Winklevoss Twins on Bitcoin

I have serious doubts it will ever supplant gold. Humans have hoarded gold since time immemorial. We are drawn to the shine. It’s coded into our DNA. But people’s willingness to dismiss it because they don’t understand the premise behind it is pure folly. It’s the future because it addresses some of the issues inherent in our current and historical monetary systems. The underlying structure, the blockchain, has application across industries and that is where the real value lies.
 

Alt coins are where the money is being made right now. Buy them cheap on kucoin or crytopia and wait fir them to get dropped on binance or bittrex. Also pump and dump groups are good if you have fast fingers. 2-3 pumps a week with a chance to make 100%-200% roi.

Trx was a major let down but could still bounce back. Xlm is good. Cnd did very well today. Xrp is ok but you arent buying coins. Only tokens.
Fyi do your trading with eth for cheaper fees or bnb on binance for 50% cheaper fees. Day trading using btc will kill your money fast. If you guys wanna cash out, coinbase is still working but obviously is not the best idea because its all recorded. Another option is to get one of the new btc debit cards and use a fake mame. Then head to a btc atm or i think even a regular atm and take out your daily limit.

If anyone wants to join the discord pump and dump group heres my affiliate link. Lots of good crypto advice as well in the chat.

Https://discord.gg/3fXde5
 

Yep that's the way to do it. Play the system for yourself and learn the strategies but get your principle back out asap and put that into silver, and make regular withdraws so it's a lesser risk, that's my opinion but I'm a nobody.
The pump and dump is the way to go with this and it's too early to count on it being any kind of long term storage but I could be wrong. We will know in a few thousand years.
I just say silver cuz its cheap but do something with the winnings. Don't get greedy!
 

SultansOfSwing said:
Alt coins are where the money is being made right now. Buy them cheap on kucoin or crytopia and wait fir them to get dropped on binance or bittrex. Also pump and dump groups are good if you have fast fingers. 2-3 pumps a week with a chance to make 100%-200% roi.

Trx was a major let down but could still bounce back. Xlm is good. Cnd did very well today. Xrp is ok but you arent buying coins. Only tokens.
Fyi do your trading with eth for cheaper fees or bnb on binance for 50% cheaper fees. Day trading using btc will kill your money fast. If you guys wanna cash out, coinbase is still working but obviously is not the best idea because its all recorded. Another option is to get one of the new btc debit cards and use a fake mame. Then head to a btc atm or i think even a regular atm and take out your daily limit.

If anyone wants to join the discord pump and dump group heres my affiliate link. Lots of good crypto advice as well in the chat.

Https://discord.gg/3fXde5
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There are also a few places you can buy gold with BTC. That’s my exit strategy. Just to bring this whole conversation full circle. And gold is beautifully easy to unload.
 

Madmox said:
There are also a few places you can buy gold with BTC. That’s my exit strategy. Just to bring this whole conversation full circle. And gold is beautifully easy to unload.
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Almost yes. Jm bullion and Apmex utilize bitpay to allow you to buy PMs with bitcoin. Bitpay does the conversion amd takes a percentage. The day either of those companies accept straight crypto will be a monumental day.
 

Bitcoin (and the rest of them) are Ponzi schemes. Those who get in at the beginning get rich, but the rest will get taken.

Any "currency" that loses half it's value in a couple of months isn't a stable "currency" and shouldn't be invested in, imo.
 

I like Veldt and Vaultoro. Veldt because as I recall they accept etherium and litecoin and btc.
 

FreeBirdTim said:
Bitcoin (and the rest of them) are Ponzi schemes.
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I'm not sure that you understand how either cryptocurrencies or Ponzi schemes work.

FreeBirdTim said:
Any "currency" that loses half it's value in a couple of months isn't a stable "currency" and shouldn't be invested in, imo.
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Any "currency" in use by any major government today is fiat and is based on the public's perception that it's worth something. That dollar bill in your pocket is a piece of (admittedly good quality) paper with George Washington's face on it. The money in your bank account is one's and zero's. It's all worth what we agree that it's worth, but it's not valuable unless we agree that it is.

Of course, the same can be said for precious metals, diamonds (a heavily manipulated market), or any commodity really. Gold has commercial uses, but does it have practical uses for you or I? No. It looks nice and it's hard to extract from the environment. Beyond that, we agree that it's worth something, but only because of the context. If you were out in a desert for a few days without food or water and I gave you the choice between a $1000 gold ingot, $10,000 in dollar bills, a $300,000 house, and a $1 bottle of water, which would you pick first?

