THE DIFFERENCE IN THE K.G.C. DIAMOND SYMBOL

[mdog]

mdog, this website provides some interesting correlations. The Kensington Runestone - Mystery Solved

I don't necessarily embrace all of what this websites presents - such as the Kensington Rune Stone code leading to Inspiration Peak - but the takeaway for me at this time is the nearly exact 1362-mile great circle distances measured from the top of IP to the geoglyphs at the US northeast, northwest and south land extents. Also, whereas the KRS was found in a nearly random spot in typical swell-and-swale farmland, Inspiration Peak is a high prominent knoll and an easy to find landmark for anyone looking for it. A surveyor might call it a benchmark or a control point. But for what purpose? In addition, I've discovered quite an intriguing geometrical link from IP to a strangely-named southwestern landmark that then aligns to a suspicious location in the Superstition Mountains in Arizona, located within a very prominent lat/long grid location. I have no plans to visit the area, but I do appreciate its beauty from a cartographic perspective.

I'm kind of a "show me" guy, and when I see stuff like this - physical evidence available for all to verify for themselves - I take notice. Especially when the evidence turns out to be a remarkable "coincidence". I don't know who chose this spot or created the geoglyphs, but they were capable hands. As you well know mdog, when you start discovering beautiful geometry that ties common themes together all across the country, it gets your attention. There's a method at work here on a grand scale.

Incidentally, a number of medieval-era metal artifacts have been found through the years all over the upper Midwest, especially at the headwater region of the Red River. Below is a weapon found at Brandon, MN - twelve miles south of IP, halfway to KRS. Two additional battle axes are also shown. These and other artifacts are in the KRS Museum in Alexandria, MN.

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Here's a mystery that sdcfia's Inspiration Peak link helped me solve just a few minutes after I read it. I've been studying an alignment of mounds on top of a bluff of the Mississippi River. There are 20 mounds in the group but 8 of them are setup in a perfect line going from east to west with the largest of the mounds being on the east and the rest of them gradually decreasing in size with the 8th mound being the smallest. What little information I've been able to find about this group, mentioned an excavation that took place on 10 of them back in the 1870s. The 10 mounds were trenched down to two feet below ground level and nothing was found in any of them except for occasional traces of charcoal. This seemed unusual to me because there are hundreds of mounds in this area that are associated with burials of the Hopewell period and excavations have always produced some type of artifacts. The line of 8 mounds line up with the tip of an island in the river and I suspected that the mounds might have been acknowledging some type of solar event important to the Moundbuilders. On the fall equinox of a week ago, the sun came up just north of the island tip. According to a sun calculator that my grandson found for me, the sun will rise over the tip of this island on October 12th. This is Columbus day, the day in 1492 that Columbus landed in the Americas. Using google earth, I started a line at the largest mound and ran it to the point of the island and kept going toward the Atlantic Ocean. This line passed directly over the Washington Monument in D.C. So, this year anyway, on Columbus Day if you stand on the large mound and face the tip of the island, you'll be watching the sun come up over the Washington Monument. So this alignment of mounds was built much latter than the culture it was accredited to. Thanks for the link sdcfia. I don't believe there was any sinister intent, just an acknowledgment of an important event and location.

 

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[Rebel - KGC]

I didn't mean to skip over this part.



Before we explore his stuff, how do yo know Harrison came up with the FIRST chronometer? There are a couple different ways you can look at the chronometer - a really handy damn thing for Sailors and Map Makers, or ...

... Top Secret Military Science. Or, Top Secret Governmetal Science. Or, Top Secret Monastic Science. Or, etc ...

I don't present evidence, only the open minded thought that for as important as that invention was, there would be Groups that MOST DEFINITELY kept such secret for as long as possible ...



Man, you haven't even read his book yet and have crowned him king of Truth? I just checked is website. If that is who I think it is, I remember watching an interview with him with some English dude with blondish hair. I don't remember the nuts and bolts of it, but it was interesting stuff. As far as knowing the secrets of Draco, well, Miller's theory concerning the uses (and who used to do what) better dip into some Other Realm stuff to make that claim. From his About page:

After further years of research, Crichton, unrestrained by dogma or doctrine and having no peer group pressure

At the bottom of his page, he has this to say:

As Christ told us, "The Kingdom of God is all around us if we have eyes to see and ears to hear"

Hmm ... unrestrained by dogma or doctrine, eh? Lol. Going to his Introduction, I see he is heavily swayed (obliviously so, I am sure) by the Falsified Chronology peer pressure group. sdcfia, that dude is stealing my tag line - After further years of research, Nobody, unrestrained by dogma or doctrine and having no peer group pressure ... lol.

I'm curious enough now that I'll refresh my memory on his stuff as I remember his 'use' for the Celtic Cross was indeed interesting, but I doubt it will provide the insight into Draco that you suspect, and while I will do so open mindedly, his credibility isn't off to good start with me ...



Man, not only are you crowning Miller King 'O Truth without reading his book, but you are claiming Miller's work defeats the work of someone else, that you haven't read either. sdcfia, for whatever cool stuff Miller may be onto, it better be one damn impressive and comprehensive theory to pull that off.

I don't agree with the entirety of Fomenko's reconstruciton on every level. He attributes construction of the Pyramids to The Empire, and the methodology he points ot is that of a some type of geo-polymer science that a Fench Scholar proposed some years ago. I don;t touch the Megalithic stuff right now, either in Africa or the Americas. The Empire just moved in, chiseled the place up, and used it as their Necropolis, complete with surrounding/supporting civilization. I am focused on about 1000 A.D forward, for that is all that exists for any Historical Record. There are no 'original' copies of teh Bible. Of the Greek Historians, etc. 'Copies' just magically surfaced in the Middle Ages, usually around the Renaissance. The oldest copy of the Bible (Saturn based Old Testament ONLY, not NT) in existence is 900 A.D. (at the oldest and according to Biblical Scholars, not Fomenko), and it is written in Greek, not Hebrew or Aramaic. That is how it is with this stuff, including the Greek and Roman Histories - a copy just shows up in the Middle Ages/Renaissance 1500 years after it all supposedly happened.

For whatever Truth Miller may be on to with the uses of the Celtic Cross, I wouldn't try to bury Fomenko with it, and claim it does anying resembling boding unwell for his work. I doubt it will answer any of the Issues we have been told that Chess Champion Gary Kasparov raised INDEPENDENTLY of Fomenko, either.

Since my early childhood, I have been inspired and excited by ancient and medieval history. I also have a good memory, which allows me to remember historical events, dates, names, and related details. So, after reading many history books, I analysed and compared the information and, little by little, I began to feel that there was something wrong with the dates of antiquity. There were too many discrepancies and contradictions that could not be explained within the framework of traditional chronology. For example, let's examine what we know of ancient Rome.

You and me both, Gary. When you finish that book, sdcfia, let me know how it handles this Issue Gary brings up:

Despite all these deficiencies, Roman numerals supposedly remained the predominant representation of numbers in European culture until the 14th century. How did the ancient Romans succeed in their calculations and complicated astronomical computations? It is believed that in the 3rd century, the Greek mathematician Diophantus was able to find positive and rational solutions to the following system of equations, called Diophantic today

x31 + x2 = y3
x1 + x2 = y.

According to historians, at the time of Diophantus, only one symbol was used for an unknown, a symbol for "plus" did not exist, neither was there a symbol for "zero." How could Diophantic equations be solved using Greek letters or Roman numerals (see Figure 2)? Can these solutions be reproduced? Are we dealing here with another secret of ancient history that we are not supposed to question? Let us point out that even Leonardo da Vinci, at the beginning of the 16th century, had troubles with fractional powers. It is also interesting that in all of da Vinci's works, there is no trace of "zero" and that he was using 22/7 as the approximation of p - probably it was the best approximation of p available at that time.

