Informal Poll...Arrested or cited for metal detecting.

[Tom_in_CA]

NEVER EVER hunt military installations without first getting permission from the base commander!...

Why can't a person look up the base rules for themself on that base? If there were nothing prohibiting metal detecting, then does it "need permission" to begin with ?

Like how about frisbee flying. Afterall you might poke someone's eye out. So do you need the base commander's permission for that? You'd probably say "no". Because you think frisbee flying is innocuous, harmless, etc.... right? Ok then: why the inherent premise that detecting is somehow harmful, dangerous, etc...? Since when ?

 

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[Tom_in_CA]

I have permission to hunt the base park at Randolph AFB, but I had to run it through channels first....

I have no doubt you "got the base commander's permission" wherever you're at. And in your mind's eye, maybe you think that "therefore, permission-asking was necessary". Because maybe you think "how ELSE could he have said yes, or no, unless his permission was necessary?". But human nature doesn't work that way. The fact of a "yes" or a "no" doesn't mean "gee it's a good thing I asked".

Like: did you expect him or any authority to say "gee, that's a silly question. Why are you asking me? You don't need my permission" No, of course they won't answer that way. Instead, they'll bestow on you their princely "yes" or "no". Afterall, you asked. Thus implying their sanction was necessary (lest why else would you be asking, if it didn't need their say-so ?")

 

[4dcr]

I've been metal detecting since the mid seventies, I have heard stories of people getting arrested or cited for detecting but have never talked to anyone who actually has. I would like to ask this question: Have you ever been arrested or cited for metal detecting? Not warned or kicked out of a park by employees but actually arrested and or cited, first hand information only please. I would venture to say it will be very few or none at all.I might also add that I'm a retired officer and never observed anyone get cited or arrested in the three different departments that I worked at. So anyone?

I personally have not but have a close friend who has received a ticket

 

[FreeBirdTim]

Just remember that public parks and baseball fields are PUBLIC and paid for by YOU, the PUBLIC. You have a right to be there and a right to detect, as long as you fill in your holes and don't trash the grass. I do not back down from any maintenance worker at any public place.

I once had some maintenance worker tell me I couldn't "dig holes" on HIS field. I told him it was a public field and I had every right to be there. He called the police (or pretended to call them), but they never showed up. He never bothered me again after that day.

It's a good thing to keep a low profile, but you have rights and you need to protect them. Running away whenever someone in "authority" tells you to leave will eventually get ALL our detecting rights taken away. Don't be a jerk, but stand up for your rights.

P.S. The police have watched me detecting numerous times and never bothered me. They may run my license plate to see who I am, but that's about it.

 

[cudamark]

I personally have not but have a close friend who has received a ticket
View attachment 986735

In looking at the ticket, it was on a National Wildlife Refuge. What are the posted rules regarding that area? If there are no restrictions on metal detecting, he will have a valid defense. I also note that the violation was for searching for "objects of antiquity". Who came up with that statement. If it was the ranger, your friend could argue that he was just looking for some modern change or a lost ring. If your buddy said that, he needs his head examined for making such a volatile statement! Why not just kick the ranger in the shins while he was at it!

 

[4dcr]

In looking at the ticket, it was on a National Wildlife Refuge. What are the posted rules regarding that area? If there are no restrictions on metal detecting, he will have a valid defense. I also note that the violation was for searching for "objects of antiquity". Who came up with that statement. If it was the ranger, your friend could argue that he was just looking for some modern change or a lost ring. If your buddy said that, he needs his head examined for making such a volatile statement! Why not just kick the ranger in the shins while he was at it!

This was a few years ago and the wording is from the ranger who threatened to confiscate all equipment and vehicle at which point my friend decided to accept the ticket rather than risk so much.

