Story of 2 Jesuit Priests going into the Superstition Mountains

[Cubfan64]

Does anyone here remember a story of 2 Jesuit Priests (Priests for sure - perhaps not Jesuit) who entered the Superstitions sometime in the last 25 years or so? I remember reading a story - I think it was by Jim Hatt - where he had a photo of the 2 men with their faces obscured. I don't recall the full story except that I believe they went in alone and nobody knew what they were searching for.

This is a long shot I know - it may have been written on this forum or on the one Jim Hatt ran. I'm going to keep looking but if someone happens to remember anything about it, could you let me know here?

 

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[deducer]

Hi Paul, I remember that story. I am pretty sure it's on the other site.

Quite frankly, I came to conclude that these two priests were not out looking for anything, they were just on a hike. If they were in fact searching surreptitiously, I don't think they would have wore cassocks.

 

[sdcfia]

Hi Paul, I remember that story. I am pretty sure it's on the other site.

Quite frankly, I came to conclude that these two priests were not out looking for anything, they were just on a hike. If they were in fact searching surreptitiously, I don't think they would have wore cassocks.

The monks at the Benedictine Monastery in the mountains just above Silver City wear their full length hooded canvas work robes all the time while cutting trees, clearing brush, building fences, building trails, fighting fires and every/anything else. The only concession to the 6th Century Rule of St. Benedict is footwear - boots replacing sandals.

 

[PotBelly Jim]

An interesting story. It seems to have been related to a certain Catholic school in Phoenix

The story was told by Jim and "Wright1" over where Jim had his moderated forums. Look in "Legends and Lore of the Superstitions", "Rojas' Silver Bell". The pic of the two Padres was posted in that thread by Jim on 10 Dec 2009.

They were wearing black boots with their habits...I guess they replaced their sandals too

 

[Cubfan64]

Thanks everyone - I would never have guessed people would have remembered that story, much less be able to tell me what thread it's in Much appreicated

 

[PotBelly Jim]

I had just read through that thread not too long ago, and took the time to try and figure out which Catholic school was being referenced. It was all a little too mysterious how some guy that just happened to be visiting came up with the story...and then Jim deleted certain parts of the guy's post, like the name of the school, to "protect the innocent"

Perhaps that's all it was, but reading the thread all these years later, I wondered if it was related to something Jim had been working on.

 

[deducer]

Thanks everyone - I would never have guessed people would have remembered that story, much less be able to tell me what thread it's in Much appreicated

I am curious as to why you wanted to learn more about this tale. Care to share more?

 

[Cubfan64]

I am curious as to why you wanted to learn more about this tale. Care to share more?

Honestly no specific reason. It just happened to pop into my head the other day - all I could remember was the photo with the heads blotted out and couldn't remember the rest of the story. Just random brain synapses firing and wanting to confirm.

 

[Sentinel]

Paul,

If I remember correctly they were just visiting and were at first water. I think the pic was meant as tongue in cheek. Just tourists. I saw some Jesuits walking down the street in Tucson one day while We were premiering Lust for Gold at the Arizona Film festival. Were they following Us? Were they drawn there because of Robert Kesselrings research? They did buy a couple of Sonoran hotdogs and sat near me and my boys. Were they following me? I should have confronted them and asked about the Peralta stone maps. My own little DaVinci code. Lol.

 

[deducer]

The subject of whether Jesuits have ever been in the Superstitions has always seemed to generate intense discussion, for one reason or another.

Just one of those things that will never go away.

 

[PotBelly Jim]

I think it's pretty obvious to locals around there which Church they were talking about. To pick up a bit where Jim's thread left off, there was some question about whether or not the Aylor's had been searching for a bell and if it had anything to do with this church.

All I will say is that the school was there back then (1930's), but the church wasn't built until the late 1950's. The statues, as Wright1 alluded to, are said to represent St. Francis (a disciple of Loyola) flanked by a Jesuit (Kino) and a Franciscan (Serra).

It sounded to me like someone at the Church had told the OP that the statue at the left hand of Francis was not Serra, but was Rojas (another Jesuit like Kino in the Pimeria Alta).

I have my doubts that the statue represents Rojas. But who knows?

The High School there used to beat the tar out of us in football games. That's about all I really know

 

[deducer]

I think it's pretty obvious to locals around there which Church they were talking about. To pick up a bit where Jim's thread left off, there was some question about whether or not the Aylor's had been searching for a bell and if it had anything to do with this church.

