Ran a "sting operation" on some Gold Buyers today

[ramjet2187]

Re: Ran a "sting operation" on some Gold Buyers today

Ramjet, are you in Clarksville? I'm in Hoptown.

Yup

 

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[hombre_de_plata_flaco]

Re: Ran a "sting operation" on some Gold Buyers today

You knew what the result was going to be....why did you waste your time doing this? The people that sell to these operations dont care. If they did they would do a little research on where to sell.

Maybe I just like to mess with people? Fishing is a colossal waste of time in my opinion (unless you can't afford to buy food) but whatever floats your boat lol.

 

[lookindown]

Re: Ran a "sting operation" on some Gold Buyers today

You could of just gave your answer, you didnt have to be smart about it. Guess your upset that everyone is not patting you on the back for your "Sting Operation".

 

[hombre_de_plata_flaco]

Re: Ran a "sting operation" on some Gold Buyers today

You could of just gave your answer, you didnt have to be smart about it. Guess your upset that everyone is not patting you on the back for your "Sting Operation".

LMAO! Don't start nuthin' won't be nuthin' gramps.

 

[diggummup]

Re: Ran a "sting operation" on some Gold Buyers today

Well i'll give you a pat on the back and a touche to go with it. I like to call people out myself. I can't stand a con man or a thief.
I think these types of outfits SHOULD be illegal. With the price of precious metals nowadays, it should be against the law for ANY "legitimate" company or business to buy such metals at anything less than fair market value minus a certain amount points for expenses and overhead. I mean even 60-70% "could" be an acceptable price for those in desperate need of cash. A friggin pawn shop is paying way more than these shysters, and that's saying something. I hope a pack of ghetto dwellers jacks 'em up and takes all their ill gotten gain.

 

[jim4silver]

Re: Ran a "sting operation" on some Gold Buyers today

Well i'll give you a pat on the back and a touche to go with it. I like to call people out myself. I can't stand a con man or a thief.
I think these types of outfits SHOULD be illegal. With the price of precious metals nowadays, it should be against the law for ANY "legitimate" company or business to buy such metals at anything less than fair market value minus a certain amount points for expenses and overhead.

Do you support communism/socialism too? What about free markets. Why is your view of what is "reasonable" reasonable? These sellers go to the hotel setups because they want to sell. It is their responsibility to find out the best price. If they don't do that and don't check around, they get what they deserve.

It is a shame that not every coin dealer or buyer pays what is generally the "going rate", but to wish that the gov would get involved and make laws mandating prices is unwise. Everyone wants the gov to protect them and/or give them stuff nowadays. If you want to blame somebody you should blame the sellers for not being smarter and more careful.

Nobody seems to believe in personal responsibility here anymore. No wonder we are in the trouble we are in economically and otherwise.

Jim

 

[hombre_de_plata_flaco]

Re: Ran a "sting operation" on some Gold Buyers today

Well i'll give you a pat on the back and a touche to go with it. I like to call people out myself. I can't stand a con man or a thief.
I think these types of outfits SHOULD be illegal. With the price of precious metals nowadays, it should be against the law for ANY "legitimate" company or business to buy such metals at anything less than fair market value minus a certain amount points for expenses and overhead. I mean even 60-70% "could" be an acceptable price for those in desperate need of cash. A friggin pawn shop is paying way more than these shysters, and that's saying something. I hope a pack of ghetto dwellers jacks 'em up and takes all their ill gotten gain.

I'm glad you can appreciate some good ol' guerrilla consumer advocacy.....

I wouldn't go so far as to back any sort of regulatory legislation, but I think that people who deal in scrap gold/silver/rare coins should operate like a trade organization (the ANA tries to do this in regards to coins, but not all members abide) and try to keep what they offer to sellers within a set percentage across the board. In a "perfect world" I would be happy if it was in between 40%-60%. Those percentages leave plenty of room for a hefty profit after the items have been flipped or sent away for refining. I have had offers on stuff that amounted to 50% of spot and I declined them and POLITELY walked. I wasn't upset at the offer, because I know how the game works and I knew the guy was trying to make his share.

50% I can respect.

Less than 10%, not so much....

