CW buckle - etched "WE WON" UPDATED

[shack24]

CW buckle - etched "WE WON" UPDATED

I went out not expecting to find very much but just had the itch to swing my arm so I headed out to a park where I have found a couple of relics in the past. I dug a bunch of junk. Then on my way back I got a strong surface signal that I almost passed up thinking it was a can or large junk. I decided to dig and about 2 inches down I found the carbine sling buckle. A little bit later I found the .69 caliber 3 ringer.
I got home and cleaned it up and started looking online to identify the buckle. Some buckles had the makers mark in the pictures so I started looking closely at mine and noticed it had some etching. That is when I really got excited. Some of it was hard to make out and whoever did it didn't etch it very deep which made it more difficult. The second picture is the best I can get of it and what I and several other people with me see is "WE WON". All the other relics I have found in the area have been Federal.
I am not one to imagine things or jump to conclusions, but it is there. The W for "won" is extremely hard to see due to the buckle being in the shape it is (looks like it has been hit with a plow a couple times) and the O is roughly scratched in the shape of a triangle.
I know there will be some people who say they can't see it, and it isn't there. I am sorry but this is the best picture I can get of it. It is hard to see when holding it in different light and angles so I was surprised that at least some of it can be seen.

Happy New Year to All!

 

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[Silver Searcher]

Re: CW buckle - etched "WE WON" UPDATED

Wow, this has caused quite a little stir!

Thank you to all the congratulations. I really do appreciate it. I am still going to try to use other methods to bring out the more elusive letters. Thanks for all of the suggestions. I am about to start teaching my second semester of Spanish so I am a little occupied at the moment.

I love finding artifacts from the Civil War. I remember being little and my mom telling me about how her great great (however many) aunt passed down the story of when she was just a little girl and saw her dad for the last time. His last name was Sexton and was from North Georgia. She remembers him saying goodbye, getting on his horse and riding off to join the Confederacy. He never came back and they have no idea when or where he died.

I have had the opportunity to do some living history events with my father-in-law. The last one I was able to attend was a few years ago in Vicksburg. We were given permission to go into the park and slept in and occupy the confederate earthworks. That was amazing. Looking across and seeing the federal encampment and thinking about how those starving soldiers felt was more than sobering. There were many great men on both sides who died fighting for what they believed to be right.

Silver Searcher: I understand your skepticism, I would be skeptical too. But if all you can see is a "W" and maybe an "E" then you might need a vision check up or some new glasses. Or perhaps a trip to the Imagination Station wouldn't hurt either. The last "N" is as clear as day, the "O" carved as a rough triangle is pretty visible too. The second "W" is hard to see because it is right where the buckle has been bent so the nice, smooth patina is not present. But if you look at the updated picture with the circled area with the arrow you can see the middle of the "W".
I'm really not sore that you can't see it; just wish I could show it to you in person. P.S. I would love to come over and hunt on your Island one day when I get rich from teaching. HH!

I don't need a Vision check, perhaps you need a reality check, it's a Buckle with a W and some scratches, and why whould anyone depict a O with a triangle, much better to do it, and easier as a square, and why is it civil war period, just because you have found outher CW finds in the area, doesn't meen that this is.
And another point which you might want to explaine to me, the W at the start is almost perfectly done, yet all the outher letters are poorly done, like scribbles, or was it done by a dying CW soldier

SS

 

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[SoMdRelicHunter]

Re: CW buckle - etched "WE WON" UPDATED

Wow, this has caused quite a little stir!

Thank you to all the congratulations. I really do appreciate it. I am still going to try to use other methods to bring out the more elusive letters. Thanks for all of the suggestions. I am about to start teaching my second semester of Spanish so I am a little occupied at the moment.

I love finding artifacts from the Civil War. I remember being little and my mom telling me about how her great great (however many) aunt passed down the story of when she was just a little girl and saw her dad for the last time. His last name was Sexton and was from North Georgia. She remembers him saying goodbye, getting on his horse and riding off to join the Confederacy. He never came back and they have no idea when or where he died.