Or this issue:

GK: Correct. We know that for the last 300 or 400 years, the size of
human bodies is growing. Now what happened is that we suddenly, in history, have the backward process. We have these great Greek athletes, we have ultra-powerful Roman soldiers. You look at the size of the Roman soldier who has to carry all this ammunition. You’re
talking about 300,000 Arnold Schwartzeneggers. And even well-known historians like Edward Gibbon are talking about how the soldiers of the 18th century were not able to do the same type of exercise.

TT: Isn’t it possible that we have an over-romanticized view of the
Romans and so we grossed up their abilities a bit? No harm done, the duration of the empire remains the same, but they simply weren’t as fast, they didn’t jump as high, they didn’t carry as much iron.

GK: But then we have to devaluate all the sources. And that’s very
important. We’re talking about very reliable quote-unquote historical
sources. And they describe it in great detail . . . it’s not just
fifteen kilos of iron. He’s talking about all sorts of ammunition: a
sword, a shield, a long pike. It’s a precise description.

TT: So this is about credibility of source material.

GK: Oh, this is a big credibility issue! If these things, if all these
things never existed, then we have to devaluate as a credible source the entire literature that is attributed to the ancient authors, because how could they make such mistakes describing the ammunition of their contemporary soldiers? This suggests that those sources do not belong to the contemporary writers, and they were made up much later.

Or this:

TT: What kind of reactions have you had to these ideas?

GK: Mostly people are very arrogant. And they get very defensive, or
very insulting, because they don’t want to hear about it. It’s like you
are destroying their family branch.

[Indeed, Gary, indeed. Might I also say most are quite close minded about it, too]

TT: How have historians reacted to your ideas?

GK: Once I spoke about this subject among a group of English
intellectuals. One of them was a professor on Roman Law at one of the leading British universities (without giving the name for him not to be embarrassed). And I asked him one question. I asked him, I don’t want to go into mathematics, or armour, or ammunition, or military inventory because those are not your subjects. Let’s talk about something that is entirely your field. What was the official language of the Byzantine Empire? According to official history, Emperor Constantine moved the capital from Rome to Constantinople. So, at that time, he moved his court and most of the bureaucrats to the new capital. They couldn’t start speaking another language, it means they came with the Latin language. So, at what time - according to historians the official language of the Byzantine Empire was Greek - when did the official transfer actually happen?

He said, maybe sometime in the sixth or the seventh century.

And I said, but the Justinian Codex, the rule of law in the Byzantine
Empire which was produced by Emperor Justinian, it was written in Latin.

And he looked at me . . . he knew that I knew already that the only
original copy was found in the beginning of the sixteenth century -
amazing the sixteenth century - in Italy, in Latin. So there is no
original text in Greek.

And he said, yes it was in Latin.

So I said, excuse me, can you explain to me and to other people, how come that the entire - while the official language was Greek and
everybody presumably spoke Greek, I mean ordinary people - how come they used Latin documents for jurisdiction, for the court, for official documents, because you can’t use an unknown language in the courtroom where you solve the problems of all the people.

Now he said . . . it’s a mystery we haven’t solved yet.

That part bolded directly above? Well, sdcfia, I think most people would be surprised about what percentage of these 'Ancient' Greek and Roman Histories were 'found' in precisely the same way - in a place like Italy in the 16th Century. Hey, look what I found, must be genuine ... err ... a genuine copy, often even in a different language. Nah, we can't tell ya were the actual original is, must've been lost to History, lol ...

World Mysteries - Articles by Garry Kasparov
Garry Kasparov Interview from 2001 | TimothyTaylor.ca

Will Miller's book explain to us how there was this thing the Falsified Chronology calls the Bronze Age, yet metallic Tin (1/2 of what Bronze is made of) was unknown in that time period? How do you pull that one off, sdcfia - make Bronze with no Tin and only Copper?




There is no superficial delving into Fomenko's work. The only thing that can be gained superficially is an overview of his reconstruction and Chronological Shifts. And because that overview one comes away with is so contrary to what they have been told occurred that the asumption is that it can't be true, and is a WASTE of time to investigate. You do whatever you want with your time, sdcfia. Even though if one were to only take into consideration the last 6 months, the time it would've taken to read Fomenko's 7 volumes that provides enough info to start forming some open minded, qualified opinons on how it 'bodes' against King Miller's Truth, well it would've only consumed a fraction of your TNet time. Found the Truth here yet (well, if ya haven't, ya just need to read a little more Nobody, lol). How many years did you spend here looking for that Truth before you registered? Man. Understanding Fomenko's stuff is probably about 0.0X% (at most) of the time you have spent reading posts here at TNet.

Good luck with sticking to that gameplan and strategy in hopes finding Bigger Truths. Yer gonna need it ...



Well, checking Fomenko's Math is something few people on Earth are qualified to do. Considering that is his expertise (an understatement in his case), I am willing to trust he knows how to do Math. Don't confuse that aspect with his overall methodology, logic and data he used when performing those statistical calculations, all of which we can make decisions on regarding the overall suitability of his methods and data set, while not making any sacrifices with trusting his Math. And he uses LOADS of circumstantial evidence (all ANY Historian uses) in addition to whatever Math he brought in regarding the Chronological shifts said Statistical Math indicated.



In Italy, like the Roman Colessium? Built NO EARLIER than about the 1400's. And if I were to ask you to prove to that it was built 2,000 years ago, you know what the only 'solid' evidence you could point to is? Books. A Book handed to us by The Powers That Be said that it was built by some people called Romans who lived there 2,000 years ago. And that book will be a copy of the 'real thing' that has been lost and unknown for 1500 years and just showed up in the hands of a Venetian one day who said, "Here, read this. Trust me, it's all true. No, really, trust me ..." That's all ya really got, sdcfia - that is all anyone, PhD Historians and archaeologists included, really has for 'proof'. You don;t want to look into it, but at least Fomenko brought SCIENCE to the table ...

Your 'in situ' argument is one of a circular nature. Somebody finds a 'long lost, ancient' Greek or Roman Manuscript that mentions this thriving City in what is relayed as Nortehrn Africa in the 1500's. In the 1600's, some dude finds some ruins of some buildings walking around North Africa, scrathces his head, says, "Hey, this Justantinus dude who lived 1500 years ago (cause the book says so) in this copied book just found 50 years ago says there was a thriving city in Nroth Africa 2,000 years ago. Well, hell. Here are some ruins. This must be it.

Voila! Carthage is confirmed and PROVED to have existed in that exact spot 2500 years ago. That is History, sdcfia, that is how all of your in situ stuff got dated, and it was all POST 1600's that it was dated.

And those dates have NEVER BEEN QUESTIONED IN ALMOST 500 years. Just continually accepted and regurgitated, and NEVER, EVER questioned by ANY student of History, just blindly accepted and always looked to circumstantially reinforce. Sounds like an awfully stagnant situation to me, sdcfia, but if you wanna put all yer eggs in that basket, and watch them all fall out the bottom, well, yer choice.

And now, sdcfia, when I ask you to prove Carthage existed 2,000 years ago, you point to some COPY of an 'ancient' manuscript, the original of which nobody knows or has ever seen, unearthed in the 1500's and some ruins in North Africa. And when I ask you to prove that those ruins in North Africa are rements of Carthage, existing when, where and to the extent that manuscript said it did, why you point to the manuscript, again. And to you, a few ruins of a building proves correct the claims of the manuscript, while the manuscript proves the validity of the ruins as Carthage and that they MUST exist WHEN claimed.

And in the end, you have FAR LESS of anything resembling definitive proof about who built those building in situ that you reference than you think. You got one, big circular argument that all began in the 1500's-1600's based largely on COPIES of 'ancient' texts that all just started magically reappearing after centuries of being who knows where.




It is not their existence that is questioned - it is who built and used them, and when. Really, sdcfia? 2,000 years ago in Italy, the technology required (using Roman Numerals, no less, lol) to build something like the Colisiuem existed in an Empire that COVERED all of Western Europe, and then after the Barbarians sack Rome, all of that just disappears for 1,00 years? Were all of the Empire's MULTI-NATIONAL engineers killed? The concept of the Dark Ages is ludicrous. That is not what happens. Infrastructure and technology would not disappear from Europe like that for one thousand years as claimed - for there was TOO MUCH benefit from it, from the commoner and having roads, to the power hunger idiots that would mimic the same infrastructure on a local scale for control, including keeping certain technologies alive.

