Rattlesnakes in a cave

[DizzyDigger]

Roger: I've re-read your original post, and you do seem determined to access this
cave area.

My sincere hope is that, contrary from the all the advice to burn 'em out or
shoot them all, you will ultimately decide to use a non-lethal option.

You mentioned that there were several dozen of them in the cave, and
that very likely makes up the bulk of the local rattler population. They are
congregated for a reason, and as Kuger said above, they'll be leaving soon.
If you were to kill them all the rodent population in that general area would
absolutely skyrocket for the next few years, and that would alter the balance
of predator/prey sufficiently enough that the area could take years to recover.

Let 'em do their thing, and leave. When they've gone you'll likely have the cave
all to yourself, and then you can safely do your dig. Minimizes any risk to you or
those with you, and the snakes can continue to live, doing what they do best.

Killing 40-60 rattlesnakes just so you can go in and dig one hole seems like an
absolute waste, and IMO would be bordering on criminal. Take the higher road,
and in time they'll leave and go do snake stuff, and you still get your prize.

 

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[TheNewCatfish]

Mr. Brown. You've already found the treasure. Rattle Snakes are BIG MONEY. If you've got a cave with 25 to 100 snakes in it, you've hit the jackpot. You can only hope there are a thousand in there. Killing the snakes will substantially REDUCE your profits. Locate someone in your area who hunts rattle snakes and negotiate a deal (finders fee). If the place is extremely remote, i'd say 25% is quite reasonable. You'll want to be there when the snakes are removed, so you can verify the count. Hurry now, before all that money crawls away.

 

[DizzyDigger]

I guess some people will do anything for money.

Just because humans are dominant does not mean we have to completely
dominate everything in our path.

Those snakes aren't bothering anyone, and the very reason they congregate there
is because of the privacy. Mr. Brown is going to dig one hole, and then leave the place
forever. He can either allow the critters to move out on their own and then dig his hole,.....
...or he can leave a wake of unnecessary death and carnage behind that will take the
environment several years to sort out (we ain't talking about just one snake here, but
an entire local population).

If a snake is threatening you, then by all means terminate it. I am not a person that believes
in all this animal rights crap, but wasting 40+ animals of any kind simply out of greed (for the
hides, or whatever is in that hole) is simply wrong. If there was a school 100 yds. away that would
be a different matter, but again the best solution is to relocate them to the wilds of the deeper desert.

Said all I need to say here, and continuing this discussion is not going to make the
decision for him.

 

[TheNewCatfish]

Mr. Brown. You already found the treasure in the cave. Rattle Snakes are big money. Killing the snakes will substantially REDUCE your profit. Locate someone in your area who hunts snakes professionally and negotiate a (finders fee). 10% is standard in Texas for a small to medium size haul, (20 snakes or less). 100 + and 20% is in order. At this point, you're looking at hundreds of dollars in your pocket. You can only hope there are a thousand snakes in your cave. Act quickly before your money crawls out the front door. As mentioned in a previous post, they will be moving soon.

 

[CleenSweep]

What'd Edward Abbey say? "I'd rather kill a man than a snake. Not because I love snakes or hate men. It is a question, rather, of proportion."

 

[Holly_squirrel]

I guess some people will do anything for money.

Just because humans are dominant does not mean we have to completely
dominate everything in our path.

Those snakes aren't bothering anyone, and the very reason they congregate there
is because of the privacy. Mr. Brown is going to dig one hole, and then leave the place
forever. He can either allow the critters to move out on their own and then dig his hole,.....
...or he can leave a wake of unnecessary death and carnage behind that will take the
environment several years to sort out (we ain't talking about just one snake here, but
an entire local population).

If a snake is threatening you, then by all means terminate it. I am not a person that believes
in all this animal rights crap, but wasting 40+ animals of any kind simply out of greed (for the
hides, or whatever is in that hole) is simply wrong. If there was a school 100 yds. away that would
be a different matter, but again the best solution is to relocate them to the wilds of the deeper desert.

Said all I need to say here, and continuing this discussion is not going to make the
decision for him.

Dizzy Digger is right. It would be a horrendous act of greed to harm those animals. We share this Earth, we do not rule it. And you would discover that when you get bit , trying any of these methods. To use gasoline in any way would be Absolutely reckless. I'm appalled at the thought of someone being so greedy , that they'd kill whatever is in their path ... Morally it's flat out wrong.

 

[Joe hunter]

After clearing snakes by non lethal means to prevent one sneaking

Back up on you I've heard snakes hesitate to cross a rope.(not nylon heavy hemp rope)
I've never tested this you should do as much research on all suggestions as you can

 

[wainzoid]

Here in Pa it is illegal to kill a rattlesnake. I dont know about Arizona, but its something to consider.

Extermination isnt a wise choice.

Trap and transfer would be nearly impossible.

Gasoline isnt something to play with.

If it were me.... Id offer Ric Savage a cut and send his fat a$$ in there !