I have had the opportunity to do some living history events with my father-in-law. The last one I was able to attend was a few years ago in Vicksburg. We were given permission to go into the park and slept in and occupy the confederate earthworks. That was amazing. Looking across and seeing the federal encampment and thinking about how those starving soldiers felt was more than sobering. There were many great men on both sides who died fighting for what they believed to be right.

Silver Searcher: I understand your skepticism, I would be skeptical too. But if all you can see is a "W" and maybe an "E" then you might need a vision check up or some new glasses. Or perhaps a trip to the Imagination Station wouldn't hurt either. The last "N" is as clear as day, the "O" carved as a rough triangle is pretty visible too. The second "W" is hard to see because it is right where the buckle has been bent so the nice, smooth patina is not present. But if you look at the updated picture with the circled area with the arrow you can see the middle of the "W".
I'm really not sore that you can't see it; just wish I could show it to you in person. P.S. I would love to come over and hunt on your Island one day when I get rich from teaching. HH!

I don't need a Vision check, perhaps you need a reality check, it's a Buckle with a W and some scratches, and why whould anyone depict a O with a triangle, much better to do it, and easier as a square, and why is it civil war period, just because you have found outher CW finds in the area, doesn't meen that this is.
And another point which you might want to explaine to me, the W at the start is almost perfectly done, yet all the outher letters are poorly done, like scribbles, or was it done by a dying CW soldier

SS

Perhaps it is you that needs a reality check. It is most assuredly a civil war era carbine sling buckle; there is no doubt about that. And I don't think I believe you don't see anything... I think you just like to nay-say and cause a ruckus. Glad you get your kicks that way, but I have read this whole thread and not seen one constructive comment nor input from you. It is VERY clear that there is something written on this buckle (more than just random scratches...). What it says we may never know, but there is something there. Why don't you keep your close minded ignorance on your side of the pond, there, red-coat. We don't need it in this thread. People like you are why I don't post here, but I gotta tell you that you really ruffled my feathers here. Enough for me to make a quick comment anyway. Thanks for reassuring me about the Know nothing "experts" that plague this nice forum like you.

 

[SoMdRelicHunter]

Re: CW buckle - etched "WE WON" UPDATED

Does anyone else have a problem when you are typing a reply while quoting someone, that the text input box jumps around and you can't see what you're writing while you're typing it? Might just be my computer... Aggrevating either way.


Silver Searcher:

Why couldn't someone scratch an "O" as a triangle?? Just because it doesn't make sense to you, doesn't mean that it couldn't make sense to someone else. People do things all the time that make no sense to me. I see it every day. Whether it be my employees or the hundreds of customers I deal with on a daily basis (generally both!), the things some people do make no sense to me. Would they do it if it didn't make sense to them? No. So I see no valid argument in that point of yours either. Whether or not someone would scratch an "O" as a triangle is relative.

 

[Silver Searcher]

Re: CW buckle - etched "WE WON" UPDATED

Does anyone else have a problem when you are typing a reply while quoting someone, that the text input box jumps around and you can't see what you're writing while you're typing it? Might just be my computer... Aggrevating either way.


Silver Searcher:

Why couldn't someone scratch an "O" as a triangle?? Just because it doesn't make sense to you, doesn't mean that it couldn't make sense to someone else. People do things all the time that make no sense to me. I see it every day. Whether it be my employees or the hundreds of customers I deal with on a daily basis (generally both!), the things some people do make no sense to me. Would they do it if it didn't make sense to them? No. So I see no valid argument in that point of yours either. Whether or not someone would scratch an "O" as a triangle is relative.

I think you should mind your own, I have a opinion that's all, you slagging me of means nothing, there are dozens of uses for buckles like that.
I don't go around nay-saying people's finds, why should I. I am not going to say I see something, just to please fools like you. My opinion still stands, and that's all it is, but if you want have a go at me...fine but do it in another thread.

