Legend of the Stone Maps

i dont think the photo is a cabinet card, i think its a photo in a
cardboard frame, im looking for that Greek Key Design, was prob
sold everywhere though,and in the 30s and 40s
http://www.dowahdiddy.com/v/vspfiles/photos/FRAME1-W12-3.jpg

Hal Croves said:
cw0909,
So, that photo of Bearmun (b.1919), Freddie (b.1923), and Eddie (b.1921)... what year do you think that it was taken?
I would say aroundish 1930.
The bumper photo could not be earlier than 1938/9, because of the car, but the two images use the same boarder. That can only mean that the images were taken and then years later(?) reprinted into these cabinet card like prints. Matthew Roberts has said as much.

Nice observation cw0909!

Unfortunatly, dating the cabinet card will not tell us when the original photo was taken. But, if that cabinet card pre-dates 1948 then something is wrong with the discovery story.
Click to expand...
 

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Homar, i shaded the img a little and it looks like the heart
is in place

 heart insert.png
 

cw0909 said:
i dont think the photo is a cabinet card, i think its a photo in a
cardboard frame, im looking for that Greek Key Design, was prob
sold everywhere though,and in the 30s and 40s
http://www.dowahdiddy.com/v/vspfiles/photos/FRAME1-W12-3.jpg
Click to expand...

It may be.
I see it as an image printed on card stock, a cabinet card. They look like this when cracked or torn. This one was split, by the thing that pierced it or the string that is tied to it. There should also be a clean die cut around the center opening. If you look at the top of the inner photo, the edge is jagged.

I didn't think about a frame!
Still could be.
We can't know until we see the original.

Its history, how it became public would be something.

 

Last edited:
coazon de oro said:
Howdy Lynda,

The one's you are using to show the difference are two different photos. The bumper photo has the heart insert in place, while the other one does not.

Homar
Click to expand...

I had to do a double take on that one, LOL. Gotta disagree on that. The two photo's I'm comparing both have the heart inserted. I'm talking about the bumper photo. One with the fancy border which has been retouched to take out the scratches and the other is the same photo, with the scratches and no border. Are we on the same page?
 

Gotta cha.

Let me rephrase.........Both the retouched bumper and the original bumper photo (same photo) show a different arch peak at the Rio line from the stone maps on display in the museum. I do not see any recent displays, replicas with the arch as depicted in the area I pointed to on the bumper vs. the area on the museum display.
 

LOL we cant even fig if they are authentic, to go look and see
 

H-2 CHARLIE said:
Does anyone truly think they are going to find any treasure from this rocks ? Ha ha
Click to expand...

Lots of people do and have for a long time.
I do.
More than a few members here do.
Even the skeptics hope they do.

There are other examples of stone treasure maps. Those stories point to Mexico, Santa Anna and that group, which makes complete sense. The Mexicans did lose the land to the Americans. If they are Mexican treasure maps, it would be logical that one of the Tumlinsons somehow came into possession of the stone maps, at some point in history.

How and when is a mystery.

For now, all we can do is hope to date them.
 

cw0909 said:
thats odd dosent go through the design

attachment.php
Click to expand...

It may support your idea of a photo in a frame. It looks like the die cut was off and the tab or tear overlaps the photo.
If it is a cabinet card, I can't explain it.
Unless the picture was hand marbled after made into a cabinet card?

?
 

For anybody Wondering about the difference between the stones in the Bumper Pic and now, here is a GIF I made a while back comparing the lower trail map from the bumper pic to one I took in 2010. It is not exact, but extremely close. The reason is that I had to reorient the map from the bumper pic because it was not a straight ahead view.

A lot of the differences are for several reasons, lighting, poor older pic quality, and don't forget the dirt and roots still in the grooves (according to both Travis T and Al Reser).

Mike

Lower Trail GIF.gif
 

Last edited:
You 'all may need to get out the rotten tomatoes for throwing at me but here goes anyway.

