Trump letter - Pebble Mine

[ratled]

This week’s letter to President Trump is on behalf the Pebble Mine out of Alaska. It is a very interesting story for those who haven’t followed it. They are up against the exact same folks that the independent miners and prospectors of the West coast are, the same junk science and preconceived agendas. It has the EPA stepping in overriding the Army Corp, very questionable contact and interaction with NGOS’s, state and federal officials. One of the key players even fled the US for some time!
https://www.adn.com/environment/article/hard-find-retired-epa-scientist-tells-where-hes-been-and-why-he-fought-pebble/2016/04/04/

I have mentioned the Pebble Mine in the past, but as a big outfit and not what we are use to as independent miners and prospectors, IT's THE REASON IT IS THIS WEEK’S THEME, and it clearly shows that what can happen to us little guys can happen to the big boys. THIS is why the big outfits need to pay attention to what happens to us. Additionally, it shows that the new administration is concerned with minerals on federally managed public lands. Rep. Smith, Texas, and House Science Committee chair, wrote a letter to the EPA citing the questionable science http://www.treasurenet.com/forums/gold-prospecting/532402-house-urges-epa-rescind-veto-alaskan-mine-despite-local-opposition.html and just yesterday, 3/8/17, the White House Press Secretary announced in his daily briefing that President Trump was meeting that day with newly minted DOI Secretary Zinke and two Alaska senators to discuss how to best manage federally managed public lands in Alaska. While it is just on Alaska (and I’m sure Pebble will be discussed) it clearly shows that minerals are in the administrations big plan. We just need to get the independent gold miners and prospectors to be part of that plan.

Make no mistake about it, even the biggest outfits get their big money makers by putting some poor guy on the ground walking around prospecting.

Sorry for being a little long winded but this week’s theme is a little outside of the box for some of us. In addition to sending this week’s letter to President Trump I will be cc’ing it to Rep Smith out of Texas and the House Science Committee Chair, DOI Secretary Zinke, EPA Administrator Pruitt, and Rep Rob Bishop out of Utah, the House Resource Committee Chair. I'll post the addresses in a bit

Thank you for your support. Please send in letters, our letter writing campaign has worked before.

ratled

As always, please send your letter to the president here https://www.whitehouse.gov/contact#page

Donald J. Trump, President of the United States
The White House
1600 Pennsylvania Avenue NW
Washington, DC 20500

Dear President Trump,

For weeks now the West Coast independent gold miners and prospectors have been asking you for assistance to get us back to work in the face of the environmental movements massive push to over regulate us out of existence. We will continue to seek your assistance to get us back to work. This week we reach out to you on behalf of one of our of big brothers, the Pebble Mine in Alaska.

Just last week Representative Smith, Texas, Chair of the House Science Committee, wrote Administrator Pruitt of the EPA asking him to reverse the extraordinary actions against the Pebble Mine “amid claims that the agency overstepped its statutory authority under President Barack Obama…… and was justified by a questionable scientific assessment that relied on predetermined conclusions developed by EPA officials,”

These are the exact same tactics that have been thrust upon the independent gold miners and prospectors of the West Coast. We been have fighting against them for 8 years now and seek assistance from your administration. Any action that we lose will be used against the other users of natural resources such as Pebble Mine, energy developers and others.

You recently met with DOI Secretary Zinke and two senators from Alaska to discuss the priorities of federally managed public lands in Alaska. We ask that you consider all the natural resource users in all of the states, especially where it impacts the independent gold miners and prospectors. The EPA and many of the state run water agencies are causing extreme undo burden upon the miners and must be stopped. In several cases they have flat out banned our pursuits.

We bring millions of dollars annually to the smaller communities we operate in. We are all hard working Americans who once used to augment our incomes, fixed income retirees who need to supplement our needs through other than hand outs, and full time miners who are just trying to scratch out an existence in the rural American West were economic opportunities can be scarce.

We look forward to working with you to Make America Great Again and get the gold miners back to work!

 

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[wildminer]

There is an overwhelming amount of info to be had by searching "pebblemine".

 

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[Capt Nemo]

Not too hard to get salmon to return to a stream. One batch dumped in Lake Michigan returns to the same boat launch where they were planted.