It is not an issue of fake or real - it is an issue of age.



'Some' things pointed out isn't a word appropriate to do justice to the VOLUME OF ISSUEs TO POINT OUT that don't hold up to scrutiny regarding the Falsified Chronology on multiple levels and from multiple angles. Far more than Math and computer programs are involed here. But, you don't want to waste any of your time looking into that, so, you'll just have to take my word for it, lol.



The only way this could have happened was as a systemic ruse, and yes, Fomenko's work is that COMPLETE and COMPREHENSIVE.



Your call. If yer chatting with me, you are on the Dock of Truth, for that is the only port this Christopher Columbus pulls into. You don;t have to board this Boat of Truth, but I assure you it is the only one out there, and while plenty of other boats may stop here for you to board, well watch where ya step, for the rest of them all carry Bulls with them and you don't want to get yer Sailin' Shoes dirty...

I'm not trying to be combative or insulting in stating that you are in no position to determine how Miller's theory compares against Fomenko's, and how Fomenko then 'bodes'. After I brush up on Miller, I, however, will be in that qualified position to opine such. And I'm tellin' ya right now, if Miller's theory relies upon the 'ancient' Egyptian Dynastic Chornology that got its start with Mantheo, ya know, the guy were are told lived 2,000+ years ago in Alexandria Egypt, and who's original works are lost, but copies just happend to magically apperance out of nowhere circa 1500-1600's, well, I will already tell you with some degree of confidence that Fomenko's DBL DIGIT NUMBER of books already published will not bode well for Miller's theory, as far as crowing him King of Truth on all of this. Starting with this one already published, concerning the dates given by horoscopes from supposed 'ancient' Egypt:

www.hiddenmysteries.org/freebooks/history/Zodiacs.pdf


That St. John comment by Rebel I found interesting, certainly concerning the implications for things over here.

By papal decree, the property of the Templars was transferred to the Order of Hospitallers, which also absorbed many of the Templars' members. In effect, the dissolution of the Templars could be seen as the merger of the two rival orders.[45] Some may have fled to other territories outside Papal control, such as excommunicated Scotland or to Switzerland. Templar organisations in Portugal simply changed their name, from Knights Templar to Knights of Christ.

Hmmm ... let's see. Papal Decree said that everything the Templars owned now belonged to St. John's Secret Society, and Freemasonry is really into St. John. Does that mean that Freemasonry has been acting, over the course of decades, at least, as an arm of the SMOM to get their gold back to them across the Atlantic?

There might be some G-G-G-G-G-Hospitllar Grandsons out there that would disagree with Rog on who has proper and legal Birthright to New Mexico Gold ...

"ROG"... !!! Roger SNOW...? HA! You ARE Roger Snow!

 

[Rebel - KGC]

NOW then... WHO has the "head"/skull of the BAPTIST (John)...? KNIGHTS Templar "of OLD", were accused of worshiping a "Head"/Skull; I will have to do some R & I, as to the TRUE "name"...

 

[Rebel - KGC]

BAPHOMET! LATER KT combined teachings of John the Baptist (Essene, with GNOSTIC "leanings") with Teachings from "SUFI" Islam; I am NOT Freemasonic KT, so... THAT info is from INDEPENDENT Research (R & I); WHO would believe it...? BTW, Freemasonic KT has NOTHING to do with the OLD ORDER... AND! FKT was "stuck" into the YORK RITE DEGREES, 8-10; and SEPARATE... as the COMMANDERY. Apologies to all FKT reading this; your "sword-play" is USELESS, in light of weapons of TODAY!

 

[Rebel - KGC]

MORE R & I (GREAT coffee, here... I am "ON FIRE"!)... HIGHEST ORDER of Knight-hood is Knight of the Grand Cross (KGC) HA! YOUR "Diamond" is in THAT... check it OUT! It came from SUFI Geometry, KT Geometry, The OLD Square & Compass WAS the SEXTANT (Sea-farers would KNOW...), and the CELTIC CROSS was used for "Sun-sighting" on the SEAS.

 

[sdcfia]

Before we explore his stuff, how do yo know Harrison came up with the FIRST chronometer? There are a couple different ways you can look at the chronometer - a really handy damn thing for Sailors and Map Makers, or ...

... Top Secret Military Science. Or, Top Secret Governmetal Science. Or, Top Secret Monastic Science. Or, etc ...

I don't present evidence, only the open minded thought that for as important as that invention was, there would be Groups that MOST DEFINITELY kept such secret for as long as possible ...

I agree with your line of reasoning. As with all things human on earth, we can't be certain exactly what happened before our own experiences. Hell, we can't even be sure what happened re things we witness ourselves. In this respect, I've been hard-wired my entire life into an awareness probably best described by the Greek Skeptics, who argued that humans can never really arrive at any ultimate truths because the tools we have to survive in the physical universe are too limited. This is why some of Fomenko's ideas can't be dismissed, and it's also why they can't be accepted unequivocally. One way or another, we all rationalize our beliefs based on faith, whether arrived at rationally or emotionally.

Hmm ... unrestrained by dogma or doctrine, eh? Lol. Going to his (Crichton Miller) Introduction, I see he is heavily swayed (obliviously so, I am sure) by the Falsified Chronology peer pressure group. sdcfia, that dude is stealing my tag line - After further years of research, Nobody, unrestrained by dogma or doctrine and having no peer group pressure ... lol.

I'm curious enough now that I'll refresh my memory on his stuff as I remember his 'use' for the Celtic Cross was indeed interesting, but I doubt it will provide the insight into Draco that you suspect, and while I will do so open mindedly, his credibility isn't off to good start with me ...

Man, not only are you crowning Miller King 'O Truth without reading his book, but you are claiming Miller's work defeats the work of someone else, that you haven't read either. sdcfia, for whatever cool stuff Miller may be onto, it better be one damn impressive and comprehensive theory to pull that off.

My interest in Miller is strictly to verify for myself that his reconstruction of measuring instruments found in the Giza pyramid can be used to determine longitude at any global location. That's all. I may even construct an instrument myself as part of the process, although I don't believe that will be necessary. I don't give a whit about Miller's character, claims, beliefs or agendas. If his theory can be validated in my mind, the results will speak for themselves. Who possessed this knowledge over the centuries, how and when it may have been used, and why it may have been suppressed is open to speculation.

For whatever Truth Miller may be on to with the uses of the Celtic Cross, I wouldn't try to bury Fomenko with it, and claim it does anying resembling boding unwell for his work. I doubt it will answer any of the Issues we have been told that Chess Champion Gary Kasparov raised INDEPENDENTLY of Fomenko, either.

You've stated previously that your interests lately are focused beginning ca 1000 CE, presumably extending to the present - as revealed by Fomenko et al. You may be absolutely on point, but my response is that since I can't verify Fomenko's celestial and analytical math used to prove his theories, he's just another expert with a belly button. Same goes for the chess master. These guys are brilliant, yes, but that doesn't make their new religions any more true than all the old ones. A generation ago, Pierre Plantard and others dropped the Priory of Scion bomb on us too, embraced by many. We can't be sure about him either. I can't crucify Fomenko on Miller's cross (ha ha, good one), but I can verify Miller's allegations - that's all.

 

[Rebel - KGC]

Heh... WHERE was CC sailing from...? He sailed under the "KT Flags", because he had "access" to the OLD ORIGINAL Knights Templar MAPS! In a "sense"... he WAS KT! Think about it... NOW! Colorado, was the FIRST HQ of OAK (Order of American Knights)... w/o KGC (Knights of the Golden Circle); FULL of YANKEE capitalists, $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ to connect the East & West coasts of a UNITED Nation. FIRST OAK was HQ'ed in NYC with KGC (Teddy knew about this)... 357. 3rd degree of KGC, with 5-7 FILTHY RICH, OLD men "into" Railroads, STEEL, OLD RESTORATIONS (Colonial, as in Williamsburg, Va.), etc. Look at Denver, Colorado AIRPORT; first by SEA... then, LAND... now, AIR! Hmmm... It ALL started with the KT... in Portugal/Spain.

