JESSE JAMES AND THE KNIGHTS OF THE GOLDEN CIRCLE A JOINT VENTURE

[Ol' Kentuck]

I'm Not Hitting Like Cause I Don't Want You To Leave....You are a very, very good researcher Kentuck and you are knowledgeable about history.

I talked to a man last night who's a great researcher and historian...he's been through some rough times trying to relate things to some folks things he knows to be true....I know he wanted to throw in the towel many times...But He Didn't. I Respect Him...he's very interesting and knows so much more than I do about Civil War era History. I hope I get to talk with him again.

I Do Not Want To Lose The Combined Knowledge Here. Ive lost a lot of the older guys in my life, but it's Almost like having them back when we get on these topics. It means a lot to me getting input from you guys.

You're like some of those guys I've lost...That's meant as a compliment cause there's not a day that goes by that something doesn't happen to remind me of them.

Kace

No worries, I'll keep in touch. Thank ye for tha nice words, yer one sharp cookie yerself and I look forward ta workin with ye in tha future.

 

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[LUE-Hawn]

Steve Wilson's Book Oklahoma Treasure and Treasure Tales page 145. You can read all about what it is that was found or sought. 18 burro loads of gold that is roughly over 112 pounds per animal or 2020 # pounds total. Clues are given you only have to look.

Todays value: A bit over 37 mil.

 

[LUE-Hawn]

And THIS is...?

The KGC Alphabet to decipher the Greeting I posted.

 

[Rebel - KGC]

Steve Wilson's Book Oklahoma Treasure and Treasure Tales page 145. You can read all about what it is that was found or sought. 18 burro loads of gold that is roughly over 112 pounds per animal or 2020 # pounds total. Clues are given you only have to look.

Todays value: A bit over 37 mil.

Don't have it...

 

[Rebel - KGC]

The KGC Alphabet to decipher the Greeting I posted.

OK, THANKS!

 

[L.C. BAKER]

I'm Not Hitting Like Cause I Don't Want You To Leave....You are a very, very good researcher Kentuck and you are knowledgeable about history.

I talked to a man last night who's a great researcher and historian...he's been through some rough times trying to relate things to some folks things he knows to be true....I know he wanted to throw in the towel many times...But He Didn't. I Respect Him...he's very interesting and knows so much more than I do about Civil War era History. I hope I get to talk with him again.

I Do Not Want To Lose The Combined Knowledge Here. Ive lost a lot of the older guys in my life, but it's Almost like having them back when we get on these topics. It means a lot to me getting input from you guys.

You're like some of those guys I've lost...That's meant as a compliment cause there's not a day that goes by that something doesn't happen to remind me of them.

Kace

Well, if you are done talking to yourself we can continue with one of you or none of you.....either way Nancy! LOL!

 

[L.C. BAKER]

I Respectfully Disagree

Kace

It's important for people to recognize that it's not me saying something, it's the evidence and the facts. Do not confuse that with any speculations I may have said out loud. There’s a lot of evidence and testimony that just simply does not support your version of what happened. My statements are not opinions, but based rather on a surfeit of evidence gathered by investigation before the statement was made. I can only assume that you would do the same thing and apply the results to your statement. It is also imparitive that you realize it is not my place to sway anyones opinion, only to deliver the facts. If you have any facts that specifically can overturn what I have stated let them be known. I for one, would like the truth as compaired to an accepted biased "family" ledgend supported only by hearsay printed in newspaper articles and magazines.

 

[L.C. BAKER]

Like this simple letter E. You can accept it for what you see, or you can look deeper to find its true significance. It is up to the one laying their eyes upon it to be themselves. The K.G.C. counted on it.

"Jesse James and the Knights of the Golden Circle a Joint Venture" That is My speculation on this thread. The rest of it is us discussing if they were or were not together as one. Everything we say about it is speculation unless it leads us to something more to corroborate it as a fact. I have the sum of the equation in my hands, but it is not proof that he was involved with it. I can put him at the scene, at the right time, and with the right people, but that is still only circumstantial evidence. Be it strong circumstantial evidence, it is not concrete proof of anything more. Most every treasure hunter I have heard of has a story they are working on believing or tossing as fodder because it did not lead to a treasure trail. In my case, I have the trail it led to in my hand, but the way it got there is fuzzy when it comes to Jesse James. If I can prove he had some of it in his hands before it was stashed away by the K.G.C. and hoarded by the O.A.K., that would be very significant to a buyer I would suspect. I can hope for something that he may have put with it to tie him to it, but that seems very unlikely. The fact is that I have a treasure trail tied to the K.G.C members I know of, and they were very aquainted with Quantrill and his members, and Jesse James who visited them on occasions that were recorded. The trail we are on has produced gold and this trail so I know it is still there in my heart, but it could be an empty hole too.