 

[wildminer]

Just an fyi on that- the naturalists (extreme environmentalists) want it all natural and wild. The hatchery programs and hatchbox programs are severely curtailed by the fish departments out west as they are right in line with the enviros. Alaska salmon fisheries are considered, for the most part, wild and the runs in the pebble mine drainage are wild. The lower 48 has dam dams on most of the best producing rivers from the past and the public was promised hatcheries to make up for the lost fish runs. Along came the extremests and wanted it all wild, hence the lost production of the hatcheries. They've got the fishermen under their thumb and have moved on to the miners in their quest to have it a look, but don't touch mentality. Sorry to talk about fish, but oh well, just the way I see it. I was shamed off another gold forum for telling the truth as I see it, but you see I have made my living by fishing, but I am also a very concerned miner and prospector. A double whammy for me. Rant over.

 

[winners58]

there is no PoO or EIS based on that Poo yet, for the pebble mine the EPA based their evaluation to not let them apply for a permit
based on an SEC filing to find financial backing, the pebble mine is 100 miles from Bristol bay and not near a flowing stream, the EPA
evaluated where they thought there might be tailing piles that is like a 30 mile radius.
here's the lat/log to look up the location; 59°53'46.86"N 155°17'28.54"W
when a PoO is submitted it would be scientifically evaluated with several alternatives based on the environment footprint.
none of that has happened the preemptive EPA study is political all based on environmentalist hype.

 

[wildminer]

wikepeda"
The Pebble prospect is in a remote, wild, and generally uninhabited part of the Bristol Bay watershed. The nearest communities, about 20 miles (32 km) distant, are the villages of Nondalton, Newhalen, and Iliamna. The site is 200 miles (320 km) southwest of Anchorage, Alaska.[2]

Pebble is approximately 15 miles (24 km) north of, and upstream of, Lake Iliamna. The deposit area is characterized by relatively flat land dotted by glacial ponds, interspersed with isolated mountains or ranges of hills rising one or two thousand feet above the flats. Pebble is under a broad flat valley at about 1,000 feet (300 m) above sea level dividing the drainages of Upper Talarik Creek and the Koktuli River.[3]

Upper Talarik Creek flows into Lake Iliamna, which flows through the Kvichak River into Bristol Bay. Waters in the Koktuli River drain into the Mulchatna River, a tributary of the Nushagak River which empties into Bristol Bay at Dillingham. Water from Lake Clark, approximately 20 miles (32 km) east of Pebble, flows down the Newhalen River to Lake Iliamna

 

[Laz7777]

I was ranted at on another gold mining forum for opposing pebble creek. the folks at anglo-american have one goal: profits. nothing horribly wrong with that, but at the cost to something more precious than copper or gold: food. I shut the thread down when I asked if anglo-american lent any support to small scale miners..hey they have got to have a shyster or two on retainer, right?

anyhow, I see it as good that there is some debate here and some basic values concerning the world we live in and pass on to the next folks that have to live with the leftovers.

 

[Goldwasher]

i guess if you really value what is passed on and don't want to make an impact on ANYONE....then you should stop using ANYTHING with metal in it.

because the impact mining has in many many places is much worse on a daily basis than a mine in a developed nation like the U.S.

 

[Bejay]

That's the issue with wild salmon runs...once you destroy the run, the fish don't
come back. There's no fish going upriver to spawn, therefore no fish returning.

A wild run of any salmon species is unique to that particular river. Consider why
everyone wants to buy the Copper River salmon each year..it's because that
particular group of fish are the best eating. They're unique, and even within
a river system there are returning fish not just to the river, but to the exact
area where they first hatched. Other runs up the same river might be spawning
in small feeder rivers flowing into the main river. Each group is unique.

End result is, once they're unable to spawn, you can't restore it.

p.s.: Just as a clarification, I am generally among the crowd that wants to
tell the gov't they can kiss my rosy red arse, and given youth again I'd be
out there digging somewhere.

As for the gov't, the agencies aren't just hurting us, they're hurting every
traditional outdoor activity. Hunting, fishing, trapping, etc. is all under fire
from "those who think they know better - but haven't got a clue".

I'm all for science and common sense, and the Pebble just isn't good common
sense when the full risk is considered.

First I will say that I am all about protecting salmon runs. And genetic diversity of such runs is important. But recently I often think of the Great Calif Gold Rush era. I have read many books on how things were done back in those days. Rivers/streams/creeks were literally gutted and altered beyond anything we see today. But one MUST consider that today the anti mining community is all about protecting the salmon runs that occur in these very same rivers/streams/creeks that were gutted. Even with the huge amount of devastation done, in early day mining, we see that nature heals and restores itself dramatically.

There is one true devastation of a fishery that continues today...and that is overharvest and (takings). When Mt Saint Helens exploded it was determined by the fish biologists that the salmon runs were destroyed. On the contrary...the fishery overcame the impact and prospered. In the Siuslaw River watershed (Oregon) all timber harvest off of public lands has halted to protect salmon. All logging roads are being removed etc etc. But when one studies history the Siuslaw Watershed underwent a devastating fire that left all the adjacent mtns burnt. Heavy rains that winter brought forth huge landslides and debris flows into the drainage. The Siuslaw became 2nd only to the Columbia River for the amount of salmon it produced after the devastational fire and slides.