All I will say is that the school was there back then (1930's), but the church wasn't built until the late 1950's. The statues, as Wright1 alluded to, are said to represent St. Francis (a disciple of Loyola) flanked by a Jesuit (Kino) and a Franciscan (Serra).

It sounded to me like someone at the Church had told the OP that the statue at the left hand of Francis was not Serra, but was Rojas (another Jesuit like Kino in the Pimeria Alta).

I have my doubts that the statue represents Rojas. But who knows?

The High School there used to beat the tar out of us in football games. That's about all I really know

I visited that parish to check out Wright1's story, and got nowhere. Yes, that statue is Serra, not Rojas. One may wonder why/what a Franciscan is doing standing alongside two prominent Jesuits depicted by a Jesuit parish. The simple answer is that when the Jesuits were expelled from the Pimeria Alta, the Franciscans were chosen to take over their missions. Serra, as the head of the Franciscans was chosen to administer these missions.

But there's another problem: these missions that Serra presided over were in California, not Arizona. No idea why he was honored in Phoenix, rather than in Baja, California.

 

[PotBelly Jim]

It does seem strange, but I suspect it had a lot to do with regional Catholic politics. Phoenix was always sort of a satellite of San Diego, most of the organizations in a growing Phoenix seem to have had a bigger brother in the organizational food chain, located in San Diego. Perhaps a lot of Catholic pull over that way down I-8. It's only about an 8 hour drive.

The 50's were an important time in the path of getting Serra canonized. It seems to me like it was a way to "help out" their big brothers in San Diego, to show Southwestern solidarity. If Kino finally gets sainted, all 3 of them on the front of that Church will be saints.

Regardless of who is depicted by the statues, a lot of questions remain about the stories of mining to the south and east of Phoenix. Like Jim Hatt pointed out, seems strange that two different people who had never met, were told the same story by someone at that Church. Perhaps it was just a priest who liked old treasure stories.

Mitchell had a similar story about the mission bell at Guevavi being hidden in the mountains near there. A copper and silver bell.

 

[markmar]

In regards to what Deducer wrote about why Serra was honored in Phoenix and not in California, the answer is how when Franciscans were chosen to administer the Jesuit missions, there were not states of California and Arizona, but only the Spanish Empire, only one state by the name Nueva Espana.
https://www.slideserve.com/ayanna-russell/arizona-westward-expansion-spanish-empire-to-statehood

 

[markmar]

I think it's pretty obvious to locals around there which Church they were talking about. To pick up a bit where Jim's thread left off, there was some question about whether or not the Aylor's had been searching for a bell and if it had anything to do with this church.

All I will say is that the school was there back then (1930's), but the church wasn't built until the late 1950's. The statues, as Wright1 alluded to, are said to represent St. Francis (a disciple of Loyola) flanked by a Jesuit (Kino) and a Franciscan (Serra).

It sounded to me like someone at the Church had told the OP that the statue at the left hand of Francis was not Serra, but was Rojas (another Jesuit like Kino in the Pimeria Alta).

I have my doubts that the statue represents Rojas. But who knows?

The High School there used to beat the tar out of us in football games. That's about all I really know

Jim, I believe Aylor's were searching for the bell mentioned in the treasure story of gold bars that Ernie Provence had heard from a person who was present when one guy that have found the cache, sold one gold bar to a scrap yard in California. The story is written in Bob Ward's book.

 

[Cubfan64]

Paul,

If I remember correctly they were just visiting and were at first water. I think the pic was meant as tongue in cheek. Just tourists. I saw some Jesuits walking down the street in Tucson one day while We were premiering Lust for Gold at the Arizona Film festival. Were they following Us? Were they drawn there because of Robert Kesselrings research? They did buy a couple of Sonoran hotdogs and sat near me and my boys. Were they following me? I should have confronted them and asked about the Peralta stone maps. My own little DaVinci code. Lol.

Interesting - Jim's "take" on it and the posts on his forum were the only references I ever saw to it so never heard any other story - thanks for adding to it

 

[deducer]

Mitchell had a similar story about the mission bell at Guevavi being hidden in the mountains near there. A copper and silver bell.

Now that story rings a bell....

Sorry, just had to say that.

 

[joshward]

Jim, I believe Aylor's were searching for the bell mentioned in the treasure story of gold bars that Ernie Provence had heard from a person who was present when one guy that have found the cache, sold one gold bar to a scrap yard in California. The story is written in Bob Ward's book.