Florida Again

[Treasure_Hunter]

It's Florida law and as stated multiple times, with 95% of our beaches open for detecting it doesn't really matter to us the few that are closed. I have legally hunted several of our state park beaches with permission and no issues at all.......






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[cudamark]

Including the water at these State Park Beaches?

 

[Treasure_Hunter]

Including the water at these State Park Beaches?

GIB, didn't say what beaches he is talking about, I have hunted several East coast Florida state park beaches with no issues.

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[Warnberg]

Tom, an example of a Florida park.. read, rules are posted: https://www.pinellascounty.org/park/pdf/FortDeSoto-brochure-Map.pdf

 

[Florida_Orange]

You're initial assumption is incorrect. But you're very close. Here's how the law actually works on the east coast of Florida: if you are near one of the 1715 ship wreck sites, you can not metal detect in the water. If you are not near one of these ship wreck sites you are allowed to metal detect in the water, however, if you find anything that is more than 100 years old it automatically belongs to the State of Florida. If you are metal detecting near one of the ship wreck sites then yes, you must only detect on the beach and anything found there is yours to keep, old or otherwise.

 

[Tom_in_CA]

.....anything that is more than 100 years old it automatically belongs to the State of Florida....

Correct. And there are archies waiting there, when you leave the beach, armed with calculators doing the math on the age of each coin you found!

.....you can not metal detect in the water....

Correct. And there are armed state rangers that measure the difference between "in" (the ebbing surf), versus "out" (the nebulous inter-tidal zone)

.....anything found there is yours to keep, old or otherwise....

Really ? Let's put that to a test: If I find a 1916 wheatie (101 yrs. old), and I ask a state FL purist archie: "Hi, I just found a coin over 100 yrs. old on *your* beach. Can I keep it for my own fun and profit to sell on ebay ? Or does it belong un-disturbed on the coast or in a museum?". What do you think his reply will be ?

 

[Tom_in_CA]

Tom, an example of a Florida park.. read, rules are posted: https://www.pinellascounty.org/park/pdf/FortDeSoto-brochure-Map.pdf

Warnberg, thanx for the link. One of the rare places that isn't simply silent on the subject. Ok, .... I'm not seeing anything there forbidding md'ing. So long as you/I are not disturbing nesting birds, and are filling in their holes. So ... what's the point ?

 

[G.I.B.]

I live in Pinellas County.

I hunt that beach.

You guys sure can wear a subject down.

There are only TWO sandy beach areas in the park. North Beach and East Beach. The rest is either mangrove (protected shoreline) or part of the Fort DeSoto Historic Preservation site.

Califorina is a couple of thousand miles away- (thankfully)

 

[G.I.B.]

however, if you find anything that is more than 100 years old it automatically belongs to the State of Florida.

Oh dear God- not again.

There is no such law.

 

[Warnberg]

Oh dear God- not again.

There is no such law.

Agree... pretty simple actually, when in doubt ask.. there is no 100 year law, where does this come from?

Sheesh

 

[Tom_in_CA]

Oh dear God- not again. There is no such law.

...... there is no 100 year law, where does this come from?...

Are you guys sure ? It's probably some deeeply buried minutia under cultural heritage verbiage. Where the word "artifact" or "historical resource" is perhaps used. Then it's your duty to study even more deeeply yet, to determine the archie-purist meaning of those words. After enough cross-referencing, I bet you will indeed find that they're defined as the silly 100 yr. age cutoff . This is how it is in CA anyhow. And every other state has some form/wording of cultural heritage verbiage too I'm sure.

Ok, I know you are now grief-stricken with guilt. So send me all your coins over 100 yrs. old, and I will absolve your conscience of all guilt !

 

[G.I.B.]

The definitive age was once set at 50 years. So, we sent in pennies declaring the beach a historical site.

They soon grew weary of us and our 1950's pennies, and removed the numerical reference. It's subjective now.

Articles of cultural significance, that sort of stuff is the new verbiage.

No, pull tabs are not articles of cultural significance... lets no go there too- must we?

 

[Tom_in_CA]

The definitive age was once set at 50 years. So, we sent in pennies declaring the beach a historical site.

They soon grew weary of us and our 1950's pennies, and removed the numerical reference. It's subjective now....

Tell me you're not serious ?? haha ! People actually sent in 1950s pennies "so as to be in compliance with the law" ? Shheeesk Mother Teresa would be proud of such integrity !

Ok, and if the rest of what you said is true, then how about I do this: I contact the most purist state Archie in FL (the type that BRISTLE at the notion of md'ing anywhere, anytime). I show them a 1915 barber dime that I found on *his* beach. While carelessly "ripping it from the context", hence "depriving future generations from knowing about their past". Then I suggest that .... if it's really true that numerical references were removed in the past, that .... well gee..... let's just solve all this numerical nonsense and outlaw md'ing altogether. And my new-found state-employed archie friend, is no doubt connected to fellow state employees with connections to legislature law-makers for FL. And perhaps he can suggest a bill be introduced to solve this "pressing issue".

