Crow
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Hello Matt do you have a time frame these events happened? year of His death etc...
Crow
Crow
The Lost Carson Mine
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Crow
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Okay I will have look if I can find some thing in the archives. that might help verify Levi Carson. So sit tight. Back in 5.
Crow
Crow
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Okay
There was a Levi Carson whose parents was originally from Pennsylvania. Levi was born in Ohio in around 1830. He married Sarah Pemberton in Kansas 3rd February 1859. They had 6 children. They all lived in Ammas valley la Plata county Colorado in 1880. Was listed as a farmer.
Per Hood Mortuary Records. Durango Democrat says Levi Carson was a farmer on the Florida Mesa raising, among other things, goats. His estate was handled by an Oliver Carson. Oliver Carson was his youngest son, confirmed also by 1880 census records. the recorded date of his death was 24th October 1904. he was buried in the Green mount cemetery Durango la Plata county Colorado.
So from this we can assert that a Levi Carson did exist in the state of Colorado. what is interesting by the time of the 1900 United States Census there was no mention of him. This could of been because he was away at the time on a trip to his alleged gold mine?
Crow
There was a Levi Carson whose parents was originally from Pennsylvania. Levi was born in Ohio in around 1830. He married Sarah Pemberton in Kansas 3rd February 1859. They had 6 children. They all lived in Ammas valley la Plata county Colorado in 1880. Was listed as a farmer.
Per Hood Mortuary Records. Durango Democrat says Levi Carson was a farmer on the Florida Mesa raising, among other things, goats. His estate was handled by an Oliver Carson. Oliver Carson was his youngest son, confirmed also by 1880 census records. the recorded date of his death was 24th October 1904. he was buried in the Green mount cemetery Durango la Plata county Colorado.
So from this we can assert that a Levi Carson did exist in the state of Colorado. what is interesting by the time of the 1900 United States Census there was no mention of him. This could of been because he was away at the time on a trip to his alleged gold mine?
Crow
sdcfia
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More info on the story (quote and map from GeoZone The Lost Carson Mine):
"Shortly after his last visit to Silverton, Levi Carson died of a heart attack near Big Molas Lake. Prospectors began to search the rugged country between Big Molas Lake and the West Needle Mountains for Carson's mine. Search parties scoured the area near the headwaters of Twilight Creek after one of Carson's campsites was found there. During the 1920's, a prospector from Durango named John Edwards discovered a fragment of rich "float" on Twilight Creek. The float consisted of iron-stained quartz filled with nodules of free gold. During the summer of 1928, another resident of Durango named Mike Powell found float similar to this near the junction of Twilight Creek and Lime Creek. Rich float can still be found on Twilight Creek."
"Shortly after his last visit to Silverton, Levi Carson died of a heart attack near Big Molas Lake. Prospectors began to search the rugged country between Big Molas Lake and the West Needle Mountains for Carson's mine. Search parties scoured the area near the headwaters of Twilight Creek after one of Carson's campsites was found there. During the 1920's, a prospector from Durango named John Edwards discovered a fragment of rich "float" on Twilight Creek. The float consisted of iron-stained quartz filled with nodules of free gold. During the summer of 1928, another resident of Durango named Mike Powell found float similar to this near the junction of Twilight Creek and Lime Creek. Rich float can still be found on Twilight Creek."
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UncleMatt
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Before he died Carson confided in his family that his strike was on the north face of the West Needle Mountains. He also told them he did not have to work hard to recover the ore, and that it was a surface outcropping of sugar brown quartz loaded with free gold. As well he indicated it was far above his main camp at the foot of the mountains, well above tree line. He said when he was working at the site he stayed in a crude shelter under a rock overhang with some poles leaning against it, and when he left he always made sure the vein was well covered. He said it was inaccessible to pack animals entirely as well.