I realize I can't force these "entrepreneurs" to act in an ethical manner in regards to the prices they pay out on PM's or coins, but people who operate like the guys I messed with give the people who are actually on the up and up a bad name and it sucks for those folks.

It just boils down to greed and "gold fever" IMO. Over the last few years I have messed with the stuff, I have seen some crazy things. It's a cutthroat world out there, especially since the price spikes. People get a wild look in their eyes and a trembling voice. It's like they suffer from some sort of disease or something. It's the "Ecstasy of Gold" I suppose.....

 

[lookindown]

Re: Ran a "sting operation" on some Gold Buyers today

Well i'll give you a pat on the back and a touche to go with it. I like to call people out myself. I can't stand a con man or a thief.
I think these types of outfits SHOULD be illegal. With the price of precious metals nowadays, it should be against the law for ANY "legitimate" company or business to buy such metals at anything less than fair market value minus a certain amount points for expenses and overhead.

Do you support communism/socialism too? What about free markets. Why is your view of what is "reasonable" reasonable? These sellers go to the hotel setups because they want to sell. It is their responsibility to find out the best price. If they don't do that and don't check around, they get what they deserve.

It is a shame that not every coin dealer or buyer pays what is generally the "going rate", but to wish that the gov would get involved and make laws mandating prices is unwise. Everyone wants the gov to protect them and/or give them stuff nowadays. If you want to blame somebody you should blame the sellers for not being smarter and more careful.

Nobody seems to believe in personal responsibility here anymore. No wonder we are in the trouble we are in economically and otherwise.

Jim

They just dont get it.....you dont have to sell to these people, they are not forcing you...just say NO.

 

[EARL51]

Re: Ran a "sting operation" on some Gold Buyers today

Well i'll give you a pat on the back and a touche to go with it. I like to call people out myself. I can't stand a con man or a thief.
I think these types of outfits SHOULD be illegal. With the price of precious metals nowadays, it should be against the law for ANY "legitimate" company or business to buy such metals at anything less than fair market value minus a certain amount points for expenses and overhead.

Do you support communism/socialism too? What about free markets. Why is your view of what is "reasonable" reasonable? These sellers go to the hotel setups because they want to sell. It is their responsibility to find out the best price. If they don't do that and don't check around, they get what they deserve.

It is a shame that not every coin dealer or buyer pays what is generally the "going rate", but to wish that the gov would get involved and make laws mandating prices is unwise. Everyone wants the gov to protect them and/or give them stuff nowadays. If you want to blame somebody you should blame the sellers for not being smarter and more careful.

Nobody seems to believe in personal responsibility here anymore. No wonder we are in the trouble we are in economically and otherwise.

Jim

They just dont get it.....you dont have to sell to these people, they are not forcing you...just say NO.

Sorry the elderly and desperate aren't as smart as you.

 

[lookindown]

Re: Ran a "sting operation" on some Gold Buyers today

If you see a great deal at a yard sale, do you offer to pay more so you don't rip the seller off? If a used car salesman offers you below book value for your car is he scum? I could go on but I don't think it will help. We don't live in a world of kittens and butterflies....its the school of hard knocks.

 

[diggummup]

Re: Ran a "sting operation" on some Gold Buyers today

If you see a great deal at a yard sale, do you offer to pay more so you don't rip the seller off? If a used car salesman offers you below book value for your car is he scum? I could go on but I don't think it will help. We don't live in a world of kittens and butterflies....its the school of hard knocks.

Your comparing apples to oranges pal. Some people ya just can't reach.

 

[ivan salis]

Re: Ran a "sting operation" on some Gold Buyers today

its morally wrong to let a "sucker" keep their cash * - since they will just use it for food and shelter , and in the process breed and raise even "more" future suckers -- thus weakening the future human gene pool --for the sake of humanity --its our moral duty to "fleece" the fools.

 

[jim4silver]

Re: Ran a "sting operation" on some Gold Buyers today

Kind of an interesting dichotomy I have detected in this thread. Spend time in the Coin Roll Hunting forum (which many in this forum do) and see how many take joy and relish in the fact that the masses don't know the value of their silver coins and thus deposit them at the bank for FACE VALUE, so that said CRHers can be the ones to acquire those same coins for face value and make a huge profit, all because of some "elderly", "desperate", "sucker", (insert word of your choice) person does not know the value of the coins.

