Archaeology?

[Lady_Huntress]

Hey I noticed only a few sites out there that really try to work together as a team with Archaeologist/Treasure Hunters together

This site..I think?
Melfisher.com
Treasureadventures.net
Shipwreck.net

does nayone know of any other sites trying to bridge the gap? talked to a few Archaeologist's and they were pretty hostile. any input on this?

 

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[jeff of pa]

There are a Few Archaeologist's here at TreasureNet.
and a Few who have at least Studied it.
they seem to want to keep it Quiet.
So I oblige.

We have had at least one come here and Attack us
already too.

 

[Tom_in_CA]

Ordinarily, there is only animosity. True, sometimes there's a marriage of the two, but truth be told, it can be quite boring! I once "assisted" an archaeologist in a Chinese fishing village, who followed me around as I showed him beeps, explained the TID of each, etc... But after a few swings over the first target, he planted a flag, and would not allow it to be dug (they would come back later with paint brushes, screens, photo it, gps it, blah blah blah. Know you know us md'rs, would just plop down and dig the sucker, right? I ended up flagging a few dozen signals, while he made copious notes of the TID, size (based on beep smear), etc... I suppose it took him a week to dig those.

I have heard of others who assisted in archie digs, and had the same deal go on. Nothing wrong with that, if that's your thing, but don't believe that you'll go out there and just practice beeping and digging as we're all accustomed too. A rare exception *might* be when an archie knows that they can't cover all the ground, and a place is about to be cemented over, etc... blah blah. In that case, I have had an archie agree to dig some random targets, on site, right then. But this is rare. Even in those "lost cause - might-as-well" cases, most archies will let the targets sit and rot, because, afterall, 3 centuries from now, a future archeologist, and future generations, can "enjoy" the items when future digs are done.

Although this is bleak, I still enjoy kissing up to archies though, sharing data, getting in the "in" circles, etc.... because it can reveal site tips Yup, sheep in wolves clothing 8) Oh well.

 

[rommelvon]

Here is a video where detectorist and archeologist get together in a massive hunt that is very beneficial to both parties

 

[jonw440]

Talk about an Army of detectorists!!
Looks like a great time!

rommelvon what a sweet looking GSD!
We have a 7 month old male named Rosco who is 75 lbs...so far!

Thats him when he was 4 months old with a friend of ours 3 yr old Son.

 

[Ocean7]

*L* well Archie's as we call them are as about anti-MD'ing as any single group on the planet. If they had their way, no single item would be removed from the ground unless by one of their own, and they'd rather see it rot then dug up by a TH'er. They have helped get laws passed prohibiting MD'ing on many lands owned by the government and surely cannot be looked upon as the friends of this hobby.

 

[rommelvon]

Talk about an Army of detectorists!!
Looks like a great time!

rommelvon what a sweet looking GSD!

Thanks, he just turned 4, he detects with me, beautiful GSD you have there as well.....awesome dogs!

 

[rayredditch]

Over here, some prefer to see the item lost or destroyed rather than have someone other than an archie dig it up. I´m in the local Museum society, and we found half of a seal on building site (Eyes only), so we rang the archies and told them (It´s a known middle age high road, and scene of many battles), too which they replied, we haven´t got time, and we´re not really interested. So we asked if we could MD the site before it was totally ruined (As we also have our own town Museum, the archies being 40 miles away in another town). They said, no way, you´re not archeologists, and therefore have no right to search for artifacts (You need a permit for any MDíng over here). End of story, it´s now been dug down to 6 or 8 foot deep, for roads, foundations, drainage etc., and anything there is destroyed and scattered to the four winds. And we (Via taxes) pay them to look after our heritage, makes me want to bang my head on a wall.
HH Ray

 

[Bodyguard]

Kind of reminds me of what I read about the Dead Sea Scrolls. The are in the hands of "professional translators", and have been for years. Someone, possibly a group, using published photos of the scrolls, and the internet, translated quite a few pages, and published them all, citing that the "professionals" were taking too long. Of course the amateurs got SUED for their efforts. I don't remember how/if the situation was resolved.

 

[Tom_in_CA]

Ray, your situation reminds me of why I/we don't even talk to archies over here (except to mine for site tips ) Unless a site is owned by them (a current dig of their's going on at a site), we will not presume to put them in a position of authority, as if we needed to "ask" them.

Bodygaurd, as I recall the dead sea scrolls evolution, there is no coverup or conspiracy involved. When the news broke in the world of the discoverey, everyone and anyone was there to demand to riffle through them. You know, sects, religions, scholars of all different persuasions, etc.... all lined up demanding to be amongst the first to view them. There had to be order to the madness, lest stuff start "walking away" fragile stuff start crumbling, etc... Well you can guess what happens: Any one of those guys who got a "no, sorry, you're not qualified" or "no, you'll have to wait your turn, the current waiting list is 2 yrs", etc... stomps off grumbling CERTAIN there is a conspiracy, coverups, etc.... To this day, nearly 60 years later, those original person's grumblings at the process have sprouted into conspiracies, that refuse to go away. Put yourself in that govt's and finder's hands back then. What do YOU do with that amount of pressure and demanding researchers? You put order to the chaos, right? And the natural result is..... ?

 

[Lady_Huntress]

There is a real hostile tone with arch's and hunters I have noticed. This other friend of mine on treasureadventures.net is trying to have a polite conversation with a group of them and they are being complete jerks. It really seems there should be a middle ground, or maybe they jusy dont have anything better to do then to just knock hunters?

