Jesse James Artifact Found in SE Oklahoma. I need all the information I can get.

Sides

Greenie
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Best Photo.webp

UPDATE

Please. As much info as possible. The metal scratches bright silver. Possibly Lead. It is heavy for its size as well. Dimensions below.

4in x 2 3/8in

1in wide varying slightly

100mm x 60mm

width slants from 22mm to 27mm
 

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That is soooo dam cool !
My guess is it is a slice ( pieces of eight ) 8-)
It was positioned pointed toward frank and Jessie’s buried treasure. Follow the direction it was pointed ,Find the remaining seven !
Congratulations to you and your Dad on such an interesting pieces!
Good Luck and HH !!

No likes? Wow talk about socialism...
 

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If it's been previously posted by the OP's dad, maybe there is a clue in "dad's" thread. What was his username? Perhaps the original info can be resurrected.
 

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What truly it is, versus what the imagination do see, the two shall never be....
 

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I think it's an earlier version of Schrödinger's Box and there is a poisoned cat inside.

Open it and get back to us.
 

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what good is it if no one knows what it is. crack that thing open allready. Cant sell it cause no experts know what it is if no one here knows nobody knows ..........Si its a worthless piece of pie. Cow pie crack it open..........
 

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I definitely am aware it could be nothing at all. I wanted to make sure and that's why I am here. So far, no one can really do anything further than speculate unless we can come up with photos of things that look similar. As of right now I've gotten a lot of information and I appreciate it a great deal but I'm essentially in the same boat as when I posted.
The system works. Thats why this forum is famous. Everyone posts their thoughts and opinions and one good idea leads to another and bang its solved! It could take days, months or years. Be patient, follow every lead and testing the metal is important so we know what we are working with.. Yes there are some items unsolved after years still pending but I have also seen many mysteries solved, even when it looked impossible. Solving it may be necessary to get top dollar but its not worthless. It may prove to be worthless but at this point its an unknown.
 

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The James gang left clues for each other near all their caches. If you have good info on where it was found I would return to the area and look for markers on trees, boulders etc....what do you have to lose right? Watch the KGC documentary about the James gang. Sky is the limit on this one.
 

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I did not. My father unearthed this in a wooded area near an old road in SE Oklahoma. I know it's previous placement to the exact point but of course, I cannot disclose any information. Also I can post more photos on request. I just want to get to the bottom of it or find someone that can.

Sides, i dont know what it is, interesting for sure. have you checked to see what
was in the area of the old road, for the last 100yrs or so, can you will you share
that info in general terms, IE: was a few farms 100 yr ago, 150 yr ago was nothing
but maybe Indian Territory
 

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.. but I'm essentially in the same boat as when I posted.

Strongly dis-agree. You've drawn on the minds of 100's of treasure hunters, with 1000's of years combined experience, who've spent countless hours in the libraries, museums, internet, news papers and out in the fields and on the trail of countless treasures. The collective experience of this forum, based on the photo's and information you've provided, has lead to a general consensus that it was a handmade artifact given as a toy or gift or craft for a more or less utilitarian purpose.

I know it's not the outcome one wants and we all want to let our imaginations run wild, but based on what we have, that's the general consensus.

There are a few more things you can do on your end as many have suggested. First, have the materials tested to determine it's exact composition. Second, post pictures of the missing side. Third, drill a core sample from it if you want to find out whats inside.
 

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As a crafts person, I find it hard to accept that one could create a design such as this, only to look at it after it was finished, and go, "OH DARN, the circles are all out of whack."

That's the part that is odd ... I think they DID align the openings.

It could mean a thousand different things, though.

TRIANGLE.webp
 

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Strongly dis-agree. You've drawn on the minds of 100's of treasure hunters, with 1000's of years combined experience, who've spent countless hours in the libraries, museums, internet, news papers and out in the fields and on the trail of countless treasures. The collective experience of this forum, based on the photo's and information you've provided, has lead to a general consensus that it was a handmade artifact given as a toy or gift or craft for a more or less utilitarian purpose.

I know it's not the outcome one wants and we all want to let our imaginations run wild, but based on what we have, that's the general consensus.
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That part I like...

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There are a few more things you can do on your end as many have suggested. First, have the materials tested to determine it's exact composition. Second, post pictures of the missing side. Third, drill a core sample from it.

DONT drill it. heh

And... this IS lead and copper. IMO.
 

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If it's been previously posted by the OP's dad, maybe there is a clue in "dad's" thread. What was his username? Perhaps the original info can be resurrected.

But shouldnt this have been disclosed in post#1?

chub
 

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Your start position was: “I need all the information I can get” but getting information from you has been like pulling teeth. There will be questions you can’t answer (the interpretation of the numerals/date for example, which surely we must regard as a critical part of any solution for what it is) but there have been a lot of simple questions which you have ignored or evaded and basic information which you have not volunteered.

