Unearthed war relics from Africa

[boertjie]

This is a follow-up posting on Boer war relics unearthed in Northen Natal some time ago.

This pic shows 2 nicely preserved Lee-Enfield cartridges, Mauser and Martini Henry cartridges and a Quedes (?) spent cartridge case.



1/2 penny coin dated 1899 found at British camp dump site



British artillery tunic buttons



I found this US button at the site but I am not aware of any US involvement in the Boer War. This button looks as of military origin. Can someone help with this? I include a pic of backside as well.




In this pic you can see British pith helmet top ventilators (wheels), brass button cleaner plate with stamped military ID number, webbing clasps, cavalry straps clasps and brass tent hooks



Tooth brush, shaving blade and spoon with ID number stamped



Bayonet scabbards, tent peg and steel heels for boots.



British water canteen and 2 kinds of mess tins



Spurs, steel brush for horses and saddle parts



Very interesting find: button of Essex Imperial Yeomanry



British pipe with "DUBLIN" written on it

 

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[ivan salis]

metal shortages could account for the brass vs lead wheels as copper and brass are both vital to the war efforts maybe they swithed to lead---on the pith helmets --the vents are a pain to use so many guys tended "yanked" them out --it provided better venting that way since helmets of any kind tend to get hot ---brits in diego garica (were i spent a good deal of time at wore old "military surplus" style pith helments and did this quite often to them as I recall---folks who wore the pith helmets seemed to hate these wheel type vents for some reason--if that makes any sense to you.---ivan

 

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[CRUSADER]

All the British Buttons he has pictured have Victoria's Crown on the top of them. Making them Victorian. These we NEVER used in WWI.

Hi Crusader

You seem to be much knowledgable on Victorian matters ; Do you know what is "Imperial Yeomanry", on the one button that I found?

thanks
boertjie

Only that they were formed in 1902.

http://www.regiments.org/regiments/uk/volmil-england/vcav/essex.htm

 

[boertjie]

wow! very intresting! Where you have found it?? in the field or in the trench?

Hello Nahabit

Most of the items were found in a British camp dump site but some on the surface.

Did you know their was a small volunteer Russian contingent fighting with the Boers in 1899-1902?

I saw some of your posts on ww2 finds, very very interesting

regards
boertjie

I have seen your ww2 findings; super stuff.

 

[ivan salis]

the great seal button is so named after the great seal of the united states after which the design was fashioned---first issued in 1902 on enlisted mens coating---so basically it was issued it was issued more or less after the boer war however it could have been an "observer" if he was issued it and went striaght over in 1902 highly unlikely but possible---most likely ot was lost by a enlisted service man in either WW1 or WW2 who was poking about the battle site or off a military jacket by some one who got a US military jacket some how---I find it quite odd that the yeoman button group also has a 1902 "form" up date also---hummm--Ivan

 

[boertjie]

the great seal button is so named after the great seal of the united states after which the design was fashioned---first issued in 1902 on enlisted mens coating---so it was issued after the boer war---most likey lost by a enlisted service man in either WW1 or WW2 who was poking about the battle site or off a military jacket by some one who got a US military jacket some how---Ivan

Thanks Ivan

I did read somewhere of US observers present on both sides during the war. There is still the possibility of US staff present at these British camps as some of the camps were still in existance well after 1902 for occupation duties. The Boer War ended well in advance of 1902.

regards
boertjie

 

[ivan salis]

hummm seems they fought in several battles during the boer war the yoman group---calvary and signal types it seems on first look

 

[boertjie]

Crusader
thanks for that site on Essex Yeomanry; these internet sites are fantastic
regards
boertjie

 

[CRUSADER]

Crusader
thanks for that site on Essex Yeomanry; these internet sites are fantastic
regards
boertjie

Here's another:

http://www.essex-yeomanry.org.uk/index.php?section=1

 

[boertjie]

the great seal button is so named after the great seal of the united states after which the design was fashioned---first issued in 1902 on enlisted mens coating---so basically it was issued it was issued more or less after the boer war however it could have been an "observer" if he was issued it and went striaght over in 1902 highly unlikely but possible---most likely ot was lost by a enlisted service man in either WW1 or WW2 who was poking about the battle site or off a military jacket by some one who got a US military jacket some how---I find it quite odd that the yeoman button group also has a 1902 "form" up date also---hummm--Ivan

Hi Ivan

Look what I found in the Essex Yeomanry web page that crusader so kindly supplied to me:

"Yeomanry, i.e. volunteer cavalry, first appeared in Essex in April 1797 as a result of French invasion threats"

and
"Many Essex men served in South Africa 1899-1902 in the Imperial Yeomanry, which had been raised as mounted infantry to deal with the highly mobile Boer Commandos."

