Photos not mine but to look I advise

[nahabit]

I search for remains Russian the soldier, to tell the truth remains German me worry much less....

This statement pretty much well rules out any possibility of them being a real historian or archeologist. Furthermore, I have never seen an archeologist, regardless of what country they are from, that did not carry a compass and journal to log the events, findings and locations.

It is in my opinion; Nahabit is using the painful events of what happened in WWll as his propaganda package to the readers, to gain sympathy and encouragement to continue. Sorry, but displaying a human skull on a trophy shelf, and claiming the originating country does not want it (or others) back is way beyond belief for the normal person.

I am in great hopes that Nahabit continues to work with Benny, as well as other German organizations, to return the fallen soldiers home. Alternatively, supply those organizations with the ID Tags, and not treat them as trophies.


Good luck Gentlemen, Jim

Look attentively my friend and in my photos you will see me with a compass and a map!

 

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[nahabit]

i do it

 

[Benny-vermisst]

Hello Nahabit,

Yes, I have many books about the 2nd World War, approx. 250 pieces.
Also about Rshev.

Have even still reconciles originally grave reports of the German armed forces from this area.
Look here once:

This was the normal standard (as far as the time was there) in the German army.
But this is known, the German bureaucracy...

And you must admit, @Nahabit,
there was not something like that in the red army.

@Jim, @hollowpointred,

I hope for it of whole hearts.
Perhaps we can send you a picture one day,
where we both can be seen,
Nahabit and I.

Benny

 

[nahabit]

The circuit very interesting, but circuits of tombs are not necessary for me... Circuits of operations in area to the south and to the west of Rzhev. Tell and whether there are at you circuits of cemeteries or burial places in Moscow region? Perhaps they are necessary for finding?

 

[cryptodave]

I search for remains Russian the soldier, to tell the truth remains German me worry much less....

This statement pretty much well rules out any possibility of them being a real historian or archeologist. Furthermore, I have never seen an archeologist, regardless of what country they are from, that did not carry a compass and journal to log the events, findings and locations.

It is in my opinion; Nahabit is using the painful events of what happened in WWll as his propaganda package to the readers, to gain sympathy and encouragement to continue. Sorry, but displaying a human skull on a trophy shelf, and claiming the originating country does not want it (or others) back is way beyond belief for the normal person.

I am in great hopes that Nahabit continues to work with Benny, as well as other German organizations, to return the fallen soldiers home. Alternatively, supply those organizations with the ID Tags, and not treat them as trophies.


Good luck Gentlemen, Jim

Come on Jim, don't be an @ss. Russia is a desolved communist country, almost bordering on third world now. They have high ranking military officers having garage sales of military equipment to known terrorist countries. This kid is worried about his own country history... Come off the high horse and look around your own backyard... Is what he doing any worse than treasure hunters in the states finding historical items and places and not turning them in because they are afraid of taxes or were searching illegally?
I really have no doubt he contacted the German government and they put him off, and this other guy rubbed him the wrong way, just like he has done to me.
Don't use your American values on European countries, they don't equate very well...

 

[cryptodave]

No Jim, everyone's opinion matters, it just seems you have had it out for this guy since day one.

Look, I'm happy he seems to have been hooked up with someone who cares about dead nazi soldiers as he is about russian ones. Maybe they can work it out and play nice together.
Your complaining because he uses some of the jewelry he finds to fund his expeditions, or considering the economic environment in "Mother Russia" just to feed himself.... But again, is that any different than finding a civil war belt buckle and selling it? Or finding a wreck and selling some of the items recovered? Personally I don't think so. To each their own, but again, we must look at the situation with a little more of an open mind, not just for the graves that we dig up, but just the background of the situation.

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

"In closing, may the family's of the MIA soldiers have closure with the ID Tags that Nahabit is taking off his trophy shelf. Hopefully, one day, all MIA's and KIA's will have the chance to go home."

Peace, Jim



Amen.

 

[caratjuice]

I think I just witnessed one fascinating occurrence here. A man that has found and dug graves of lost soldiers, another man who looks to find these remains, and they agree to work together to return them home. And it happened right here on TreasureNet. Way to go you two.

 

[jeff of pa]

I think I just witnessed one fascinating occurrence here. A man that has found and dug graves of lost soldiers, another man who looks to find these remains, and they agree to work together to return them home. And it happened right here on TreasureNet. Way to go you two.

I Agree.


Thank you to both of you for Finally Ending a war that should have been over years ago.

JEFF

P.S.
Hopefully there are no Snipers out there who didn't get the Memo
yet

 

[cryptodave]

---While I have you on the horn, I would like to touch base on one item here you kind of mentioned. Not all German soldiers were of the Nazi party, or of the Nazi beliefs. A soldier does what he is ordered to do, regardless of personal beliefs.---

Agreed, that was a typo of mine. I too watch much history channel and have read quite a few books concerning WWII.

 

[nahabit]

I would like to make very important remark! All of you speak about excavation of tombs! But personally I not dig up tombs! - I go with the detector on trenches and I dig iron and here sometimes together with iron bones come across, unless it is possible to name excavation of tombs a finding of remains the soldier in trenches? The great bulk of bones lays in shellholes, trenches and is simple on the ground and I think all these places it is impossible to name tombs!

 

[DigEmAll]

I honestly never remember him saying that he has ever dug up a properly buried person, AKA: a tomb. And I can say that I follow his threads closely.

