Gods country gone to hell and turned into a garbage pile in less than 200 years

[BillA]

Don't get me wrong, I do agree "we" have polluted and messed up most of this world. Gotta wonder though... if we didn't do that would this website even exist?

excellent point
some monkey genes got polluted, and here we are
or
we are simply the froth riding on top of the swirling mass of . . . .

a question:
is industrial/commercial pollution more damaging than what might be called 'people pollution' (per this thread) ?
- w/o the industrial pollution this website would NOT be here

 

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[BillA]

Beings you replied / quoted my post prior to my editing and eventual deleting... tis moot.

ah ARC, you have taught me aboul these tricky devils that post . . . and its gone
its cool

 

[Megalodon]

hey Mega, I hear you - but just how does an individual buck the system ?
the economic system ? (pop increase, growth, growth)
it will end poorly - but we think not in our day so we party on

I have no children, by conscious choice.
Any breeder is part of the problem (as I see it).
And, like you I have moved and moved to try to find a less obnoxious environment.

It is certainly not easy - and I admit that I don't have "the" answer. We can try to speak truth to power, but it will take a lot more of us to do it. The system has been rigged against doing just that. And there are risks as well. I live in a county where billboards encourage people to shoot democrats. The sheriff says that is free speech. At the same time, I cannot display a small bumper sticker expressing my opposition to a fracked gas refinery without quickly being pulled over by his local deputies and harassed. I politely but firmly expressed my opposition to his Gestapo tactics last time I saw him (campaigning for re-election outside my voting precinct - and he just laughed it off because he has the guns).

There is a lot of blame to go around. And we must hold ourselves to high standards of personal responsibility. But the damage done by big corporate polluters dwarfs anything done by us when we drive our gasoline powered cars and trucks.

The system has completely broken down. Have you ever tried to speak with a politician? We have spoken to many and they are owned by the polluters. They help those who pay them. Have you ever spoken to people in gov't environmental review offices? Some of them were once friends. They did their jobs once. Today, they rubber stamp every hazardous project. When confronted - as I have done, they will admit that they do it to keep their jobs, get a promotion, pay their bills, provide for their families, etc (I have heard all the excuses). Co-workers, they started to walk the other way when they saw me and I would tell them to hurry - there were more monstrous projects waiting for their rubber stamps. Show contempt for such!

A simple thing to do is to closely examine your portfolio. Dump all investments that pollute or finance the polluters. Call and speak to someone as high as possible at your investment company about ethical or socially responsible investments and pull out of funds from those who won't change their ways. Talk to your bank. In some cases, you can actually speak to someone who appears to listen and explain that if they choose to finance projects that harm us, we take our business elsewhere. Going further, you could contribute to defend those who are jailed for trying to save the earth. Or contribute to those putting themselves on the line - as I did when folks with climbing gear unfurled a banner a few years ago in Bank of America stadium during monday night football to protest this fracked gas refinery. Yes, our jails are full, and yes, some are in there for long periods for trivial offences like small quantities of dope. At the same time, the CEOs who laugh their way to the banks while polluting without regard for human life of the planet, are free. They are murderers, nothing less and should be reviled.

Watch the movie "The East". One of my fantasies is to drive a dump truck filled with coal ash into the home of a CEO who has been dumping his waste on us. Its time for "an eye for an eye" IMO.

 

[Megalodon]

excellent point
some monkey genes got polluted, and here we are
or
we are simply the froth riding on top of the swirling mass of . . . .

a question:
is industrial/commercial pollution more damaging than what might be called 'people pollution' (per this thread) ?
- w/o the industrial pollution this website would NOT be here

"People pollution" to me means nutrient pollution. Human waste finds its way to our waterways and enriches the nutrient loads, leading to massive algal blooms, some of which, like red tides, produce toxins. When the algal blooms crash, the oxygen is quickly depleted and we have "fish kills" (quotes because its not only fish).

The industrial pollution usually consists of persistent contaminants, many of which are human carcinogens. Much of the toxics pollution has technical solutions that would cost the companies money. So naturally they take the cheapest options, while also taking our tax subsidies. We read about tying public benefits to having children. It is time to link the corporate welfare with some kinds of corporate responsibility - IMO.

 

[Kray Gelder]

Megalodon, I agree with your message, but your personal escapades, and the bumper sticker story has my BS meter twitching.

 

[Megalodon]

Megalodon, I agree with your message, but your personal escapades, and the bumper sticker story has my BS meter twitching.

Truth is stranger than fiction. There have been no escapades - too old to climb B of A rafters, just contributed $. The bumper sticker stops were experienced by more than just me and our shared experiences became a campaign issue in the last sheriff's election. If I cared about your twitching, I could post links.