 

[sdcfia]

So, I assume you feel then, that the only right and just thing to do is open all of the prison doors, for no Truth can be known by anyone about anything without having personally witnessed and experienced it, rendering all jury decisions MORALLY AND ETHICALLY INVALID? Sheesh. You sound one step away from Nihilism, lol.

Ha, ha... to quote the late, great Alvin Lee, "I'd like to change the world, but I don't know what to do/so I'll leave it up to you". On the other hand, I did have a great affinity for Pink Floyd too.

Hell, I know I irritate the helloutta some all ya'll, think of it as chance to debunk my and put me in my place - but you cannot attempt that without at least reading that 7 volume set, the book I linked to, and a general reconstruction he put together on his website. I'm Triple Dog Darin' any one of you Baby Boomers (or Secret Society Fella) that finds me irritating to try to make me look the idiot with this stuff, lol.

I eat up many of your posts Nobody, but Fomenko in toto is a bust for me so far. Sorry - no way am I gonna read three or four thousand pages for him or you. Frankly, I'd rather re-read the Flashman series. You're a lot younger than me, with fire in the belly, so you do it. Then give us an honest critical review.

There is no smartarsery or attack behind my pointing out that you are in NO position to speak upon the 'acceptance' and its equivocalness of Fomenko's research - for you have done nothing more than gloss over the Abstract, quite briefly and incompletely. I also suspect the glossing was done with some partial closure of the mind, and with the pervasive cloud of pessimism that hangs over you with your philosophical outlook and your estimation as to anyone's (not just yours, but everyone's) odds at being able to sift out any significant amount of the Truth from what is available to us.

And I point that pessimism out, not to be contentious, but to make sure everyone reading this recognizes it, for I would prefer them not to be persuaded by it, as I find it an incorrect mindset to Truth Research. And it is nothing less than a self-imposed closed mindedness ...

Really? Yeah, well, I am in a position not to accept Fomenko. And that's where I stand for the time being. Been down this road before - with proselytizers, conservatives, liberals, cultists, recruiters, revolutionaries, and sellers of tickets to see the two-headed dog. I'm familiar with many fringe theorists, including the Russian. He's merely a contender.

Incidentally, sdcfia, since L.C. was asking for interpretations of horizontal diamonds on KGC trails that can be found in 'different' forms, think KvM's ToVoS and LUE might be relevant in trying to figure it out? That like L.C., KvM was on the Treasure Trails of some Fellas that like to leave diamonds, as well as other things, with age and which Fella's trail he was tracking (or, laying down and documenting a new one, for he was a Fella, too) being the real question?

I'm not presumptuous enough to offer any opinions re the interpretation of KGC signs.

You get hung up on what you want, sdcfia, but I hope you are not encouraging others to get hung up on your 'I can't verify Fomenko's celestial and analytical math used ...' thing that leads you to the 'therefore, I can never know if he is 'right' about any of it, will certainly not 'waste' any of my precious TNet time looking into it open mindedly'. No, sdcifa, you will never be able to check the 'math and applied celestial mechanical math' of a dude who not only holds doctorates in Mathematics and Physics, but is the Head of teh Department of Differential Equations at Moscow University, a member of the prestigious Russian Academy of Science (something like that name), and well respected by his peers in that realm of mathematics and applying mathematics to real world problems. Few people can do so, and they are all going to have a PhD. in Mathematics and/or Physics.

Yeah, he's a peach.

I don't encourage anyone to follow my line of reasoning.

sdcfia, do ya know who your worst enemy and what the biggest obstacle to figuring any of this out is? You ...

I've heard that one a few times! Look, that approach has failed with me since Sunday School when I was seven years old.

 

[Rebel - KGC]

Lol. Nah, just similar tastes in dogs, lol. Different Bloodlines, Rebel. Rog comes from the Guys who have to ride two-to-a-horse, like they are missing one, or sumpin'. Me, well, I come from Horse Thieves outta Luxembourg, the Mountain of Light. And the Royal Scott/Scythian Line ...



Interesting take on the Baphomet. And while I will open mindedly entertain that line of thought about the origins of the Baphomet, I'm still gonna tell ya that hanging out in Clubhouses with pieces and parts of dead parts of people 'venerated' by the Craft, well sounds like Halloween might be going on 24/7/365 at some Lodges, no matter who the body part belongs to ...

Cemeteries are where dead pieces of people reside and Death Cults frequent. Don't make your Clubhouse a Cemetery, too, I say ...

Col Chivington, the Fighting Parson. Also responsible for the Sand Creek Massacre, where old ladies' and children's skulls were bashed in with rifle butts, and female bodies Ritually violated, like private parts being cut out and paraded around on horse pommels and sticks. Babies cut out of dead mothers, that sorta good clean Masonic Led Battlefield Fun ...

And no, Rebel, I don't accuse you or any other Mason reading this of being guilty by association, nor capable yoursleves of such horrific and evil acts. However, you don't get it both ways - you don't get to claim a benign Organization that operates completely in the background, and is only concerned with making its Members 'Better Men' - or perfect Saturnian Cubes (Yikes!), yet ignore or deny its members seem to always be at the forefront of things. Like Chivington, Franklin, Washington, Jefferson, et al.

Like the Mason Trotsky. Like the Mason Hitler, etc.

Rebel us non-Masons can listen to what All Ya'll say, or we can watch what All Ya'll do. And You Guys aren't all that keen on saying too much, so ...

Anyway, Chivington's Baphomet he had was not of John the Bapist, but of a 'spanish bandit' named Espisito (pretty sure that is the name, close if not). This is information, Rebel, that Chivington had that head in a jar, that baphomet in the Clubhouse basement, was delivered to me by one of the most respected Colorado College Historians in Denver 20+ years ago in a Colorado History class. I believed him, but you are free to believe neither of us, if you choose. IIRC, Chivington was instrumental in geting the Central City (gold rush town) Lodge set it up, and it has Templar ties via artwork, etc.

Chivington was alos part of some Civil War shennanigans in the Civil War on Glorietta Pass in NM. It was north/south battle, but there were some sketchy type things that occurred - and on Glorietta Pass, which seems to have some KGC/Jmaes ties.

Let me ask ya sumpin', Rebel. How do your Hindu Brothers feel about the FACT that Masonry openly venerates the Abrahamic Religions ?...? From St. John the Catholic who was nothing less than a Military Field General for the Vatican, to John the Baptist's Head with the Templars (Masonic Founding Father type Fellas), to a whole bunch more ...

Nah, Freemasonry isn't still, and hasn't been, the Arm of the European Oligarchs or the Vatican, lol ...

How many highranking Masons are also SMOM, Rebel?



Well, one take has it he married into the Knights of Christ, and the info came from his Father-in-Law. I can also point you in the direction of a guy with a PhD iin Patristics from Oxford that says taht the Genoese we call Columbus got his info in Constantinople, from teh Byzantine archives.

Well, the paintings say he sailed under the KT flag. MAybe they are correct, maybe not. Have any more sources of evidence? For if he was sailing under the KT Flag, Rebel, it might have looked a little more like this:

View attachment 1218333



Colorado has far less discussed about it on this site for as important a role it was, the wealth coming out of it immediately post-Civil War with the Gold Rush, the internal political shennanigans, etc., than it should, IMO.

You are speaking of Colorado Springs, of course. And the Pike Memorial Highway runs into Colorado just south of there, up the Ark into Pueblo. And then, west of Pueblo, the Treasure Legend released to the newspapers in the 30's by Alberta Pike. Spanish gold, found out about by 'recently acquired Spanish documents', lol. And the Red Cross at the cave site is, of course, labeled as a 'Spanish Cross', lol.

Man, why you wanna bring up DIA? That'll bring the REAL crazies out, lol. You can get lost on YouTube about DIA murals (though these are a bit creepy), reptillians, underground tunnels, etc., lol. Then you got that creepy arsed horse that greets you, that the locals have nicknamed Bluecifer, lol. The original sculptor was actually killed by this sculpture before he finished it.