 

[Rebel - KGC]

Like this simple letter E. You can accept it for what you see, or you can look deeper to find its true significance. It is up to the one laying their eyes upon it to be themselves. The K.G.C. counted on it.

"Jesse James and the Knights of the Golden Circle a Joint Venture" That is My speculation on this thread. The rest of it is us discussing if they were or were not together as one. Everything we say about it is speculation unless it leads us to something more to corroborate it as a fact. I have the sum of the equation in my hands, but it is not proof that he was involved with it. I can put him at the scene, at the right time, and with the right people, but that is still only circumstantial evidence. Be it strong circumstantial evidence, it is not concrete proof of anything more. Most every treasure hunter I have heard of has a story they are working on believing or tossing as fodder because it did not lead to a treasure trail. In my case, I have the trail it led to in my hand, but the way it got there is fuzzy when it comes to Jesse James. If I can prove he had some of it in his hands before it was stashed away by the K.G.C. and hoarded by the O.A.K., that would be very significant to a buyer I would suspect. I can hope for something that he may have put with it to tie him to it, but that seems very unlikely. The fact is that I have a treasure trail tied to the K.G.C members I know of, and they were very aquainted with Quantrill and his members, and Jesse James who visited them on occasions that were recorded. The trail we are on has produced gold and this trail so I know it is still there in my heart, but it could be an empty hole too.

View attachment 1684863

No "E" there... an "F" for BROTHERHOOD OF LASTING FAITH; "Waning Moon" "behind" it...

 

[L.C. BAKER]

It is an E Reb, The man's last name began with an E. The Moon makes it hard to see right. I think that may have been why it is there.

 

[Rebel - KGC]

I see an ADAMS on the tomb-stone...

 

[L.C. BAKER]

No "E" there... an "F" for BROTHERHOOD OF LASTING FAITH; "Waning Moon" "behind" it...

He was a close friend of Jesse James and his wife's brothers were in Q raiders. He was also a banker in Nebraska City after the war, but he hauled some stuff first, just as soon as he was released from Johnson's Island and made his way to Nebraska City. He was visited there by the James on ocasion. There are two secret societies represented on his tomb one above the other. The B.L.F. never came until the O.A.K. Reb. I have only seen two letters on a monument that use that type of lettering. Here is the other that came into play later on down the trail. It is a T. You can also see that all three monuments are made of the same type and color of stone.




https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/29621270/logan-f_-enyart

 

[LUE-Hawn]

Lue...I apologize, but I have no idea what you are asking or showing in that pic. Hopefully someone more knowledgeable than I will be able to help.

Good Luck,
Kace

I believe L.C. Baker knows what is shown? Is that a correct assumption?

Regards

LUE-Hawn

 

[L.C. BAKER]

The letter that Yeatman and his partner found

Kace

TED YEATMAN is a freelance researcher and writer who was trying to sell a book. His articles have appeared in Civil War Times Illustrated, True West, Old West, and The Quarterly of the National Association and Center for Outlaw and Lawman History. Have you seen the letter that he found? Do you have a link or location I can use to find it? For some reason they did not quote the letter or show it on the Pinkerton or LOC sites?

 

[uglymailman]

Sorry folks, behind again. This is just for clarification.
Ol Kentuk's post # 404: The article from the Windsor (MO.) newspaper talks of "the Democrat man" is most likely talking about the Clinton(MO.) newspaper The Daily Democrat newspaper. Cole and the Editor of the Democrat were acquainted.
The Roscoe (MO.) gun battle where John Younger was killed happened about 3 miles S.E. of Monegaw Springs (pronounced mon ah go). Roscoe is some 5 or 6 miles further South and Osceola is about 10 miles East of the Springs.
The wounded Pinkerton man was taken Roscoe and was said to die there. Other reports have him being put in a coffin, the wagon taken to Clinton where it was put on a train. The Doctor treating the wounded Pinkerton man helped sneak him out. Anyway, he was buried years later.
The Pinkertons hung around the Courthouse of St. Clair Co. MO. to listen to the idlers talk of the Younger & James and got a lead on them. The Pinkerton's might not have been know that way but were known to be strangers.
The Youngers hid out with a black woman who's sister worked for the Younger family in Jackson Co,MO. and were welcome and may have stayed with a white family just down the road, the Crowder's. The Youngers also had family at Osceola.
Lot's of places to hide out in that country. That area was not very far from Bates Co. that was almost completely vacated in 1865 and took years to repopulate. Clinton,MO. is 30 miles North of Osceola and in the 1870's there were few roads and I've read articles that between Clinton and Kansas City (80 miles) there were NO fences. Hard to imagine in these times. Good luck.