 

[Hillbilly Prince]

Megaloodon, I imagine we may disagree in some political matters. Which doesn't matter.
Just curious-are you in a rural area? Small town or large?
Not being aware of what the company is doing I'll still opine
Why not put a sign on your lawn? Is there no place you can have a Constitutional protest against this company's practices? That is a better way to get their attention. How about Twitter?
The fact is money and power win every time. I would bet this company speaks of the things they do to protect the environment.
We need corporations to maintain our lifestyle. People want stuff and corporations provide.
Sounds like you are on the sheriff's poop list. And you are probably seen as an outsider.
It would be great if a national campaign could be mounted in regard to personal responsibility and disposal of trash. Television and radio spots.

 

[Megalodon]

Megaloodon, I imagine we may disagree in some political matters. Which doesn't matter.
Just curious-are you in a rural area? Small town or large?
Not being aware of what the company is doing I'll still opine
Why not put a sign on your lawn? Is there no place you can have a Constitutional protest against this company's practices? That is a better way to get their attention. How about Twitter?
The fact is money and power win every time. I would bet this company speaks of the things they do to protect the environment.
We need corporations to maintain our lifestyle. People want stuff and corporations provide.
Sounds like you are on the sheriff's poop list. And you are probably seen as an outsider.
It would be great if a national campaign could be mounted in regard to personal responsibility and disposal of trash. Television and radio spots.

Thanks for your fair post. The area is mostly rural, with no actual towns, only place names. I remember when it was the last county east of the Mississippi R to get its first traffic light. Before we got mail delivery, a person's address was mostly a matter of which post office was convenient to use for either a PO Box or general delivery. We have had postal delivery since a county house numbering system started in the late 1980's. We've been here 40 years and you are correct that the stops by the sheriff deputies started with accusations of being "outside agitators". Lawn signs disappear quickly after they are put up and the sheriff's office ignores reports. They work only for a highly subsided out-of-state energy company from VA that pays no taxes. Their product is liquefied natural gas - LNG, refined, liquified and exported from here to two customers, one in Japan and the other in India. We get the pollution while these clients receive the product. The feds and the state quietly removed the public benefit requirement so this project could proceed.

 

[BillA]

. . . . The feds and the state quietly removed the public benefit requirement so this project could proceed.

the crux of the issue today, corrupt governments that serve the big players that employ the serfs
shutup and row

 

[BillA]

Mega, am not twisting your tail - the perspective is shared

this article has to make one's blood boil, consider the whys towards the article's end

https://www.mining.com/rare-earth-miner-lynas-picks-kalgoorlie-for-processing-plant/



note carefully that eco-activism does not stop the pollution, merely causes it to move to a 'cheaper' area

 

[Charlie P. (NY)]

I work at a wastewater treatment plant - doing my part. I can tell you the largest challenge we face is "disposable" hand wipes (especially the washcloth size). The fibers form ropes in the grinders and stop the pumps and also clog the grit removal screens.

We do pretty good at removing suspended solids, nutrients and biological contaminates, but we have no way to remove the pharmaceuticals that people flush - either before or after ingesting them. We are just basically a concentration point for those to be introduced into the river.

And here's a thought. The US puts 20 billion disposable diapers in landfills annually and it is estimated they make take 500 years to fully decompose. Convenient now, but sooner or later we'll have to figure out a better way.

 

[Megalodon]

I work at a wastewater treatment plant - doing my part. I can tell you the largest challenge we face is "disposable" hand wipes (especially the washcloth size). The fibers form ropes in the grinders and stop the pumps and also clog the grit removal screens.

We do pretty good at removing suspended solids, nutrients and biological contaminates, but we have no way to remove the pharmaceuticals that people flush - either before or after ingesting them. We are just basically a concentration point for those to be introduced into the river.

And here's a thought. The US puts 20 billion disposable diapers in landfills annually and it is estimated they make take 500 years to fully decompose. Convenient now, but sooner or later we'll have to figure out a better way.

I agree that these new convenience items are an issue. People flush these things with no understanding of the downstream consequences - out of sight, out of mind. As a grad student in the 1970's, I maintained a small college sewage treatment plant in exchange for free housing at a biological station dormitory. Luckily, these items were not in use at the time.

Our own homes have had septic systems (tanks with drain fields) and we have not been connected to public sewer systems. Careful with my own septic system to the point of keeping "grease & fat jars" under the sink, I always worry about out-of-town guests who might have grown accustomed to flushing such things where they live.

Incidentally, those flushed pharmaceuticals have been implicated in hormonal changes to fish in waters that receive the wastewater. Intersex bass have been found in the upper Potomac River for at least the past decade.

 

[ARC]

Florida lake full of ‘deformed’ fish with tumors, burn marks, anglers say...

"
Posted: Nov 25, 2019 / 08:43 AM EST / Updated: Nov 25, 2019 / 08:43 AM EST

LAKE OKEECHOBEE, Fla. (CNN) – It’s a stomach-churning sight.

