NRA slams Holder

[Crispin]

Liz Goodwin
Yahoo news
today...

The National Rifle Association has responded to Attorney General Eric Holder's "stand your ground" law criticism, calling the self-defense laws "a fundamental human right."

Holder devoted part of his speech at the NAACP's national convention on Tuesday to urging attendees to reconsider the laws, which remove the "duty to retreat" before using deadly force for people who are attacked in public places.

Neighborhood watchman George Zimmerman initially wasn't arrested after he shot and killed 17-year-old Trayvon Martin in February 2012 because of the state's "stand your ground" statute. Zimmerman was ultimately acquitted of any crime in the shooting on Saturday, with one juror citing "stand your ground" as part of her decision to find him not guilty.

Holder said "stand your ground" laws "senselessly expand the concept of self-defense and sow dangerous conflict in our neighborhoods." He added, "There has always been a legal defense for using deadly force if—and the 'if' is important—no safe retreat is available." He urged America to "take a hard look" at the laws.

The NRA blasted the comments in a statement on Wednesday.

"The attorney general fails to understand that self-defense is not a concept, it's a fundamental human right," said Chris Cox, the NRA's legislative director. "To send a message that legitimate self-defense is to blame is unconscionable, and demonstrates once again that this administration will exploit tragedies to push their political agenda."

The NRA backs the "stand your ground" laws, which have been adopted by at least 22 states in just the past 10 years, according to the National Conference of State Legislatures.

After the Martin shooting and subsequent uproar, a coalition of civil rights groups and New York City Mayor Michael Bloomberg, the nation's highest-profile gun-control advocate, started a campaign, called "Second Chance on Shoot First," to encourage the repeal of these laws. Soon after, Florida Gov. Rick Scott, a Republican, appointed a task force to study the law. Meanwhile, lawmakers in at least four states with "stand your ground" laws introduced legislation to alter or repeal their laws.

But not much has happened since then on the state level. The Florida task force recommended no significant changes to the law, and no state repeal efforts passed.

A Tampa Bay Times analysis of 200 "stand your ground" cases in Florida—the law was adopted there in 2005—found that the law has been inconsistently applied, with one man escaping homicide prosecution even though he left an altercation to get his gun from his car, returned and then shot the attacker.

 

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[XLTer]

Crispin , is it possible to post the full story of the man retrieving his gun then shooting his attacker ? I'd like to read the circumstances .

 

[Crispin]

I thought that was odd as well. She did not cite a source...

 

[XLTer]

I thought that was odd as well. She did not cite a source...

OK thanks . Just that it leaves alot to speculation on how the confrontation transpired . EX: If I heard a pounding on my from door or a bump into my vehicle in a parking lot , I would first investigate what was happening . When I realize it's someone trying to do me or my vehicle harm , I would THEN retrieve my weapon for protection . If just the weapon did not deter the attack , lead poisoning surely will . Just an example of needing to retieve your weapon ......

 

[Dave44]

I have a problem with Holders take and that of the author altogether. Since we are in the United States and not Mexico or the Ghettos of European countries, Why should we be afraid to walk anywhere we are not trespassing?

Most of our laws say that we should avoid lawless areas and run away in the respectable areas if a bad guy is around. This makes no sense but in military terms shows retreat to the other side, where they gain ground because there is no resistance.


Remember the good old days when you could walk any sidewalk? You could easily be stabbed, beaten, shot and or raped near any street nowadays. Government just says that there is not enough freedom for the law abiding, we have to make way for the criminals to spread out.

 

[packerbacker]

I don't understand one thing. Isn't Holder supposed to SUPPORT our judicial system? He's like the rest of this administration; they don"t know what their job is or how to do it.

 

[Treasure_Hunter]

I don't understand one thing. Isn't Holder supposed to SUPPORT our judicial system? He's like the rest of this administration; they don"t know what their job is or how to do it.

Yes he is suppose to support judicial system, and he is suppost to support and defend the Constitution too, just like his boss, but since his boss does not support nor defend the Constitution I guess you can't expect much from holder or anyone else he appoints..... This adminstration has a lot of nuber 1's, worst president ever, worst Sec of State ever, worst Attorney General ever, it goes on and on....

 

[Treasure_Hunter]

Liz Goodwin
Yahoo news
today...

The National Rifle Association has responded to Attorney General Eric Holder's "stand your ground" law criticism, calling the self-defense laws "a fundamental human right."

Holder devoted part of his speech at the NAACP's national convention on Tuesday to urging attendees to reconsider the laws, which remove the "duty to retreat" before using deadly force for people who are attacked in public places.