After Carson died people began looking for signs of where he had been working in the area. A couple of his campsites were located, one of the most extensive being found at timberline on Twilight creek, where grazing was excellent for his pack animals, and he only had to build a crude gate in the only downhill exist to prevent them from wandering off. As sdcfia posted, John Edwards found samples of float that matched Carson's ore on Twilight Creek. He was a professional prospector, and also an avid fisherman. While on fishing trips on the east bank of the Lime River he would explore the Twilight watershed extensively searching for signs of Carson's mine. One year he found a cache on a small ledge of dynamite and steel drills presumably left by Carson, up a little side canyon high up on the Twilight Creek watershed, very near Carson's main base camp. But he soon gave up after not finding anything further, and it was extremely hard to access the area he needed to search.
Mike Powell, a local stockman, also found float of the same kind much lower in the same area of Twilight Creek. The most memorable sample was about the size of a man's fist and assayed at the time at several thousand dollars per ton. Unfortunately he was not experienced with prospecting and only searched the area he found the fist size ore sample, not understanding it had come from much higher in the watershed.
But the most interesting find was made by a sheep herder named Juan Quintana while working for J. J."Jack" McCormick, a sheepman from Durango. That year Jack established a sheep camp at the little basin at the head of Twilight, very near where Carson had his main base camp. While bored and hiking around the area, Quintana discovered the vein Carson had been working, including the crude pole shelter, an old fire pit, and rusted tin cans in a trash site. He took some samples from the vein back to the camp Jack had set up for him to tend sheep from, and when Jack came to visit to make sure all was well with his heard and Quintana was managing things well, he saw the ore samples. Of course he became quite excited and demanded his employee tell him where he had found the ore. But Quintana was afraid he would be killed if he revealed his secret, and was very superstitious, which was quite common with Mexican born sheepherders in the area at the time. Quintana took all the ore samples but the leanest one and buried them under a large spruce tree nearby during the night. Then when Jack returned to Durango to have the remaining ore sample assayed, Quintana returned to the vein site and covered it completely with dirt, and removed the poles from the shelter and threw them down the slope and scattering them completely.
The lean ore sample Jack returned to town with assayed at over $500 a ton. But Quintana would not reveal the place he found it, no matter what Jack tried to induce him with to reveal the location. Around ten years later in 1932 when Quintana was working for another outfit run by a guy named Corny, he started talking about what he had found long ago. Corny was a kind and considerate man who respected the sheepherder and treated him much better than Jack had. By this time he was an old man, and though he tried to describe the exact location to Corny, he could not describe it well enough so that Corny could figure out the location. He promised to lead Corny to the exact spot the following spring, as winter had already set in. But he died that winter from pneumonia, and the last living link to the Carson Mine was lost.
After Carson died people began looking for signs of where he had been working in the area. A couple of his campsites were located, one of the most extensive being found at timberline on Twilight creek, where grazing was excellent for his pack animals, and he only had to build a crude gate in the only downhill exist to prevent them from wandering off. As sdcfia posted, John Edwards found samples of float that matched Carson's ore on Twilight Creek. He was a professional prospector, and also an avid fisherman. While on fishing trips on the east bank of the Lime River he would explore the Twilight watershed extensively searching for signs of Carson's mine. One year he found a cache on a small ledge of dynamite and steel drills presumably left by Carson, up a little side canyon high up on the Twilight Creek watershed, very near Carson's main base camp. But he soon gave up after not finding anything further, and it was extremely hard to access the area he needed to search.
Mike Powell, a local stockman, also found float of the same kind much lower in the same area of Twilight Creek. The most memorable sample was about the size of a man's fist and assayed at the time at several thousand dollars per ton. Unfortunately he was not experienced with prospecting and only searched the area he found the fist size ore sample, not understanding it had come from much higher in the watershed.
But the most interesting find was made by a sheep herder named Juan Quintana while working for J. J."Jack" McCormick, a sheepman from Durango. That year Jack established a sheep camp at the little basin at the head of Twilight, very near where Carson had his main base camp. While bored and hiking around the area, Quintana discovered the vein Carson had been working, including the crude pole shelter, an old fire pit, and rusted tin cans in a trash site. He took some samples from the vein back to the camp Jack had set up for him to tend sheep from, and when Jack came to visit to make sure all was well with his heard and Quintana was managing things well, he saw the ore samples. Of course he became quite excited and demanded his employee tell him where he had found the ore. But Quintana was afraid he would be killed if he revealed his secret, and was very superstitious, which was quite common with Mexican born sheepherders in the area at the time. Quintana took all the ore samples but the leanest one and buried them under a large spruce tree nearby during the night. Then when Jack returned to Durango to have the remaining ore sample assayed, Quintana returned to the vein site and covered it completely with dirt, and removed the poles from the shelter and threw them down the slope and scattering them completely.
