Spanish Conquistador questions

[nebraskadad]

I am curious about any of you hard core Conquistador searchers if you can point me in a direction?

The Spanish were in many parts of the country from the early 1500s to the mid to late 1700s, once Lewis and Clark ventured west the reign of the spanish was close to the end.

Is there any good historical websites containing information about the Spanish actual ventures in the Midwest, ie, Kansas, Missouri, Nebraska, Iowa, Arkansas, Oklahoma?

Also, if you've heard of Spanish burying items did they bury stuff and mark it somehow, say for example, by placing rocks or dirt in a geometric design around it? That seems a little too obvious, so I am putting up an image to see what you all think..

 

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[nebraskadad]

supposedly this is the approximately location of a Spanish clash with indians in the Missouri territory pre-1800. The legend goes "Before being massacred by attacking Indians in 1772, several hundred Spaniards buried 15 loads of gold averaging 130 pounds each and 1,000 bars of silver weighing an average of 20 pounds to the bar... in the area "

 

[ColoradoMike]

I have re ad different versions on that story. I'm an old MO boy myself. Some versions believe that a town has grown up around the treasure. The Spanish may have indeed done something like that pic above, Indians too even settlers etc.IF it is the real deal run a 2 box unit over it, better yet a PI with a 1 meter loop. Have you been to the site or are you just scanning sat pics? If you have been to the site can you describe it better?

 

[Darren in NC]

My scale of the two maps show that the ring should be about where the "b" is in your phrase "should be here." Does this make sense?

 

[nebraskadad]

Mike just sat images.. I m heading that way tomorrow for some R & R.. snooping and sniping the glacial till north of the mo river...

 

[nebraskadad]

darren I got both off http://terraserver-usa.com I don't think i've got the scale equal but it's close........

 

[OutBack Duo]

I own some property in Central Missouri (purchased it last year). While Exploring I found this sunken area. I will be going out there this weekend with my metal detector. I can see no reason for this area to be sunken, it is not anywhere near any road or trail. My proerty is out in the middle of nowhere and it is very wooded and lots of hills. To give you an idea of where its at, its just north of Lake of the Ozarks.

 

[Darren in NC]

It does seem weird. I used to have a hauling business and sometimes owners preferred to bury stumps, trees and yard waste on their property rather than pay the landfill fee. Over time, the burial spot would sink in due to ongoing rot. I don't know if this would apply to your spot or not - could be a natural sinkhole...or a treasure Good luck!

 

[lonewolfe33]

I think when you get there, you will find that both pics are correctly orinitated and it is just a pond.
just my thought,though.

 

[ColoradoMike]

I grew up in Missouri or (Misery) as we who have escaped like to call it. In MO. ex-specially in the area you are in there are a lot of caverens & underground rivers, sink holes etc. Sometimes they colapse leaving a hole like that. I remember a guy near Union MO that one day walked out in his front porch & his lake was gone, fish & all. It colasped into a underground river.

I don't think a detector will pick up anything if there is anything there. (to Deep) I would try a 2 box at minimum. PI or EM or Ground Resistivity unit or something like that. It's worth checking out.

 

[lates]

dathvick

I've done a lot of work in the Stockton area of Missouri. (20 years) Your sink could be a bigger indicator of something else. I will give you more info if you want. My e-mail is [email protected]s

 

[nebraskadad]

dathvick,

while the presence of a sink is curious, in some areas of missouri it could indicate a hole in the pennsylvanian limestone that underlies the loess deposits.. Could be a big a*s cave down there. what precludes you from digging it?

 

[OutBack Duo]

I ran my metal detector over it and didn't get any hits. There are caves in the area so this could possibly be the makings of one. It is located between 2 densly wooded hills, there is a dried up creek bed near the sunken area and no matter how much it rains there is never any water in the creekbed. As far as digging it, there is no way to get any heavy equipment down to the site without destroying the natural beauty of the area. The ground if very rocky so I don't think a shovel would do much good either. I am more apt to leave it a lone and dream about what it could be.

 

[TheNewCatfish]

You might try locating a copy of the book "Cabeza de Vaca" Tortures and Triumphs in Early America 1527-1537 Report to the King of Spain. Edited and printed in English Translation by Doyle Phillips. Try the Big Spring Howard County Library, Texas.

I can tell you from my own investigation into the history of the Conquistadores there were MANY expeditions (some quite large), led by lesser nobles and lesser known explorers. Not all such expeditions were sent out by the King of Spain. As late as the end of the 1700's and early 1800's Spanish merchants in Texas were still financing exploration to the north trying to find trade routes and treasure they could exploit. And yes.. for over a hundred years sizable Spanish gold and silver shipments were lost to attacking Indians many, many times.

As for their manner of hiding and marking treasure caches, there were as many different methods as there were different types of Conquistadores. Some were nobles educated in engineering, alchemy and navigation. These were clever, devious fellows who could've figured out any number of ways to hide treasure markers in plain sight. Others were just good military commanders who understood how to kill the enemy, but little else. And some like de Vaca were total morons.

 

[Old Bookaroo]

Certainly one of the classic accounts is Narrative of the Coronado Expedition by Pedro de Casteneda of Najera. The Lakeside Classics reprint (Chicago: 2002) has the original Spanish account on the left-hand pages and an English translation on the right-hand. The 50+ page "Historical Introduction" alone is worth the price of this book.

Many translations of Cabeza de Vaca's account are available. Chronicle of the Narvaez Expedition is one version.

Finally, I recommend John Upton Terrell's Estevanico the Black (Los Angeles: 1968). KvonM called him "the king of the treasure hiders."

Good luck to all,

~The Old Bookaroo

 

[Springfield]

Certainly one of the classic accounts is Narrative of the Coronado Expedition by Pedro de Casteneda of Najera. The Lakeside Classics reprint (Chicago: 2002) has the original Spanish account on the left-hand pages and an English translation on the right-hand. The 50+ page "Historical Introduction" alone is worth the price of this book.

Many translations of Cabeza de Vaca's account are available. Chronicle of the Narvaez Expedition is one version.

Finally, I recommend John Upton Terrell's Estevanico the Black (Los Angeles: 1968). KvonM called him "the king of the treasure hiders."

Good luck to all,

~The Old Bookaroo

I agree. IMO, Estevanico and Marcos are perhaps the two most important personalities in the 'treasure' field, post-Columbus at least.