What happened to Whites as industry leader?

[CC_IN_CA]

I have been out of the hobby a number of years and recently looking at new machines. I have owned over a dozen machines and almost all of them Whites. The newer Teknetics, Garrett, and Fisher machines seem to out class Whites in the $700 range in depth and recovery speed. Some brands seem to be clones of other brands now. Is that the case?


Has Whites fallen behind?

What is best coin shooting land machine in $700 range in your opinion?

What really impresses me is recovery speed on these newer Teknetics machines. Its lightning fast allowing detection of targets in heavy garbage areas. I played a newer Whites Coinmaster and its recovery speed was awful. Surprised its sold today. Is this the case with other Whites detectors?

 

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[Tahts-a-dats-ago]

I can speak only about my own experiences, which are limited to the machines I've owned.

I don't believe Whites has fallen behind. Whites may not have the market share they once did (I don't know one way or the other) but I consider Whites to be a leader in their field.

Whites has serious competitors though, and I'm glad for that: it drives the manufacturers to make better machines and helps keep costs (to the consumer) lower than they would be (without competition).

My own bias – and we all have some bias – is in favor of Whites (and their machines). I like the machines, I like the service, and I like the company. I like the machines made by other companies too; but I prefer the Whites machines.

I have owned higher-end machines from Minelab. They're fine machines, but they weren't for me (they didn't click with me – I much preferred the V3i). The V3i isn't a super fast (recovery) machine – not nearly as fast as the Tek G2 – but I like the V3i better and I have had more success with the V3i. (I do wish I had kept the G2 though)

Other than the Tek G2 I haven't owned any of the other company's $700 machines. I did find the G2 to be a fast machine and it was enjoyable to use. It was lightweight and the ergonomics were a good fit for me. I sold it only because I thought I had to have a CTX 3030 – turns out I was wrong.

The only Fisher I've owned was the F4. It too was a fast machine. Lots of people have had great success with their F4, but it didn't do it for me. I probably didn't give it enough of a chance, but I'm not sorry that I no longer own it.

I've never owned a Garrett machine (other than a pin-pointer – which I like). I have seen the AT Pro up close and in-person though (I have not used one). The machine doesn't appeal to me – I don't like the screen at all (too small for my not-so-good eyes).

The Whites MX5 isn't a $700 machine (about $549 retail) but I'm assuming it falls in the category you're interested in. It is a fast machine and easy to swing. The ergonomics are great (IMO) and I like the interface. It also goes deep; enough so that I think it will hold its own (assuming the coils are roughly the same size) against the AT Pro. It might not get the depth of the higher end F75 and T2, but I suspect it won't be very far behind them.

I haven't owned the MX Sport long enough to really voice my opinion. I do find the ergonomics to be good, but can't tell you much beside that (only owned it for a week or so). From what I've seen (online) it will go deeper than the AT Pro and it is a fast machine.

The fastest machine (that I've used) is the Tesoro Compadre. It retails for $160 (give or take a few bucks) but it's no toy. The recovery speed is incredible – and the machine is loads of fun. I'm not exaggerating: using the Compadre brings a smile to my face every time.

For me the recovery speed of a detector is not unlike camera pixels – not meaningless, but not nearly as important as it would seem. While it is entertaining to see how fast the Compadre can differentiate between targets, the truth of the matter is that all of the machines (I own) can differentiate between targets. I just have to swing some machines a bit slower.

My own opinion is – take it with a grain of salt – that coil size and knowing your machine matter more than the speed of the machine. I never swing the Compadre as fast as it could be swung, because I don't find it comfortable to hunt that way. I prefer to “hear” every square inch as I mosey along. It just works for me.

I guess I could be considered a loyalist to Whites machines. While such a statement would be partially true, it's also partially incorrect: I'd buy another brand's machine in a heartbeat if/when I thought doing so would benefit me in some manner. In fact I fully intend to purchase another Tesoro in the near future (heck, I'd buy one of every machine from every manufacturer if I could afford it).