He was killed in his studio on June 13, 2006, when a large section of Blue Mustang, intended for Denver International Airport, fell on him and severed an artery in his leg.

How creepy is that, Rebel? The sculptor of this Creepy-Arsed Demon Horse was killed - Bled to death - by it. And there She Stands, greeting all who enter the OAK's Airport, eh? What the Hell does all of that mean in that Symbolic, Masonic sorta way Brutha Rebel? If you drive into the OAK's DIA, this is what you are greeted with (I think it is still there -don't really drive to DIA much, lol). The one picture is for an idea of size - it's big:

View attachment 1218356View attachment 1218355

Creepy, eh? Red eyes and veins on the belly, and all. All this talk about the Pale Horse, but maybe it is the Blue Horse one needs to look the hell out for, lol. I ride a Pale Horse - a Cream with brown strip and white top 1978 Bronco, lol. I know you Baby Boomers know that Ford Cream color, lol. She's a good 'ol girl, and neither her, nor I, are anything to be afraid of. I might keep my eye on the Riders of the Blue Horse, though, were I all ya'll ...

Know anything about the symbolism of that Horse you can share with non-Secret Society Folks, Rebel ?...?

HA! LOTTA questions; Hindu Bros are OK... To EACH, IT IS GIVEN, ACCORDING TO UNDERSTANDING. RACE, CULTURE, HOLY BOOK(S), etc. John was a BAPTIST/ESSENE (JEWISH), NOT Catholic. Sov. Military Order of Malta is in MALTA or across the "little pond". There IS a degree on Knights of Malta in the Freemasonic Knights Templar... AND! I am NOT FKT; wouldn't know more than that... As MASTER MASONS, we are advised that we are FRIENDS (BROTHERS) to PIRATES & CORSAIRS... any more questions? OH! Forgot the BLUE HORSE! THAT is OAK... (Singing Rolling Stones song...) WILD HORSES! WILD, WILD HORSES... Look for "M", as in Mithraism.

 

[Rebel - KGC]

LAST R & I for tonight; Thomas Jefferson was NOT a Freemason; A. Hitler was NOT a Freemason, HE actively destroyed the Lodges in Germany... Masons had to wear the BLUE "Forget Me NOT" flower in their lapels to "show member-ship"; L. Trotsky was a member of a JEWISH Masonic Lodge... BTW; as A. Hitler was growing up, he WAS active in the Roman Catholic Church, was an Altar Boy or something.

 

[Rebel - KGC]

HA! Want MORE great stuff...? Check out P2 of Italy...

 

[sdcfia]

sdcfia, back down the pride a bit, for you are not as open minded as you think, nor have you shook free from the Shackles you think you have ...

Thanks for the life lesson. I remember a Scientologist telling me that, almost verbatim, about forty years ago.

Your posts Nos. 47 and 48 are typical of the reason some people respond to you. Challenging allegations backed by a strong argument, valid logic and a stream of attainable evidence. Fomenko? Interesting allegation but a poor job of selling it, Nobody. It's on you.

 

[L.C. BAKER]

L.C., I wouldn't mind reading your thoughts expounding upon your comment of everyone being in bed pre-Civil War, in the sense of what individual Groups do you identify as comprising the 'everyone', and against whom where the waging War from the bedroom?

I will try to make this simple so I can understand it. Lets just say for simple reference, that your life is represented by a line of people waiting to get whatever they want or can imagine they want or need the most in their life. The thing they (and you) want or need can be tangible or anything that is possible if the right things were in place to make it happen for you.....and the thing that can make what your waiting for happen is at the head of the line behind a guarded door. At this point you are at a crossroads in life. Lets call it manhood, or the age of manhood (womanhood too if you had prior arrangements (mostly spying for the organization and by marriage (depending on who your Daddy or Mommy was and how much you were tied to certain projected future money/business etc.).

" If my son marries your daughter....then that will secure our names/ bloodline/ secret organization's money and operations for future generations (insert infinity symbol here)"
What is commonly known as a prenuptial agreement is not a new idea either legally or culturally.
"People have been making prenuptial agreements for thousands of years. Scholars tell us that the practice dates back to the ancient Egyptians, and that prenups have existed for many centuries in Anglo-American tradition.

So...back to standing in that life line....As you stand there thinking about what you want out of your life you notice an older man walk up and talk to another young man who is standing about twenty people behind you in the line. The two of them speak and then the older man takes the young guy out of line by the arm and walks him all the way to the door at the front and the guards open it and the two men go inside. At the end of that day you are almost to the door and this same young man that went inside earlier with the older man steps outside the door and tells the guards "we" are not seeing anyone else today send them home.

Although it is different today and there are a lot more rules laws and regulations in place to try and prevent it (each of them a hollow victory) MONEY talks and B.S. walks away mumbling "they can't do that...CAN They?" To sum it up, I was asked by Nobody who was in bed with who... It was like a soap opera that started before the first monopoly and it continues running now, but with thousands of spin-offs which makes the line to that door we spoke of so far away from you that you can't see it and never will unless.....a man or woman walks up to you someday while you are in line.....speaks to you and then takes you by the arm and walks you to the door.

L.C.

P.S. Although the team and the game are always changing, the goal of the game is still achieved at the same end of the playing field. What you have presented on these and other threads has been good speculation and to answer your question of who was in bed, just focus on the facts and the money trails, because that was and still is their ultimate goal.

 

[L.C. BAKER]

Thanks for the life lesson. I remember a Scientologist telling me that, almost verbatim, about forty years ago.

Your posts Nos. 47 and 48 are typical of the reason some people respond to you. Challenging allegations backed by a strong argument, valid logic and a stream of attainable evidence. Fomenko? Interesting allegation but a poor job of selling it, Nobody. It's on you.

What is speculation? It starts by weeding things out of a patch of B.S. as it progresses it is harder to prove if that is a weed or perhaps an offspring of the original that has crossbred many generations. Nothing is for sell here, ........just the facts, and facts lead to allegation. I consider everything you guys talk about and anylize it and weed it out, and I appreciate every weed and flower you guys and gals have left. I have been busy and have not had time to catch up for a while. You can't run me off! I am in the HEARTLAND WINTER is coming!!!!!!

L.C.

 

[Rebel - KGC]

OK, YOU stated you had TWO trees with "symbols" ("post" # 5); THAT is the "bottom" of "triangulation". The UPPER part is when the SUN is directly overhead, with the "TREASURE" being where the SUN shines onto. franklin is correct. HH! Good Luck!

 

[sdcfia]

Hey Nobody, I didn't speak for "the people" - I spoke for "some people", including myself and a couple others - remember? Anyway, thanks for the reading list. It's a start. By the way, if I feel I need your help with my life, you'll be the first to know. Same thing I told the Scientologist. Not a potshot at you - just a friendly reminder that people are who they are, not who you want them to be.

And, no, I'm not comparing you with Hubbard - I don't see you as a cynical huckster. By the way, I was in Haight-Ashbury in '67, but I was also there in '63, when there was a there there. Ironically, that Haight thing could be seen as a sort of twisted analogy to Hubbard's gig. In '63 the place was a haven for poets, philosophers and free thinkers. By '67 it was a refugee camp for runaways, gawkers and predators. Kinda parallels L Ron's science fiction/religious career in a way - kind of a fractal analogy, huh, Nobody? I've often wondered if human ideas, advancements, retracings, religions and histories follow fractal patterns.

 

[sdcfia]

Nice recovery attempt sdcfia, lol. Take care. Think I'm gonna follow the advice of the guy who told me not to trust you ...

Probably a good idea. You ought to consider putting me on "Ignore" while you're at it.