But if all you guys in FL send me $100 each (I accept paypal), I will not ask those FL archies those questions, suggestions, alerts, etc...

I expect to start seeing $ flow into my paypal account by noon tomorrow. If not .... then I am going to have a talk with certain people regarding these unclear ill-defined things.

 

[Warnberg]

This is how it is in CA anyhow. !

Found the issue, see quote.. grew up in California so trust me when I say California is more and more like a foreign country all the time, they have their own way of doing things, I believe there is still a law on the books about spitting on the sidewalk? Anyway no offense Tom but you can in no way compare laws in California to any other state, suggestion..... get out while you still can, there is a whole new world out there just waiting to be discovered.... hahahahahaha.

Good hunting

David

 

[G.I.B.]

People actually sent in 1950s pennies "so as to be in compliance with the law" ?

I sent some in- I would tape a penny to a piece of paper, give the location and demand a receipt. (which I never got)

This was done in protest.

Why is it that people from California think their way is the only way and want to control other states laws and actions?

Have you ever been to Florida? Have you ever hunted a beach in Pinellas county?

 

[Tom_in_CA]

I sent some in- I would tape a penny to a piece of paper, give the location and demand a receipt. (which I never got)

This was done in protest.

Why is it that people from California think their way is the only way and want to control other states laws and actions?

Have you ever been to Florida? Have you ever hunted a beach in Pinellas county?

Laws that someone can find (if they sleuthed deep enough, then cross-referenced with definitions) and after asking enough purist archies, is sort of like spitting on sidewalks laws.

You and Warnberg seem to think that when I use CA as an example, that therefore it's wacky CA that restrictive. On the contrary: Despite the laws for state beaches here, we can hunt state beaches here till we're blue in the face. And most of our coast is state administered beaches, BTW. And if you were to ask the average CA beach hunter here who hunts state beaches "is it legal to find and keep old coins?" he would say "of course". NOT because he's dug deeply enough into the minutia to truly find out. But only because it's just a practical "given", that no one cares or thinks about it. People have md'd our beaches since the 1960s, and .... all that came after those pioneers simply hunt where their mentors before them hunted (why argue with success?).

So too do I have no doubt, that when asking the average Florida hunter here on the forum, they too would say that there's no prohibitions on older coins. Perhaps it was truly deleted and age restrictions lifted. No one here had to send in 1950 pennies to get it done. It was just never known or enforced anyhow.

 

[Warnberg]

For your reading enjoyment
http://www.mdhtalk.org/cf/city-regulation.cfm?st=FL

 

[G.I.B.]

You and Warnberg seem to think that when I use CA as an example, that therefore it's wacky CA that restrictive. On the contrary: Despite the laws for state beaches here, we can hunt state beaches here till we're blue in the face. And most of our coast is state administered beaches,

It's the same here. Go forth and hunt.

There are a few restrictions, that people go to extreme length to complicate. (and they don't live or detect here either- that's the funny part)

California doesn't have beaches that were littered with Spanish treasure... just like Florida doesn't have a zillion confusing laws on panning for gold and causing a stream to get a little muddy.

If people would quit complicating the couple of basic laws we have- it wouldn't seem so darn confusing.

 

[Tom_in_CA]

For your reading enjoyment
MDHTALK - Florida Metal Detecting Law & Regulations

Bingo Here is a line lifted from the state park's section of that: "... and the removal of historical objects from state lands is prohibited...."

Ok, bear with me now Florida people: A lot (most?) of the beaches you're hunting, with utterly no problem (and that you say has no age restrictions on coins) are STATE run beaches, right ? That makes them state land, right ? Albeit not an IN-LAND park, but .... it's the EXACT SAME park's dept. that administers each, right ? So whereas perhaps you have express allowance to detect on beaches (versus in-land parks which perhaps dis-allow it), .... Yet, that doesn't change the fact they are both state administered. Hence that verbiage dis-allowing "removal of historic artifacts" would technically apply to their state park beaches too. Right ?

Next you cross-reference this by getting a definition of "historic artifacts". Typically it's defined as objects 50+ or 100+ yrs. old. G.I.B. claims that was vacated, and numerical references removed. Got a link to that relaxed wording G.I.B. ? If not, I bet that by asking enough archies, and showing them this wording from Warnberg's link, that you could indeed find a couple that would say it applies.

 

[Tom_in_CA]

.... California doesn't have beaches that were littered with Spanish treasure....

Correct. This is no doubt the reason that only Florida gets this perpetual questions by worried md'rs.

....If people would quit complicating the couple of basic laws we have- it wouldn't seem so darn confusing.

And my point in commenting on all this, is to show how .... in like manner ... well meaning sincere md'rs send letters, email inquiries, stop in a city and county halls, talk to lawyers, etc.... to find out what they can and can't do. Right ? Hey, who better to ask than the authorities in charge, right ? Afterall, you wouldn't want to get in trouble, right ? But as you can see, sometimes all that does is complicate it, when truth was, no one cared !