 

[SouthJerseyJim]

Re: CW buckle - etched "WE WON" UPDATED

Thats a sweet little buckle. Whatever it says its pretty cool. I do however disagree with the statement of the civil war being THE most important war of our time. The rev war is just a little more important than our "civil" issues. Without the rev war we would still be knitting knickers for the red coats.
Silversurfer has to lighten up a bit. Finds like this may not be ancient gold coins but have a lot of historical signifigance to us. Even if it doesn't say we won.

 

[Silver Searcher]

Re: CW buckle - etched "WE WON" UPDATED

Thats a sweet little buckle. Whatever it says its pretty cool. I do however disagree with the statement of the civil war being THE most important war of our time. The rev war is just a little more important than our "civil" issues. Without the rev war we would still be knitting knickers for the red coats.
Silversurfer has to lighten up a bit. Finds like this may not be ancient gold coins but have a lot of historical signifigance to us. Even if it doesn't say we won.

I don't know why people are getting ruffled by what I say if I don't see something, then I will say so, every body is entitled to a opinion, it's Silver Searcher by the way

Nice Stamped Pressed Brass Buckle..

SS

 

[SouthJerseyJim]

Re: CW buckle - etched "WE WON" UPDATED

Silversearcher my bad. Had a brain fart typing I guess

 

[SoMdRelicHunter]

Re: CW buckle - etched "WE WON" UPDATED

I take no sides on matters of finds/coins & try & stay objective whatever country the poster is from. However, if you disagree with an opinion there is no need for the racial connotations to get your point across, because it makes no real impact other than to upset/create more division in our great hobby. Maybe its 'jokey', I'm often bad at that, but lets all keep it a healthy debate & try to argue our case with the facts as we know it.

This is what I 'believe' - it is CW Period & it does have some 'letters' on it.
I'm not yet convined its 'WE WON', however I'm happy to take the posters word that its there, as far as he can make out.
I never got a reply from my quick little picture, where I think I see other scratches which could over lay & confuse other already present letters & therefore believe the story of this one is still in debate (not fact yet, although maybe proved later??). But none of this is a bad thing, just needs further analysis by other eyes to make out the full story. Please get another competent/experienced person to view it with the right equipment or fresh eyes & update us? It maybe far more interesting than 'We Won'.....

Not that two wrongs make a right, but;

although I don't have the vivid imagination of an American

I was mearly responding in kind regarding racial connotations...

That being out of the way, I love having oppinions and I often express my own, however, to make sarcastic comments regarding someones find is not an oppinion. It only serves to belitle the find and/or the finder. I agree with Crusader as I am not sure what I see however I do see something. It is more than likely initials as that was relatively commonplace.

What purpose does;

A lot of fuss over a few scratches on a Buckle

Or;

but even better if there were any Buckle, posted with we won on it.

Or;

And another point which you might want to explaine to me, the W at the start is almost perfectly done, yet all the outher letters are poorly done, like scribbles, or was it done by a dying CW soldier

Serve other than to be sarcastic and belittle the find and poster. Have an oppinion. That's Fine. But no need to keep drilling your sarcasm laced remarks into peoples heads. We get it. You disagree. Move on. Perhaps even just say "Nice Finds!" and keep your oppinion to yourself if you can't help but be so sarcastic. Crusader substantiated his oppinions with a picture of what he sees. At least that's constructive. No sarcasm there. Just Respect. And, Just for the record;

and why is it civil war period, just because you have found outher CW finds in the area, doesn't meen that this is.

Here's Why;

http://www.andersonmilitaria.com/Web_Pages/belts_buckles/beltsbuckles.htm

8th Item down. Even includes hardware and the batwings.