But, when same those same sellers take their silver coins to a buyer who offers them less than what those who proclaim price controls believe the coins are worth, said buyers are BAD and EVIL, even though they are paying the seller more than the seller would get if they deposited the coins at the bank.

Maybe if those on this board who want to protect the unknowing are so concerned, they could spread the word of silver coins' "coinflation" values far and wide. If none of these sellers sold for less than 80% of spot it would cause the buyers to have to raise their prices to keep the sellers coming to them. Then the uneducated sellers would not be "fleeced" so much because they would become learned. But then the CRHers would not reap all the face value silver anymore and that would be a problem for the CRHers, so we gotta keep it secret like many there say to do, even going crazy on the forum whenever a poster talks about doing a youtube video about CRHing- because it may educate the poor, unlearned masses too much. Instead it's better to vent at the buyers who, like the CRHers, are profiting off of sellers' lack of knowledge, albeit profiting LESS than those on this site who CRH and find silver at face value.

Seems a but hypocritical in my opinion.

Jim

 

[diggummup]

Re: Ran a "sting operation" on some Gold Buyers today

its morally wrong to let a "sucker" keep their cash * - since they will just use it for food and shelter , and in the process breed and raise even "more" future suckers -- thus weakening the future human gene pool --for the sake of humanity --its our moral duty to "fleece" the fools.

The problem with Galton's theory is that, if it were true, there would not be so many ig-norant people with large amounts of financial wealth. I think the human gene pool is so far tainted, that it's stink has permeated the very fabric of mankind.

 

[ivan salis]

Re: Ran a "sting operation" on some Gold Buyers today

do not sell for less--- if you know the "right price" of a item * you should demand a good % of it orat the very least find the "best priced scrap dealer in your area" to sell to -- if one knows the "right price" of ones items , and then one knowly allows someone to beat their "price down" by selling for much less than the items really worth --he's even worse than the folks that do not know anything of its value -- because those that do not know --well at least they got the excuse of "ignorance" to fall back on.

 

[mrs.oroblanco]

Re: Ran a "sting operation" on some Gold Buyers today

We went to 3 - count them - 3 different "we buy gold" shops with 1/10th oz gold, all of which did not know they were gold bullion, and offered us 3 bucks a gram. Really?

So, since there is 3.11 (troy) grams in a tenth ounce, (approximately) they wanted to give us $9.33 for each one. I told him that I would give HIM $4 a gram for everything he had. Geesh. Actually, two offered that, one said they were "mini-coins" that were 14K gold - these were certified bullion, with the one insisting I had gotten ripped off by buying them.

Eventually, we did find a REAL coin dealer, who gave us the right price - in fact, the one piece we had, he had been looking for, for his own collection, so he gave us a "bonus" on spot.

I did finally figure out that the "we buy gold" shops were just fronts for druggies who wanted to sell "hot" goods, for a quick sale. Not an assumption, either, as a different customer came in and he showed him a gun that had been pawned, and he told the guy that it was "still hot".

Figured we needed to be in a different part of town.

I understand that most buyers, honest ones - are going to sell them to someone else, so need to make a little money on them - but, there are lots of cheaters out there. You need to do your homework.

I'm glad to see you not only did your homework, but that you tried to help others from being ripped off!

Beth

 

[lookindown]

Re: Ran a "sting operation" on some Gold Buyers today

We went to 3 - count them - 3 different "we buy gold" shops with 1/10th oz gold, all of which did not know they were gold bullion, and offered us 3 bucks a gram. Really?

So, since there is 3.11 (troy) grams in a tenth ounce, (approximately) they wanted to give us $9.33 for each one. I told him that I would give HIM $4 a gram for everything he had. Geesh. Actually, two offered that, one said they were "mini-coins" that were 14K gold - these were certified bullion, with the one insisting I had gotten ripped off by buying them.

Eventually, we did find a REAL coin dealer, who gave us the right price - in fact, the one piece we had, he had been looking for, for his own collection, so he gave us a "bonus" on spot.