 

[L.C. BAKER]

"Yea ... that's really not my sorta thang, L.C. I was in that Line. Then, when I was 13, I got the hell outta it. Told one of those Old Men that I though his lIne sucked, and wasn;t buying the Promise that was supposedly behind the Door, either. Looked for another Line to stand in at another Door for awhile, with the Door with a Spiritual Truth sign above being the one I was really looking for. After a couple decades, I let the front of my mind resign itself to apathetic pessimism sometimes labeled as Agnostic, or givng up, 'for there is no way my worthless, feeble mind can ever reach any Truths about anything". Focused on having fun in Life. Accomplished that. With some not-so-Fun stupid stuff thrown in there, too. 3 deacdes later, well, it is a different story. Had a little April Uprising 4.5 years ago, and an interesting Dog Days of Summer this last Summer." - NOBODY
The line just represents your lifetime on this earth. Everything you describe above happened while you were in that line and continues to this day. The line of your life is not straight. The shape you make your piece of it only determines where it will fit in the big picture. To be asked behind the door represents having that door and every other door you need to go through in life opened for you until you reach a place where you can see the "BIG PIC TURE". That is what it means to be inside the secret organization that grew from the K.G.C. and O.A.K. into what ever it is called today. Just my two cents as always.

P.S. Even when you two argue with each other I have to study to understand what the pissing match is about...... That is what it is all about, gaining knowledge on subjects that are not discussed among most people. That makes us an extraordinary group of people. Back in the day they were called wise men, and I am sure they were all a little hard to talk to without offending them on a regular basis. Keep up the discussion it is all good.

 

[KANACKI]

Hola LC Baker I must say I have really enjoyed your posts.

While there has been much debate here about various claims of the amount of impact of their organization on American history and their evolution? I do profess not to have the expertise on matter or have had the time and liberty to follow up on the many quotes that you have kindly presented here. Which clearly shows the amount of research you must of taken and about a lifetime to acquire. Truly a labor of love even if some times it can be a thankless one And for that I thank you for the interesting insights and sharing them.

So in respect of the much of you shared Here is a newspaper article from 1862 in which you probably already have.





For me I came across a treasure information connected to William Walker and his series of Filibustering expeditions in Mexico, Nicaragua and Honduras. Whose expeditions was clearly part of bigger agenda largely influenced by manifest destiny and Gen. George Bickley experiences 1846 Mexican American war and the early ideologies of KCG.

Anyway kudos for all the interesting research on the subject your have done.

Cheers Kanacki

 

[Rebel - KGC]

No worries, looked like you could use some help. No, sdcfia, I don't think you remember such conversation, for you can't know any such thing with any certainty whatsoever, even if you experienced it empirically, and certainly not if it occurred 40 years ago. And since none of us were there to witness it, too, there is NO WAY you can actually expect any of us to believe that, for it happened in the past, and we were not there to see it, so that conversation is forever lost to us, never to be reconstructed, no matter how hard we try, for our minds are just too damn feeble, and our memories too unreliable. And hell, 40 years ago you were around Height-Ashbury, so if you actually had that conversation with someone, it was probably with a giant purple caterpillar named Herb that Timothy Leary introduced you to.

Remember? You said so yourself, about your (and our - thanks for speaking for the feeblness of everyone's minds, and letting us all know how incapable we are) lack of being able to know any of that with any certainty. Did the Sceintologist mention anything about your pessimistic philosophical view that impedes open mindedness?

I think you are just taking another shot at me, comparing me to a Scientologist, lol. And forget not, sdcfia, that observation of mine is actually just me repeating and rephrasing your own admission - no way in hell am I going to read 3,000-4,000 pages of anything in my search for Truth and the Big Picture, even if I have been presented with evidnece that ther could be something VERY worng with the Chronology, and ceratinly not from another Russian fringe Theorist. And you proceeded to then say things like it was a new religion, no different than anything else, etc.; namely CLOSE MINDEDLY labeling and judging it, stereotypically, without any REAL knowledge of it.

I simply provided a concise, clinical definition of it all sdcifa, and if the shoe fits, wear it. I'm glad you found benefit in that life advice, and hope, for your sake, you make efforts everyday to employ it. And if you don't like wearing that shoe, well, it is up to you to change shoes. And if you got more than one person telling you the EXACT same thing about yourself, maybe we might be on to something. Denial ain't jsut a river in The Empire's Royal Graveyard and Necropolis, sdcfia.

From a Snake Oil Man with a new religion based upon nohting more than forever unprovable allegations to now being more defintively defined as Sceintologist-like, with of course Sceintology being nothing more than a new religion/cult at the hands of Hubbard. Lol. Well, sdcfia, since you got me all figured out on this and what a bunch of bunk I'm selling with my prosteletyzing, as well as Fomenko's stuff, I might as well spill the beans. Tell ya who some of the past Grand Masters of this cult are. But ya gotta stop calling it a new religion, for the GMs go back cneturies.

DeArcilla - 16th century Professor at Salmanca University who determined that 'ancient' History was forged in teh Middle Ages.

Issac Newton - (1643-1727) Concluded the chronology of the Classical Age was wrong, and even attempted his own corrected version of the Chronology.

Jean Hardouin - (1646-1729) Eminent French scientist and Director of the French Royal Library concluded that most 'ancient artifacts' were either counterfeit or much more recent than claimed.

Peter Krekshin (1684 -1763) Personal Secretary of Peter the Great. Concluded the same kind of stuff about the Chronology.

Robert Baldauf - (late 1800's-1900's) German scholar of Basel University wrote 4 volumes on the issue, concluding that the 'ancient' literary works are much more recent than claimed.

Edwin Johnson (1842-1901) English Historian who concluded that the Falsified Chronology needs to be drastically truncated.

Nikolai Morozov (1854-1946) Prominent Russian scientist and Encyclopedist. Same conclusions. He wrote a book about it, lectures, etc.

Wilhelm Kammeyer (?-1959) German scientist and lawyer who developed a method of verifying the age of 'ancient' documents, and discovered nearly all 'ancient' and Mediaeval Western European documents to be either copied or forged in a more recent time.

Nobody - (1972- ) One Cool Arsed Cat who smelled sumpin' fishy by age 13, and called a meeting with a Jesse with a PhD in History to let 'em know I ain't buyin' it.

There is at least eight different people (respected scientist type folks, no less), from differtn countries, cultures, time periods, and educational/professional backgrounds who all independently came to the conclusoin that not only is the Falsified Chronology worng, but that it was wrong by being elongated and way too long. They not only discovered a problem, tehy discovered the SAME problem. Independently and via different methods.

Yea, a real new religion with a bunch of cultist Snake Oil Men, lol. And of course, while proudly proclaiming your decision to look no furhter into it or understand it, you continue to stereotypically and PEJORATIVELY label it and me.

Let's go back to that Gloriously Awesome year of 1972 that bore me in the Spring. American astrophysicist Robert Newton publishes a paper dealing with Lunar acceleration over the course of a couple thousand years. When it was all said and done, an unexpected and unexplainable 'leap' occurred in one of the acceleration parameters, and it was a big one. It was of the magnitude of a whole mathematical order, and it occurred around the X century. Didn't make sense. So a little later that year there was some amount of controversy about it all and the Royal Society of London and the British Academy of Sciences organized a discussion about it. They came up with nothing. In the end, Robert Newton suggested that they just write the whole thing off as being caused by some mysterious extra-gravitaional forces in the Earth-Moon system.

Lol. "Ah hell, boys, we can't figure it out. Why don't we just call it 'Magic' and go get some bangers and mash down at the pub and call it a day."

In 1973, Fomenko became aware of the problem and began to work on it. One thing he discovered is that NOBODY questioned the veracity of the data set. The data set included dates for Lunar and Solar eclipses that had occurred going back to the first century. Never did any of those guys question if the dates given by the Falsified Chronology were correct. Fomenko had heard of Morozov's work, but in no way was anything resembling a subscriber. And when he found Morzov's book and used some of the corrected astronomical tables for dates, he was still a skeptic of the whole notion - he was jsut being a good, critical, open minded scientist and looking for a solution and way to determine the validity and accuracy of the original data set.