 

[cudamark]

How much was the fine? Did he go and fight it? If it's a posted site (either on a sign or in the appropriate code) he was lucky to just get off with a fine. Personally, I think it's ridiculous to ban detecting in a wildlife refuge as we remove all kinds of junk metal and trash that might harm wildlife, but, if it's the law, you have to abide by it until you can get it changed.

 

[4dcr]

How much was the fine? Did he go and fight it? If it's a posted site (either on a sign or in the appropriate code) he was lucky to just get off with a fine. Personally, I think it's ridiculous to ban detecting in a wildlife refuge as we remove all kinds of junk metal and trash that might harm wildlife, but, if it's the law, you have to abide by it until you can get it changed.

Fine $100.00 + $25.00 processing fee Total $125.00

 

[Tom_in_CA]

Fine $100.00 + $25.00 processing fee Total $125.00

Well, if you ask me, if that were the only price I'd have to pay once in a blue moon, I'd say .... fine. That's just the price I'd pay. I'm about as brazen as they come. And in 35 yrs. I've never had a "ticket" for metal detecting. I've had many "scrams" and such, but ...... so far, never a ticket. If the day came where I got one like that, I'd just pay it and ... oh well.

I knew a guy who got ticketed for hunting at a historic army base (an admittedly sensitive monument federal area). And at first, he was torqued (no one likes getting a ticket afterall). But after getting the ticket in the mail, and seeing it was something like $175 ...... he just paid it as no-big-deal.

I'm not saying to "throw caution to the wind", but just saying, that an occasional fluke thing like that ....... if it's going to cause you to cower and grovel at every city hall and ranger kiosk you come to .... then I think we need to develop a little thicker skin than that.

Also I know several others who fought their tickets and got them dismissed. But that's for a different thread, haha

Bottom line is: You can ALWAYS find examples of over-zeolous cops passing out tickets and roughing up motorists for nothing but a tail-light out. But sheesk, will that stop you from driving? No. We look at those things as "exceptions". Not "norms".

 

[FloridaMike]

Prior to getting an Excalibur I stopped by the Fish and Wildlife commission and asked about a number of locations where people gather at the outlet to some springs here in Florida. I spoke to an officer and asked if there was a law preventing me from Metal detecting in a couple of specific areas. She said no. Just leave any artifacts you may find. She also gave me leads on other locations where people gather on sand bars.

So I got an Excalibur and took it to a local gathering place. There was one other boat of people enjoying the water on a beautiful 92 degree day. As I started to search I heard someone yelling. It pulled off my headphones and it was the manager of the campground and land around the spring.

A lot of us call him 'Campground Nazi' (see the actual spring is surrounded by a Forestry dpartment campground). He routinely stands at the edge of the property and harasses people outside the park.
He was hollering something like - 'Stop what your doing'
He hollered 'You can't do that, you're breaking Federal Law'.
I said 'No I'm not, this is not Federal property'.
He said 'Yes it is'.
I said 'I already spoke to the Fish and Wildlife Commission and they have jurisdiction over here'.
He said 'They might have jurisdiction on the water, but the bottom is Federal land'
The other other boaters that were there yelled out 'That's BS and he's not breaking any law'.
The Campground Nazi turned and left in a fluster.

That was around 10am and I never saw any law enforcement in the 6 hours I was there.

So It helps to know where you are and who has jurisdiction.

Mike

 

[cudamark]

You can also look it up yourself and not be subject to the whims and personal beliefs of people you might ask. Who knows if the F&W guy knew what he was talking about. Taking the word of others can lead to trouble.

 

[FloridaMike]

You can also look it up yourself and not be subject to the whims and personal beliefs of people you might ask. Who knows if the F&W guy knew what he was talking about. Taking the word of others can lead to trouble.