For coin shooting (which is what I mostly do) machines in the $700 range, I'd look at the two Whites machines I already own (plus the M6 and/or the MX Pro) or the Tesoro Outlaw (or the Vaquero or Mojave) or the Fisher F70 (or F75) or the Tek 8500 ( or G2+).

Of course I want them all, but I ended up choosing the Whites machines because they were the best machines for me. They may not be the best machines for you – but only you can figure that out.

I wish you luck in finding the best machine for you.

Happy hunting.

 

[CC_IN_CA]

I can speak only about my own experiences, which are limited to the machines I've owned.

I don't believe Whites has fallen behind. Whites may not have the market share they once did (I don't know one way or the other) but I consider Whites to be a leader in their field.

...

I wish you luck in finding the best machine for you.

Happy hunting.

Thanks for your input. I appreciate your help figuring out the current market. I was a strong Whites believer for a long time, but not sure Whites is still on top of the market today. My biggest requirement is lightweight due to back problems. The Whites TreasurePro and Coinmaster are only ones that could work, and I'm not happy with those choices.

I kept a loose check on things. I vaguely recall someone revived the Teknetics brand after years of being a non-player. It seems that group has infused same technology into Fisher and perhaps Bounty Hunter and Garrett. All four brands have very lightweight and powerful machines.

Here are the machines I have owned in chronological order:
Bounty Hunter - gold anodized BFO
Whites 6000Di Series 3
Whites silver eagle
Whites XLT
Whites Quantum XT
Minelab Sovereign
Minelab Excalibur
Whites XLT (2nd one)
Whites GoldMaster II
Whites GoldMaster III
Tesoro Conquistador
Whites Prizm V

It seems most of current Whites are older style heavy machines, while everyone else is going lightweight. As boomers get older you would hope Whites would upgrade to accommodate the older folks out there. I'll try to get my hands on a TreasurePro to test, but the other options are might tempting. Saw below video on youtube of a Fisher F70 double-d 6 1/2" coil air testing a nickel at 13 inches! Things have changed! Not sure this one is best choice, but unbelievable compared to past machines.

Saw Teknetics youtube video demonstrating ability to pull good signal out of rusty nails that was unbelievable. That super fast recovery speed was amazing. Is that unique to Teknetics? V3i maybe, but its heavy and expensive.

 

[masterjedi]

I love my Whites MXT All Pro... Its amazing and deep...
I also love my Fisher F75SEDST... its deep and fast and great in iron...
I also love my Etrac... its has the best ID a depth and is a coin monster...

Its like fishing... you have to have more than 1 pole or you wont catch all of the fish...
If its all about weight get a DEUS... super light beep and dig machine, fast and great in iron...

Like the previous post. Whites may not have the market share they once had but they still rock!
Look at the new MX Sport waterproof detector...

Hope you find what your looking for.

Gary from Oregon

 

[Tahts-a-dats-ago]

...

I kept a loose check on things. I vaguely recall someone revived the Teknetics brand after years of being a non-player. It seems that group has infused same technology into Fisher and perhaps Bounty Hunter and Garrett. All four brands have very lightweight and powerful machines.

....

It seems most of current Whites are older style heavy machines, while everyone else is going lightweight. As boomers get older you would hope Whites would upgrade to accommodate the older folks out there. I'll try to get my hands on a TreasurePro to test, but the other options are might tempting. Saw below video on youtube of a Fisher F70 double-d 6 1/2" coil air testing a nickel at 13 inches! Things have changed! Not sure this one is best choice, but unbelievable compared to past machines.

Saw Teknetics youtube video demonstrating ability to pull good signal out of rusty nails that was unbelievable. That super fast recovery speed was amazing. Is that unique to Teknetics? V3i maybe, but its heavy and expensive.

I believe one company (First Texas) owns Bounty Hunter, Teknetics, and Fisher. I believe Garretts is a different company altogether. Based upon my experience with the G2 (and the F4) I have to concur with your thoughts: they make very lightweight and powerful machines.