Neighborhood watchman George Zimmerman initially wasn't arrested after he shot and killed 17-year-old Trayvon Martin in February 2012 because of the state's "stand your ground" statute. Zimmerman was ultimately acquitted of any crime in the shooting on Saturday, with one juror citing "stand your ground" as part of her decision to find him not guilty.

Holder said "stand your ground" laws "senselessly expand the concept of self-defense and sow dangerous conflict in our neighborhoods." He added, "There has always been a legal defense for using deadly force if—and the 'if' is important—no safe retreat is available." He urged America to "take a hard look" at the laws.

The NRA blasted the comments in a statement on Wednesday.

"The attorney general fails to understand that self-defense is not a concept, it's a fundamental human right," said Chris Cox, the NRA's legislative director. "To send a message that legitimate self-defense is to blame is unconscionable, and demonstrates once again that this administration will exploit tragedies to push their political agenda."

The NRA backs the "stand your ground" laws, which have been adopted by at least 22 states in just the past 10 years, according to the National Conference of State Legislatures.

After the Martin shooting and subsequent uproar, a coalition of civil rights groups and New York City Mayor Michael Bloomberg, the nation's highest-profile gun-control advocate, started a campaign, called "Second Chance on Shoot First," to encourage the repeal of these laws. Soon after, Florida Gov. Rick Scott, a Republican, appointed a task force to study the law. Meanwhile, lawmakers in at least four states with "stand your ground" laws introduced legislation to alter or repeal their laws.

But not much has happened since then on the state level. The Florida task force recommended no significant changes to the law, and no state repeal efforts passed.

A Tampa Bay Times analysis of 200 "stand your ground" cases in Florida—the law was adopted there in 2005—found that the law has been inconsistently applied, with one man escaping homicide prosecution even though he left an altercation to get his gun from his car, returned and then shot the attacker.

Zimmerman wasn't arrested because there was no evidence to refute his self defense claim, per the the Chief of Police..You know, evidence is required to be arrested, there was no eye whitness or conflicting evidence to use......The police chief said that Zimmerman was released for lack of evidence and lack of legal grounds for arrest, and that Zimmerman had a right to defend himself with lethal force.... ZIMMERMAN DID NOT USE THE STAND YOUR GROUND LAW AS A DEFENSE.

Florida's stand your ground law is supported by the govornor, it has already with stood a task force review ordered by govornor after Zimmerman's used self defense against a brutal attack..... Govornor has already stated he supports stand your ground and will not repeal it or support its removal....

Why should I or any law abiding citizen be obligated to retreat, when I/we are being attacked or threaten by someone, that gives the upper hand to the attacker, and will make it that much harder to defend myself or my family, I have the legal right to defend myself, my family and my property from thugs, gangsters, criminals low lifes and such, no matter what their age is......



Article is written by Liz Goodwin who is is a liberal columnist who's rants border on the irrational most of the time........

 

[Crispin]

Zimmerman wasn't arrested because there was no evidence to refute his self defense claim, per the the Chief of Police..You know, evidence is required to be arrested, there was no eye whitness or conflicting evidence to use......The police chief said that Zimmerman was released for lack of evidence and lack of legal grounds for arrest, and that Zimmerman had a right to defend himself with lethal force.... ZIMMERMAN DID NOT USE THE STAND YOUR GROUND LAW AS A DEFENSE.

Florida's stand your ground law is supported by the govornor, it has already with stood a task force review ordered by govornor after Zimmerman's used self defense against a brutal attack..... Govornor has already stated he supports stand your ground and will not repeal it or support its removal....

Why should I or any law abiding citizen be obligated to retreat, when I/we are being attacked or threaten by someone, that gives the upper hand to the attacker, and will make it that much harder to defend myself or my family, I have the legal right to defend myself, my family and my property from thugs, gangsters, criminals low lifes and such, no matter what their age is......



Article is written by Liz Goodwin who is is a liberal columnist who's rants border on the irrational most of the time........

And nobody ever posts sources from strongly conservative sources? Its only irrational if you disagree with it. Reason is in the mind of the beholder.

Crispin

 

[Treasure_Hunter]

And nobody ever posts sources from strongly conservative sources? Its only irrational if you disagree with it. Reason is in the mind of the beholder.

Crispin

While I agree with what you said it does not change anything.

We have the moral and legal right under the law to defend ourselves against evil people who wish to do us bodily harm.

T.Martin was a thug and wannabe gangster, he was found with stolen jewelry in his book bag, also found with burglary tool on different occasion. He was on his 3rd suspension from school. He bragged about liking to fight as well.