I was out on the water again today. I put my detector up and about 3 minutes later the FWC patrol boat pulled up next to mine. He was after the guy next to me. He had left his boat anchored overnight without mooring lights. He did not give them a ticket. As he was checking the guys info my front post came loose and I had to drive back it down into the sand. ( Many of us use PVC pipes driven into the sand to cut down on anchor lines and stubbed toes.) So I proceeded to use a fence post driver and slam the pipe in. The guy next to me had done the same thing and after the FWC finished with the first this second guy asked about putting in the PVC pipes. The FWC Officer said you cannot use them in the place of anchors. He went on to say that you're disturbing the waterbed and it is not allowed. But anchors are allowed. Of course I had to ask this FWC officer why is it okay to dig in the sand but not ok to put in a pipe for mooring. He said you cannot dig in the sand. I told him another FWC officer said I could metal detect and dig. He said you can't . He said the bed of all bodies of water belong to the State of Florida and are protected archaeological sites. He wanted the name of the officer that told me that I could. I didn't have a name to give him.
He said that the law says you cannot disturb the earth under the water. Even fanning the sand with your hand is technically illegal. If you pick something up it is a felony. He said you can metal detect but cannot remove anything.
He was pretty nice guy and did not hand out any tickets.
I got his card and he said if I send him an email that he will send me the laws.

I will post what he sends me.

Mike

 

[Tom_in_CA]

.... He said you cannot dig in the sand. I told him another FWC officer said I could metal detect and dig. He said you can't . He said the bed of all bodies of water belong to the State of Florida and are protected archaeological sites. He wanted the name of the officer that told me that I could. I didn't have a name to give him.
He said that the law says you cannot disturb the earth under the water. Even fanning the sand with your hand is technically illegal. If you pick something up it is a felony. He said you can metal detect but cannot remove anything.
He was pretty nice guy and did not hand out any tickets.
I got his card and he said if I send him an email that he will send me the laws.

I will post what he sends me....

Mike mike mike .... I think you are opening a can-of-worms I have no doubt he can show you something that says "you can't dig" or "you can't remove things from a public park or beach", etc... But do you really think those things were meant to stop a kid from digging a sand castle? Do you really think they mean your 10-yr. old daughter is in trouble for picking up a seashell for her grade school art project? Do you really think those things were meant to mean you can't metal detect (which requires, gasp, digging, and, gasp taking an item). No. Of course not. In fact, the laws predate metal detectors and were originally for things like:

Taking park features like the park benches, or backing up your truck and harvesting the sand for commercial purposes, or cutting down the trees for firewood, etc...

And as you have seen, a fellow ranger isn't so silly as to apply those things to metal detecting. But by your asking "barney-fife" for proof, sure, I have no doubt he can send it to you. And given enough semantics, sure, can apply to metal detecting, if you stand on one foot and squint at the wording real hard.

I'm glad you didn't have the the name of the other officer, lest this new officer merely "appraise him" of the evil of detecting. Or now goes about putting out a B.O.L. to all the other rank and file to boot md'rs, etc... (may happen now).

If it were me, and I got a "yes", I would stay as distant as possible from anyone who interprets differently than that. I mean, sure, if you were faced with a ticket, your other person's say-so would have to surface.

But then on the other hand, I don't like barney-fife's any more than you do. So perhaps I too would have done the same thing, to show him the silly-ness of the his statements. Unfortunately, you can see where front-&-center attention puts us Therefore, when I've gotten booted (or as in this case, told "no metal detecting"), I hate to say it but: sometimes it means "avoid that one individual". If no one *really* cares except that one person, then presto, avoid that one individual. Sure it means having to detect at lower traffic times, etc... but ... oh well.

 

[cudamark]

That will teach you to go into a battle of common sense with an unarmed opponent. Did you ask him how you can walk in the sand without "fannng" it? Not that the answer would matter. He was going to flex his regulatory muscles regardless. Give that guy a wide berth, he may not be as benevolent next time....and quit asking these boneheads, will you? It just gets you nowhere as you found out by asking the first F&G guy.

