I've been Claim Jumped!

[Asmbandits]

Where to begin.. So I filed my placer claim back in 2016, Its filled correctly both with the blm and county and has been kept current. Here are some photos of my signs I put up in 2016 and my discovery monument which I made a placard with the claim info on it. The capped pvc pipe contains the location documents.





It has been quite a while since Ive been up to the claim, I like to go after the first big storms to see if anything has changed. I made it up there today with a couple friends and when we first arrived and walked by the location monument I noticed the placard was gone, screws that held it still there... The pvc tube with the location document was there, I looked inside and saw paperwork... ( I wish I would have looked at it now but didn't at the time..)

We explored and detected around as usual, found some gold. I had just figured some A hole took the placard for god knows what..I didn't think much of it other than it sucked until on our way out I walked past one of my claim signs on the trail and saw that someone has blacked out all of my info and put new info!! I immediately recognized the claim name as one I had seen the night prior as I was checking into mylandmatters to see what has changed around my claim, I noticed that there seemed to be some new claims in an area that seemed too small for that acreage.. Now I know why, it was all coming together as I stared at my claim sign..

This genius not only top filled over my claim, which is filled correctly and marked correctly and always maintained and fees paid, he just decided to use my signs and monument while hes at it! I didn't even think to check the pvc tubes documents until riding home, I bet he removed my papers and put in his, and that's why he just removed the placard...

Here is what I found..



Now this happened for two reasons, first is that the idiot did not do the proper research and did not check with the county. This would have made up for the second reason, which was the blm when entering the info on my filed paperwork into the computer database made a typo, which translates in the claim not showing up in some reports in lr2000. I had been in contact with the blm for over two years trying to get this resolved so something like this wouldn't happen. It took 2 years but they have since corrected this mistake and now my claim shows up as should, but the damage has been done.

I am 100% certain my claim has been filled and maintained and kept up with the blm and county properly. The fact remains that this person top filled "claim jumped", most likely committed mineral trespass, defaced my property and stole my property.

What is my proper recourse here? Wouldn't you know it the guy lives just 10 minutes away!! what are the odds!!....

I was thinking of bringing him a copy of my paperwork and asking for my placard back and compensation for the placard and signs and fuel to drive back up to replace everything, and that he stay away from my claim.
If he were to disagree then I would be forced to further action, could I then call the sheriff and file a report?

I feel my demands are more than fare in this situation. I would calmly state everything Ive said here and provide paperwork to back it. My only concern is if he does not comply I understand that the property dispute is a civil matter but that about the mineral trespass and claim jumping and theft/defacement?

Anyone have any thoughts or advise? I could sure use it!

 

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[IMAUDIGGER]

Of course leaving a shovel on a claim was enough to warn others to stay away...

Actually Amsbandit would not fair well using the old mining district bylaws.
His claim would be considered too large for one person and deemed abandoned due to the lack of active mining.

It would be an open and shut case. You couldn’t just tie up claims and let them sit idle (especially not for some minimal fee).
If a claim owner wanted to leave for a month, he would have to either pay someone to mine it or build improvements while he was gone as a way of “holding his claim”.

It had to be a good claim to justify keeping it active while away on business or prospecting trips.
His fellow miners would honestly say.. yep that Amsbandit only mines this claim for a day or two a month and sometimes goes two months without working his claim. It’s becoming a nuisance to the adjacent claims due to the fact the banks keep collapsing into the pits. The lack of mining is causing the upstream claims to become flooded. Easy verdict, now let’s have some drinks!!

There would be a lot of open ground today if those rules were followed. Now the gov. just want a steady stream of revenue, however small.

 

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[IMAUDIGGER]

Additionally it was common for miners to abandon tools and belongings on a claim.
Once they were deemed abandoned, they became property of the new owner.
Exceptions were made when the waters were too high to mine or heavy snow prevented mining.

 

[Asmbandits]

Actually Amsbandit would not fair well using the old mining district bylaws.
His claim would be considered too large for one person and deemed abandoned due to the lack of active mining.

It would be an open and shut case. You couldn’t just tie up claims and let them sit idle (especially not for some minimal fee).
If a claim owner wanted to leave for a month, he would have to either pay someone to mine it or build improvements while he was gone as a way of “holding his claim”.

It had to be a good claim to justify keeping it active while away on business or prospecting trips.
His fellow miners would honestly say.. yep that Amsbandit only mines this claim for a day or two a month and sometimes goes two months without working his claim. It’s becoming a nuisance to the adjacent claims due to the fact the banks keep collapsing into the pits. The lack of mining is causing the upstream claims to become flooded. Easy verdict, now let’s have some drinks!!

There would be a lot of open ground today if those rules were followed. Now the gov. just want a steady stream of revenue, however small.

Something tells me you probably have a claim or more yourself that your not living at. Back then it probably looked no different if you spent more time lets say operating a store front business or similar than you do working the claim. Truth is its only an assumption, I don't know you but you seem think you know me quite well and I take it you don't care for me much.

Truth is what may have been ain't how it is now, and that kind of thinking will get you nowhere in the legal world. I'm just as entitled to the land you so seem to think you and other should be, only thing is I found it first and did things properly. Your thinking is almost in line with Steve, you guys should see about reclaiming some trophy gold ground from some other poor feller, you might get lucky never know!

 

[Asmbandits]

And also, a little history I remember from a book I read called "On and Beyond the Georgetown Divide" which falls in my mining district. The book is a collection of the Georgetown gazette newspaper from 1880 to 1900. There are many, many accounts of mining being done first of all in season, and secondly most that had claims also worked other jobs. Even the head of the gazette himself worked a mine he owned between the paper. There is a chapter about two senators, Cornelius Cole and John Conness who were both also invested in mines hands on. This was in my mining district, and +130 years ago with the district well established and near its prime.