 

[rayredditch]

Some Archeologists are trying to work together with MDérs, but the vast majority are indoctrinated by their Hand in the Trouser pocket Professors, who see it not as the peoples heritage, but as their own private kingdom, and some of them have at home collections to rival the larger museums! These they have accidentally forgotten to record, or are still in the process of evaluation (After 30 or 40 years). We´ve had several cases in Europe where archies have died, and on clearing out the house have found all sorts of treasures that were reported as stolen or lost years before, or the daughter of one, who had original Roman statues as gifts from her father (Very large statues stood in the garden)!!
One law for them, another for us !!

 

[Bodyguard]

Bodygaurd, as I recall the dead sea scrolls evolution, there is no coverup or conspiracy involved. When the news broke in the world of the discoverey, everyone and anyone was there to demand to riffle through them. You know, sects, religions, scholars of all different persuasions, etc.... all lined up demanding to be amongst the first to view them. There had to be order to the madness, lest stuff start "walking away" fragile stuff start crumbling, etc... Well you can guess what happens: Any one of those guys who got a "no, sorry, you're not qualified" or "no, you'll have to wait your turn, the current waiting list is 2 yrs", etc... stomps off grumbling CERTAIN there is a conspiracy, coverups, etc.... To this day, nearly 60 years later, those original person's grumblings at the process have sprouted into conspiracies, that refuse to go away. Put yourself in that govt's and finder's hands back then. What do YOU do with that amount of pressure and demanding researchers? You put order to the chaos, right? And the natural result is..... ?

I never spoke of cover up or conspiracy.... I merely stated that the experts don't want to jeopardize their cushy job. These people are being paid excellent wages I am sure, and if someone else finds a way to do the job, without their "permission". The experts feel like they have been cheated. I am the last person in the world to deny the merits of education. But to sue someone for being productive, and I believe the non experts doing the translating were using already published photographs of the scrolls, because they did not have permission Come on... somebody is being ripped off, probably the taxpayers

 

[Ocean7]

There is a real hostile tone with arch's and hunters I have noticed. This other friend of mine on treasureadventures.net is trying to have a polite conversation with a group of them and they are being complete jerks. It really seems there should be a middle ground, or maybe they jusy dont have anything better to do then to just knock hunters?

well give them a sign that reads "BANG HEAD HERE"! Total waste of time!

 

[re-tek]

i work with an archie and p'd her off real good today when i told her that i had a treasure mag that explained how to go about getting permission to treasure hunt anywhere in mexico. oh man i got her fumed! i giggled and walked away while she festered.

darn right, they rather let it get bulldozed and dredged before letting us "amateurs" dig it up. i brought that up to her as we had a battle of morality and she couldnt explain her way out of it.

bunch of crap...

 

[cavers5]

Good grief! I'm entering the discussion with white flag already waving...ughh..frantically waving!

I'm an archaeologist and you're all right. Most archaeologists SUCK when it comes to listening to metal detectorists. And, believe me, there are some that consider it ETHICAL to treat metal detectorists like criminals and that includes ENTRAPMENT! So, all of you beware when you do talk to archaeologists.

Whew! However, that being said, let me say that I'm a caver and metal detectorist and that comes before my archaeology. It was because I was a caver and metal detectorist that I even got into archaeology! My fellow cavers and I were finding all kinds of cool stuff, burial tombs, etc and wanted to make sure that these places and artifacts were recorded for prosperity.

Yep, I had to wake up and smell the shi?!!!! I have my M.A. in archaeology and believe me, after dealing with some of the academias in KY and TN, you couldn't pay me to tell them where these places and artifacts are. I sincerely believe that they would lie, steal, cheat, etc to get their hands on this stuff and try to further their own name without giving proper credit where its due. I've already suffered this to happen to me once. That was enough. It won't happen again, if I can help it!

So, what can detectorists, esp. one like myself who is considered to be on the wrong side of the fence, do? Well, it's an all-out war. There are good archaeologists and bad archaeologists just like there are good detectorists and bad detectorists. Find the good archaeologists (I will pray there are at least two or three in your state!) and work with them, if you want to or need to.

If metal detectorists would just do one thing, it would help. If you have sites that you are done with or even that you want to be recorded for future generations to know about, then fill out a site form. It's a relatively painless process and although somewhat intimidating at first, it can be done. It's just paperwork. Granted we all hate paperwork, but it needs to be done. If you don't want to file the forms with your local or state archaeology office, then file them at your home and when you're dead and gone, WILL them to the local or state office! This may seem like an amusing request, but it might would help bridge the gap for future detectorists and archaeologists.

Serious detectorists keep notes and journals anyhow! It would not take much more to fill out site forms.

My two cents worth..

"Curtsey...off-stage left..white flag still frantically waving!" (just my sense of humor showing up!)
Cavers5

 

[Ocean7]

well I wouldn't help an Archie find anything. The only purpose that would serve is to further their 'agenda', & give them more ammo to shut down all MD'ing! That just doesn't make any sense whatsoever.

My advise to the wise - stay clear or lose your hobby!

 

[eagle77]

The archies I've ran into seem to have this personna that they 'know it all' and you don't. While on vacation the archies were working an old military fort. A friend and I was watching them screen out iron relics from one of the barracks, they found an old door hasp. They thought it was the coolest thing in the world, I piped up that you can still by the same designed hasp at most farm hardware stores. They found other items and had no clue what they were until we told'em.

I've ran into a few archies that cavers5 described. I've been also been burned by the Historical Society membership, they view us in the same category as the archies do. The only way I would even consider helping them is with a written contract.

 

[RON (PA)]

I would definitely like to work with one or a group of them. I think it would be a very interesting experience. We could both learn a lot from each other. Just my 2 cents.

 

[rayredditch]

We could, but they mostly won´t let us, no matter how much we ask (Or even plead).
There are a few that do though.