 

[L.C. BAKER]

"The Youngers hid out with a black woman"...... Do you know any more about her or her sister? The state they come from? Last name?

Thanks, Ugly, very interesting stuff! Kace is pretty convinced they were in that same area of Moganah or how ever you spell it. I would like to know if they were there after 1870.

 

[Rebel - KGC]

He was a close friend of Jesse James and his wife's brothers were in Q raiders. He was also a banker in Nebraska City after the war, but he hauled some stuff first, just as soon as he was released from Johnson's Island and made his way to Nebraska City. He was visited there by the James on ocasion. There are two secret societies represented on his tomb one above the other. The B.L.F. never came until the O.A.K. Reb. I have only seen two letters on a monument that use that type of lettering. Here is the other that came into play later on down the trail. It is a T. You can also see that all three monuments are made of the same type and color of stone.


View attachment 1685273

https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/29621270/logan-f_-enyart

Yes, that DOES look like a "T" with the "8-pointed Star"; HOWEVER, your "Find-a-Grave" is for Capt. Logan F. Enyart, who was also a Free-Mason. The "T" with the "8-pointed Star" (in the background) is NOT the same as on Enyart's tomb-stone; NO back-ground "star"... "E" died in 1912, so he could have been O.A.K./B.L.F., dunno.

 

[Rebel - KGC]

By 8-pointed star, I mean two triangles pointing up & down within a SQUARE.

 

[uglymailman]

L.C., the black woman's name was Aunt Hanna McFerrin. Her husbands name was John. They lived in a "Negro settlement", I guess a sort of village of several houses. At one time, Cole Younger had stayed there and scratched his initials into a window pane with his diamond ring. People tried to buy that pane for many years and the day after Aunt Hanna's death the pane disapeared.
Aunt Hanna's daughter Missouri McFerrin worked as a cook at the Monegaw Hotel. Also living in the settlement was another daughter Mrs. George McDonald. George was called "Speedy". Another daughter was married to a malatto named Wes Brown. There was a son John Rod McFerrin. There were several Negros named Montgomery, who had been owned by a family named Montgomery. Several of them worked 3 miles south at Roscoe unloading boats at the docks on the Osage River. This was about as far upriver as the boats could go.
I don't know Aunt Hanna's sister's name but it should be noted she worked for the Younger family in Jackson County,MO.. Cole and his family lived in Cass County,MO., the County south of Jackson. The Younger's had a big family.
The Pinkerton agent that was wounded was Capt. Louis J. Lull. While in the Roscoe Hotel, either dying or getting well, his was visited by his wife Marion B. Lull and Wm. Pinkerton. After he "died", he was put in a coffin, loaded into a wagon and hauled to Clinton,MO., placed on a train to Chicago. There a Masonic funeral was held with burial in a Chicago cemetery. Sorry I can't find it now but somewhere I found where Lull had also been buried back east (PA.?) many yrs later. The Dr. that treated Lull was Dr. D.C. McNeill of Osceola,MO. who had been a surgeon during the Civil War. There were also 2 other Dr.'s who treated him so he had the best medical care available in the area at the time. Dr. McNeill talked to a lawyer about what could happen to him if he said a man was dead when he wasn't. The lawyer told him that Dr.'s sometimes made mistakes. He had to say that Lull had died as the Younger's and their supporters had vowed Lull would not leave St. Clair Co. alive. Hope this answers your questions. Good luck.

 

[L.C. BAKER]

By 8-pointed star, I mean two triangles pointing up & down within a SQUARE.

Yes, that DOES look like a "T" with the "8-pointed Star"; HOWEVER, your "Find-a-Grave" is for Capt. Logan F. Enyart, who was also a Free-Mason. The "T" with the "8-pointed Star" (in the background) is NOT the same as on Enyart's tomb-stone; NO back-ground "star"... "E" died in 1912, so he could have been O.A.K./B.L.F., dunno.

Good Eye on different symbol backgrounds. There are two different meanings. The two Cresent Moons are a representation of the K.G.C. exactly the same with the same lettering style being used on the same type of stone in the same color scheme black granite. The difference is the symbol of Capt. Enyart is only a representation of the society and it is telling you no more than that, just like the one above it is telling us he was also a Freemason. The one with the T, however, is part of another message from the same society directing us to physically do something at that site as well as drawing our attention by displaying the Cresent Moon. Any ideas of what we had to do there and why, Rebel?

Here is a multiple choice hint for you.

https://medium.com/@dott.lucafalace/the-eight-pointed-star-bad570901f4c

https://www.masonic-lodge-of-education.com/47th-problem-of-euclid.html



L.C. Baker