Ohio Lance forms- Paleo to Late Archaic

[joshuaream]

There was an interesting post that brought up some of the Lanceolate forms from Ohio. Not as much scientific info in this thread, just some examples I have scattered around my collection. A hodgepodge of old and new pictures, eventually I’ll get the actual pieces sorted into some type of grouping.

I firmly believe that some of these are post-fluted point paleo items related to their name-brand western forms (Agate Basin, Angostura & Cody Complex), and I believe some of them are likely related to Early to Mid-Archaic or even later form more common in Missouri & Illinois, and then some are likely introductions or evolutions from the East that extend into the Late-Archaic or even more recent than that.

Maybe it’s anecdotal vs studied fact, but one of the unique things is that they are predominately made from one of the black cherts from Ohio or WV, even when found in areas where other flints are more common.

Please feel free to post any you have, or ideas about them.

FWIW- You'll probably see some edits to this thread. I am going to insert pictures, and then add some comments above the pictures that are comment worthy.

 

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[Force_of_Iron]

Points are becoming so cheap it seems the better way to go.

 

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[ohiofinds 1]

Joshua,I keep coming back to study your pictures.I have given these lanceolates a lot of thought over the years and believe that the different aged points have different traits.
Materials-Paleo-dark upper mercer Late Archaic-grey and tan cherts.
Grinding-Paleo basal and edge grinding common Late Archaic-very seldom ground.
Blade Shape-Paleo are narrower-Late archaic are wider
Caches- None in Paleo but fairly common in Late Archaic


The earlier points have a different flake scar pattern than the late archaic ones,which grade into weak shouldered early adenas.
Here is a photo of some early ones.The two in the center are ohio agate basins.
The agate basin on the right is unusual because it has beveled and serrated resharpening.
We found it in Pike county and the material is a black flint with dull luster that is not upper mercer.

 

[1715]

In the 1970's I found a 6" spear head fairly smooth hard white rock I think, not too sharp point, flat bottom, have seen similar ones called clovis points but they have a concave bottom. I found it on South Hutchinson Island after storms had left some shell mounds about 2 ft high and maybe 15' across on the beach. It was in the shells along with an old pewter or lead toy rifle about 3".

I loaned the point to the St Lucie County Historical Society Museum on S Beach Causeway Ft Pierce so they could display it with their indian collection, and they "lost" it. What a bummer, oh well, I just got my first detector, a nox 600 and will be going back there soon.

 

[newnan man]

In the 1970's I found a 6" spear head fairly smooth hard white rock I think, not too sharp point, flat bottom, have seen similar ones called clovis points but they have a concave bottom. I found it on South Hutchinson Island after storms had left some shell mounds about 2 ft high and maybe 15' across on the beach. It was in the shells along with an old pewter or lead toy rifle about 3".

I loaned the point to the St Lucie County Historical Society Museum on S Beach Causeway Ft Pierce so they could display it with their indian collection, and they "lost" it. What a bummer, oh well, I just got my first detector, a nox 600 and will be going back there soon.

We have discussed several times on this site how many times museums have "lost" peoples artifacts. Someone had yours in a display somewhere. I would have loved to have seen it.

 

[kor]

Some nice pieces in this thread!

Here are some Ohio Paleo pieces that my dad and I have found over the years. I could fill several frames with just the broken ones!

 

[newnan man]

Some nice pieces in this thread!

Here are some Ohio Paleo pieces that my dad and I have found over the years. I could fill several frames with just the broken ones!

View attachment 1827493

A couple of really nice Stringtown Lances in your group.

 

[joshuaream]

Kor, those are great pieces!

 

[uniface]

Missed seeing your post before now -- not used to looking at the modern area.

Paleo-EA fingerprint, in my experience (such as it is) is high-angle flaking along one bottom edge of the base. You see this on no-brainer Ohio Lanceolates. If somebody wants to PM me their mailing address, I'll send him one to illustrate what I'm describing.