I did finally figure out that the "we buy gold" shops were just fronts for druggies who wanted to sell "hot" goods, for a quick sale. Not an assumption, either, as a different customer came in and he showed him a gun that had been pawned, and he told the guy that it was "still hot".

Figured we needed to be in a different part of town.

I understand that most buyers, honest ones - are going to sell them to someone else, so need to make a little money on them - but, there are lots of cheaters out there. You need to do your homework.

I'm glad to see you not only did your homework, but that you tried to help others from being ripped off!

Beth

Giving you false info on your gold is wrong and Im totally against that. A lot of houses being broke into because gold is so easy to get rid of with no questions asked.

 

[gallienus267]

Re: Ran a "sting operation" on some Gold Buyers today

Oh boy. Went myself to a hotel buyer just to see what type of crooks they were. Took three items
1. American silver eagle in a Littleton coins package (40.00 spot) 2. 1954 proof set in a capital plastic case
3. Class ring 10K worth melt 170.00

Entered like a hayseed that had no idea what I had. Said the proof set was a gift. First thing he did was to look at my proof set a say it was a common set ( red flag ) He weighed the ring and told me he would pay 27.00 for all three items. This for 300.00 worth of stuff. Asked if I wanted to sell and I said that was what I was there for. He very quickly snached all three items and reached for his check book. ( Game Over )

Hold it right there. I am not the hayseed that you think I am and happen to know the true value. What do you think your stuff is worth ?? says the man. When the conversation startes to get a little heated the manager comes over. Problem sir ?? Yes this man is a crook I blurted. Manager weighs the ring and offers 150.00 for it. How can you pay me 150.00 when this crook offers 27.00 for all ?? Because I am the manager and I am allowed to do this. No Thanks as I storm out of the hotel after letting these a$$es know what I thought of them.

A week or so later I wrote a story to the voice of the people in the local newspaper warning the widows etc to be very carefull when selling such items. I made sure not to use direct names only refering to them as hotel buyers. The paper refused to print my letter saying they do not endorse positive or negative stories about business. Funny part is that the full page ad was designed to look like it was written by a staff writer from the paper. They had no problem printing that though.

Yes they are crooks.

 

[hombre_de_plata_flaco]

Re: Ran a "sting operation" on some Gold Buyers today

Yeah, I too noticed how they put an "authors" name on the ad so it looks like the article has been written by a "journalist" employed by the newspaper.

It appears that offering less than 10% of the value is standard operating procedure for these scum.

Their ad I posted above states in regards to coins that "Rare dates and mint marks can make them [coins] even more valuable". Well, when it comes to "rare dates and mint marks", it doesn't get much rarer than an uncirculated 1885 Carson City Morgan Silver Dollar graded at MS63. There were only 228,000 of these minted, yet I was offered less than scrap melt value on that particular coin.

And I believe that "International Gold, Silver, and Diamond Buyers" is likely an offshoot of "Treasure Hunters Roadshow". The ad from my hometown paper lists Matthew Enright as the "company spokesperson". I am assuming they send in the "Treasure Hunters Roadshow" into the larger cities to burn people on their antiques as well as precious metals, then set up shop in the smaller towns with "International Gold, Silver, and Diamond Buyers" to rip people on their coins and jewelry. The guys I spoke with were wearing black polo shirts with the THRS logo on them.

Here is an article that describes their "Newspaper Grift".

http://www.theawl.com/2010/04/real-...roadshow-and-their-small-town-newspaper-grift

Real America: The 'Treasure Hunters Roadshow' and Their Small-Town Newspaper Grift

One look at the Treasure Hunters Roadshow operation and it's clear what popular program the operation is exploiting. The Illinois-based traveling con has little in common with PBS' Antiques Roadshow beyond a treasure chest logo and a similar name. Another thing it shares is a popularity based on a decreasingly well-off population's desperate hope that a lifetime of treasuring material things will somehow, miraculously, be monetarily profitable.

A national cultural failure, for sure. But the real tragedy is that this swindle is being underwritten by the very organizations charged with protecting their respective communities from just such chicanery.