Material of Construction?
It appears to be lead with copper wire inlay, neither of which are actually confirmed and you don’t want to have any tests conducted on it. Fair enough if you don’t want to risk damaging it, but in the UK you can buy a twin-pack of 3M “Lead Check” swabs for £7.75 and I’d be amazed if you can’t get them in the US. You only need to swab a little dust off the surface to test, with no harm to the piece itself.

Is it solid?
You say it’s not a box and doesn’t open in that way, but that doesn’t mean it’s solid. You haven’t confirmed that it doesn’t rattle although your comments infer that it doesn’t. Since it has ‘seams’ and may have been poured in two halves (or multiple pourings) as has been suggested, you have no way of knowing whether something was inserted during the casting process (a coin, key or whatever for example), or if it has a void. A density calculation (see below) might help and an X-ray (as previously suggested) might tell you nothing at all, but surely is worth a try to see if anything shows up.

Size?
You say it’s 100 x 60mm with a width between 22 -27mm. But is the 100mm measurement the actual height from centre of the base to the apex or measured on the diagonal from corner to corner? You were also asked how many pieces the same size would fit into a circle but didn’t answer. You could easily establish this by repeatedly tracing it onto a piece of paper.

Weight?
Despite being asked several times, the only answer you have given is that it’s “heavy for its size”. An exact weight (with confirmation of the nature of the exact dimensions as above) would enable a calculation on its density and potentially help determine its composition or construction. Why don’t you want to provide this information? It might also be relevant if the piece has been made to an exact weight in terms of number of ounces.

The other face?
You have consistently avoided showing it to us, despite numerous asks. Some are calling it the back and some calling it the bottom but – just to be clear – what is being asked for is a picture of flipside to the face that has the ‘copper’ decoration. If it’s completely blank to the extent that it’s of no relevance then why don’t you just say so? Or is there some other reason why you don’t want to show it to us? If so, please at least give some indication of why, even if you still won’t show us. Are there some additional marks or letters that you think might be a code or something like that? I’m sure we’d understand if you didn’t want to show it for that reason, but you could at least offer an explanation.

Surface?
It was suggested that you look using a loupe to see it there is any sign that it was once painted, but you ignored the suggestion, or at least didn’t answer the question.

Find environment?
You say your father ‘unearthed this in a wooded area’ but have told us nothing about the actual environment in which it was buried, nor how long ago he found it. Was it wrapped in anything or just bare in the soil? Presumably not dry soil if in a wooded area. What is the explanation for the lack of corrosion on the ‘copper’ versus the corrosion of the ‘lead’. Has someone polished up the ‘copper’?

You’re hoping someone can provide “photos of things that look similar”. I would think the chances of that are between slim and none. And Slim left town. Surely this is going to be a one-off hand-crafted piece with no similar examples from elsewhere. Unless you believe it’s a slice from a bigger round ‘pie’ and the other matching slices are kicking around somewhere. That doesn’t seem very probable and surely, if any of them had turned up, someone would have been asking about them.


EDIT: Just seen @crabstang44's reply, made while I was typing... so the above may no longer be relevant.

Couldnt agree more. Should really have been a much more comprehensively detailed post. Didnt mention dads original post. Imagine trying to solve a homicide with the same lack of details...

Chub
 

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http://www.treasurenet.com/forums/g...618-need-advice-jesse-james-marker-found.html

The object is around 4" long and 1 1/2" thick. It is very heavy, lead I presume. The writings are raised out from the surface, as though it were poured. Lines on the sides seem to show it was poured in two or three layers. The bottom is full of small holes, as if bubbles were forming during pouring. Small copper wire is pressed into the top surface, held in with very small nails. The wire forms a triangle, or cedar tree...as the wire is wavy. More copper wire is pressed in the surface, forming 3 0 0 0 0. I dont know if this means $ or symbols meaning something else. I have had many interested messages about this piece. Some were quite pushy in their attempts to gain access to the object for what ever reason. I am reluctant to post a photo because of this. I believe this is genuine simply because the location is very remote. I do appreciate the recommendations on treasure symbol literature. Thank you.
quote new member freeflyer1 Jun 01, 2014, 12:06 PM
 

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sorry the link was incomplete that I posted . the above info is the same I was referring to.
 

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You can see that the top portion is like a lid. It may be sealed, on purpose and may contain something like a relic related to them. I would send pics to an expert.
 

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You can see that the top portion is like a lid. It may be sealed, on purpose and may contain something like a relic related to them. I would send pics to an expert.

Those are different lifts of the pours when it was cast. If you look carefully you will see they are not level or uniform thicknesses. I really don't understand all the suspicions that there is something hidden inside.
Or that it is two pieces fused together.
 

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