FWIW (little) -- http://www.christmasseals.net/store...union-township-2-78-two-paleo-lance-fragments

 

[antmike915]

Amazing pieces, all of them; thanks for sharing.

 

[gilmerman]

Very impressive collection. I like the paleo's I was able to pick out on each picture. You've a right to be proud.

 

[uniface]

May as well toss this one (one half) into the pot. Found on a Plano era site on the Ohio-Michigan border near the Auglaize River that also produced a Crowfield (of Coshocton) and an Agate Basin of Burlington (both also broken discards) by Steve Worden. Material may be Nellie (marginal quality if Coshocton) except Hothem said Nellie patinates grey (?)

NB the beveled base edge, which is the first thing I'd look for when distinguishing the early Ohio Lanceolates from the many Late Archaic ones.

 

[billb]

Here is my main "frame" showing some of the variety, all Ohio. I probably have more color in this frame than would be normal in an typical collection of these, I've tried to get a few examples from other materials. Click the pictures and you should get a higher resolution picture.

View attachment 1816256

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Congratulations on your beautiful collection well done

 

[discoidal roller]

Here's my Kanawha lanceolate, found just north of DC.

 

[Tdog]

Looks like a stemmed piece without the stem. Kanawha's I've found via Google are bifurcates -- not unlike LeCroy. As I understand, lanceolates are not bifurcated points.

 

[southfork]

Older pictures of points I have.

View attachment 1816273

A could of decent stemmed ones.
View attachment 1816274

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The white one is from Illinois or Iowa, the rest are Ohio. The small flintridge piece was a personal find of Lar Hothem, I bought it at his auction. Not sure about the big one, it was in a small group. Could just be a later knife form, but it was in the picture...
View attachment 1816276

Some debate on this last one. I thought it was Archaic or Paleo, some pretty knowledgeable people think it's an Adena. Flint Ridge material.
View attachment 1816277

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What a beautiful point out west that would scream Paleo

 

[Digger RJ]

Here is my main "frame" showing some of the variety, all Ohio. I probably have more color in this frame than would be normal in an typical collection of these, I've tried to get a few examples from other materials. Click the pictures and you should get a higher resolution picture.

View attachment 1816256

View attachment 1816257


View attachment 1816258

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View attachment 1816265

Sweet Points!!!

 

[Jlill]

Here is my main "frame" showing some of the variety, all Ohio. I probably have more color in this frame than would be normal in an typical collection of these, I've tried to get a few examples from other materials. Click the pictures and you should get a higher resolution picture.

View attachment 1816256

View attachment 1816257


View attachment 1816258

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View attachment 1816260

View attachment 1816265

Amazing

 

[Gare]

There was an interesting post that brought up some of the Lanceolate forms from Ohio. Not as much scientific info in this thread, just some examples I have scattered around my collection. A hodgepodge of old and new pictures, eventually I’ll get the actual pieces sorted into some type of grouping.

I firmly believe that some of these are post-fluted point paleo items related to their name-brand western forms (Agate Basin, Angostura & Cody Complex), and I believe some of them are likely related to Early to Mid-Archaic or even later form more common in Missouri & Illinois, and then some are likely introductions or evolutions from the East that extend into the Late-Archaic or even more recent than that.

Maybe it’s anecdotal vs studied fact, but one of the unique things is that they are predominately made from one of the black cherts from Ohio or WV, even when found in areas where other flints are more common.

Please feel free to post any you have, or ideas about them.

FWIW- You'll probably see some edits to this thread. I am going to insert pictures, and then add some comments above the pictures that are comment worthy.

VERY NICE FINDS WHere in Ohio I am 20 Miles South East of Canton Ohio

 

[newnan man]

VERY NICE FINDS WHere in Ohio I am 20 Miles South East of Canton Ohio

This one is from Coshocton County, Ohio. Not real far from Canton. Found on the Kuhn farm.

 

[Gare]

are you in Ohio ?