According to Treasure Hunters Roadshow, they are a team that travels "300,000+ miles per year, many times re-visiting an area more than once annually. Our fair and honest offers are made based on the current market, Internet and specific collector values. Many times, our representatives will contact specialists in our collectors network while the residents are in front of them to establish value with the seller. We are here to BUY the items at fair and honest prices!"

According to others, Treasures Hunters Roadshow, known also as Ohio Valley Gold and Silver Refinery, is a band of traveling con artists, bamboozling the unsuspecting out of their gold and valuables.

But who to believe? This truth is probably apparent in the employment of exclamation marks in the insistence of one's trustworthiness. In other words, the Treasure Hunters doth insist too much.

The Roadshow is a group of appraisal "experts" that set up shop for several days in communities across America. Generally, the event is hosted in a small hotel conference room, as was the one I attended in Grand Forks, North Dakota. Those looking to sell their antiques and collectibles, coins and gold (especially gold!) take a number and sit around waiting until one of the Treasure Hunter agents is ready to look over what the treasure owners brought in.

In the Grand Forks hotel waiting area, I sat with a handful of hopefuls. A few were alone. All were accompanied by boxes overflowing with yellowed books and toys and cereal boxes and carvings and ceramics. A lamp; a shotgun; a sad collection of ancient detritus largely valuable only to each individual, mostly worthless to others. Juiced on Antiques Roadshow dreams of garbage worth thousands, the room's energy was higher than reality warranted, like a long line of excited suckers waiting to take that Disneyland ride that they would later understand actually sucked eggs. A fake fireplace was on one wall of the room, a flat-panel TV showing Fox news was above that. As if out of an overreaching satire, Fox News repeatedly featured gold commercials.

When finally a number gets called, the excited customer shuffles into the Roadshow's examination room where an expert gives the goods a look-see and, after a few calls, makes an on-the-spot offer. Take it or leave it. In the case of the cereal boxes and carvings and ceramics and yellowed junk, no offer is forthcoming. The gun, maybe a few bucks. But seriously... you have any gold? Gold would be great. Any kind.

But it is true that some offers are made, and it is the nature of these offers that should raise eyebrows. An undercover investigation in January by Beaumont, Texas' The Examiner found that, despite claiming "top dollar" payments, Roadshow agents consistently offered amounts "nearly a third of the actual value of the items being presented for sale." The Examiner's research found that various Roadshow events in Beaumont, Marshall and Shreveport offered as little as 28% of the open market value of the "treasures" brought in. In one instance, a Roadshow broker offered $640 for a coin package valued at $1,550.

No great surprise then that Treasure Hunters Roadshow is not a friend of the Better Business Bureau-although, until being asked to not do so, the group did use the BBB logo on its website. It did this despite not being BBB-accredited. The Roadshow is also, it seems, not always a fan of "certified" things, such as the scales the group used recently in Chico, California. It was a decision that cost them $1,700 in Agricultural Department fines. God knows how much it may have made them in unbalanced gold weighs. (Gold!)

Then there are the satisfied customers. Before it was removed from the Treasure Hunters Facebook page, "James" had the following review of the Roadshow:

Although they advertise (see Friday's St. Pete Times) to buy antiques, toys, guns, knives, antiques, coins, jewelry, they are nothing more than scrap metal buyers. They are only interested in scrap gold and sterling. The wait ? several hours in most cases ? is fustrating. You bring in the items they advertise they are buying only to find out they are REALLY only interested in buying scrap metal. I did sell some old coins and sterling, but as scrap with absolutely no other value. Antiques with apprased value, they wern't interested in. Jewelry from the 20's and 30's they were not interested in. If it didn't contain scrap metal value, they simply were not interested. The lobby was full of people with antiques and jewelry, but, sadly, the lobby was also full of disappointment as these people were not interested in those items unless they contained some scrap metal value.

Here's a February 2010 lawsuit filed against the group, and its various aliases, by the WGBH Educational Foundation (PBS) charging the Roadshow gang with knowing trading "on WGBII's famous and hugely successful Antiques Roadshow television program and its ARS Marks and treasure chest logo" and that this use is "designed to deceive and has deceived consumers into believing Defendants are associated with Plaintiff."

