Artifacts?

[eppingera]

Hello all!

Looking for opinions on these items. The 2 outside ones were found in Howard County, MO on a farm where we have found numerous projectile points (mostly broken) and possible pottery shards. The round-ish one fits perfectly in the palm with the fingers fitting in the grooves on the underside. The end is damaged as if it was used as a hammer. The cylindrical one I have no idea about, it is a strange looking rock but doesn't look natural to me. The middle one was found on a Missouri River mud flat. Any ideas or opinions?

Thanks!

 

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[martymac]

Pretty cool, can't help with any ID, a friend of mine has a brother I law that lives in the area and has found so many points on his property that he has bunches of them inlaid in is fireplace and other spots in his home.. I'm in MO also, St. Charles area.

 

[GatorBoy]

Well..Hmmm... the cylindrical object that is pinched on the end looks like oxidized lead.
The other two...if they are artifacts could be a hammer stone like you already described..the wavy surface natural..not made for..or made by fingers.
The other is shaped like a bopper both being knapping tools...if in fact are artifacts.
Since I don't know the context of where they were found this is just my best guess.

 

[unclemac]

...is that fire patina i see on the hammer stone?

 

[rock]

Well..Hmmm... the cylindrical object that is pinched on the end looks like oxidized lead.
The other two...if they are artifacts could be a hammer stone like you already described..the wavy surface natural..not made for..or made by fingers.
The other is shaped like a bopper both being knapping tools...if in fact are artifacts.
Since I don't know the context of where they were found this is just my best guess.

I believe GB hammered it. lol

 

[eppingera]

Missouri is certainly a hot spot for points, ect. So, oxidized lead? How could I tell for sure? Try scoring it or soaking in acid or base solution?
The 'hammer stone' does have dark areas on it, not sure if it is from fire or natural color, any way to tell for sure?

I am posting a couple of pics of our points. The first and second (front & back views) is our better finds. The point on the upper left was my first find ever in a creek in Randolph county, Mo. I about fell over when I pulled it out of the sand beside a buried tire! Just a partial edge was showing but it caught my eye. The one on the top right was found in Kansas years ago by my husband. I thought it a Dalton but after reading on this site I don't think it is. It doesn't have the fluting.
The 2 tiny ones we just found yesterday in the same field that the hammer stone was found in.

The next photo is some of our broken finds.

Thanks for your opinions and expertise!

 

[GatorBoy]

Great finds.. as far as...lead or not...if you don't own a metal detector you could just scratch a small section and it will be shiny underneath if it is.

 

[scotto]

The one on the top right was found in Kansas years ago by my husband. I thought it a Dalton but after reading on this site I don't think it is. It doesn't have the fluting.

That sucker is awesome. Sure looks like a Dalton to me, if it was found in MO, I'd call it a Sloan.

 

[rock]

Id call it a Dalton. Paleo had the fluting at the base.

 

[GatorBoy]

www.lithicsnet.com/dalton.htm

 

[Get-the-point]

Its a Dalton Hemp hill........nice points......the collateral percussion flaking is nice. Right to the median ridge. That is a fine example of the type...........

 

[GatorBoy]

How do those differ from the Meserve point? I don't see heavy grinding like most Dalton's.
I was thinking Meserve.. help me/us out if you can..thanks.

 

[rock]

Come on........peace

 

[GatorBoy]

What? I'm asking a question.. is there something wrong with that?

 

[Get-the-point]

What? I'm asking a question.. is there something wrong with that?

Why do you think it is Meserve?

 

[GatorBoy]

Because I don't see grinding on the base and it doesn't have the flair on the ears that I have seen with Dalton hemp hill points.
We find points almost identicle to Dalton hemphills here except we call them Dalton Greenbriars..
The Meserve is a early to middle archaic point so that may explain the lack of grinding and the nicely set up median ridge.
Mabey? I honestly am just figuring this out so...the question.

 

[Get-the-point]

Because I don't see grinding on the base and it doesn't have the flair on the ears that I have seen with Dalton hemp hill points.
We find points almost identicle to Dalton hemphills here except we call them Dalton Greenbriars..
The Meserve is a early to middle archaic point so that may explain the lack of grinding and the nicely set up median ridge.
Mabey? I honestly am just figuring this out so...the question.

How can you see the grinding or lack there of? As far as the rest of the point, it shares the same concave base, weak shoulders and pressure flaking around the base, along with style and form as exhibited on Dalton and form distinguishes this one for Hemp hill. The collateral percussion flaking is what makes this piece exceptional. Not sold on the Meserve call but that is OK.. Can't call it on basal grinding. Just look at known hemp hill points. Go on Davis's website he might have some g-10 examples. This one has great form.

 

[Get-the-point]

Because I don't see grinding on the base and it doesn't have the flair on the ears that I have seen with Dalton hemp hill points.
We find points almost identicle to Dalton hemphills here except we call them Dalton Greenbriars..
The Meserve is a early to middle archaic point so that may explain the lack of grinding and the nicely set up median ridge.
Mabey? I honestly am just figuring this out so...the question.

Hemp hill Daltons rarely have the feet on the auricle you are talking about. They have usually straight bases like the Holland point and Scotty, but with the concave. The meserve base is basally thinned and constricted and the blade is usually beveled on meserve points.A first stage Meserve may share this form. but again most meserve points are beveled.

 

[GatorBoy]

This Guy is usually pretty good..but has me confused I suppose.
Its a decent resource for descriptions as far as the net goes usually.
www.lithicsnet.com/dalthemp.htm

 

[Get-the-point]

Those points show the nice flared auricles your speaking of. The only problem with those is they share more of a Dalton Classic form. I do not think they are Hemp hill form. The tell tale sign for those is the oversharpening. Hemp hills never show over sharpening. Dalton classics do. The piece to the left in your photo looks like a Hardaway Dalton......jmo...not to take any credit away from the gentleman who pulled those photos together for lithic net.