When he plugged Morozov's numbers into Robert Newton's algorithm's, that mysterious, and significantly and quite abnormally large 'leap' in acceleration around the X century disappeared, and everything behaved as it should and was expected. Use the right data set, and you don't have to invent Magic Forces. From there, the next question is obvious. Why are the dates of the Falsified Chronology so apparently wrong, and what are the correct ones?

And the rest is History, lol. Scientologist. Gimme a break, dude. Third time now, sdcfia, I am pointing out how petty you are being with your new religion, no different than a Scientologist prosletyizing fdor a cult comparisons and labels. And Fomnenko, of course, your 'just another' Russian Fringe Theorist, whom, you, of course, claim to know all about and have all figured out, just like all of the other Russian Fringe Theorists. Lol. You got friends here, sdcfia, and even if they won;t admit it, or come defend you out of loyalty, it is jsut as clear to them how silly and petty you are being with your continued labeling of me as a seller of a new religion. firnge theorist, etc.

All it does, sdcfia, is validate your closemindedness you proudly procaliam and announce with your personal philosophy (as well as your own claimed personal inability to change that 'hard-wired' pessimism), as well as your perpetual and self-limitng pessimism that not just you (nah yer bold enough (lack of persumption my arse) to claim you know my mental limitations, as well as everyone else's), but nobody can figure any of this out, sort through any of the mess in the Treasure Field, etc. We are all just too damn stupid and feeble minded. You are validating things about yourself with all of those cheapshots, sdcfia, not convincing anybody that I am a Snake Oil Salesman and that Fomenko is nothing but another 'Russian fringe theorist', not worth anyone's time to look into. And certainly not worth anyone's time if the work can't be presented in some Instant Gratification, no work or effort on your part form, and if ya gotta read more than a couple hundred pages to get to the Truth of things, well forget it, 'cause our minds are too feeble to figure it out anyway, so why bother ...

And while you get all giddy over a little book by a guy claiming to have the last 10,000+ years of human civilization all figured out because he figured out a 'use' for the Celtic Cross, you call a new religion/fringe theory something from a highly trained and respected scientist who spent 3,000-4,000 pages trying to reconstruct a much more modest time frame of just the last 1,000 years, only 1/10 of the Truth Miller promises. I guess if a researcher can promise you 10,000 more years of 'The Answer' for 10 times less reading material, you are all over it, proclaiming it the King of Truth and Defeater of the Snake Oil Salesman, Russian Fringe Theorist Fomenko. And not only does Fomenko call for OUTSIDE, MULTIDISCINPLINARY collaboration and review of his work, I don't 'sell' Fomenko as THE SOLUTION AND ULTIMATE TRUTH. I neither agree with 100% of his reconstruction, nor do I claim that ALL Truth is found therein - you will have to look elsewhere, too. But I do claim this a huge piece of the puzzle. A game cahnger that WILL affect your other research. And for the serious researcher, much of your research will be for naught and out of context if yo ulack proper Historical perspective of it all.

And this includes my Masonic Brothers. And while I, non-Mason may be consider to speaking form a position of ignorance and wrong on some things, I consider my Masonic Brothers to be quite turned around in many of their Traditions, so they really don;t know what the hell they are talking about concerning some of this stuff. And, yes, being a non-Mason, I am at a greater disadvantage in the field dealing with Treasure clues. But an X-Marks the spot is not my ultimate goal, so it is not neccessary. And I assure all ya'll don;t bet against me unless you have gold you can afford to lose ...



When did you start speaking for 'the people'? And why do you assume you know why I post here and who I am actually talking to?



Again, you are speaking of Fomenko's work as if you actually no more tahn the frist damn thing about it. You don't. You can't even answer Kasparov's questions, and instead of attempting to answer them, you skipped to calling Kasparov a purveyor of just another 'new religion', and by extension, of course, not to be taken seriously or any time wasted looking into.

BUt, sdcfia, those very reasonable, very logical, and very critically thoughtful questions Kasparov posed, you cannot answer. If that cannot stimulate even a modicum of curiosity out of you to at the very least stop pejorative labeling it as you continue to do, well I don't' know what else you expect out of me. Am I supposed to drive down to NM every night, tuck you into bed and spoonfeed you the stuff and read you to sleep every night? And sdcfia, I don't care if you look into it or not. I am however, not all that hip, obviously, to you continuing to try to persuade every one else reading that Fomenko is a Snake Oil man, and just another fringe theorist, for it is incredibly inaccurate and is being spoken by someone that doesn;t know what the hell they are talking about concerning the issue, even though that person is continuing to speak as if they do ...

Last pot shot is yours, sdcfia, if you feel the need to take another one (why stop now, yer on a roll). All done here. I could provide you with an extensive list of questions to ask yourself, all like Kasparov's, but, you'll just ignore them, pretend they don't exist and that they don't INDICATE A VERY SERIOUS problem with the Historical Chronology, a problem that has implications for everything discussed here, and tell everyone it is all new religion crap, and to not waste their time looking into it ...

I was told by someone that knows you very well to not trust you. With the behavior I am seeing outta ya here, that person may have been right, but you are welcome to PM me if you feel that advice was incorrect or misunderstood by myself ...

L.C., it is clear that whether one agrees or disagrees with anythign I say, I'm a Big Picture Guy, always. And I consider a great portion of this Treasure Stuff, including pretty much all of the KGC stuff, involved in that Big Picture. For a non-Mason, when it comes to things like KGC Diamonds, one of the things that might come in handy is trying to trace its origins and who all has used such symbolism. And when you start tracing those origins, there is no avoiding dealing with the Historical Chronology. Hence my reason for speaking about it here.

I am a very direct and blunt person, and, well, I got a mouth on me, for sure. And diplomacy always struck me as a bunch a pomp and circumstance and pretty much nothing short of being dishonest with your ture thoughts and feelings. Not me sorta thang. However, sdcfia is not the mud slinger I am, and I never really expected him to participate in anything that was going to result in a whole bunch of insults going back and forth, really jacking up your thread. And I am done with anymore public conversation regarding that back and forth.



You and I are essentially on the same page with a lot of things, it seems. I define it as the Oligarchical Power Structure of the World, and it includes Bloodlines/Families and Institutions, like the Vatican. And yes, it is Old and very, very well Established. I bet we might diverge a bit on the tracing back, for I obviously stop around 1,000 A.D., as that is really the only Historical Record we have to go off of, and, quite frankly, nobody, including Fomenko (his acknowledgement, too), knows what the hell was going on more than 1,000 years ago, let alone the 10,000-40,000 years Miller, and many other researchers, claims to have all sorted out. Or even the probably 3,000+ years teh Masons incorrectly think they have all figured out. And at that point in time, circa 1,000 A.D., there was The Empire. Included in the Bloodline spinoffs are the Priest Class, Administrative & Banking Classes, Military Classes, etc.



I consider it more that some players are exterminated/drop-out of the Game, while 'new' Groups jump on in and start playing in a continuous type cycle. And while these New Groups can make some waves, there are still those Groups that have been firmly established for centuries. I and while those older Groups have waxed and waned to some degree over that course of time in power, well, they are still there. And my opinion is that for whatever Good Guys are involved in that Game, they're getting their arses kicked. And my Research indicates to me that we are on the brink of a lot of bad stuff, unlike anyone alive right now has experienced (I'm including WWII in this).

We're running outta time Fellas, and I haven't seen enough progress out of the Good Guys to have any faith in them and their strategies. And the Bad Guys right now, well they're doin' just fine, with big 'ol 'stuff' eatin' grins on their faces, both from their current success and their anticipation of what is to come. This Information Age window we have available to us to use right now to save ourselves will NOT stay open unless we make it stay open ...

I have followed no small amount of money trails. Regarding the KGC, not to the extent you have, to be sure, but I have seen enough significant money trails leaving the US, to be more concerned with those right now. An Oxford PhD'ed guy I reference also has an interesting theory out there under the title of The Banksters of Babylon. It is meaningful to Them, in a tailismanic sorta a way, for us to be lusting after things with their symbology all over it. There is more going on with some fo this stuff than is found in the typical paper trail. And littered throughout all of this stuff, Treasure Legends included, is some of that Other Realm stuff. My opinion, of course.