Taking advantage of others' ignorance after creating false hope may make you an --deleted-- but it is no crime. To see Treasure Hunters Roadshow as a clique of slimeballs and sharks preying on the weak-and yet ignore the fundamental nature of America's economic superstructure-is naive and short-sighted. Money is not nice nor is it friendly and it never has been.

But as is the case with every good grift, there is an inside man.

What first interested me in the Treasure Hunters Roadshow's stop in North Dakota was an article that ran in the local newspaper, The Grand Forks Herald. A full page (under tiny print marking it as advertising) included, amongst a number of ad-looking ads, a glowing report from a "staff writer" about all the wealth to be had from the Roadshow. The advertorial looks exactly like any other news article; its "advertisement" call-out diluted by the other ads on the page. Aside from straight under the table paid-for and unmarked content, this is as misleading as advertising gets.

Curious as to just how misleading the advertorial was, I ran it by twelve senior citizen acquaintances, asking if they could identify the ads on the page. Of course they could, they said, pointing to the ad-looking ads. Not one noted the "staff report."

In one small community newspaper after another on the Treasure Hunters' tour, these deceptive advertorials can be found-confusing matters, the newspapers also run genuine staff reports about the events.

When the "staff writer" really is a paper's staff writer, the reports are noxious excuses for journalism. Despite The Examiner's report being available to even the laziest Google journalism, reports lauding the Treasure Hunters pour forth. For example, a Savannah Morning News March 7 report "Treasure Hunters Roadshow digs in Savannah" by public safety reporter Arek Sarkissian's was a real meatball, containing lines like "The most sought after merchandise is gold-especially with high market demands" and "It's generating a lot of money right back into the general public... as a matter of fact, in the last six months, Treasure Hunters has paid out $65 million." No mention of robbery-like payments. No mention of questionable business practices. No warning.

Four full-page ads ran in that same paper the four consecutive days before the March 7 article. Each one with the same phony "staff writer" report, next to a separate Hunters advertising section. This is largely typical of the way the papers bend their independent content to satisfy the Treasure Hunters advertisers.

Meanwhile, the Savannah Morning News has the gall to claim its mission is "helping build a stronger community." (Ironically, in the paper's "about us" section it makes a plea to its online users to "Demonstrate how you would like others to behave. Every time you post, ask yourself: Am I helping make a better place to live?")

Then there is the case of the canned staff report. I took a random line from the March 26 staff report on the event from California's Hanford Sentinel: "Enright noted an item doesn't have to be old to be valuable ? just unusual and in the best possible condition." That same line turns up in a March 31 report on the event in Southern Pines, North Carolina's The Pilot. From that same article in The Pilot, the line "As the dollar gets weaker, gold and silver go up in value. The gold market is through the roof" appears verbatim in a March 31 piece in Alabama's Andalusia Star-News. None of these are marked as advertising. But all of them are communities where "citizens may have a fortune in their homes, but not even realize it."

Not a single one of the publishers of the various newspapers that have run Treasure Hunters advertorials and staff reports responded to requests for comment. Funny, because that mirrors the Treasure Hunters response to my repeated requests for comment. I did get one response from a Grand Forks Herald editor, who said, "I have to say I'm not especially surprised at or shocked by it. As I understand it, ads 'masquerading' as news stories are fairly common practice at daily newspapers."


Local newspapers are desperate for advertising dollars. But in a rush to whore themselves for decreasing amounts, they are abandoning their mission and jeopardizing the very populace they enjoy claiming they benefit and serve, all the while whining about being ripped off by those dastardly bloggers who have no sense of responsibility... or ethics.

In the bigger picture, is this any surprise? What is going on with the Treasure Hunters and smalltown papers is just a smaller version of our national woes. Editors and journalists shrug their shoulders. Publishers plead "the market." Our national discourse is our only real treasured heirloom, and the powers that be, mostly corporations, are the Treasure Hunters, willing to give us a couple bucks for the lot of it. And the whole rip-off is facilitated by a foul fourth estate that pleads "economic realities."

You are scum Matthew Enright.

 

[gallienus267]

Re: Ran a "sting operation" on some Gold Buyers today

The hotel buyers that I dealt with was Ohio Valley gold and silver refiners. I also remember that the "staff" writer was named David Morgan.
Morgan - how creative