Whites has two lightweight machines in the F70/AT Pro price range: the MX 5 and the MX Sport. I'd guess that the MX 5 is roughly the same weight as the F70/AT Pro and it is probably close to them with regards to recovery speed (having not used either the F70 or the AT Pro, I must guess and could well be wrong). I believe the MX Sport is probably a pound heavier than the F70 and slightly heavier than the AT Pro. I'd guess that the MX Sport is faster (recovery) than the AT Pro and every bit as fast as the F70 (again, I'm just guessing).

There are always trade-offs though.

The F70 — from what I've seen/read online — is wicked fast and deep. It is also very lightweight and reasonably sturdy (especially when the light weight is considered). It isn't waterproof though.

The AT Pro — from what I've seen/read online is a good all-around detector that can go in the water. My own opinion is that the screen is far too small for my aging eyes.

The MX 5 — lightweight machine with very fast recovery. It is a very sturdy machine too. It is “weatherproof” (not waterproof) which I take to mean it can handle being used in the rain. It is a threshold machine, so you'll have some noise. The ground balance is auto and cannot be locked. I believe it is no longer in production (beginning of 2017).

The MX Sport — probably the heaviest of the 4 machines mentioned. It is lightweight, wicked fast and deep. I can't tell you much more than that because I haven't used it enough to really know. I believe it is the most expensive of the 4 machines mentioned. It is waterproof to 10 feet.

Swing a MX 5 and the MX Sport at your local Whites dealer; I think you'll find that Whites is still very much in the game. (I'd try out the other brands too — find out which one is the right machine for you)

I did see that Teknetics is coming out with 3 new machines (sometime in March). One of those new machines (the Patriot, I believe) seems to be a F70 with some new paint — and a $200 discount from the cost of the F70. That machine sure has my attention.

Tesoro has their new Mojave out too. At a mere $251.10 it looks to be a souped-up Compadre coupled with a new coil. The reviews are fantastic so far — enough so that it seems the company can't keep up with the demand. I'd guess that it is lighter in weight than even the F70, and faster too. No display though and I'd be shocked if the Mojave went as deep as the F70.

I have no doubt about the ability of various Teknetics machines pulling coins out of areas loaded with rusty nails. The G2 could do it with ease, but so can the Euro Tek Pro (entry level machine from Teknetics). With the exception of the Beach Hunter 300 (coil is far too large) every machine I own can pull coins out of the nails — the Compadre excels at it. (Most of the places I hunt have tons of nails and other trash).

I think you'd be very pleased with any of the mid-range lightweight machines out there. They're all good machines and they'll all sniff coins out of nails. Put a small coil on them and they'll all shine.

Happy hunting and let us know which machine you choose.

 

[wingmaster]

You won't do any better for depth than the White's MXT I've detected with people who use the V3i and the E-trac before and the MXT is just as deep with the right coil, some people try to compare one with a 6" coil against one with a 10" or bigger coil and that's not a fair comparison. Find a good used one and save a lot of money as well, just make sure and check it out to make sure it works good and if you ever do have a problem White's has always been good on price to fix one. I think they still work on their older ones as well, I wouldn't trade my MXT for three of any other detector. HH

 

[chowder]

You won't do any better for depth than the White's MXT I've detected with people who use the V3i and the E-trac before and the MXT is just as deep with the right coil, some people try to compare one with a 6" coil against one with a 10" or bigger coil and that's not a fair comparison. Find a good used one and save a lot of money as well, just make sure and check it out to make sure it works good and if you ever do have a problem White's has always been good on price to fix one. I think they still work on their older ones as well, I wouldn't trade my MXT for three of any other detector. HH

Totally agree, especially when they show air tests, and try to relate the test to real world detecting.

 

[De.Digger]

​Ive gotta say the best machine out there is the machine that you know how to use.