 

[FloridaMike]

Mike mike mike .... I think you are opening a can-of-worms I have no doubt he can show you something that says "you can't dig" or "you can't remove things from a public park or beach", etc... But do you really think those things were meant to stop a kid from digging a sand castle? Do you really think they mean your 10-yr. old daughter is in trouble for picking up a seashell for her grade school art project? Do you really think those things were meant to mean you can't metal detect (which requires, gasp, digging, and, gasp taking an item). No. Of course not. In fact, the laws predate metal detectors and were originally for things like:

Taking park features like the park benches, or backing up your truck and harvesting the sand for commercial purposes, or cutting down the trees for firewood, etc...

And as you have seen, a fellow ranger isn't so silly as to apply those things to metal detecting. But by your asking "barney-fife" for proof, sure, I have no doubt he can send it to you. And given enough semantics, sure, can apply to metal detecting, if you stand on one foot and squint at the wording real hard.

I'm glad you didn't have the the name of the other officer, lest this new officer merely "appraise him" of the evil of detecting. Or now goes about putting out a B.O.L. to all the other rank and file to boot md'rs, etc... (may happen now).

If it were me, and I got a "yes", I would stay as distant as possible from anyone who interprets differently than that. I mean, sure, if you were faced with a ticket, your other person's say-so would have to surface.

But then on the other hand, I don't like barney-fife's any more than you do. So perhaps I too would have done the same thing, to show him the silly-ness of the his statements. Unfortunately, you can see where front-&-center attention puts us Therefore, when I've gotten booted (or as in this case, told "no metal detecting"), I hate to say it but: sometimes it means "avoid that one individual". If no one *really* cares except that one person, then presto, avoid that one individual. Sure it means having to detect at lower traffic times, etc... but ... oh well.

You're right, it is a can-of-worms.
I will not be contacting him about anything.
And I will be going into stealth mode with my detecting.

Government - A group of people providing services at the barrel of a gun.

 

[FloridaMike]

That will teach you to go into a battle of common sense with an unarmed opponent. Did you ask him how you can walk in the sand without "fannng" it? Not that the answer would matter. He was going to flex his regulatory muscles regardless. Give that guy a wide berth, he may not be as benevolent next time....and quit asking these boneheads, will you? It just gets you nowhere as you found out by asking the first F&G guy.

You're right too!
I hope the guy forgets all about this.

 

[George (MN)]

I read about 2 people who asked a local National Forest ranger if they could detect the nearby ghost town. He said sure, as long as you can draw a map showing the precise boundaries. So on a later detecting trip, ranger goes home with one guy & takes everything that might have been found in the forest with a metal detector. Total loss unknown, but presumably thousands of dollars. So 1 govt person giving you OK does not really mean you are safe from robbery. Best wishes, George (MN)

 

[George (MN)]

You can detect most FL beaches from just below the sand dunes to the low water line. Detecting in the water is banned by shipwreck laws.
In the case of Mel Fisher, they got their salvage costs back, but the rest went to the state. Best wishes, George (MN)

 

[Sand-duner]

Aside from a "Did ya find anything?" or the occasional "Whatcha doin?" (Usually from a youngster), I've never had a problem with any kind of law enforcement/guards/groundskeepers/etc. I've always made it a point to engage in friendly, although short, conversation with anyone while I'm out and try and explain the positive aspects (litter clean-up and such) of detecting. I'll usually show parents the pieces of glass and the pull tabs and nails I find in the tot-lots, and park rangers the fishing hooks and weights I find near boat launches and beaches. Letting people see you NOT doing damage and making a point for them to see you throwing trash away goes a long way in keeping them from making "nuisance" complaints against you.

 

[aamkajutsu]

I'm new to MDing. I bought a metal detector and it should arrive tomorrow. That being said, I have to admit that after reading this thread and the horror stories, that I'm having 2nd thoughts. I'm thinking that it just isn't worth the hassle so maybe the smart thing to do is to just return it unopened and find a different hobby.

Phil