New Mexico treasure recovery of enormous size circa 1913...additional info?

[Randy Bradford]

If the suggestion is that the gold found in the 1913 story in the opening thread, I'd offer a few insights into why (assuming the gold is real) it wouldn't be Aztec. Taken at face value, the story indicates the gold found was raw and bullion. Aztec gold would have been in two forms:
1) Objects of art that likely would have been reported as such (not bullion or raw gold)
2) Rough cast bars that the Spanish made by melting down art objects that were lost when they fled the Aztec capitol and lost much of the gold (and many, many soldiers)

Rough hewn bars MIGHT pass for bullion, but that would explain the presence of raw gold, least of all significant amounts of it. Assuming the Aztecs move melted bars for the sake of drawing away future Spaniards, it seems likely that some evidence of their presence would have been left behind with the depository in a way that would have given future finders a reason to conclude what its origins were. It is also likely, that given the brief details of the 1913 story, that many of these details were omitted because ultimately the source of the gold wasn't as interesting as it's discovery and subsequent recovery.

 

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[Randy Bradford]

Duran's "codex" - actually his presentation of Mexica mythology collected decades after the conquest - is quite a read, but it's so drastically romanticized that it was only a curiosity for centuries until discovered by ethnologists. I wouldn't call the document outright fake news, but as your source Unexplainable.net states, "In Duran's version, Aztlan is a Garden of Eden where the people still live an idyllic existence and where neither disease and death is known." Many passages in the "codex" are similarly fantastical. Duran was a staunch native advocate and colored his Mexica history to emphasize their tragic fall from grace. That said, the question remains: is his Moctezuma I tale historical fact or just more poetic license? You won't find much if anything about it in most Moctezuma I material, but most folks who repeat the story reference Duran, including Mexico Unexplained, which leans towards the current La Raza political agenda - again, latter day staunch native advocates often playing fast and loose with historical facts.

Bottom line: first, where is the original Aztlan? The pueblo cultures claim it's in New Mexico, or Arizona. The guys in Utah firmly believe it's there. California is in the mix. One of the most convincing presentations I've seen place it in the middle or lower Mississippi Valley, maybe around Cahokia. Second, our crass curiosity asks, "Where'd the loot go?" Makes sense to me that it's still somewhere in Mexico. We'll probably never know.

Incidentally, this is one of the most cogent, logical and articulate responses I've seen in a long time. I bought Duran's book some time ago but have not gotten around to reading it. Having a better grasp of the context, as you have so eloquently shared, will certainly be meaningful.

 

[piegrande]

>>Then again, found treasures don't get near the attention as the unfound ones do.

Ain't that the truth?

 

[piegrande]

I suspect that it is plausible that the Aztecs' primary source of gold was not in Mexico, but somewhere to the north, where their original homeland was, and where the Cibola legends pointed. The Spanish were certainly looking in that direction. If the Aztecs removed a bunch of treasure from Tenochtitlan after the Spanish conquest, it seems much more likely to me that they hid it somewhere else in Mexico instead of hauling it all the way to North America.

I will say Amen to that as I have written extensively on the Aztec Gold sub-forum that exact concept. Though it is totally an intellectual exercise, I have concluded that the remaining Moctezuma II treasure is around 150 yards from where I sit.

 

[longshotman]

Not making any assertions about the authenticity of the story, simply wondering if the story was one others had heard before or not. Without seeing the whole 22 page letter (which isn't beyond the realm of possibility but would take some doing) I couldn't speculate too much. It's not often you run across a story of gold of this magnitude where there isn't already 50 books written about it. Then again, found treasures don't get near the attention as the unfound ones do.

Well IF you get your hands on any more info, it would be nice to discuss, I live there and have NOT heard about anything that big ( except victorio peak) being recovered, i have heard that there is potentially some Aztec stuff that could have some large amounts but not that much.

 

[longshotman]

If the suggestion is that the gold found in the 1913 story in the opening thread, I'd offer a few insights into why (assuming the gold is real) it wouldn't be Aztec. Taken at face value, the story indicates the gold found was raw and bullion. Aztec gold would have been in two forms:
1) Objects of art that likely would have been reported as such (not bullion or raw gold)
2) Rough cast bars that the Spanish made by melting down art objects that were lost when they fled the Aztec capitol and lost much of the gold (and many, many soldiers)

Rough hewn bars MIGHT pass for bullion, but that would explain the presence of raw gold, least of all significant amounts of it. Assuming the Aztecs move melted bars for the sake of drawing away future Spaniards, it seems likely that some evidence of their presence would have been left behind with the depository in a way that would have given future finders a reason to conclude what its origins were. It is also likely, that given the brief details of the 1913 story, that many of these details were omitted because ultimately the source of the gold wasn't as interesting as it's discovery and subsequent recovery.

There is rumor of a large Aztec gold mine in the southern sacramento mtns. I have done a minor amount of looking and I know some gold to be in the general location area, so maybe some truth?

 

[longshotman]

Last night I spent a couple hours looking for information about the Capitan Peak legend but I didn't have much luck.

You New Mexico folks have a rich history of strange events. I ran across one of the underground tunnel stories. I don't know if the stories are true but they are entertaining.

yes we do and those stories never seem to end!!

 

[longshotman]

It's hard to get any info on this one. It's alleged to be an Aztec treasure. I'm not sure where this tale surfaced, or when. UFO-types also claim that there's a cavern entrance near Capitan Peak with a stone staircase leading down into the mountain from the surface. The Capitan Range is north of the Sacramento Mountains, but maybe it's close enough for the story. I guess if it's a KGC cache, the clues may be hidden within an Aztec treasure story. By the way, the Capitans were where they rescued Smokey the Bear during a fire.

I have heard about that stair case as well as others in the same general vicinity in southern NM, i would be interested in discussing what you know with what I know, are you in the area?

 

[longshotman]

IF any of you are from this part of the country and wish to discuss things in this location I would be glad to discuss!!

 

[Ryano]

There are several threads on this site where that staircase is mentioned.

 

[BIGSCOTT]

I have brought this up on other threads without any results there was a guy that was mining engineer
and treasure hunter, he lived alot of his life in Riudosa New mexico, wrote a few articles for different treasure magazines
he was suppossed to know alot about the aztec treasure and searched around Capitan quite a bit,
his name was Walter (Wally) Hess. I beleive he died several years ago in Roswell.