estatic about the idea and wants to assist in it. I want to video Andres in periodic interviews with stories of his adventures.

The site will most likely not be up and running until later this summer if it does happen. I believe it will, and I will keep you updated. Eventually I will be stepping foot in the Llanganatis and will have it filmed, so people will get to witness the craziness of the park.

PS. It was Andres' cousin who fought with the government to protect the Llanganati mountains and have it be turned into a protected National Park. Kudos to him.

 

[cactusjumper]

AA,

Sounds like you are on a great adventure yourself.

Peter Lourie does not waste any time getting to Andres Fernandez-Salvador, and brings him into his story on page 6 of his spellbinding book.

My good friend Paul, mentioned he was going to meet the author four years ago. I sent him my copy of the book and Mr. Lourie wrote a nice inscription for me. It's a book that's hard to put down once you get started.

Can't wait for your website to get up and running.

Good luck,

Joe Ribaudo

 

[Alaskan Adventurer]

AA,

Sounds like you are on a great adventure yourself.

Peter Lourie does not waste any time getting to Andres Fernandez-Salvador, and brings him into his story on page 6 of his spellbinding book.

My good friend Paul, mentioned he was going to meet the author four years ago. I sent him my copy of the book and Mr. Lourie wrote a nice inscription for me. It's a book that's hard to put down once you get started.

Can't wait for your website to get up and running.

Good luck,

Joe Ribaudo

Thanks Joe. I can't stress how amazing Andres is, with his wonderful sense of humor. I have never met a more interesting person in my life.

 

[Cubfan64]

Alaskan Adventurer - Hard to imagine meeting Andres was just a lucky coincidence, I like to think things happen for a reason. That's definitely a once in a lifetime opportunity to spend time with him and possibly learn some things and maybe even become included in an exploration trip with him. What a remarkable honor!!

If you do get photographs and/or video, I can tell you I would be thrilled to see them all! If the website you're talking about doesn't get off the ground, and you have too much to post here at TNet, I would be happy to share my e-mail as well as mailing address with you if it meant I could experience the Llanganatis and exploring out there vicariously

Have fun and be safe!

 

[Alaskan Adventurer]

What is honestly stopping you from coming here and joining the adventure? Get to know me and my buds and potentially join us.

I spoke to him, his daughter and wife today again and now I have their personal cell numbers and have been given permission to call them at any time.

While I am playing the waiting game, i am embracing my second passion. Permaculture, and organic gardening. One interest Andres has in me is my knowledge of a hardwood tree called the Paulownia. Very valuable timber, and is the most environmentally friendly tree in the world and is the fastest growing plant in the world. It can reach 15 feet in height in its first year, and he wants me to bring a couple hundred roots with me when I head out to his ranch.

Keep in touch, Cub.

 

[Cubfan64]

Right now the biggest hindrances to going there and joining the adventure are time and money . I chose a path many years ago that requires of me a responsibility for others as well as myself. While I don't regret that decision, I have my moments where I wonder what things could have been like .

That said, there's always the possibility of at least heading there to visit for a week - certainly not out of the question, just needs to be planned better. In the meantime, I definitely want to stay in the loop and keep in touch - if not here, then by e-mail.

Interesting story about the tree you mentioned. I don't recall the type(s) of trees in the US that can grow that quickly, but I though trees that grew that fast rarely if ever have useful wood as it's too weak. The Paulownia must be something unique.

I'll send you my e-mail address

Paul

 

[cactusjumper]

Hi Paul,

Everything you might ever want to know about the Paulownia tree:

Paulownia - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Wow! Take notice of the sunlight needed, the effects of a high water table and growing them in on a plantation.

Take care,

Joe

 

[Alaskan Adventurer]

Hi Paul,

Everything you might ever want to know about the Paulownia tree:

Paulownia - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Wow! Take notice of the sunlight needed, the effects of a high water table and growing them in on a plantation.

Take care,

Joe

Yes, like everything else in the world, the Paulownia is not perfect. It has some remarkable properties though and should be respected. The majority of plants do not do well in swampy conditions. I have been experimenting with the Paulownia for a good 6 months now and they are tough and relatively easy to grow. Most plants prefer full sun, and the Paulownia is no different. It has an advantage though of having leaves that reach a couple feet in length.

Anyway, let's get back to the subject at hand. The Llanganatis!

 

[hamiddetecting]

Congratulation!

 

[heroemartin]

Alaskan Adventurer.

I am really jealous of you meeting Andres Fernandez Salvador. I believe he is the key to finding the the actual sites mentioned by Valverdes Derrotero.

I have made some research in the matter because it is a passion I have, the llanganatis treasure. I even tried to hunt Adnres down to be able to chatt with him and know some of his opinions on the matter.

I went on an Expedition to the Llanganatis once, 5 day trek. I went not to Cerro Hermoso or Laguna de Brunner, but to the Cueva de los Tayos. After reading a lot of information and passages of books referring to Dyott and Andres Fernandez Salvador, I believe i have pin pointed the areas of interest. I hope in the future to be making another expedition a bit more prepared, since the time I went, the jungle had taken the trail, and it wouldve taken us at least 10 days to reach the Cave, although the guides knew the way, they lost it in the bushes.

It be interesting if we could meet up some time to talk and share stories and view points. I currently live in Quito, so send me an email anytime and we can meet up if youre in Quito as well, or close to Quito and I can go to you. My email is [email protected]

The information i tried to gather is taken from many people, but i am sure Andres Fernandez Salvador holds the best information on the Llanganatis,

Really enjoy your time with him! Its an honor of yours meeting him!

 

[Alaskan Adventurer]

Hey HeroeMartin. I Pmed you concerning meeting up down the road. Yes, i am a lucky person to have met Andres and his daughter. What is the odds of randomly meeting his daughter in Vilcabamba and then getting a chance to spend days with her father in person? Pretty small world.

AA

 

[wilkes]

I have to tell you guys, this conversation has me glued to the computer screen. Being out there in the jungle and mountains after a fabled treasure is about as exciting as I feel this life gets!

Would love to plan something and join in on the expedition some day guys. Will follow with keeness until then!

Wilkes

 

[ayahuasca]

Hello All

Just a few more interesting points

There are no references to Valverde in the context of the legend prior Richard spruces publication of the Map and Derrotero? ( first publication 1861 and later 1863 )



Crow

I used to believe that too - that there was nothing before Spruce.

However, not so.

Villavicencio published a book on Ecuador's history and geograph in 1858 and it contains mention of the Llanganati legend, Valverde, the derrotero, etc. It was published before any of Spuce's information.

Interestingly, some of Villavicensio's phraseology sound familiar: e.g. that he only saw a copy of the derretero as someone "not content with a copy, made off with the original."

Spruce first became aware of the Llanganates legend in 1857 and he researched it in 1858 and 1859, publicising it (to the English speaking world) in 1862.

It it seems that one of his 1858 sources might have been Villavicencio's work, in which case the information clearly did not originate with Spruce but was known previously.

Villavicencio, for what it is worth, thought that the legend could be true.

In my opinion the best reading material on the Llanganates, and I have pretty much all of it apart from d'Orsay, is Luciano Andrade Marin's book, 'Llanganati'. The 1935 edition is available online (as is the Villavicencio book).

 

[Old Bookaroo]

Would you mind providing the details of the d'Orsay book you mentioned?

Thank you!

Good luck to all,

The Old Bookaroo