The lean ore sample Jack returned to town with assayed at over $500 a ton. But Quintana would not reveal the place he found it, no matter what Jack tried to induce him with to reveal the location. Around ten years later in 1932 when Quintana was working for another outfit run by a guy named Corny, he started talking about what he had found long ago. Corny was a kind and considerate man who respected the sheepherder and treated him much better than Jack had. By this time he was an old man, and though he tried to describe the exact location to Corny, he could not describe it well enough so that Corny could figure out the location. He promised to lead Corny to the exact spot the following spring, as winter had already set in. But he died that winter from pneumonia, and the last living link to the Carson Mine was lost.
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UncleMatt
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In 1936 Corny was able to find the large spruce tree and also was able to dig up the ore sample Quintana had buried under its branches. They were exactly the same kind of ore that the story of Carson's Mine had described, oxidized brown quartz loaded with free gold. But he was unable to follow the jumbled description Quintana had told him where he could find the vein itself. This is where the story ends, as no further finds were made in the area that have been revealed to the general public's knowledge. Quintana's direction indicated a generally southern direction from the sheepherder's camp at the head of Twilight Creek.
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UncleMatt
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So there you have it. The vein is most likely at the head of Twilight Creek on the south side of the watershed. I would love it if anyone knows any further details.
Getting up there is certainly a challenge. Twilight Creek empties into Lime Creek at around 8600 feet, and then the watershed meanders ever upward to the east north-east for close to 3 miles with an elevation increase up to 11,900 feet, with the surrounding terrain extending up much higher than that. To engage in a proper search would require people acclimated to the elevation and able to haul enough food, camping equipment, prospecting equipment, and metal detector gear up to 11,900, and then be able to carry on the search at even higher elevations. I have an idea where to look specifically, but have never gone up there to engage this in a serious way. I hope to do so soon however.
Getting up there is certainly a challenge. Twilight Creek empties into Lime Creek at around 8600 feet, and then the watershed meanders ever upward to the east north-east for close to 3 miles with an elevation increase up to 11,900 feet, with the surrounding terrain extending up much higher than that. To engage in a proper search would require people acclimated to the elevation and able to haul enough food, camping equipment, prospecting equipment, and metal detector gear up to 11,900, and then be able to carry on the search at even higher elevations. I have an idea where to look specifically, but have never gone up there to engage this in a serious way. I hope to do so soon however.
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UncleMatt
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Crow, I appreciate the search for Levi Carson, but I am not sure that is the correct Carson of the tale. No mention is ever made that he had a wife in the area, but would love to try to nail that down with certainty. There is mention he had family though, which he shared some info about his mine with, so it will be interesting to see what can be found.
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Crow
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Hello Matt I am more than sure Now. What difference a few hours can do. In millions of records of census Fedral and state there was only 11 Levi Carson's of that era. Most was in the eastern states one in Louisiana either too young or died before the event happened. The only one recorded in Colorado is as mentioned above. His son Oliver took over the Farm on death of his father in 1904. Levi Carson was the only recorded Levi Carson in Colorado.
You can see for yourself below 1880 census.
This 1875 census that show where he was earlier.
I will post the 1900 census that you might find interesting.
Crow
You can see for yourself below 1880 census.
This 1875 census that show where he was earlier.
I will post the 1900 census that you might find interesting.
Crow
Crow
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hello Matt
He was not in 1900 census but his wife and son was now living in Silverton. So Levi might of been away on the night of the Census in 1900 where perhaps gathering his gold?
you can see for yourself... below.