Jason Blair, a fisherman who organized a recent protest at Lake Okeechobee, believes the Florida Fish and Wildlife Conservation Commission’s aquatic spraying program is destroying the lake’s vegetation and causing fish to suffer from tumors.

“A lot of us tournament anglers fish for largemouth bass out here on the lake,” Blair said.

But now the catch-of-the-day is catching his attention for reasons that he says are terrifying.

“Week after week, day after day, we’re pulling out damaged fish with tumors and burn marks on their sides and it’s just a terrible thing,” said Blair. “Tumors on a fish is definitely unusual and something I have not seen before until the last couple of months in these heavily sprayed areas.”

Blair — who’s planning to protest FWC believes the agency’s chemical spraying on Lake Okeechobee is to blame.

“They’re out here everyday spraying, spraying, spraying and all that stuff is coating the bottom of the lake with muck and mud,” Blair said.

But FWC officials say herbicide spraying is needed to control the spread of non-native invasive plants.

As for the deformed fish FWC tells CBS 12 News:

“Lesions in fish are not uncommon and are often caused naturally by secondary infections as a result of a physical injury.”

Florida Congressman Brian Mast weighed in on the chemical spraying

He said if we wouldn’t put it in the bathtub with our children — it doesn’t belong in our waterways.

 

[RustyGold]

The only thing I can do is on a personal level, remove all trash I find from the beach and recycle it. The next thing I do is separate all recyclables from the trash. I don’t throw things out of my car window. I do not trash a place because I think no ones looking or doesn’t care. If I find trash on my footpath I pick it up and haul it out.
If everybody did this and took responsibility and made sure the recycling companies were doing their job, we would all be better off.

 

[BillA]

Florida Congressman Brian Mast weighed in on the chemical spraying

He said if we wouldn’t put it in the bathtub with our children — it doesn’t belong in our waterways​

are we talking about Roundup ? ?

 

[IMAUDIGGER]

spoken like one who has never been in the joint, lots of different people in prison for lots of reasons
your generalizations are bull poop

I've not spent any time.
I do know good people do bad things.

Point I was making is that convicts are there based on poor choices they made.
Slavery is a little bit different.

I have spent some time working around convict work crews.
Pretty rough bunch of people always pushing the limit on what they could get away with without getting caught. I would categorize them as scary dudes. I wouldn't want to spend 10 minutes alone with them on the bus.
These were low risk inmates which I figured were there based on "good behavior" and the fact they were low flight risks due to being close to parole.

You are correct though..it was a generalization and doesn't apply to ALL people.
It sounds stupid, but I've watched many hours of prison documentaries and feel like I've got a decent idea of what goes on. Not a place I want to be.

 

[BillA]

you still have not understood
there are people in jail/prison who do not warrant such
again, no
some "convicts" should never have been convicted

I know, let god sort 'em out

edit: "hours of prison documentaries"
a clue, why did the documentary get made ?
answer, to make people fear going to prison
(as they should, but because their life has been trashed - forever, goodbye)

 

[xcopperstax]

I wanted to add more fuel to the fire of this post. Does anybody else think about the irony that the Amazon is burning while Amazon.com is growing and growing? People order more and more and more on amazon every day. I think it adds a new level of hyper consumption for people who have or don't have money. If they don't have it they simply buy on credit. I think our lives on the earth will soon all be on credit as there isn't enough clean water / resources to go around. If you don't have it where you live you can get it elsewhere ….but that can't go on forever. Every Amazon item comes in a package. We have this recycling problem where the stuff goes in the recycling bin but it doesn't actually get recycled... just gets thrown away or burned. I'm going to make a wild guess and say that we don't need 95% of the stuff being ordered.

 

[IMAUDIGGER]

you still have not understood
there are people in jail/prison who do not warrant such
again, no
some "convicts" should never have been convicted

I know, let god sort 'em out

edit: "hours of prison documentaries"
a clue, why did the documentary get made ?
answer, to make people fear going to prison
(as they should, but because their life has been trashed - forever, goodbye)

There is nothing good that comes from this situation (either to the victims or the perpetrators).
Being wrongly convicted..that would be horrible. I'm not sure what can be done to eliminate that from ever happening.

I still have no problem having prisoners do public service while serving time.
In fact I feel there should be more of it with vocational training as a goal.

Arguing different aspects of the legal system..that's a conversation for a different day and probably a different forum.

 

[Louie D]

If this don’t bring a tear to your eye you are just as pathetic, in less than 200 years or so we have littered and trash this country to the point Of no return it’s embarrassing. Next time your detecting and dig , cans, pull tabs, and the rest of the massive mess, rivers, lands, oceans a dumping ground, now that a crime. Next time your digging and find garbage I hope it brings a tear to your eye like mine

Which third world are you speaking of? India, China, Russia or Africa?