I have two

[GL]

Of these:

I found them a few years ago in an abandoned house on a shelf. They make me think of this:

So I keep them outside just in case they are real. I figured they were fakes because...well...look at it.
I was reading the brass gold ingot thread and was reminded of these weird bars I have.

Well? What do you all think?

 

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[Bigcypresshunter]

I too missed the fact this was a 2008 thread.

Anyhoo ... Just for the record, it definitely appears that the "Hewitt Company" was connected with the railroad industry in some manner and, as Big Cy indicated, apparently made train related parts ... plus a variety other "stuff."

The first ad is from a 1910 magazine called "The Frisco-Man." Which was published by the "Frisco Rail Line" that operated in the areas shown in the second picture. And if the Hewitt Company did in fact use Radium-A in the making of train berrings, I'm still not sure why. But that could very well be where the item in question originated from, and explain what it's primary purpose was intended for.

SBB

1st ad dated 1910
2nd ad dated 1949

Railroad workers melted babbitt ingots on site to replace large cast bearings. About every piece of large machinery made before WWII had babbitt metal bearings. Melted pieces of babitt metal along railroad tracks or railroad yards is a common metal detecting find. http://forum.treasurenet.com/index.php/topic,325544.0.html

Im not sure what the Radium ingot was for but back in the late 40's Radium was thought to be good for everything.

 

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[SODABOTTLEBOB]

I agree its better to be safe than sorry ...

But just for the record, has it been proven 100%, beyond a shadow of a doubt, that the item in question was dangerous?

SBB

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

I agree its better to be safe than sorry ...

But just for the record, has it been proven 100%, beyond a shadow of a doubt, that the item in question was dangerous?

SBB

No, but it has been proven 100%, beyond a shadow of a doubt, that Radium is dangerous and the item is clearly marked.

I cant find anything about fake Radium ingots (Breezie searched too) and I see no reason anyone would manufacture a fake ingot because Radium was as recently as the 60's thought to be safe if not beneficial to your health. Fake Gold and Silver ingots yes but not Radium A.

I think the ingots are cool and I can find no other picture online. Radium has no stable isotopes and hopefully the solder ingot had a very lo percentage of the Radium A.

 

[SODABOTTLEBOB]

I guess I will have to go back and re-read everything. But the reason I ask about the dangerous aspect is because of the "A" part. Do we know for sure what the "A" stands for? Maybe it indicates "neutralized" radium or something like that. I'm just wondering because sometimes we (myself included) assume things that may not be accurate.

SBB

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

I guess I will have to go back and re-read everything. But the reason I ask about the dangerous aspect is because of the "A" part. Do we know for sure what the "A" stands for? Maybe it indicates "neutralized" radium or something like that. I'm just wondering because sometimes we (myself included) assume things that may not be accurate.

SBB

I was just searching that. I thought it was an isotope but I can find nothing on "Radium A" And I find very little on "Radium solder." Im thinking these bricks were all destroyed years ago to limit lawsuits.

 

[SODABOTTLEBOB]

There are references to Radium "A" "B" and "C" here ...

Link: http://thinkexist.com/dictionary/meaning/radium/

I just briefly scanned it so far, but I did see the word "unstable"

 

[SODABOTTLEBOB]

This is from the site I just posted. I wonder what it means?

"It is possible that lead is the stable end product"

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

This is from the site I just posted. I wonder what it means?

"It is possible that lead is the stable end product"

Good link Bob. I see it but I dont know what it means. Radium is supposed to have a half life of 1600 years.

The radioactivity of radium is therefore an atomic property, and is explained as result from a disintegration of the atom. This breaking up occurs in at least seven stages; the successive main products have been studied and are called radium emanation or exradio, radium A, radium B, radium C, etc. (The emanation is a heavy gas, the later products are solids.) These products are regarded as unstable elements, each with an atomic weight a little lower than its predecessor. It is possible that lead is the stable end product.



It sounds as if Radium A is an unstable solid product of one of the first stages of disentegration , not that I have any idea .