The fact that you believe that an unstable currency should not be invested in hints that you don't have a firm grasp of investing in currency. Money is made by buying low and selling high. If there are no lows and no highs, how does one profit? Discounting obvious garbage coins that will never go anywhere, some people look at those price oscillations and get scared. They shouldn't invest in this market. Others look at those price oscillations, get an idea of where the peaks and dips are, and then set their buy and sell limits appropriately. The software handles the rest, with panic buyers and sellers providing the income.

Somewhat ironically, if there were no inexperienced or uneducated investors playing with crypto, there would be no whales manipulating the prices, the prices would remain stable, cryptos would make more sense as actual currency, and investment would stop. It's a very interesting market.
 

Dave Rishar said:
I'm not sure that you understand how either cryptocurrencies or Ponzi schemes work.



Any "currency" in use by any major government today is fiat and is based on the public's perception that it's worth something. That dollar bill in your pocket is a piece of (admittedly good quality) paper with George Washington's face on it. The money in your bank account is one's and zero's. It's all worth what we agree that it's worth, but it's not valuable unless we agree that it is.

Of course, the same can be said for precious metals, diamonds (a heavily manipulated market), or any commodity really. Gold has commercial uses, but does it have practical uses for you or I? No. It looks nice and it's hard to extract from the environment. Beyond that, we agree that it's worth something, but only because of the context. If you were out in a desert for a few days without food or water and I gave you the choice between a $1000 gold ingot, $10,000 in dollar bills, a $300,000 house, and a $1 bottle of water, which would you pick first?

The fact that you believe that an unstable currency should not be invested in hints that you don't have a firm grasp of investing in currency. Money is made by buying low and selling high. If there are no lows and no highs, how does one profit? Discounting obvious garbage coins that will never go anywhere, some people look at those price oscillations and get scared. They shouldn't invest in this market. Others look at those price oscillations, get an idea of where the peaks and dips are, and then set their buy and sell limits appropriately. The software handles the rest, with panic buyers and sellers providing the income.

Somewhat ironically, if there were no inexperienced or uneducated investors playing with crypto, there would be no whales manipulating the prices, the prices would remain stable, cryptos would make more sense as actual currency, and investment would stop. It's a very interesting market.
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A well reasoned and succinct response!
 

I think cryptos are unfortunately the way of the future. It will be a long process and pointing out the current flaws is pretty pointless. Tnet is a fun place to talk about it cause a lot of people are into the total opposite of it here yet are also into profiting, have old-school ideas yet spend time on message boards. In the grander scheme of things I would rather find an old silver ring in the sand or pan a nice nug out my creek than spend too much time on my laptop and end up filthy stinking rich. But that's just me. I do trade currenies, I do have cryptos, but I still love gold. It will never be replaced by any currency.......maybe slightly devalued but never replaced.
 

Thaddeus said:
I think cryptos are unfortunately the way of the future. It will be a long process and pointing out the current flaws is pretty pointless.
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Why is this unfortunate?

What are the flaws (from the point of a consumer)? The flaws from the point of view of a government’s central bank are obvious, but their interests are not in line with mine nor probably yours.
 

Dave Rishar said:
Why is this unfortunate?

What are the flaws (from the point of a consumer)? The flaws from the point of view of a government’s central bank are obvious, but their interests are not in line with mine nor probably yours.
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The flaw is that it has zero stability. Govt currency has no intrinsicly backed value, but it has the backing of a country. National currencies fluccuate against each other, but in small amounts over long time. BC just lost almost 50% of value within days. So today your BC may buy you a car and tomorrow it may buy you a gallon of milk. That would be pretty unfortunate to never know if you can pay your bills from your next paycheck because your company decided to pay employees in a crypto-currency.
 

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Jason hit the nail on the head. If the dollar lost half it's value in a few months, panic would set in. Why would you think Bitcoin is any different? Bitcoin is not a safe currency if it fluctuates that much.

And I have a very firm grasp on speculators in any market. They can't make money unless stocks, commodities or currencies fluctuate. Stability is the kiss of death for short sellers and speculators. That's why we're going to have a huge correction in the stock market soon. The shorts aren't making enough money right now, so they need to trigger a "correction" in the market to get the ball rolling again.