 

[Silver Searcher]

Re: CW buckle - etched "WE WON" UPDATED



Your link proves nothing, like I said many uses for that Buckle. Batwing Buckles date back to 1600s As for my first post ,perhaps if was a bit flipent of a remark, I never meant it to be so. But you or know outher people, except the poster has the right to tell me so.

It's typical of some one like you who's not around much to come along and through is aw in, and then dissapear.
Quote.
Thanks for reassuring me about the Know nothing "experts" that plague this nice forum like you.
For your imformation I spend a lot of time on trying to help people, and with a bit of sucsess I might add.
Quote.
People like you are why I don't post here, but I gotta tell you that you really ruffled my feathers here. Enough for me to make a quick comment.
I'm glad you don't post anymore after reading this dribble.

That said, if I have offended the poster I opplogise.

SS

 

[SoMdRelicHunter]

Re: CW buckle - etched "WE WON" UPDATED

Your link proves nothing, like I said many uses for that Buckle. Batwing Buckles date back to 1600s As for my first post ,perhaps if was a bit flipent of a remark, I never meant it to be so. But you or know outher people, except the poster has the right to tell me so.

It's typical of some one like you who's not around much to come along and through is aw in, and then dissapear.
Quote.
Thanks for reassuring me about the Know nothing "experts" that plague this nice forum like you.
For your imformation I spend a lot of time on trying to help people, and with a bit of sucsess I might add.
Quote.
People like you are why I don't post here, but I gotta tell you that you really ruffled my feathers here. Enough for me to make a quick comment.
I'm glad you don't post anymore after reading this dribble.

That said, if I have offended the poster I opplogise.

SS

Hmmmm. I see you making no effort to prove me wrong. Please, if you would, go ahead and show me proof that it isn't civil war. I dig and collect civil war artifacts, as well as many others on this forum. They will all tell you the same thing. Go ahead and google civil war carbine sling buckle to see for yourself. Save me the trouble of posting another link which your closed mind will refuse to accept anyway. You know NOTHING of OUR civil war and the relics associated with it. Perhaps, just perhaps, you have something similar over there in your 3000 years of history that may span a few hundred years of the same style belt buckle with different uses. However, in our 300 years of history this was made for a military application during the civil war. Does it have more than one use? Of course. Was it built for and issued to the troops? Absolutely. You can conjecture all you like, but perhaps you should let the people who know and dig this stuff daily (which I would be willing to bet you never have) be the judge. I am not a carpenter, so I don't question what a carpenter know or does. Pretty simple premise, actually. And I know nothing of the relics you guys dig over there so I would never question something YOU dug or something you knew about your relics as to not to be made to look like an arrogant fool. I am glad you spend some of your time helping others, however, I see NONE of that here.

 

[Silver Searcher]

Re: CW buckle - etched "WE WON" UPDATED

Your link proves nothing, like I said many uses for that Buckle. Batwing Buckles date back to 1600s As for my first post ,perhaps if was a bit flipent of a remark, I never meant it to be so. But you or know outher people, except the poster has the right to tell me so.

It's typical of some one like you who's not around much to come along and through is aw in, and then dissapear.
Quote.
Thanks for reassuring me about the Know nothing "experts" that plague this nice forum like you.
For your imformation I spend a lot of time on trying to help people, and with a bit of sucsess I might add.
Quote.
People like you are why I don't post here, but I gotta tell you that you really ruffled my feathers here. Enough for me to make a quick comment.
I'm glad you don't post anymore after reading this dribble.

That said, if I have offended the poster I opplogise.