All of this over the death of a teenage thug and wannabe gangster who was attacking an honest citizen and beating his head in the concrete yet the death of a little boy shot in the face by 2 teenage black thugs gets little to no attention and means nothing...



Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk 2

 

[Crispin]

While I agree with what you said it does not change anything.

We have the moral and legal right under the law to defend ourselves against evil people who wish to do us bodily harm.

T.Martin was a thug and wannabe gangster, he was found with stolen jewelry in his book bag, also found with burglary tool on different occasion. He was on his 3rd suspension from school. He bragged about liking to fight as well.


All of this over the death of a teenage thug and wannabe gangster who was attacking an honest citizen and beating his head in the concrete yet the death of a little boy shot in the face by 2 teenage black thugs gets little to no attention and means nothing...



Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk 2

It means something to me...

However, nobody lets me make the rules. Probably a good thing. I would force everybody to take WorldTalker's class on emotional control before being allowed to have children.

TH, seriously though, I know you have strong opinions on this subject and I'm not telling you that your opinions are wrong. What I will tell you, is that there are two sides to this tragic story and tens of millions of people disagree with you. Are they all irrational? Two of these tens of Americans are GMD and myself, people whose opinions most likely hold water in your mind. Agree with us or not, it does not make us irrational. I see irrational all the time from those who do not have the ability to reason.

Sincerely,
Crispin

Ps. I sense a disturbance in the TNET force. Is it my imagination or have they been a lot more posts on the subject of racism recently? Surely, this cannot be a good thing.

 

[Peyton Manning]

"attacking an honest citizen" isn't a fact- only the survivor's story. NO one knows what happened. and if anyone is following me when i haven't committed a crime is going to explain why.

 

[Treasure_Hunter]

It means something to me...

However, nobody lets me make the rules. Probably a good thing. I would force everybody to take WorldTalker's class on emotional control before being allowed to have children.

TH, seriously though, I know you have strong opinions on this subject and I'm not telling you that your opinions are wrong. What I will tell you, is that there are two sides to this tragic story and tens of millions of people disagree with you. Are they all irrational? Two of these tens of Americans are GMD and myself, people whose opinions most likely hold water in your mind. Agree with us or not, it does not make us irrational. I see irrational all the time from those who do not have the ability to reason.

Sincerely,
Crispin

Ps. I sense a disturbance in the TNET force. Is it my imagination or have they been a lot more posts on the subject of racism recently? Surely, this cannot be a good thing.

Crispin, I never said you were iirrational.......

Jury found Zimmerman innocent. There was never a shread of evidence presented at the trial to prove he was not telling the truth, and Zimmerman passed not one but two lie detector tests, and while a person traind to beat a lie detector test may beat it, there is no way Zimmerman had the ability to beat two tests. I would not defend zimmerman if there was any evidence that showed he was lying or it did not happen as told.....

I have no sympathy for people who want to be gangsters, thugs and criminals and it does not mater what race they are. Trayvon could have been a white teenage boy and my stance would not be any different than it is now, if someone wants to take the path of being a criminal and or being evil they deserve what ever they find in the process.......

There are white thugs, criminals, and wannabe gangster and there are black, brown and every other color, it is not the color of their skin that makes them bad, it is the path they choose.....

 

[packerbacker]

Funny how the white community acted when OJ was released. Not one stolen tv reported. If we just put free TV's on every street corner of big cities when a jury decision was about to be announced, we could probably all get along.

 

[packerbacker]

Cris, who are these tens of millions of people you speak of? I bet I could guess every one of them. The SAME, EXACT people that don't want me to keep my guns and 99.999% of the black community. They think they can decide the TRUTH when they haven't really paid any attention to the trial, just the color of the thug. The same people that couldn't understand what dna was in the OJ trial.

 

[Treasure_Hunter]

"attacking an honest citizen" isn't a fact- only the survivor's story. NO one knows what happened. and if anyone is following me when i haven't committed a crime is going to explain why.

Jeff are all the murderers convicted without an eye witness innocent because the victim did not survive.?

You guys keep skipping over the fact Zimmerman passed not 1 but 2 lie detector tests with out a single discrepancy, and don't tell me you think he beat the tests.

If your walking in my neighborhood acting suspicious I will follow you to see what your up to, and I am armed 95% of the time when I leave my home.

Crispin I counter your 10s of millions with ours....

I have already been threatened while working in a certain part of town.

Crispin answer this, where were the riots after the OJ trial when he was found innocent. There was 1000 times more evidence against him, why wasn't the community up in arms over that travesty of justice?






Evidently you do not believe in our judicial system.

Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk 2

 

[Crispin]

Jeff are all the murderers convicted without an eye witness innocent because the victim did not survive.?

