Cat & Mouse
- Thread starter uniface
- Start date
Th3rty7
Silver Member
Re: Cat & Mouse
Interesting, yes, but also terrible. A catch 22.
Interesting, yes, but also terrible. A catch 22.
bravowhiskey
Bronze Member
Re: Cat & Mouse
Partly good, partly not so good. I never buy any and don't plan to. What I pick up is known to me to be authentic.
Good article, thanx.
BW
Partly good, partly not so good. I never buy any and don't plan to. What I pick up is known to me to be authentic.
Good article, thanx.
BW
- Jan 27, 2009
- 18,795
- 11,913
- 🥇 Banner finds
- 1
- Detector(s) used
- Tesoro Conquistador freq shift
Fisher F75
Garrett AT-Pro
Garet carrot
Neodymium magnets
5' Probe
- Primary Interest:
- All Treasure Hunting
Re: Cat & Mouse
Interesting read on ebay and pottery. Have heard a little about this nice to actually read an article.
Thanks
TnMtns
Interesting read on ebay and pottery. Have heard a little about this nice to actually read an article.
Thanks
TnMtns
Th3rty7
Silver Member
Re: Cat & Mouse
Dont get me wrong, I think it's good that less artifacts are being looted, but creating a global marketplace for fakes and reproductions that will recirculate through the collecting world, imo is more of a threat.
Dont get me wrong, I think it's good that less artifacts are being looted, but creating a global marketplace for fakes and reproductions that will recirculate through the collecting world, imo is more of a threat.
joshuaream
Silver Member
Re: Cat & Mouse
The sad part is that archaeologists are fooled a lot more than collectors... Yes, most of the lower priced items on eBay from Peru (sold by sellers in Peru) are bogus, but to almost any collector they look bogus. (That said, there are people who will buy anything...)
Collectors of foreign material get in trouble with fakes when they stop trusting their instincts and start ignoring obvious red flags (i.e. buying anything described as Pre-Colombian jade from sellers in China.) They also get in trouble when they are able to buy several authentic items from a seller, and then stop questioning as the artifacts get better and better.
There are now a lot of rechips in African neolithic pieces, and we are starting to see better quality local restoration on pre-colombian pottery as well. I saw my first fake Mayan flint blades a couple of years back, and they were pretty obvious fakes or examples taken from one of the local archaeology classes that teach Mayan lithic reduction. Now we are starting to see some very good quality rechips and fakes, but if you take the time to look at the pieces and look for real patina, the fakes stand out. (Again, the problem is when people see something too good to be true, but still dive in with their wallets before they look at the pieces.)
The sad part is that archaeologists are fooled a lot more than collectors... Yes, most of the lower priced items on eBay from Peru (sold by sellers in Peru) are bogus, but to almost any collector they look bogus. (That said, there are people who will buy anything...)
Collectors of foreign material get in trouble with fakes when they stop trusting their instincts and start ignoring obvious red flags (i.e. buying anything described as Pre-Colombian jade from sellers in China.) They also get in trouble when they are able to buy several authentic items from a seller, and then stop questioning as the artifacts get better and better.
There are now a lot of rechips in African neolithic pieces, and we are starting to see better quality local restoration on pre-colombian pottery as well. I saw my first fake Mayan flint blades a couple of years back, and they were pretty obvious fakes or examples taken from one of the local archaeology classes that teach Mayan lithic reduction. Now we are starting to see some very good quality rechips and fakes, but if you take the time to look at the pieces and look for real patina, the fakes stand out. (Again, the problem is when people see something too good to be true, but still dive in with their wallets before they look at the pieces.)
OP
OP
uniface
Silver Member
- Thread starter
- #7
Re: Cat & Mouse
I have nothing against the principle that if somebody wants something, it's his business whether or not he buys it. Not mine.
But by the same token, nearly every ill that besets artifact collecting comes directly from the high-rollers. People get competitive. And rich people more than others, it seems. It started with "Who's Who in Artifacts" and stuff like that. Hey everybody -- look what I've got ! Am I cool, or what ?! Once the thin line between the joy of sharing and bragging gets crossed, manipulators move in to exploit that character weakness and artifacts, like anything else, start to become an adjunct of money.
Then once the crooks notice the money there is in artifacts, everything goes to hell fast. Rechips, fakes, the works. Look at ebay for an example. The new fad is to call debitage "paleo tools" and ask big bucks for it. And they get it sometimes. "Paleo" is the hot fashion trigger this year. Like "all natural."
