Swamp Gold

[Bigcypresshunter]

Why do I lose my attachments? This is still an ongoing problem? Maybe I posted incorrectly or maybe the attachments work for others.

 

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[ECS]

Hello ECS. Im a bit confused and maybe I also suffer from a bit of wishful thinking..

I read your email but can you please clarify for me. You say your information comes from various sources,including military records from Union Fort Meyers and the CSA Cow calvary of Fort Meade,diaries from those who served both from university and college libraries,genealogy sites.

I am particularly interested in post #1127. Where did you obtain this? I need the exact quotes (not your words) and I also need to know the reference source of each sentence please, if its from more than one source..

This is great information but it depends on where it came from. (its only as good as its source) Thanks a bunch ECS. Please clarify.

As I mentioned in my PM,the information DID NOT come a treasure book or mag,but cumulative of reports and diary's of those that served at Union Fort Meyers(Capt Henry A Crane),CSA Fort Meade(Capt James McKay Sr,Capt John A McKay,and CSA Comp "B"1st Florida Special Calvary Battalion "cow calvary"(Lt Col Munnelyn,Capt John T Lesley,Capt Leroy G Lesley,Pvt Charles Greenleigh McKinney,and Pvt William McCullough).
The specie was Spanish and Cuban gold coins,not US $20 gold coins,because Capt Riley's cow cargo was shipped to Cuba.

 

[ECS]

Why do I lose my attachments? This is still an ongoing problem? Maybe I posted incorrectly or maybe the attachments work for others.

Same thing happened to me.The above post was my second attempt-the first contained links.

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

As I mentioned in my PM,the information DID NOT come a treasure book or mag,but cumulative of reports and diary's of those that served at Union Fort Meyers(Capt Henry A Crane),CSA Fort Meade(Capt James McKay Sr,Capt John A McKay,and CSA Comp "B"1st Florida Special Calvary Battalion "cow calvary"(Lt Col Munnelyn,Capt John T Lesley,Capt Leroy G Lesley,Pvt Charles Greenleigh McKinney,and Pvt William McCullough).
The specie was Spanish and Cuban gold coins,not US $20 gold coins,because Capt Riley's cow cargo was shipped to Cuba.

Thanks ECS. Sounds great. But you said you found nothing older than 1940s? You realize I need to work with exact quotes and references. Are these your own words based on your research? This may be the most valuable information to date and I really need the exact quotes and which part came from which diary, report or reference. Or maybe you dont want to reveal this at this time? PM me if there is a problem. Thanks a bunch..



Have you tried Harpers Weekly? http://www.harpersweekly.com/catalog/product_info.php/products_id/187

 

[ECS]

As far as ECS post 1127 goes, I have someone that thinks they know the general location of that gold story and where the gold may be. They live out-of-state and are not interested in pursuing it. It is on the west coast of Florida. The gold that I am after on Alligator Alley is from a completely different story as I have stated more than once. The gold that I am after was a shipment being sent across the glades to be sent out to England for arms payment.

My knowlegde of where this cache is within several hundred square miles! It all depends on how far CSA Pvt Lanier went to hide the gold coins during March,1864, and how long it took him to return to Fort Meade-he was killed April 7,1864 at the Little Battle of Bowlegs Creek.Union Capt Henry A Crane made reference in his report,"killing a leading guerilla Lanier",concerning this skirmish.
Yes,the CSA did use gold they negoiated from London and Paris banks to buy arms,including $20,000,000 to purchase the CSA ships of war ALABAMA and SHENANDOAH,but the CSA also traded in cotton.After the war,the US government sued Great Britain for breach of the neutrality laws for "doubling the duration of the war by her aid to the Confederacy",and was awarded $15,500,000 by THE GENEVA TRIBUNAL.
My doubts to the EVERGLADES gold legend:
1.When did this event occur?From 1861-1864 the CSA still had many open ports available.
2.Where was the gold shipments point of origin?
3.Why ship 1/2 ton of gold across the Everglades to what Florida port?
4.The mention of Capt John Riley-true he was a successful CSA blockade runner,in some versions he was killed after burying the gold (he died May 10,1901).Riley also appears in another Florida lost CSA gold legend.
CSA Sec of State Judah P Benjamin & later Sec of the CSA treasury,established the blockade runner trade routes,besides Capt John Riley,he also employed Capt Archibald McNeil in Florida.It was Capt McNeil that carried Benjamin from the Gamble Plantation in Ellenton,Florida to the Bahamas with a portion of the remaining Confederate treasury.

 

[ECS]

Thanks ECS. Sounds great. But you said you found nothing older than 1940s? You realize I need to work with exact quotes and references. Are these your own words based on your research? This may be the most valuable information to date and I really need the exact quotes and which part came from which diary, report or reference. Or maybe you dont want to reveal this at this time?



Do you have the exact date of the event?

Nothing older than the 1940's for the 1/2 ton of gold in the Everglades.
Yes,I wrote a complilation of my research into that post.
No exact date,the event occured between March 16,1864(date on Union Capt Henry Crane's report) and April 7,1864 when CSA 'guerilla leader" Lanier was killed(letter dated April 13,1864 Capt Henry A Crane).