I don't think the car in the photo is new OR a cherry example of show room quality. The whole front chrome section of the bumper is missing. The upright's are missing from where the bumper joins at the chasse clips and the paint is less than mint in the headlight area.
 

Old said:
You 'all may need to get out the rotten tomatoes for throwing at me but here goes anyway.

I don't think the car in the photo is new OR a cherry example of show room quality. The whole front chrome section of the bumper is missing. The upright's are missing from where the bumper joins at the chasse clips and the paint is less than mint in the headlight area.
Click to expand...

This was already hashed out in my old Stone Maps Thread. The car is a 1939 Olds. When I asked Janie Tumlinson in 2011 about it, she told me that her dad always loved his Oldsmobiles. That is the only type of car he liked. Here is the base pic I used to figure it:

1939 Oldsmobile-01.jpg foundstonemapsbumper.jpg

Mike
 

Last edited:
Old said:
You 'all may need to get out the rotten tomatoes for throwing at me but here goes anyway.

I don't think the car in the photo is new OR a cherry example of show room quality. The whole front chrome section of the bumper is missing. The upright's are missing from where the bumper joins at the chasse clips and the paint is less than mint in the headlight area.
Click to expand...


Old,

No one throwing tomatoes at you for an honest, extremely well thought out opinion and the courage to voice it.

The car is not new, it's 16 years old.

Cabinet cards were merely a way to mount a photograph. Any photograph can still be made into one today. They were very popular in the 30's 40's and 50's. Early Phoenix studios sold them 5 photo cards for $1
There were two ways to mount a photo. Insert an actual photograph onto the card, or the image and card would be developed as one.

Of course no camera took ready made photocard photo/negatives so the photo and card had to be at some point married or manufactured by the developer.

This is what the original photograph of the Stone Maps on the bumper of the 1939 Oldsmobile looks like before being made into a photocard.

Stone Map original photo 1956.jpg

Now if I were to say the photo was taken in 1956, the tomatoes would definitely start flying.

Matthew
 

Matthew Roberts said:
Old,

No one throwing tomatoes at you for an honest, extremely well thought out opinion and the courage to voice it.

The car is not new, it's 16 years old.

Cabinet cards were merely a way to mount a photograph. Any photograph can still be made into one today. They were very popular in the 30's 40's and 50's. Early Phoenix studios sold them 5 photo cards for $1
There were two ways to mount a photo. Insert an actual photograph onto the card, or the image and card would be developed as one.

Of course no camera took ready made photocard photo/negatives so the photo and card had to be at some point married or manufactured by the developer.

This is what the original photograph of the Stone Maps on the bumper of the 1939 Oldsmobile looks like before being made into a photocard.

View attachment 1182320

Now if I were to say the photo was taken in 1956, the tomatoes would definitely start flying.

Matthew
Click to expand...

Perhaps the photo was taken much later than that? Who knows....
The photo has been touched up, doctored, re touched and doctored again.
In my opinion, the photo won't tell any of us squat. We can't date it or authenticate it therefore the best someone can label it is just what it is; a keepsake souvenir.
 

Not necessarily before or after 1949.
This from Ryan's last video.......

View attachment J Steele story map.bmp

As the header says.....made from the photo taken at the gas station in AJ.
Before or after the original "bumper photo" was damaged ?
Note the 2nd large hole on the lower stone, plus the small cross above the larger hole.
 

Last edited:
somehiker said:
Not necessarily before or after 1949.
This from Ryan's last video.......

View attachment 1182408

As the header says.....made from the photo taken at the gas station in AJ.
Before or after the original "bumper photo" was damaged ?
Note the 2nd large hole on the lower stone, plus the small cross above the larger hole.
Click to expand...

Howdy Somehiker,

The header at least verifies my belief that when Travis went to search for the rest of the stones, he parked on the Northbound lane just East of the Queen Creek bridge. With no turnaround, he headed to Apache Junction where he hosed off the stones at a gas station. I believe the Florence Junction story came from someone who assumed it was there where he stopped. Travis's manuscript should set things straight. As you once said, it is what's inside the manuscript that really matters.

Homar
 

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