SS

Hmmmm. I see you making no effort to prove me wrong. Please, if you would, go ahead and show me proof that it isn't civil war. I dig and collect civil war artifacts, as well as many others on this forum. They will all tell you the same thing. Go ahead and google civil war carbine sling buckle to see for yourself. Save me the trouble of posting another link which your closed mind will refuse to accept anyway. You know NOTHING of OUR civil war and the relics associated with it. Perhaps, just perhaps, you have something similar over there in your 3000 years of history that may span a few hundred years of the same style belt buckle with different uses. However, in our 300 years of history this was made for a military application during the civil war. Does it have more than one use? Of course. Was it built for and issued to the troops? Absolutely. You can conjecture all you like, but perhaps you should let the people who know and dig this stuff daily (which I would be willing to bet you never have) be the judge. I am not a carpenter, so I don't question what a carpenter know or does. Pretty simple premise, actually. And I know nothing of the relics you guys dig over there so I would never question something YOU dug or something you knew about your relics as to not to be made to look like an arrogant fool. I am glad you spend some of your time helping others, however, I see NONE of that here.

Let's see.... no I don't have a great deal of knowledge about your CW relics, the sling buckles I have seen(genuine) usually had a makers mark, Like T. J Sheppard or Made in ENGLAND. But I think you will find that this buckle was in use after 1865, a picture of the back and centre bar would clear this up.

 

[shack24]

Re: CW buckle - etched "WE WON" UPDATED

Crusader: I am sorry for not responding directly to your effort to show me what you see. I should have.

Here is a picture of the back of the buckle. No there is no makers mark, just as MANY of them did not have a makers mark. Case in point can be seen at
http://www.bullrunrelics.com/civilwar.html

Silver Searcher: I find your posts to be quite offensive. Within 20 yards of this buckle I have found 2 Civil War bullets, an 1851 Eagle Officers Sword Belt Plate, and part of a hilt to an 1851 officers sword. There were 30,000 troops in and around the small city. And YOU are going to come on here (with admittedly no expertise in the era or relics) and arrogantly claim that it is not even a Civil War buckle? That would be like me claiming that one of your hammered coins is nothing but a replica (of which there are many). I would never do such a thing because I know little to nothing about ancient coins, just as you know little about these relics. My advice to you would be to stick to what you know. Saying you see nothing but scratches is just fine, but saying the rest you did was asinine, idiotic, and disrespectful.
I find your posts to be condescending, arrogant and less than constructive. Because of this I am requesting that you not respond to this thread or any of my future posts. If you do not honor this request I will report it to an administrator.

To everyone else, I agree, who knows what it says, but I thought it was a pretty cool and personal find. Even if the soldier had scratched "poop" on it I would still treasure it.

HH,
Jared

 

[mickk]

Re: CW buckle - etched "WE WON" UPDATED

Shove it in some blutack, do some paper rubs, plenty more to see.

 

[Silver Searcher]

Re: CW buckle - etched "WE WON" UPDATED

Crusader: I am sorry for not responding directly to your effort to show me what you see. I should have.

Here is a picture of the back of the buckle. No there is no makers mark, just as MANY of them did not have a makers mark. Case in point can be seen at
http://www.bullrunrelics.com/civilwar.html

Silver Searcher: I find your posts to be quite offensive. Within 20 yards of this buckle I have found 2 Civil War bullets, an 1851 Eagle Officers Sword Belt Plate, and part of a hilt to an 1851 officers sword. There were 30,000 troops in and around the small city. And YOU are going to come on here (with admittedly no expertise in the era or relics) and arrogantly claim that it is not even a Civil War buckle? That would be like me claiming that one of your hammered coins is nothing but a replica (of which there are many). I would never do such a thing because I know little to nothing about ancient coins, just as you know little about these relics. My advice to you would be to stick to what you know. Saying you see nothing but scratches is just fine, but saying the rest you did was asinine, idiotic, and disrespectful.
I find your posts to be condescending, arrogant and less than constructive. Because of this I am requesting that you not respond to this thread or any of my future posts. If you do not honor this request I will report it to an administrator.

To everyone else, I agree, who knows what it says, but I thought it was a pretty cool and personal find. Even if the soldier had scratched "poop" on it I would still treasure it.

HH,
Jared

Like I said earlier which you obviously never read, I appologise if I offended the poster, as a member I have the right to post in your threads or any body else's, I mealy pointed out that because it was found in a CW area, it doesn't have to be CW related, they were made later than 1865 I believe.