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

Nothing older than the 1940's for the 1/2 ton of gold in the Everglades.
Yes,I wrote a complilation of my research into that post.
No exact date,the event occured between March 16,1864(date on Union Capt Henry Crane's report) and April 7,1864 when CSA 'guerilla leader" Lanier was killed(letter dated April 13,1864 Capt Henry A Crane).

OK ECS thanks for the explanation. I think I understand now.

Also I see you are assuming the 1/2 ton gold story is a different legend. I was assuming its an embellishment of the same. We simply need to follow the trail. Yes it covers hundreds of miles lol.

Just for fun Im posting a Spanish gold doubloon. They also weigh about an ounce. We are still looking at a third of a bag of Sakrete in weight in a more compact size. Think of rolls of silver dollars equaling 600 coins..

Correct me if Im wrong. 20 coins per roll. 600- 1 ounce coins equals 120 rolls of coins. This is what we are looking at.

My job position has put me in touch with many landowners who are in, or their ancestors were in, the cattle business. I will remember all those who helped me. I am hoping others will do the same for me. To remember me in some small way.

Thanks again ECS.

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

My knowlegde of where this cache is within several hundred square miles! It all depends on how far CSA Pvt Lanier went to hide the gold coins during March,1864, and how long it took him to return to Fort Meade-he was killed April 7,1864 at the Little Battle of Bowlegs Creek..

March is the extreme dry season in the Everglades and they could have travelled far. LG Harveys ghost town could very well be the last Confederate encampment and I see no reason why they could not have penetrated into the Alligator Alley Indian reservation area south of Fort Shackleford into northern Collier County or beyond.

 

[ECS]

BCH,in my opinion,I also think the 1/2 ton of gold in the Everglades is an embellishment of the cow calvary cache buried by CSA Pvt Lanier in March,1864.Also the inclusion of Capt John Riley,CSA blockade runner,into this and another tale of lost Confederate gold in Florida.
If you have met decendants of Cow Calvary or cracker ranchers their family histories or tales can be a great source of information.

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

I am speaking with decendants of early Florida cracker families that come through my station. They all have hunt camps passed down from the family. I will keep you informed of anything we can use. My time is limited with work and all my problems and such so I havent had any time to spend on Swamp Gold. I do however keep my ears wide open. I will have much more time in January to piece it all together and I hope you will keep in touch.

The Lanier story with the March 1864 dateline is the smoking gun I was looking for.

 

[vor]

BDD
It seems that you may be the only one with first hand information on some historical artifacts that may shed light on a "swamp gold" story. You stated that you had seen "evidence of activity from the long distant past".

Without giving out information that would interfere with your search, do you care to share what, in general, this may be?

Vor

 

[Bigdogdad]

As I have stated in the past, this possible gold site may have nothing to do with any of the old stories. Ovid had a method of locating gold that he sometimes used that was a sort of reverse search. I do not care to share any more details because it is not to my advantage to do so.

 

[vor]

Thanks for info. But I wonder what would make someone remove this relic all of a sudden. And if only a "piece" was found, there should be quite a bit of small debris buried right under the surface. I think that anything of metal, clay, etc. could help in identifying the age.

V

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

Almost every hammock in or near the Shark Valley Slough has evidence either from ancient Calusa Indians or early hunt camps, Seminole, white man or both. I think what vor is saying that other items found at the site may identify the age of the site. I dont know that it matters but maybe it would help with your electronic verification to find a white mans Civil War era artifact at the site. Thats how its done, you know. Archaeologists can date a site from the artifacts found, even if its mixed with modern. Yes there should be other debris scattered about to date the cabin.


Post any artifact found and I will help ID it for you.
Even the wood with interlocking cuts can possible date the ste.

Im assuming you already tried a Pulse Unit that will go several feet deep. And yes its none of my business lol. Just conversation. Its good to see conversation flowing again. Its brain food for thought. Just like old times.

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

I believe CSA Pvt Lanier's hummock is either located in south Lee County or north Collier County,not near Alligator Alley.
This could be the source of the legend because the Union or the CSA never ventured that far south into the Everglades.

I may have posted this before but here is a 1900 map of Lee County. Points of interest "Punta Rassa Tel. Sta. to Cuba" and Fort Shackleford.

The second is a Seminole Indian War trails map. Note the trail leading south toward todays Alligator Alley from Fort Shackleford (bottom right). Another trail to the west from Fort Thompson bypassing Shackleford completely. Fort Shackleford was found on Seminole Indian lands.

And yet another more important trail leading to Fort Doane (coincidence?) from near Fort Myers bypassing Fort Shackleford down into Miccosuki lands. It would appear someone heading south would utilize this last trail. It would seem to me someone fleeing Union troops wanting to avoid Fort Myers would try to hit this southernmost trail heading in a southeasterly direction. They could easily travel this far in mid-March extreme dry season down into Miccosuki. Of course it could be buried anywhere along this route. Even in the OK Slough area or Fakahatchee that may have held water in March; the rivers mentioned.