I think they are saying that after thousands of years, (after B, C D and so forth) its possible that lead may be the stable end product. A is the first of at least 7 stages of Radium disentegration and that would make it the worst (purest, strongest)..

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

The line before says this: Their degree of activity depends on the proportion of radium present, but not on its state of chemical combination or on external conditions.

That would mean that the degree of radioactivity depends on the proportion of Radium A present in this ingot of solder. It may have a very low percentage of Radium A.

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

There are references to Radium "A" "B" and "C" here ...

Link: http://thinkexist.com/dictionary/meaning/radium/

I just briefly scanned it so far, but I did see the word "unstable"

Good link Bob. Im posting it here in its entirety in case we lose the link. It explains it pretty well IMO.

Radium Meaning and Definition(n.) An intensely radioactive metallic element found (combined) in minute quantities in pitchblende, and various other uranium minerals. Symbol, Ra; atomic weight, 226.4. Radium was discovered by M. and Mme. Curie, of Paris, who in 1902 separated compounds of it by a tedious process from pitchblende. Its compounds color flames carmine and give a characteristic spectrum. It resembles barium chemically. Radium preparations are remarkable for maintaining themselves at a higher temperature than their surroundings, and for their radiations, which are of three kinds: alpha rays, beta rays, and gamma rays (see these terms). By reason of these rays they ionize gases, affect photographic plates, cause sores on the skin, and produce many other striking effects. Their degree of activity depends on the proportion of radium present, but not on its state of chemical combination or on external conditions.The radioactivity of radium is therefore an atomic property, and is explained as result from a disintegration of the atom. This breaking up occurs in at least seven stages; the successive main products have been studied and are called radium emanation or exradio, radium A, radium B, radium C, etc. (The emanation is a heavy gas, the later products are solids.) These products are regarded as unstable elements, each with an atomic weight a little lower than its predecessor. It is possible that lead is the stable end product. At the same time the light gas helium is formed; it probably consists of the expelled alpha particles. The heat effect mentioned above is ascribed to the impacts of these particles. Radium, in turn, is believed to be formed indirectly by an immeasurably slow disintegration of uranium.

 

[SODABOTTLEBOB]

Big Cy ~

Cool Thanks.

I realize this is not the final word yet, but ya just gotta wonder what a metal company, who made train parts and other stuff, would be doing with "hot lead" (If ya get my meaning).

SBB

 

[GL]

Radium "A" is Polonium-218. Radium is super radioactive and dangerous. I located the information on Wiki...

Three other natural radioisotopes had received historical names in the early twentieth century: radium-223 was known as actinium X, radium-224 as thorium X and radium-228 as mesothorium I. Radium-226 has given historical names to its decay products after the whole element, such as radium A for polonium-218.
[edit] Radioactivity

Radium is over one million times as radioactive as the same mass of uranium. Its decay occurs in at least seven stages; the successive main products have been studied and were called radium emanation or exradio (now identified as radon), radium A (polonium), radium B (lead), radium C (bismuth), etc.

I no longer have this stuff. Wife wasnt happy when she read I had a dangerous relic of industry. I dont know what it was used for or how it was incorporated into the ingot. It would take a LOT of pitchblend to make an ingot of Radium that size so I am very certain it wasnt pure Radium. Probably had a trace in the blend for imagined benefit like the Radium water and makeup.

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

Big Cy ~

Cool Thanks.

I realize this is not the final word yet, but ya just gotta wonder what a metal company, who made train parts and other stuff, would be doing with "hot lead" (If ya get my meaning).

SBB

Sorry Bob I do NOT get your meaning. Maybe you didnt read this website I posted.. Companies actually put radiation in toothpaste and childrens toys because they thought it was beneficial or at least harmless. Please read it, its very interesting. http://historiesofthingstocome.blogspot.com/2011/04/nuclear-culture-1-healthy-radiation.html

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

Radium "A" is Polonium-218. Radium is super radioactive and dangerous. I located the information on Wiki...
I no longer have this stuff. Wife wasnt happy when she read I had a dangerous relic of industry. I dont know what it was used for or how it was incorporated into the ingot. It would take a LOT of pitchblend to make an ingot of Radium that size so I am very certain it wasnt pure Radium. Probably had a trace in the blend for imagined benefit like the Radium water and makeup.