There is no difference between my finding a set of heel taps and three feet away finding a belt buckle followed by buttons and topped of with a eagle cap plate. I am pretty sure that somewhere along the line these were all hooked together and covered the flesh of a fallen yankee... who appearantly was releived of all the rest of his gear.

Nahabit's war just happens to be 80 years younger and there were about 75 million more deaths so the remains are still there. There were far fewer soliders in the civilwar that were left unburied.

On the subject of Germany not wanting to return the remains to Germany, hell, that is something I could see our present government doing! Think about this, if Germany has 35 million dead soldiers in Russia, and it costs ONLY 1,500 dollars to remove them and return them to Germany then they are looking at 52 billion 500 million dollars ($52,500,000,000.00) to bring them home. BUT the real cost would be much higher than 1500 bucks each!!!

Do you think that the Germany would be unhesitant to bring home 35 million folks, that they have no clue where the bodies are located, from a country that just kicked their butt, after they have their country blown to shambles and total poverty?

I'm sure Russia was a bit sore over the whole deal too, and probably not to welcoming! I can see how this might have been a problem. Then 65 years later, when relations are better Nahabit finds the remains, but realistically it still isn't feasible to try to bring home two or three guys. Reason? If you find two, and you are looking around the hole to make sure you have everything and you notice another boot, then you are obligated to find whomever the boot is attached to. Pretty soon you are in the middle of a battlefield with 100,000 bodies scattered about. Then if you clear one battlefield, the nation will expect that you are going to clear all battlefields. See what I am getting at?

Either way, I don't know why anyone has to badmouth anyone else here. If you don't like what you read, simply don't read it. If you can't help yourself, then read, but simply don't post. You don't see me in the dowsing forum badmouthing anyone, do you?

 

[jeff of pa]

and altho we can't talk to these fallen soldiers,
I'd wager, IF we could, they would say
"Take everything you want, I can't use it any more"

 

[Benny-vermisst]

Hello all,
Excused everyone that I just seldom write my opinion, unfortunately, has very much work.

Good,

Paint some numbers here, unfortunately, the numbers hesitate very strongly depending on source-
the following numbers should, however, be approximately correct. :

losses etc.

Germany: Complete population 1939: 69 Million

miltary losses: approx. 5 million - approx. 3, 5 million of the east front
being regarded as missed still: - approx. 1 million soldiers
Civilians: approx. 4 million

Soviet Union: Complete population 1939: 168 million
military losses: 13, 5 million soldiers,
7 million civilians

Statistics of the people federation (Volksbund Deutsche Kriegsgr?berf?rsorge-VDK):
per example-
Founded and re-buried 2003: 36000 soldiers
2004: 34000 soldiers
2005: 30000 soldiers

Costs 2005: 3.5 million Euro- paid by the Federal Republic of Germany
Corresponds to approx. : 116 Euro / found

Interested can read the balance sheets of 2005 (VDK)here:
http://www.volksbund.de/downloads/global/Arbeitsbilanz2005.pdf


Greatings from Germany

Benny

 

[jeff of pa]

Gee wiz, we have already discovered that there ARE organizations in search of fallen German soldiers, and here we are hashing it out all over again.


Added later:

I would also like to add, that this thread was started by using pictures taken from a website that does just that, even though Nahabit claims the pictures were taken by his friends, and he will be joining them after he recovers from an illness.

are you saying these people can't be his Friends ?

Maby they are ?

I have some Friends whos Pictures are on the net.

Not to Mention the Title of this thread

Photos not mine but to look I advise

 

[ZumbroKid]

Come on Jim, don't be an @ss. Russia is a desolved communist country, almost bordering on third world now. They have high ranking military officers having garage sales of military equipment to known terrorist countries. This kid is worried about his own country history... Come off the high horse and look around your own backyard... Is what he doing any worse than treasure hunters in the states finding historical items and places and not turning them in because they are afraid of taxes or were searching illegally?
I really have no doubt he contacted the German government and they put him off, and this other guy rubbed him the wrong way, just like he has done to me.
Don't use your American values on European countries, they don't equate very well...

Whats this all about?
Sorry Dave if my opinion does not meet your agenda. The kid has not proven (to me) that they are the least concerned about preserving history. If by posting some pictures on an internet forum, you can judge them as a competent archeologist, have at it. The kid has already confessed (more or less) to digging up graves for self-profit (jewelry). Living in a third-world county must make that OK.

I have doubts they have made any attempts to contact the German authorities, and their demeanor proves it. You may not agree with my opinion, but that is the way it works.

Have a nice day, Jim

 

[PBK]

Either way, I don't know why anyone has to badmouth anyone else here. If you don't like what you read, simply don't read it. If you can't help yourself, then read, but simply don't post. You don't see me in the dowsing forum badmouthing anyone, do you?

Well said! It's been my experience that those who have only criticism to offer nearly always overestimate the demand.

 

[ZumbroKid]

My last post was to havew what i typed in, but it appears in the quote section. What i typed was, What is this all about"?
Like others stated no need to bad mouth folks or what you think you read into their posts.

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

My last post was to havew what i typed in, but it appears in the quote section.

I do the same thing. You have to be sure to type after the word quote.

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

nahabit, How are you? I hope well.
Don't forget there are many Americans of German ancestry. My fathers mother was from Germany. My mothers Lithuania. We Americans are a mixed group. Also Italian, Hungarian, Rumanian, Czech, Austrian, and Finnish Americans. You would get more support if you treated these fallen soldiers with equal respect.
BCH