I am all about protecting and conservation, but the amount of inaccurate information brought forth by the Anti Crowd is not attempting to support any kind of natural resource utilization....on the contrary it is all about stopping the utilization of natural resources. Within any argument you have two sides attempting to support their position. When the moderator (in this case the EPA & Gov) already has a predetermined position it becomes clear we need a new form of moderation!

Bejay

 

[wildminer]

So true and it is known and a fact that the EPA colluded with the anti crowd before the permitting process started and took the very rare move to stop the process before Pebble Mine had put their plan and studies on the table. I don't believe God put that huge deposit of gold, copper and molybdenum there to just let it sit and not be utilized and the same goes for the sockeye. The only reason I am personally against the mine as it stands now is that the EPA (under Obama) has not allowed the developers to show whether this huge mine is safe or not. If they (EPA) will let them show it is safe I am all for it. If they can't at least do that they don't deserve to exist.

 

[Sockeye1730]

i guess if you really value what is passed on and don't want to make an impact on ANYONE....then you should stop using ANYTHING with metal in it.

because the impact mining has in many many places is much worse on a daily basis than a mine in a developed nation like the U.S.

Ok, well aside from your last paragraph, this is categorically false.

 

[Sockeye1730]

Oops, meant to quote bjay

 

[Sockeye1730]

Oops, meant to quote bjay. To insinuate any of those river and fisheries as "healed" is misleading at best.

 

[ratled]

In support of Bejay, I know that you are correct. In addition I offer this - In the EPA Colorado mining incident at the Gold King mine that affected the river for over three states for the whole breadth of the river, the EPA declared that the river was healing itself in three days.

Sockeye you are on the ignore list as your motives are clear and not mining related.

ratled

 

[Sockeye1730]

Lmao. Ok then. Once again I SUPPORT MINING!

 

[Sockeye1730]

Idk, i guess if u want to keep your head face down in the kool-aid instead of debating the actual issue, that's fine with me. The Bristol Bay fishery is worth upward of 1.5 billion annually and sustainable. To risk that on short term profits for an multi-national corporation on the the development of the largest open-pit sulfide mine on earth and the largest earthen dam on the face of the earth, in one of the most seismic areas on earth is foolish imo and to a vast majority of Alaskans and coservationists alike.

Once again, I support mining, even large scale, here in AK. I fully support the Kensington and Greens Creek mines here. They are world-class operations that do an exemplary job to mitigate environmental impacts despite fierce opposition. I also support reopening of the AJ mine here in town and sluice mercury coated gold behind my place here, in the ruins of Treadwell.

I, and may other alaskans, far more conservative than me, will continue our opposition to Pebble.

 

[Bejay]

Nothing wrong with opposition, as most often it raises valid issues of concern. If those concerns are dealt with and create world class operations then the opposition deserves credit for raising valid issues. As long as both sides are allowed to present evidence that warrants attention the end result: whether it exists or fails to exist, should be based on valid concerns; that can either be resolved or not-resolved.

As has been the case for a very long time, such dialogue is healthy if it is based on facts as opposed to emotions. One will see how all this ends....and this is not the first "go round"....as such issues get lots of attention. This old miner can recall all the hype that occurred when the Alaska Pipeline was proposed and later constructed. I believe the concern's brought forth methodology that allowed construction addressing those concerns! I believe Alaskans benefited from the construction and the oil revenue sharing that resulted.

Guess we will see what transpires with the Pebble Mine proposal. lots of opinions will be put on the table!

Bejay

 

[ratled]

Guess we will see what transpires with the Pebble Mine proposal. lots of opinions will be put on the table!

Bejay

Bejay with the new administration citing the the US went from an exporter of copper to importing about a third of our copper needs I can't see that aspect of the Pebble Mine not going through. If part one goes I think part two, the gold aspect, will follow suit. President Trump met with DOI Sec Zinke and two Alaska reps at the WH late last week to discuss the use of the natural resources on federally managed public lands in Alaska.

The point of these letters , as well as this thread, is if the coal miners are going back to work, Pebble Mine is getting it's green light, the METALS Act is going through, it is our best interest to get the attention of the new admin and get our cause through too.... and that is all I am trying to do with these letters. No lengthy court time, no sue and settle, no lawyer fees just the day to day folks sending in emails and snail mail.

ratled