 

[racer117]

Smoke 'em out.
I wouldn't use gasoline. One of my son's is a wildland firefighter, and uncontained gasoline in the wilderness volatile. Not smart. However, you could wheel in a kettle of hot coals loaded with green brush. That'll smoke heavily without burning and send the sidewinders out, quickly. Won't hurt them, either. Do be careful though, when they come out.

I agree ,no gas.The cave is a confined space. Those fumes would hang around in that cave for quite awhile.You might survive the explosion,but it will consume all of the oxygen ,then what,your takin a dirt nap with snakes.

 

[aquanut]

A shovel + rock = spark + gasoline = BOOM!

 

[RBrown]

Kuger,

I like your idea but there is a problem. In the winter here the air temperatures (where the cave is) drops to below freezing but back in the cave the temperature stays between 55 and 60F as this is the grouns temperature there. The snakes can hybernate and stay warm in the cave. In Arizona snakes don't really hybernate much except in the colder areas of the state and they stay active most of the year. In the summer time (where the cave is) the air temperature get to well over a 100F but the back end of the cave stays around 65F (again the ground tempersture). So I would imaging the snakes would stay in the cave except when they were hunting which would be at night in the summer and day time in the winter.

However, if there are really a whole lot of them (100's) then they would exhaust their food supply near the entrance to the cave so they would spread out. However, a rattler can go several weeks without eating after a big meal, so there would be no incentive for them to leave every day.

The gasoline solution does seem a bit risky.

Then there is make a deal with a snake handler to tajke them away...

Roger

 

[mical66]

rattle snake round up have been going on for years ,and they replenish pretty quick since they lay 10 - 20 eggs a year. but like some of the others I do not condone killing anything unless you are going to eat it or are threatened by it , since that is there den and they will leave soon id say wait another month or so and most if not all will leave, if not then you may have to capture and contain them, whereas I have no problem handling snakes I would not recommend you try it , if you do have a friend come with you , or find a friend that knows how to catch them. put them in a empty 55 gal drum so they can not climb out , just drop them in with the snake grabber, when you have them all caught go in and dig, when you are done tip the drum over and let them go there own way. check with the game and fresh water commission to see if it is legal in your area to capture the snakes though , so you wont get fined.
like some one else said , if you use gas the fumes will keep you from going in the cave , even the smell of snake and there excrement will be strong enough to make you sick to your stomach.

 

[CoilyGirl]

Honey badger don't care

 

[DiggItUp]

ATTENTION: your best bet is to get high grade smoke bombs from either a fireworks store (Mammoth smoke bombs) or to go an outdoors or home supply store like lowe's, cabella's, or Home Depot and get smoke bombs designed to out into mole holes as kill miles. Throw 5-7 in the cave and cover it up with like a pallet or something and seal it tight. Wait a like 15 mins, uncover the cave, then let the smoke drain out and they'll all be dead.

 

[truckinbutch]

ATTENTION: your best bet is to get high grade smoke bombs from either a fireworks store (Mammoth smoke bombs) or to go an outdoors or home supply store like lowe's, cabella's, or Home Depot and get smoke bombs designed to out into mole holes as kill miles. Throw 5-7 in the cave and cover it up with like a pallet or something and seal it tight. Wait a like 15 mins, uncover the cave, then let the smoke drain out and they'll all be dead.

Bad option any way you look at it .

 

[Tnmountains]

This is just not sounding good at all. I know everyone hates snakes but they do serve a good purpose. I always opt for a non lethal means unless they are living at my front door. I say make an adventure out of it and be sure to film it. I am assuming you own the land. By the way snakes can go a month or more with out eating and am sure they will disperse like Kuger said before long.

 

[phishisgroovin]

410 shotgun or .22 long rifle with snake shot and a nice hot fire.

350 degrees for 30 minutes and i hear it taste like Chicken!

Rattlesnake soup! you can borrow my leather chaps to go in there.

 

[jeff of pa]

Gasoline should be the last choice. It is very volatile .
you could end up firebombing yourself.
& then there is asphyxiation, If the fumes get you first.

what scares me just as much is talk of guns in a cave ?
I believe it's spelled ricochet ?
Not to mention cave-ins


also no matter what choice you use, i believe some snakes will survive,
so I'm not sure what would be the best bet.

 

[dholland02]

Ive had tl kill a few big ones in pa when I was a logger. I wasn't takin the chance of not killing it then it coming back.

A nice unplugged 12 gauge semi auto with about 7 shells will clear it in a few mins. Just make sure u can reload fast. As all my logger friends saw the only good snake is a dead snake lol

 

[mical66]

again i say killing them should be a last resort, snakes to not Den year round, they are there for a reason and will soon leave . the only time snakes to not try to kill and eat each other is either when they Den or when they mate , and not all the time when they mate.
if you can not wait for them to leave to get in there then i still say try removing them live and storing in a 55 gallon drum until you are done then dump them back out to go there own way. but take a friend/wife /brother ,,,, any one that can help .
if you do not feel you can go down there with a long grabber then find some one who can do it.
i am not familiar with your area , rattle snakes may be over populated and if that is the case then i would not feel so bad about selling them, atleast that way they will be used and not just killed and left to rot.