Still the find and history match up.

regards
boertjie

 

[CRUSADER]

the great seal button is so named after the great seal of the united states after which the design was fashioned---first issued in 1902 on enlisted mens coating---so basically it was issued it was issued more or less after the boer war however it could have been an "observer" if he was issued it and went striaght over in 1902 highly unlikely but possible---most likely ot was lost by a enlisted service man in either WW1 or WW2 who was poking about the battle site or off a military jacket by some one who got a US military jacket some how---I find it quite odd that the yeoman button group also has a 1902 "form" up date also---hummm--Ivan

Hi Ivan

Look what I found in the Essex Yeomanry web page that crusader so kindly supplied to me:

"Yeomanry, i.e. volunteer cavalry, first appeared in Essex in April 1797 as a result of French invasion threats"

and
"Many Essex men served in South Africa 1899-1902 in the Imperial Yeomanry, which had been raised as mounted infantry to deal with the highly mobile Boer Commandos."

Still the find and history match up.

regards
boertjie

Its nice when the jigsaw pieces fit together without forcing them

 

[RUDY2003]

Real nice relics boertjie!
Very intresting stuff....

Keep diggin'...

 

[ivan salis]

as I said in my post before "seems the yeoman group took part in several battles in the boer war" and that they seemed an first look to be "either calavry or signal men"--- no "forcing"of history there or any disagreement since we all agree on this----the "american great seal button" is the only "odd item" at first it seemed sort of out of place time wize ----thats why I thought WW1 or 2 or a us military jacket used by "others" but since you say that american "observer types" stayed in british camps around 1902ish time frame it is possible that it came off a newly issued coat enlisted mans coat in the 1902 period ---- great find ---it was "Just Issued" and that would have been one of it first "uses" if lost in 1902------ Ivan

 

[boertjie]

as I said in my post before "seems the yeoman group took part in several battles in the boer war" and that they seemed an first look to be "either calavry or signal men"--- no "forcing"of history there or any disagreement since we all agree on this----the "american great seal button" is the only "odd item" at first it seemed sort of out of place time wize ----thats why I thought WW1 or 2 or a us military jacket used by "others" but since you say that american "observer types" stayed in british camps around 1902ish time frame it is possible that it came off a newly issued coat enlisted mans coat in the 1902 period ---- great find ---it was "Just Issued" and that would have been one of it first "uses" if lost in 1902------ Ivan

Thanks Ivan
boertjie

 

[nahabit]

Did you know their was a small volunteer Russian contingent fighting with the Boers in 1899-1902?


regards
boertjie
yes i know it, during english-bursk war in south africa in 1899-1902, near 300 russian's soldiers were at war against Englishmen, It were professional soldiers veterans of fights with Turkey during period 1870-188X.

 

[Yarrum]

WOW
Dig those buttons mate, top notch!!

 

[pgill]

Hello boertjie,

Great finds you have, umm I will get there...... What is that little spike above the wheels in picture 6, I also found 3 of them?
Apparently the wheels also held the ornament onto the top of the hat.... What I heard was that the troops would remove the ornament leaving a hole on top of the hat to let all the hot air out funny that not more ornament are found in this case

Here is a true American story during the Boer war

best friends decided to come to South Africa to fight in the Boer war.... they seperated from each other and each went on oposite sides, one to the British side and one to the Boer side..... After quite some time, the British American went to battle and just happen to take his friend prisoner.... the Boer American was taken to back to the British camp where the two of them sat and chatted over a cup of the British tea.... after they were finished the Boer American was taken outside where his friend then stuck a gun to his head and blew him away..... Umm new meaning to take no prisoners

Keep on showing us more of your stuff boertjie, we want to see more.....

God bless
Peter

 

[nahabit]

Boer war

In Russia this war refers to "Bur war"

 

[boertjie]

Hi Peter

I have no idea what the spike is
Maybe a special kind of horse shoe nail?

regards
boertjie

 

[nahabit]

may be it is a peg for a tent?

 

[steve m]

Nice digs!