For me this is a positive as you have a treasure legend where your not searching for a "ghost" of the principle player of the legend. Levi Carson was a real person who lived in colorado with his wife and family who died in 1904. but for several years at least noted from 1895 to have found an alleged ledge of gold. You have quite an interesting story to hunt down to get at the truth behind the story.
Since he had six children there might possibly be descendants that have knowlege of the story and perhaps a few more UN-published details? What would be nice is to find the earliest publish version of this story?
Crow
He was not in 1900 census but his wife and son was now living in Silverton. So Levi might of been away on the night of the Census in 1900 where perhaps gathering his gold?
you can see for yourself... below.
For me this is a positive as you have a treasure legend where your not searching for a "ghost" of the principle player of the legend. Levi Carson was a real person who lived in colorado with his wife and family who died in 1904. but for several years at least noted from 1895 to have found an alleged ledge of gold. You have quite an interesting story to hunt down to get at the truth behind the story.
Since he had six children there might possibly be descendants that have knowlege of the story and perhaps a few more UN-published details? What would be nice is to find the earliest publish version of this story?
Crow
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sdcfia
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Man, this is a tough project. No wonder the site has not been relocated. You'd better get busy while you're legs are still young. Below is a section of the Snowden Creek USGS quad (37107F6) with my interpretation of your chosen base camp and a rough outline of your described search zone. Also a typical GE view looking SE. A hi-res, low-angle aerial photo would obviously be much better and possibly be a valuable planning tool. At that altitude, will your drones be of any use for reconnaissance?
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UncleMatt
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Thanks for doing all the research on that Crow! Its very appreciated! I agree it is very likely you found our man Carson, and it does lend credible evidence to this tale. I may try to find out if he has any descendants still in the area that I can speak to personally.
And sdcfia, I could not agree with you more! I am 49 and every year it gets harder to struggle up to the areas I have the most interest in. I spend days every week in the gym conditioning my legs and cardiovascular system to continue to be able to do so in the summer months, but it isn't getting any easier. I live at around 6,500 feet as well, which makes it a lot easier than coming up from the flatlands. But I was planning to attack the slopes right up Twilight Creek, not take existing trails. I have a Google Earth Pro map of my planned access route, but its over 16mb! I will have to print and scan it to upload it here at work on Monday.
But consider, the fact that it is so very remote and hard to get to may be the only reason it has a chance to still exist. If it was next to US550 down below, it would have been exploited long ago.
And sdcfia, I could not agree with you more! I am 49 and every year it gets harder to struggle up to the areas I have the most interest in. I spend days every week in the gym conditioning my legs and cardiovascular system to continue to be able to do so in the summer months, but it isn't getting any easier. I live at around 6,500 feet as well, which makes it a lot easier than coming up from the flatlands. But I was planning to attack the slopes right up Twilight Creek, not take existing trails. I have a Google Earth Pro map of my planned access route, but its over 16mb! I will have to print and scan it to upload it here at work on Monday.
But consider, the fact that it is so very remote and hard to get to may be the only reason it has a chance to still exist. If it was next to US550 down below, it would have been exploited long ago.
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UncleMatt
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Also, it would be illegal for me to take a motorized drone into a Wilderness Area, though I would certainly love to have the option of doing so.
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UncleMatt
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Another thought: I know people with horses in the area. I may have them take me as high as possible and drop me off where it gets too steep and rugged for horses to get through. What I really need is some burros from Tropical Tramp to carry all my gear. If Carson could get up high with burros, I should be able to as well.
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UncleMatt
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Or maybe I should just find some areas next to Lime Creek Road to video and photograph and then pretend I hit the actual search area....
Crow
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Now now ya be watching too many of those shameful documentaries as of late. Forget documentaries go for the gold.
Crow
Crow
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UncleMatt
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Something important to consider is the fact that the vein was near an overhang where Carson used poles to create a crude shelter. So that will be one of the things I am looking for, just such a rock overhang. Or perhaps where one has obviously collapsed. If there was indeed a trash pit where Carson threw all his tin cans, that would be something I could find with a metal detector as well.The major part of all this is just reaching the area in the first place. I wish I could just hire a helo to drop me off with my gear and pick me up in a week!
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