I don't want to come across like really disagreeing with you, but money is NOT their ultimate goal, or only ultimate type goal. You got a Soul, Brutha, just like I do L.C. Them things are worth more than gold to some Folks, L.C. Make no mistake those have been battled over. And make no mistake that while they most definitely love money, want more of it than anyone else, want control of it on a global scale, etc., there is more to this War that is going on. And it is actually the 'more' that I am ultimately interested in, including with this Treasure stuff, for there still remains, throughout the land, the remnants of those Evil Priests and the Souls they tormented trapped. Ever deal with and do something about one of those 'places' with that Hex type stuff? Shaman Nobody has. Took care of one a couple months ago at an Illuminati Joint in Bear Creek Canyon. Man, L.C., the Halloween type stuff I had going on during the Dog Days of Summer in that Canyon, hell that whole Canyon going back 15 years with me, well, YOWSERS, lol. A little on-site guidance from a pure white Vesica Pieces, and was able to set someone free, though. Saw it happen.

Crazy talk, eh? Lol. Try living it - the intersection of Crazy and Creepy as Hell ...

And that World of 1,000 Points of Light that you hear Death Cult Secret Society Members (like Bonesmen) speak of with glee in their voice as to our getting close to achieving that, well, I MOST DEFINITELY ASSURE all ya'll you don't want ANYTHING to do with a world of the Death Cult's 1,000 Points of Light.

Someone has to undo the Work of those Evil Priests and put a stop to that 1,000 Points of Light Terror. See anyone else volunteering for that L.C.? Or even aware of it? You're doing great tracking that money trail, L.C., that you share with us all to read. I'm going to go work on sumpin' else. And I won't be (or haven't been) talking about it at TNet ...



Yea ... that's really not my sorta thang, L.C. I was in that Line. Then, when I was 13, I got the hell outta it. Told one of those Old Men that I though his lIne sucked, and wasn;t buying the Promise that was supposedly behind the Door, either. Looked for another Line to stand in at another Door for awhile, with the Door with a Spiritual Truth sign above being the one I was really looking for. After a couple decades, I let the front of my mind resign itself to apathetic pessimism sometimes labeled as Agnostic, or givng up, 'for there is no way my worthless, feeble mind can ever reach any Truths about anything". Focused on having fun in Life. Accomplished that. With some not-so-Fun stupid stuff thrown in there, too. 3 deacdes later, well, it is a different story. Had a little April Uprising 4.5 years ago, and an interesting Dog Days of Summer this last Summer.

Now L.C., I've come back to those Lines at age 43, after 30 years of not standing in them with the rest of all ya'll. But, I ain;t standing around waiting in Line, hoping, this time, that old beestard will come out and pick me to be the lucky one. I ain't in Line, L.C. I am currently next to it. Running full speed at that Guard. And when I get to him, I am going to speed up, lower that Aries head of mine, and Kick that Door Wide The You-Know-What Open using him. Slam that Gaurd right through that Door, knocking him out cold and that Door of the Hinges. All ya'll are more then welcome to follow me through that doorway, but ya might wanna gimme a couple minutes first. I'm mean to make a helluva mess in there and jack some 'stuff' and Folks up ...

Someone has to do it, L.C. Someone has to not fear the Nimrod and tell it to kiss their arse. And do something about it. Go kick Nimrod's arse. And if it isn't done now, your kid is screwed (if our generation isn't first), and s/he is going to mad as hell at us, for we pissed away the one chance we had to do something before it was too late. Think there is no way in hell I can do it? Watch me ...

L.C., I know ya think I can't. That there is no way I am going to make it through that gaurd, or that I am even at the right Door. And I know Masons are probably shaking there heads, snikerin' a bit, thinkin', "Ah, poor guy, he doesn't know everything, and he doesn't know the things about Masons and Masonry that I do, the Truths I do." But, the thing is, I am looking at Masons, concerning some of their important Traditions, and thinkin', "Ah, poor Fellas. They don;t know everything they think they do, even about their own Institution. And they don;t want to acknowledge this, even though the very structure of said Institution is of the structure that MUST exist an order for those Fellas to think they have more figured out about what is going on, with EVERYTHING, than they actually do. And be completely unaware of any misdirections or disinfo they may have encountered/fed, along the way. Hell, they don;t even get to picj their own Friends, for such choosings are 'advised' for them."

Ya see, I Called Out to an Older Man, L.C. Someone older than who Pike claims to be the Eldest. Uranus. And He answered me. And He took my arm and showed me some things. And then he gave me a job to complete, and told me which Door to go Kick Open. Among other signs, it is the one that has the Saturn sign above it. And it WILL BE kicked open.



I liken it to a puzzle. The first trick is to find all of the 'correct' edge pieces, and get those together. Than comes the sorting out of the puzzle peices, the data. And in that data will be plenty of pieces that don;t belong, but were intentionally added to confuse and distract, and there will be, ultimately, some peieces that are missing - but even with the missing pieces, you can still tell EXACTLY what the puzzle is supposed to look like.

Concerning the Historical Choronolgy, the Jesses came in and replaced all of the edge pieces - the border, about 500 years ago. Made it a lot bigger than it is supposed to be. Then, they took the real pieces and made copies of them, changing details on them, for they made the border of the puzzle about 3 times the size it should be and needed more pieces for us to work on, but the observant eye can notice and find these copies, and figure out what the are actually copies of.

Take care L.C. I was hoping for your opinion on some of the specific groups that were in bed together, and what Groups they were aligned against. Beggars can't be choosers. One last question I'll ask you, to which I'll check back and read, but not respond, for I'm splittin' yer thread, is your opinion on that diamond I posted from KvM's (a Mason, at least, if not more) ToVoS. I'm not looking for a definitive answer, but since you are aware of diamonds on KGC trails and that they come in different forms, ya think it might be wise to at least consider and look into the real possibility that KvM was talking about a KGC trail in ToVoS?

sdcfia:

I like your take on Turtle Mountain, the 30's, and FDR. It is definitely an interesting possibility to consider. I can't remember if you knew about Cort and Turtle Mtn before I sent you some of his stuff a while ago or not, but he has some interesting lines to be sure. I have found interesting things off of the Serpent Mound, too. I am pretty sure I have read Randy Bradford saying he traces the LUE map to coming out of Phoenix in the 30's. You always claim you don't even know what the LUE is. Perhaps, and I only say perhaps, the LUE might have some ties to the 30's Shenanigans, even if it's origins are older than that by centuries, as some claim.

Rebel, I appreciated some of the answers you provided, like verifying Blucifer/OAK ties. Jefferson is a tough one. I know he was an envoy to France, not explicitly the Nine Sisters Lodge, but that guy was pretty damn buddy with them, and in the end, at that period of time, who was France's government? I would suggest it was the one, plotting in Secret in the Masonic Nine Sisters Lodge. I am open to it, but if all you have is that Mason Historians have searched the Lodge Records and don't find his name, well, that is not meaningless to me, especially since Masonry would probably be proud to claim him. But not definitive, either. He is at least a Masonic Co-Adjutor, lol. I didn't even get into how Jefferson had Lewis and Clark (I know at least one if not both were Masons) set up to roll before the Lousiana Purchase happened and France still owned that Territory. Nor his involvement in the creation of the Seal of the US which has, since day one and before FDR threw it on the dollar bill, incorporated the Eye of Augustus, the Boss of the Illuminati and Saturn devotees worldwide ...

TY, I think YOU mix up ppl's true selves with their "PERSONA"; myself, the "Royals", AND TJ are/were ALL Humans... putting our pants on, one leg at a time, CRAPPING the SAME way, etc. I was NOT "WM", as in to "be WORSHIPED"... MORE like "leader" of a Social club, and we DID/DO help OTHERS, in many ways... like MANY "clubs" do; Masonic Lodges may have SOME Mutual Aid Society "feel" to it, LOCALLY. YOU read TOO many "Conspiracy Sites"... SOME, which MAY have had SOME Truth.