I think it is still used today for radiation treatment of cancer but its surely NOT used in solder, makeup, water or toothpaste today. I am sorry if we appear to be beating a dead horse but I didnt realize you got rid of it when I stumbled across this old thread and reopened it.

BTW Radium itself does not glow. Phosphorus glows in the presense of enegy, such as radiation.

Its obviously a lead based solder ingot. I agree with you that its a good possibility that there was only a tiny amount of Radium in the solder. I used to play with Uraniun and Mercury as a kid and Im still here. Either way its done and over but others will read this thread and it may help someone in the future.

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

Just as an aforethought to this thread....next time you come across something like this it should be reported to Law Enforcement as soon as possible. Is it possible that this old stuff could be used in the manufacturing of "dirty bombs"? I don't know, but I'd think that they would be interested in proper disposal of this type of material. Maybe I've been in the military too long and can't see any good coming of an old bar of Radium, but for me it's better to be on the cautious side of things.

This thread will remain online as long as TN is online and can be easily found by Googling the words "Hewitt Radium" should anyone in the future find one of these ingots and hopefully they will read your advice..

 

[SODABOTTLEBOB]

Big Cy ~

I meant that I doubt if Hewitt Company employees wore radiation suits when handling the so called Radium-A/Lead incots. Meaning, I honestly don't think the incots were as "hot" and dangerous as we might think. But then, this is just my opinion. And you know what they say about opinions ...

Thanks.

SBB

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

Big Cy ~

I meant that I doubt if Hewitt Company employees wore radiation suits when handling the so called Radium-A/Lead incots. Meaning, I honestly don't think the incots were as "hot" and dangerous as we might think. But then, this is just my opinion. And you know what they say about opinions ...

Thanks.

SBB

Did you read the link yet Bob? I respect your opinion but Im kinda baffled by your logic. . I also doubt that Hewitt employees wore radiation suits but we dont know how many of them died from radiation sickness!

Its very well documented how many of the "Radium Girls" became ill from working in a clock factory. Many of the women suffered from anemia, bone fractures and necrosis of the jaw, a condition now known as radium jaw. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radium_Girls The U.S. Radium Corporation hired some 70 women to perform various tasks including the handling of radium, while the owners and the scientists familiar with the effects of radium carefully avoided any exposure to it themselves; chemists at the plant used lead screens, masks and tongs. US Radium had even distributed literature to the medical community describing the “injurious effects” of radium. The owners and scientists at US Radium, familiar with the real hazards of radioactivity, naturally took extensive precautions to protect themselves.[1]

More reading. http://www.roger-russell.com/jeffers/radiumdials.htm

I agree, we do not know at this time how hot those clearly marked Radium solder ingots were and its not like they were ingested by anyone. It may be even more dangerous to someone that God forbid has that solder on their home plumbing pipes.

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

Here is some good news I found that backs your opinion Bob.

Radium paint was still used in dials as late as the 1960s, but there were no further injuries to dial painters.[citation needed] This served to highlight that the injuries suffered by the Radium Girls were completely preventable.

It appears most Radium sickness is caused by ingestion when the workers licked the paintbrush.

 

[SODABOTTLEBOB]

Big Cy ~

Yep. I read the informaton. I guess what I'm really trying to say is something you just touched on, in that "indirect" contact may not have been as dangerous as "direct" contact. In other words, I don't see yet where incots like those were literally "oozing" radiation like we see in the movies. But then, I could be wrong about that.

Bob

P.S. ~

I was typing the above when you posted your last reply.

 

[Jrrob-]

I have recently on my treasure hunting found two ingots that say Hewitt Genuine but do not say radium nor do they look like the one that started this post anyone have any guesses what they are or what there worth