Now that I have seen the back it is very similar to the ones I have seen and I would say is CW period, as for the etching I still think it's very vague, and not really anything out of the ordinary.
Perhaps you should have used a different title, like possible WE Won etched on Buckle, I post in a lot of threads and I am passionate about this site, I don't disrespect people or there finds, I'm sorry if you took it that way, but I won't stop posting in any body's threads if I want to, I will make that choice, or if I am requested by a Mod, but I have seen nothing bad in my outher posts, just doubt, any body can doubt my posts it would not bother me in the slightest, it would just make me double check, that I had the correct imformation, I certainley wouldn't cry about it.
Asking me is not to post is like asking me to way my rights as a free person, something you guys should no all about.

SS

 

[CRUSADER]

Re: CW buckle - etched "WE WON" UPDATED

Crusader: I am sorry for not responding directly to your effort to show me what you see. I should have.

Here is a picture of the back of the buckle. No there is no makers mark, just as MANY of them did not have a makers mark. Case in point can be seen at
http://www.bullrunrelics.com/civilwar.html

Silver Searcher: I find your posts to be quite offensive. Within 20 yards of this buckle I have found 2 Civil War bullets, an 1851 Eagle Officers Sword Belt Plate, and part of a hilt to an 1851 officers sword. There were 30,000 troops in and around the small city. And YOU are going to come on here (with admittedly no expertise in the era or relics) and arrogantly claim that it is not even a Civil War buckle? That would be like me claiming that one of your hammered coins is nothing but a replica (of which there are many). I would never do such a thing because I know little to nothing about ancient coins, just as you know little about these relics. My advice to you would be to stick to what you know. Saying you see nothing but scratches is just fine, but saying the rest you did was asinine, idiotic, and disrespectful.
I find your posts to be condescending, arrogant and less than constructive. Because of this I am requesting that you not respond to this thread or any of my future posts. If you do not honor this request I will report it to an administrator.

To everyone else, I agree, who knows what it says, but I thought it was a pretty cool and personal find. Even if the soldier had scratched "poop" on it I would still treasure it.

HH,
Jared

In the cold light of the morning, I deleted a couple of my posts which were clogging up your thread.

I just hate a mystery/ID to slip through our hands. This does have more to tell us, & if I were you I would not give up on those combination of letters & scratches, because now we see the back, I see no scratches. This maybe because it was protected from accidently getting harmed but I think the scratches tell a story as well. I'm just sitting here a few hundreds miles away frustrated I can't see the piece in person & make it out better.
Anyway, it is a cool piece of History, & you have raised passions on both sides of the pond which is not a bad thing, it means it created great interest which is hopfully why you do this. So stay happy & cool about your piece of history, you are the custodian so keep your records of the findspot with it & enjoy

 

[70monte68]

Re: CW buckle - etched "WE WON" UPDATED

Just drop it silversurfer. It is agreat find in my book

Love the avatar UP THE IRONS.

 

[70monte68]

Re: CW buckle - etched "WE WON" UPDATED

Silver S. No need to pm me with comments! I enjoy this site and really don't care for the nay say. I see you made the banner quite a few times and i am sure you were excited with those finds as well, so, if someone else finds something that causes some excitement around this sight and it's not YOU it is OK.
Anyway HH

 

[Silver Searcher]

Re: CW buckle - etched "WE WON" UPDATED

Silver S No need to pm me with comments! I enjoy this site and really don't care for the nay say. I see you made the banner quite a few times and i am sure you were excited with those finds as well, so, if someone else finds something that causes some excitement around this sight and it's not YOU it is OK.
Anyway HH

Use the PM to reply then, not this thread, or you guys can keep up the witch hunt on here if you want.

 

[baspinall]

Re: CW buckle - etched "WE WON" UPDATED

I think it's a great find! I also think this thread should just be shut down or locked. To many folks saying crap they will regret.