 

[CC_IN_CA]

Happy hunting and let us know which machine you choose.

After researching, I'm leaning towards Eurotek Pro. Its about to be re-released as Ameritek Minuteman mid-March and should be an even better value. Still hard to beat the value at $219. With this kind of performance at such a low price, why not. It has extremely fast recovery, great separation, big VDI numbers, 0-99 discrimination increments, 3 tone, and very lightweight. I won't miss the coin indicators or lack of notch. Down side is set ground balance, but price jump for that is substantial. I think its a good choice to get back into the hobby. Wish Whites were competitive at this level.

 

[Twinkletoes]

Good luck with whatever you buy! Post your finds! Tt

 

[sutphin]

HECK I HAD A RADIO SHACK DETECTOR AND FOUND A MOTORCYCLE PLATE FROM 1900s AND THOUGHT AS JUNK . PUT IT ON EBAY FOR 25.00 AND HONEST FELLA TOLD ME WHAT IT WAS REALLY WORTH AND BOUGHT IT FOR 1800.00....

 

[GreenMeanie]

My arm says the mx sport isn't light weight or the balance is wrong on it.

I believe one company (First Texas) owns Bounty Hunter, Teknetics, and Fisher. I believe Garretts is a different company altogether. Based upon my experience with the G2 (and the F4) I have to concur with your thoughts: they make very lightweight and powerful machines.

Whites has two lightweight machines in the F70/AT Pro price range: the MX 5 and the MX Sport. I'd guess that the MX 5 is roughly the same weight as the F70/AT Pro and it is probably close to them with regards to recovery speed (having not used either the F70 or the AT Pro, I must guess and could well be wrong). I believe the MX Sport is probably a pound heavier than the F70 and slightly heavier than the AT Pro. I'd guess that the MX Sport is faster (recovery) than the AT Pro and every bit as fast as the F70 (again, I'm just guessing).

There are always trade-offs though.

The F70 — from what I've seen/read online — is wicked fast and deep. It is also very lightweight and reasonably sturdy (especially when the light weight is considered). It isn't waterproof though.

The AT Pro — from what I've seen/read online is a good all-around detector that can go in the water. My own opinion is that the screen is far too small for my aging eyes.

The MX 5 — lightweight machine with very fast recovery. It is a very sturdy machine too. It is “weatherproof” (not waterproof) which I take to mean it can handle being used in the rain. It is a threshold machine, so you'll have some noise. The ground balance is auto and cannot be locked. I believe it is no longer in production (beginning of 2017).

The MX Sport — probably the heaviest of the 4 machines mentioned. It is lightweight, wicked fast and deep. I can't tell you much more than that because I haven't used it enough to really know. I believe it is the most expensive of the 4 machines mentioned. It is waterproof to 10 feet.

Swing a MX 5 and the MX Sport at your local Whites dealer; I think you'll find that Whites is still very much in the game. (I'd try out the other brands too — find out which one is the right machine for you)

I did see that Teknetics is coming out with 3 new machines (sometime in March). One of those new machines (the Patriot, I believe) seems to be a F70 with some new paint — and a $200 discount from the cost of the F70. That machine sure has my attention.

Tesoro has their new Mojave out too. At a mere $251.10 it looks to be a souped-up Compadre coupled with a new coil. The reviews are fantastic so far — enough so that it seems the company can't keep up with the demand. I'd guess that it is lighter in weight than even the F70, and faster too. No display though and I'd be shocked if the Mojave went as deep as the F70.

I have no doubt about the ability of various Teknetics machines pulling coins out of areas loaded with rusty nails. The G2 could do it with ease, but so can the Euro Tek Pro (entry level machine from Teknetics). With the exception of the Beach Hunter 300 (coil is far too large) every machine I own can pull coins out of the nails — the Compadre excels at it. (Most of the places I hunt have tons of nails and other trash).

I think you'd be very pleased with any of the mid-range lightweight machines out there. They're all good machines and they'll all sniff coins out of nails. Put a small coil on them and they'll all shine.