Dave, even you called it an "unstable" currency. Sorry, but only a fool would bet their future on Bitcoin or any of the other so-called currencies. And the fact that so many Bitcoin speculators are trying so hard to convince more suckers to invest in it worries me even more. That is the classic sign of a pyramid scheme or a Ponzi scheme. Count me out.
 

Here's what Warren Buffett had to say about Bitcoin and the other "currencies". When Warren Buffett talks, I listen.

 

Jason in Enid said:
The flaw is that it has zero stability.
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For now, yes. But crypto is not yet the way of the future mentioned above - that will require more stability, which I think most would agree will happen eventually.

What are some other flaws?
 

Dave Rishar said:
For now, yes. But crypto is not yet the way of the future mentioned above - that will require more stability, which I think most would agree will happen eventually.

What are some other flaws?
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Well, I'm certainly not a crypto currency expert so I don't know what other problems they may or may not have. Cryptos are popular right now because government cant track them, YET. I'm sure in the future, especially as they become more widely accepted the govt will find a way to track their movement just like they do with all the digital cash tracking through the banks today. They'll find a way to seize it from you at their discretion or will outlaw it.
 

1) It's a fantasy currency. Nothing to back up the alleged "value" (gold, government backing, etc.).

2) The inventor has 1 million shares. If he dumps his shares, Bitcoin will crash. Evener scarier than that, no one knows who the inventor of Bitcoin is and he's disappeared off the face of the earth.

3) Who's regulating it? I don't see how you can invest in something that's not regulated.

4) Bitcoin seems like a good way to launder money. The government will eventually figure this out and regulate it to death (Patriot Act, etc.).

5) Hackers will eventually find a way to steal it (already happened) and you'll be out of luck, since it's not regulated by anyone.

Bottom line, I hope you make a ton of cash off of it, but it's just WAY too risky right now.
 

FreeBirdTim said:
Dave, even you called it an "unstable" currency. Sorry, but only a fool would bet their future on Bitcoin or any of the other so-called currencies. And the fact that so many Bitcoin speculators are trying so hard to convince more suckers to invest in it worries me even more. That is the classic sign of a pyramid scheme or a Ponzi scheme. Count me out.
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Who’s betting their future? I would only ever bet what I can afford to lose. That rule stands for any investment, but I’m fairly conservative with my money.

Also, you’re still using some terms incorrectly. I would have thought that you at least would have fact-checked me when I implied that you didn’t know what you were talking about earlier, but that’s the internet. Anyway, here’s a link: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pyramid_scheme

Are crypto currencies pyramid or Ponzi schemes? I can’t account for every single one that’s out there, but generally no. Bitcoin certainly isn’t. Is the crypto speculation market a potentially hazardous place teeming with hackers, crazy people, unscrupulous scammers, North Korean and Chinese miners, and blatant market manipulation? Certainly. That’s actually why I’m looking forward to what comes next, as crypto can’t really function as a currency for consumers until things settle down.

The genie is out of the bottle though. There’s no putting it back in. Some currencies have government support, the banks have their altcoin picked out (albeit not decentralized and therefore not a true crypto currency in my opinion), and now crypto ATMs are becoming a thing. Even if every government in the world decided to ban all crypto tomorrow (and that’s probably not possible, as some are in the process of introducing their own), you would need to get rid of the internet to remove them entirely. The only questions that I still have are which ones will still be around in 10 years, and how will global commerce change in order to accommodate them?

Also, don’t get too focused on bitcoin specifically. It validated the concept and some folks still use it to trade for altcoins, but it’s dated and very clunky in operation. It would never have been a good currency. Even the drug dealers don’t use it anymore. There are newer and better currencies in use now.

In that sense that it’s not going away, I’d say that it’s the future. I don’t see the gold rush of speculative trading extending past 2019 though.
 

Bitcoin was meant to be an alternative to our current financial system and if you REALLY understand our current system (past and present), the fundamentals of crypto currency repair a lot of the broken pieces. It's not a fantasy currency, it's real and it's embracement by major institutions should be a wake up call to the haters. One million shares of Bitcoin being dumped would by no means crash Bitcoin, lower the price...yes, but only temporarily. Hackers have stolen coins from the exchanges and personal wallets, the block chain has never been hacked and most likely never will. It would be more cost effective for a hacker that wants to hack the block to just invest in the mining equipment and mine for Bitcoins.

Here's something that some of you may not know, if you want to invest in Bitcoin (or any alternative coin), you don't have to buy a full coin to play. Using Bitcoin as an example, one can purchase as little as one hundred millionth of a bitcoin.
 

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