DEUS HF DD Round Coil vs. Elliptical

[gsxraddict]

I got the round coil installed a few minutes ago, I'm going to take it to my iron infested civil war relic spot tomorrow that I've grid walked until I've found no more non ferrous targets.

I'll report back

 

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[Phishfarmer]

Interesting thread about coils. I have a deus with 11" round and the 9.5" elliptical. I've only been hunting 2 years but when I got the elliptical I noticed access(and finds) between briers, stumps, trees and bushes improved simply because of the size. Both have pros and cons. Virginia is a great place to hunt.

 

[gsxraddict]

I got the round coil installed a few minutes ago, I'm going to take it to my iron infested civil war relic spot tomorrow that I've grid walked until I've found no more non ferrous targets.

I'll report back

I didn't notice any difference, I was hoping it would light the area back up.

I've hunted the area using the hot program and I'm very good at it. Used 17 khz and 7 khz on the LF coil.

This time I hunted at 30 and 50hz., found 3 small pieces of brass that hit on 14khz so they would have hit on the LF coil also.

 

[vferrari]

I didn't notice any difference, I was hoping it would light the area back up.

I've hunted the area using the hot program and I'm very good at it. Used 17 khz and 7 khz on the LF coil.

This time I hunted at 30 and 50hz., found 3 small pieces of brass that hit on 14khz so they would have hit on the LF coil also.

Regarding that last statement. Probably true, but I have seen some strange things, there seems to be more than just the frequency difference between these two coils. For one thing, the HF coils seem to be more stable and even though the brass hit on 14k, my guess is that it hit harder on 28 which means that if they were a little deeper you may not have heard them at all on the LF.

Might be time to use a different program - have you tried gold field or a pitch based unmasking program using discrimination (or simply adding disc to the hot program and/or changing to multi-tones to see what happens)?

 

[devldog]

gsxraddict. Best of Luck to you in your hunt tomorrow. Here's hoping you find some nice relics from Chickamauga. Save some History.

 

[Professor of Engineering]

Great post with very interesting and technical information.

 

[wildthunder]

I have had the elliptical one now and it really it good for hard to swing areas and nail infested. It does not get down deep. Dont get me wrong I have found some stuff 5 or 6 inches down but not like the 11 inch coil. That things is sweet. I have found some big coins that others mist in bushy areas.. like 2 large cents in the same hole. Also got some Merc dimes with it that I missed with 11 inch because of swing room. I will try it in an area that Ive have pounded to death with all iffy to good targets. In a few weeks.. i am letting the area rest for a bit. But I have found 8 Mercs, 2 Rossie, 1927 standing lib, 1938 Washington, 1921 UK coin.. had a hole so it was a pendant. 1944 10k gold glass ring , Silver rope bracelet.. thick. one king gorge 2 penny. a loop back flat button. 1903 Indian head. over 100 wheat's and counting.. a few buffs and many clad or all kinds. Still have many signals on the gold and under tones. this was with the 11 inch coil at 7 and 12 freq. It got down very deep. with the 11inch.

So I will try using a high freq using the elliptical coil and see if it can pick anything I missed

 

[Rookster]

Concentric coils produce a cone shaped field or coaxial ellipsoid cone field, DD's do not. It is more like an Axe Head penetrating the ground, deep but narrow, the width of the center spine of the detector where the two D coils intersect. This is independent of the shape of the coil, which generally just affects the field strength or depth the field penetrates the ground. That's why I am asking about how much shape matters when talking DD coils. It certainly makes a difference on concentric/coaxial coils, but from what I can tell, not that much difference (as far as separation is concerned) on DD coils (at least at the same operating frequency) and maybe a slight hit on depth for the elliptical with the same long dimension as the diameter of a circular coil.

I bought the round coil. My dealer advised me both coils are DD. Also I Don't need the higher frequency. 54 is plenty for me hunts and I rarely use it. The elliptical runs a little high for my use.

 

[vferrari]

I bought the round coil. My dealer advised me both coils are DD. Also I Don't need the higher frequency. 54 is plenty for me hunts and I rarely use it. The elliptical runs a little high for my use.

To clear up some possible confusion regarding the the context of the quote you referenced in your post above, it was directed at a poster who erroneously thought the hf round coil had a conical field shape vs. the elliptical. He was thinking of a concentric coil. The whole point of my post was to explain that since both HF coils were DD's, what he described was not the case for these coils. My first post in the thread explains that since both coils are DD's, there is very little difference the detection fields between the two coils and hence one does not necessarily, separate better than the other. In fact, XP does not manufacture concentric coils at all for the Deus.

As far as your choice of coils, you really can't go wrong with either. I have both. The higher frequency of the elliptical doesn't make that much of a difference vs. the round, both will snag tiny mid conductors at those frequencies. The sweet spot is 28khz (both). The elliptical gives you better ability to swing side to side under restricted obstructed conditions such as in the woods or around bushes or man-made obstructions. You will enjoy the HF round coil. I use that about 90% of the time with my Deus. Smokey the Cat with several recent banners uses the HF elliptical almost exclusively on the Deus.

Good luck with your new HF round coil and HH.

 

[vferrari]

I think in reality the transmit winding on a DD round coil is about 65% round and its producing about the same amount of soil mineralization bounce back as a concentric.

Well actually, DD's get slightly more depth in mineralized soil than concentrics exactly because of that 35% (or whatever it is) less exposure.

 

[Bharpring]

Great thread y'all!

Smokey, what did you dig at 18" with the elliptical the other day (I assume at 28kHz and reactivity 2)?

I use both the round and the elliptical and in general, the round gets slightly deeper and the elliptical is slightly more quite and smooth. I relic hunt, coin shoot and beach hunt. For relic hunting my best finds have been with the elliptical. So I choose the elliptical on sites that I have already been detecting and have a good idea of where to concentrate effort on for relic hunting. New sites or sites that I have access to only once I choose the round coil to grab as many good easy targets as possible. For coin shooting, I always choose the round coil. The elliptical loves the mid conductors like nickels, where as the round likes all coins at 14kHz IMO, keeping the reactivity low for max depth. Salt water beach hunting is not good with any Deus coil IMO (except dry sanding).

In general, the round is the way to go for all types of detecting in general. But that elliptical coil is special and if you know the site already it can grab those finds of a lifetime.

 

[Gare]

Yesterday I tried air testing my ( inch HF eliptical coil i had trouble swinging a quarter under the coil and could only get it to hit at 7 inches. I then put the standard 11 inch coil and got a hit between 12 to 13 inches with the same quarterr.
I was running the same program and freq at 14.4
I was running al the same settings on both coils. I might also add i am running 4.1 version
I took the deus out to a close park and started poping quarters . I got 3 quarters out of the same hole all were CLAD

With the standard coil it went deeper then the 9 inch HF Elliptical coil !

 

[vferrari]

Yesterday I tried air testing my ( inch HF eliptical coil i had trouble swinging a quarter under the coil and could only get it to hit at 7 inches. I then put the standard 11 inch coil and got a hit between 12 to 13 inches with the same quarterr.
I was running the same program and freq at 14.4
I was running al the same settings on both coils. I might also add i am running 4.1 version
I took the deus out to a close park and started poping quarters . I got 3 quarters out of the same hole all were CLAD

With the standard coil it went deeper then the 9 inch HF Elliptical coil !

The 11" coil does not operate at 14.4 khz, did you happen to notice what the actual frequency the 11" coil was actually running at?