Happy hunting and let us know which machine you choose.

 

[Twinkletoes]

My arm says the mx sport isn't light weight or the balance is wrong on it.

The MX Sport only weighs 4 pounds compared to the Minelab CTX3030 which weights 5.2 pounds. Must be the balance...I guess...maybe...I think. Tt

 

[Deft Tones]

5.2 pounds is the machine you have listed. Balanced or not, at the end of the day you've still been carrying around 5.2 pounds.

I've never swung either. Just thoughts.

 

[Rick K]

Many's the slip between the cup and the lip - and between a patent and a ready to market metal detector somebody needs to expend 10's of man-years of engineering and millions of dollars. Sadly, it seems that Whites has neither of these critical resources available at present.

 

[oredigger62]

Not sure if all those patents actually mean much. Pulse induction for example. Minelab has had them for years even in the 1990's when Whites had a patent. Target ID... most brands have it... the list could go on. My first relic machine was a Whites 4900 DiPro XL and it was great at the time. The spectrum XLT was the cream of the crop at the time. My buddy was digging barber dimes at 15 inches with his Fisher. With today's technology all the big names are very close in product lines for the most part. If weight is a real issue think about one with a hip mount and then all you have is the weight of the coil and shaft. I am not brand loyal , but my Garrett GTI 2500 has me digging some holes deeper than i wish to dig. But it is not the lightest machine by any means. In the end they make different brands just like they do cars , because not everybody likes the same thing. White's is good , as are many others. Maybe you should hook up with a local club and test drive an assortment of machines to see what feels right to you. Just my opinion.

 

[Wayfarer]

You won't do any better for depth than the White's MXT I've detected with people who use the V3i and the E-trac before and the MXT is just as deep with the right coil, some people try to compare one with a 6" coil against one with a 10" or bigger coil and that's not a fair comparison. Find a good used one and save a lot of money as well, just make sure and check it out to make sure it works good and if you ever do have a problem White's has always been good on price to fix one. I think they still work on their older ones as well, I wouldn't trade my MXT for three of any other detector. HH

My MXT goes as deep as my V3i, both in the air and in the ground. I've done a fair bit of comparison between the two, including swapping out the exact same coil on each machine. VLF detector technology pretty much topped out 20 years or so ago and there haven't been any big breakthroughs, just adding bells and whistles. The V3i is loaded down with them, which makes it a fun machine to tinker around with, but at the end of the day, the MXT performs as well and gets as many keepers as the V3i. This is coming from a guy who owns both and with lots of time on both detectors.

So IMHO on the original question, all the big brands have stagnated for the most part, and I don't think White's is really outclassed, they just haven't done any updates or come out with new machines (except the MX Sport which is a rehashed MXT) lately. Give someone a mid-upper end machine from any of the big manufacturers and once they learn that machine's quirks, they'll be doing about as well as with any decent machine.

If there's not going to be any big breakthrough for awhile, which is probably a safe bet, the manufacturers ought to really focus on tweaking their existing designs. White's ought to spend some time really squeezing the most out of the V3i which I think is an awesome detector, just needs a little more polishing of the firmware to make it more responsive, especially in the Disc audio. If they did a really well-thought out update of the V3i, they could ride that another 5 or so years while they quietly work away on the next big thing.

 

[DirtDiggerDaveinMD]

White's has been around for a long time and the company has seen many detector outfits come and go over the years, yet they're still standing strong in the market. I have had tried other brands, but I always come back to White's. They make solid, well built machines that just work.

 

[☠ Cipher]

Anyone have any recommended settings for the MX Sport? New to the machine. Want to get the most out of it

 

[luvsdux]

I don't have access to the number of sales etc., but imho the most significant thing on discussing Whites in the market place is comparing how many companies have come along over the last few years that didn't even exist when Whites was the definite leader. For many years the only two companies most had ever heard of was either Whites or Garretts.
luvsdux