 

[IMAUDIGGER]

Something tells me you probably have a claim or more yourself that your not living at. Back then it probably looked no different if you spent more time lets say operating a store front business or similar than you do working the claim. Truth is its only an assumption, I don't know you but you seem think you know me quite well and I take it you don't care for me much.

Truth is what may have been ain't how it is now, and that kind of thinking will get you nowhere in the legal world. I'm just as entitled to the land you so seem to think you and other should be, only thing is I found it first and did things properly. Your thinking is almost in line with Steve, you guys should see about reclaiming some trophy gold ground from some other poor feller, you might get lucky never know!

I like you fine Amsbandit. You took that the wrong way.

 

[Asmbandits]

I like you fine Amsbandit. You took that the wrong way.

I may be extra defensive at the moment regarding my claim. Having no response from Steve after all the light shed has me extra PO'ed!

 

[IMAUDIGGER]

Truth is - the majority of the current claims are only worked for a very limited portion of the year.
I’m not saying there is anything wrong with that and it wasn’t a jab at you.

My comment was solely in response to the historical mining district reference.
Early gold rush days, you were restricted to very small claims and there was a prescribed time period in which a claim could be idle before it was considered abandoned. I want to say it was 2 weeks or less.

Stream claims were 40’ long...not 40 acres!

1880’s to 1900’s was a completely different time period.

Kind of a hijack on the thread, sorry bout that.

 

[Goldwasher]

Those types of districts were early and short lived.

For well over a century. It has been legal for a claim owner to work his claim as he sees fit.

Safe from the opinion's and mob rule of others!

Thankfully.

 

[IMAUDIGGER]

Those types of districts were early and short lived.

For well over a century. It has been legal for a claim owner to work his claim as he sees fit.

Safe from the opinion's and mob rule of others!

Thankfully.

Yup - just during the gold rush period.
Adverse Possession is an interesting feature of our system.
What Amsbandit is doing is part of that system - demonstrating possession and defending his property.

I hope the other guy chimes in soon with an apology and a commitment to correct the situation in a reasonable manner.

 

[gold tramp]

Not to be a smart a$$ or hijack your thread, but I hate seeing post on ground not being worked, it's just a miner thing.
Kinda like a hunk of farmland and you don't farm it.
Gt...

 

[OreCart]

That does not bother me.

I do not know what it took for that claim owner to obtain what he got, nor do I know his future plans. Maybe it is for retirement, or maybe it is for the children or grandchildren.

I know it is different, but I have quite a bit of gravel in the ground, and I am holding onto it. Right now it is worth $2 a cubic yard, but in the future it will inevitably be worth more. It is kind of like a bank account, but I am a farmer too, so holding onto, or selling resources is just how it all works.

Cash flow...

 

[Bonaro]

I may be extra defensive at the moment regarding my claim. Having no response from Steve after all the light shed has me extra PO'ed!

I agree....
This whole thing will fix itself when the assessment deadline comes and passes with no action from him. All this aggressive posturing is unnecessary. He over filed because he didn't understand the mining laws but he has not caused you any damages except for a few signs which you probably need to replace now and then anyway.

 

[Goldwasher]

Funny how society is starting to chastize those who speak up when they are wronged. Share their experience. And are actually thanked for teaching people stuff.

But, yea yea chill out.

Steves lack of knowledge.. if thats actually what caused this. Is the very reason Gerry should share this.

It has also been pointed out why he most cetainly should not wait for the Assesment deadline.

It is his duty to keep his claim secure and free of adverse claim

Waiting for Ca. BLM to catch up and fix an over filing is an illogical way to proceed.

 

[Asmbandits]

What happened to people being people, a simple "looks like I made a mistake, sorry I destroyed your signs" is really all I was ever after with any of this. A top file or high grading is somewhat expected to some degree soon or later, but this was just plain disrespectful and wrong and continues to be with the lack of resolution from Steve.

You can lead a horse to water..

Now that I have all the info, and no response from Steve I will act accordingly.

 

[Nitric]

Interesting thread... I think you are being very civil about this...I didn't see anyone actual "trash" the over claimer..

I can also see how this could happen. I would love to own a claim one day. But even after reading these threads off and on for a couple of years I think I would still need help from someone experienced. I have a little sympathy for a guy making a mistake even though the law is the law, But I think he should have corrected it as fast as he could. I could see me making a mistake, but I would be in a hurry to make things right as soon as I found out.

I've learned a lot in these threads over the years and still don't think I know enough to go file a claim. Or ......smart enough? I can do anything mechanical, but paper and words ......uggghhh!!

 

[Nitric]

Deleted ....double post for some reason....

 

[Bonaro]

What happened to people being people, a simple "looks like I made a mistake, sorry I destroyed your signs" is really all I was ever after with any of this. A top file or high grading is somewhat expected to some degree soon or later, but this was just plain disrespectful and wrong and continues to be with the lack of resolution from Steve.

You can lead a horse to water..

Now that I have all the info, and no response from Steve I will act accordingly.

Yes, you were wronged but only slightly
Has Steve (?) made any effort to assert that his over-file is valid?
Or has he just not done what you wanted him to do?

 

[gold tramp]

I think youall bullied the guy enough, he made a simple mistake.
Doubt he will ever get on this site again.
Gt....

 

[danec71]

I think youall bullied the guy enough, he made a simple mistake.
Doubt he will ever get on this site again.
Gt....

i am thinking the same thing. I was dealing with something a little more severe than this and still am for a few years now. Doesn’t sound to me like this guys gonna give you any problem. This thing is about 10 pages too long.

 

[Underburden]

There won't be a resolution by preaching to the choir.