 

[Bigdogdad]

Let me set a few things straight here. I am not a researcher. I am not a relic hunter. I am not an archaeologist. I am a TREASURE HUNTER. I think there is gold buried on the site I refer to as CLOUD MOUNTAIN. It is on the Miccosukee reservation. At this point I don't really give a rat's rectum how it got there or where it came from. It can be dug with no damage to anything.

I was contacted by a member of the tribe because he thought I seemed to know what I was talking about and came across as very serious. He wanted to meet me. We met. We reached an agreement to work together on this. They will take care of all the details. They will procure the equipment. They will do the dig. I will watch. It is as simple as that. THAT is how it is done YOU know. When the dig date is set I will contact BCH and give him an opportunity to be there to watch.

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

Let me set a few things straight here. I am not a researcher. I am not a relic hunter. I am not an archaeologist. I am a TREASURE HUNTER. I think there is gold buried on the site I refer to as CLOUD MOUNTAIN. It is on the Miccosukee reservation. At this point I don't really give a rat's rectum how it got there or where it came from. It can be dug with no damage to anything.

Whatever. No need to get upset BDD. Im not doing this research just for YOU and Im not a trained archaeologist either. Im sure one can be hired if needed. I happen to think its interesting and I love history and I know you dont give a rats ars how archaeologists operate LOL or anyone else. It was just a suggestion to help.. What do you think about the trail map and my different scenarios? Yea I know... I know... you probably dont give a rats ars lol. No problem...its cool and thanks for the invitation.
...
Ive been at the library most of the past 2 days but I gotta go to work now. I just find this all very interesting. It all fits so neatly together and thanks to ECS, we now know that its not just a legend but its indeed part of US history. I dont know about you man but it sends chills down my spine. It will be interesting to see how this all plays out with so much gold at stake.... I may not realize what I have gotten myself into. Remember Ovids warning about gold and what a man will do for it.

Next stop is the Davie Historical Society. I have a freind in Davie.

 

[Bigdogdad]

I have nothing against researchers but I do have a problem with archaeologists. They seem to hate treasure hunters and have done their best to shut them down in Floriduh. They refuse to even consider working with me on the Rocky Bluff site and as it is on state land there has been nothing I can do about it, so far that is. As far as if gold is found at Cloud Mountain, someone will be sure to be able to figure out where it came from. It just really doesn't interest me.

When it comes to the trails, I found the overlay that is on a long prior post on here very educational. It shows a military trail near the Cloud Mountain site. It passes close enough to probably be a part of this treasures past.

I too, get chills at times when I consider the amount of treasure to be found and the fact that I may know the location of a lot of it. The ONLY way to find out is to dig. As a matter of fact I dug a large amount of holes last weekend in the pursuit of another treasure on private property and at one time was convinced I had found it. I think someone had beat me to it. I hope that is not the case on Alligator Alley but it is very possible.

 

[ECS]

The Lanier story with the March 1864 dateline is the smoking gun I was looking for.

The original incident with Union Lt James D Green with the CSA Cow Calvary took place in March.CSA Capt John T Lesley was the ranking officer during this encounter who sent CSA PVT Lanier off to hide the cattle payment,while Lesley led Green's troops off in another direction.
Union Capt Henry D Crane,Fort Meyers wrote on April 13,1864(the LITTLE BATTLE OF BOWLEGS CREEK was on April 7,1864):" The detachment sent to Fort Meade in my last had a fight with the rebels and drove them from the place Thursday last,destroying all their stores complete,and KILLING A LEADING GUERILLA LANIER,and running out several others with horses and without".
Of all the CSA officers station at CSA Fort Meade,is it not curious that Crane would mention a CSA PVT in his report?Green was a CSA deserter who joined the Union at Fort Meyers,and went on to loot his former friends and neighbors in that area.
Did Crane order the raid on Fort Meade which ended at Bowlegs Creek because of the cattle gold payment?
As I have posted the Diary of Union Fort Meyers William McCullough on this thread,The Yankees of that command were known for their looting,from the Peace River Valley up to Cedar Key.
I still question why Crane would mention a CSA Pvt as a "leading guerilla leader".

 

[ECS]

FOR THOSE WHO DON'T MIND HISTORICAL DIGGING FOR THE LOST CSA GOLD CACHE

Historic Peace River Valley, Florida
http://freepages.geneolgy.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~crackerbarrel/Civilwar3.html
http://freepages.geneolgy.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~crackerbarrel/Tories.html
http://freepages.geneolgy.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~crackerbarrel/DCHS.html
WWW.oocities.org/yes_album/rebuttal.htm
http://freepages.geneolgy.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~crackerbarrel/Hardee
Confederate Polk
The above sites will give you old photos,names of the Union Fort Meyers & Confederate Fort Meade & "Cow Calvary" who took part in the events,Union Capt Crane's "death warrant" for the cracker ranchers,places for the events,and dates-but not where CSA Pvt Lanier hid that $12,000 Spanish & Cuban gold coin cattle payment.