Too much money involved, IMHO. Subtract that from the equation and it's a healthier hobby. Because the people in it are in it for the right reason.
I have nothing against the principle that if somebody wants something, it's his business whether or not he buys it. Not mine.
But by the same token, nearly every ill that besets artifact collecting comes directly from the high-rollers. People get competitive. And rich people more than others, it seems. It started with "Who's Who in Artifacts" and stuff like that. Hey everybody -- look what I've got ! Am I cool, or what ?! Once the thin line between the joy of sharing and bragging gets crossed, manipulators move in to exploit that character weakness and artifacts, like anything else, start to become an adjunct of money.
Then once the crooks notice the money there is in artifacts, everything goes to hell fast. Rechips, fakes, the works. Look at ebay for an example. The new fad is to call debitage "paleo tools" and ask big bucks for it. And they get it sometimes. "Paleo" is the hot fashion trigger this year. Like "all natural."
Too much money involved, IMHO. Subtract that from the equation and it's a healthier hobby. Because the people in it are in it for the right reason.
oldgoat
Hero Member
- Oct 21, 2008
- 538
- 9
Re: Cat & Mouse
I have a friend that goes to every artifact show that comes up in this area, he is always looking for a bargain...recently he bought a bunch of midback tang knives for a low amount and was super surprised when no one would give him the price that he thought that they were worth...because he didn't take the time to look at them as closely as others did, he didn't see the signs that they were rechips of some brokes. I do buy from people but I also take the time and effort to check them as thoroughly as possible...if the price is too good to be true, I just back away...
I have a friend that goes to every artifact show that comes up in this area, he is always looking for a bargain...recently he bought a bunch of midback tang knives for a low amount and was super surprised when no one would give him the price that he thought that they were worth...because he didn't take the time to look at them as closely as others did, he didn't see the signs that they were rechips of some brokes. I do buy from people but I also take the time and effort to check them as thoroughly as possible...if the price is too good to be true, I just back away...
- Jan 27, 2009
- 18,795
- 11,913
- 🥇 Banner finds
- 1
- Detector(s) used
- Tesoro Conquistador freq shift
Fisher F75
Garrett AT-Pro
Garet carrot
Neodymium magnets
5' Probe
- Primary Interest:
- All Treasure Hunting
Re: Cat & Mouse
Ok I have sold some redfield optics and stuff like that on eBay and done pretty well. Always enjoy seeing the artifacts. Along comes this guy selling stuff from the areas I hunt. I could not believe how close they were to exactly what I find. I bid and won an item to I could hold it in my hands. My first ever bought artifact( except some s.American). It came today and its a good piece made of fort Payne chert. Its what i find in my spots. I am still going to keep it separate though. I blame treasure net for making me buy it,,lol
TnMtns
Ok I have sold some redfield optics and stuff like that on eBay and done pretty well. Always enjoy seeing the artifacts. Along comes this guy selling stuff from the areas I hunt. I could not believe how close they were to exactly what I find. I bid and won an item to I could hold it in my hands. My first ever bought artifact( except some s.American). It came today and its a good piece made of fort Payne chert. Its what i find in my spots. I am still going to keep it separate though. I blame treasure net for making me buy it,,lol
TnMtns
Th3rty7
Silver Member
Re: Cat & Mouse
Uh Oh Tn, we created a monster.lol, just joking. seriously though,Imo life's too short to be able to hunt Oh, Ky, Tn, etc. and all the other areas I would really like to hunt. I keep my personal finds seperate from mailbox finds too. I treasure my personal finds more than my purchased ones but I really enjoy studying other types and materials from other parts of the east. They're like fine art, and quality firearms, they dont depreciate. I look at them as investment pieces.
TnMountains said:
Uh Oh Tn, we created a monster.lol, just joking. seriously though,Imo life's too short to be able to hunt Oh, Ky, Tn, etc. and all the other areas I would really like to hunt. I keep my personal finds seperate from mailbox finds too. I treasure my personal finds more than my purchased ones but I really enjoy studying other types and materials from other parts of the east. They're like fine art, and quality firearms, they dont depreciate. I look at them as investment pieces.
Top Member Reactions
-
3321 -
1923 -
1911 -
1191 -
1092 -
862 -
812 -
811 -
801 -
789 -
773 -
531 -
495 -
472 -
423 -
420 -
419 -
E
415
-
401 -
395