You guys keep skipping over the fact Zimmerman passed not 1 but 2 lie detector tests with out a single discrepancy, and don't tell me you think he beat the tests.

If your walking in my neighborhood acting suspicious I will follow you to see what your up to, and I am armed 95% of the time when I leave my home.

Crispin I counter your 10s of millions with ours....

I have already been threatened while working in a certain part of town.

Crispin answer this, where were the riots after the OJ trial when he was found innocent. There was 1000 times more evidence against him, why wasn't the community up in arms over that travesty of justice?






Evidently you do not believe in our judicial system.

Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk 2

I was in the 11th grade during the OJ case. That would have made me 16y.o. My view of the world has changed so much since then that it would be impossible for me to try and compare the two. Also, at that time I had totally different priorities. I could not have cared less about OJ or politics.

 

[Treasure_Hunter]

I was in the 11th grade during the OJ case. That would have made me 16y.o. My view of the world has changed so much since then that it would be impossible for me to try and compare the two. Also, at that time I had totally different priorities. I could not have cared less about OJ or politics.

That doesn't change anything. Why wasn't there an out cry from the same people and sources as there are now. Jesse Jackson and Al Sharpton were adults, as was obama and others. No call to boycott California then, no riots for the racial injustice either....

Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk 2

 

[releventchair]

Liz Goodwin
Yahoo news
today...

The National Rifle Association has responded to Attorney General Eric Holder's "stand your ground" law criticism, calling the self-defense laws "a fundamental human right."

Holder devoted part of his speech at the NAACP's national convention on Tuesday to urging attendees to reconsider the laws, which remove the "duty to retreat" before using deadly force for people who are attacked in public places.

Neighborhood watchman George Zimmerman initially wasn't arrested after he shot and killed 17-year-old Trayvon Martin in February 2012 because of the state's "stand your ground" statute. Zimmerman was ultimately acquitted of any crime in the shooting on Saturday, with one juror citing "stand your ground" as part of her decision to find him not guilty.

Holder said "stand your ground" laws "senselessly expand the concept of self-defense and sow dangerous conflict in our neighborhoods." He added, "There has always been a legal defense for using deadly force if—and the 'if' is important—no safe retreat is available." He urged America to "take a hard look" at the laws.

The NRA blasted the comments in a statement on Wednesday.

"The attorney general fails to understand that self-defense is not a concept, it's a fundamental human right," said Chris Cox, the NRA's legislative director. "To send a message that legitimate self-defense is to blame is unconscionable, and demonstrates once again that this administration will exploit tragedies to push their political agenda."

The NRA backs the "stand your ground" laws, which have been adopted by at least 22 states in just the past 10 years, according to the National Conference of State Legislatures.

After the Martin shooting and subsequent uproar, a coalition of civil rights groups and New York City Mayor Michael Bloomberg, the nation's highest-profile gun-control advocate, started a campaign, called "Second Chance on Shoot First," to encourage the repeal of these laws. Soon after, Florida Gov. Rick Scott, a Republican, appointed a task force to study the law. Meanwhile, lawmakers in at least four states with "stand your ground" laws introduced legislation to alter or repeal their laws.

But not much has happened since then on the state level. The Florida task force recommended no significant changes to the law, and no state repeal efforts passed.

A Tampa Bay Times analysis of 200 "stand your ground" cases in Florida—the law was adopted there in 2005—found that the law has been inconsistently applied, with one man escaping homicide prosecution even though he left an altercation to get his gun from his car, returned and then shot the attacker.

Americans need to take a hard look at Holder and why he does not need to answer for fast and furious or provide records. Victims are just as dead and are a result of government tampering with law.Don,t demand credibility from others when you have none yourself.I don,t care who appointed you.
Too, when taxpayers money is used to hire guns to protect those who would have taxpayers not using guns,(guns the reason for hiring them?), are they instructing them to retreat before using deadly force?.Any liability for hired guns action or is that why they are hired,to take the blame?.

 

[Treasure_Hunter]

Americans need to take a hard look at Holder and why he does not need to answer for fast and furious or provide records. Victims are just as dead and are a result of government tampering with law.Don,t demand credibility from others when you have none yourself.I don,t care who appointed you.
Too, when taxpayers money is used to hire guns to protect those who would have taxpayers not using guns,(guns the reason for hiring them?), are they instructing them to retreat before using deadly force?.Any liability for hired guns action or is that why they are hired,to take the blame?.

There is far more blood on holder and obama's hands from fast and furious then will ever be on 10 Zimmerman's yet liberals are more up in arms over the death of a punk wannabe gangster than the hundreds of deaths due to fast and furious including american lives...

Never understand that!!!!!

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