MYSTERY ROCK

[Sodabob]

Howdy

I haven't been around for a while and had to re-register with a different name. Anyway, I'm working on a real mystery and could use some help. If I can remember how to post pictures, please notice the carved images in what locals call "The Mystery Rock." I have been asked by our local Historical Society / Museum to research it, and depending on the results here, might write an article for them in their newsletter. The rock has already been examined by a group of Archaeologist but they are baffled as to what the carvings might be or represent. The only thing they determined with any certainty is that the carvings were done with some type of steel tool such as a chisel. As for the date it was carved, they are baffled about that as well. Its located in a brushy area about 100 feet away from an old State highway and about 100 yards from an old Railroad line that was built in 1916. In the area there is also an old U.S. military encampment that was built in 1940-41 and sold to the County around 1947-48. The two most prominent theories are ...

1. The rock was carved by a Railroad worker
2. The rock was carved by a member of the Military

But regardless of who carved it or when, we are trying to determine what the carvings might be or represent? The archaeologist said they don't recognize the pattern and are pretty sure they are not Aztec or anything like that, and that they might be random that only the "carver" knows the meaning of.

If you have any theories or recognize the pattern as something specific, please let me know and I will pass the information on to the Historical Society. The rock is located about 50 miles east of San Diego along old Highway 94.

Thanks in advance to those who participate in possibly solving a mystery that has had locals baffled for several years.

Sodabob ... a.k.a. Sodabottlebob and Sodapopbob


The rock is about 6 feet long, 3 feet wide, and about 2 feet thick. Most of the carving are on one end of the rock but in some places continue over the side. The local museum has permits to move it next Spring but will need a backhoe to lift and transport it.

 

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[Sodabob]

Game Changer?

I paid another visit to the Mystery Rock yesterday and found ...

1. Three more railroad spikes under the rock
2. Two of which appear to have been sharpened
3. A small stone with a smooth side

[ The three spikes and small stone ]




[ Close up of the sharpened spike and one of the un-sharpened spikes ]




[ Close up of the blunt end of the sharpened spike with hammer dent(s) ]




[ Smooth side of the small stone ]




[ Rough side of the small stone ]




Observations / Inconclusive but Compelling

1. The three spikes and the small stone were clumped together
2. The small stone has what appears to be rust stains on it
3. One of the sharpened spikes appears to have been ground or filed to a point

Questions:

1. Were these items used and left there by the original carver?
2. Were these items used and left there by someone digging around?
3. Why are two of the spikes sharpened? With one being sharper than the other?
4. Why is one side of the small stone smooth but the other side is rough?


Answers:

1. I don't know for certain but could easily speculate

 

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[Sodabob]

Clarification ...

When I say under the Mystery Rock I mean hand dug holes just large enough to insert my arm into and reach under the rock. Sort of like Gopher holes. But the hand digging I have done is in no way similar to a trench or anything like that. I'm hoping a full excavation of the area will take place soon. But I'm not in charge of that decision and will have to wait until the County people give us the green light.

 

[Sodabob]

P.S.

The depth where I found the 'artifacts' was about two feet directly under the rock and just about as far as I could reach up to my elbow

 

[Sodabob]

P.S. ~ P.S.

After I finish digging around I restore the area by filling in the holes and scattering dead oak leaves over the ground. In other words, you would never know that someone had been poking around. I can't wait to see what else might be under there - but I intend to wait until a controlled excavation is organized.

 

[Sodabob]

Because of the sharpened railroad spike I found the other day, I have decided to do an experiment that hopefully will determine once and for all whether or not a railroad spike is capable of chiseling into a granite rock. The tricky part was finding a granite rock that is the same degree of hardness as that of the Mystery Rock. As it turned out, I have a granite rock in my backyard that I believe is similar enough to the Mystery Rock to perform the experiment. What I intend to do is sharpen one of the many railroad spikes I have collected over the years (but not any of those I found under the Mystery Rock) and see what happens. I will sharpen the spike on an electric grinding wheel first and then use it and a sledgehammer to perform the experiment. I don't intend to try and duplicate the entire design, but instead will attempt to chisel a straight line and possibly a triangle and/or a circle. Unfortunately, I won't be able to perform the experiment until it stops raining, which might continue into the weekend. But the first chance I get I will get out there and start chiseling away. In the meantime, here are some 'before' pics of the granite rock I will be experimenting on ...




Specific area I will experiment on




Close up of specific area




Footnote: Once I perform the experiment I will post some 'after' pics to show the results

 

[Sodabob]

P.S.

I have also decided to discontinue my search regarding what the design on the Mystery Rock might represent, if anything. I feel that enough possibilities have already been presented and considered to address that aspect. Not to mention the hours and hours I have devoted to that search with little more to show for my time than a bunch of speculative maybes. My hope is that at some point and time someone will come forward with indisputable evidence to explain the design. I still believe the Y shape to be a significant clue and will not be surprised if someone eventually identifies it and ties it in with the rest of the design. But that someone probably won't be me because I have hit so many dead-ends that I frankly don't know where else to look. It should come as no surprise that my method of research is typically to throw as much stuff as I can against a wall and see what sticks. But even as I write this, most of that stuff seems to be falling off in rapid succession with little hope of any of it sticking permanently. Of course I will be more than happy to discuss other possibilities that are presented, but respectfully ask that anything presented be accompanied by a picture and/or a link to support where your idea or theory originated. I acknowledge I have done that sort of thing myself during the course of this thread, but also point out that none of the possibilities I have presented have been substantial enough to satisfy myself or anyone else. If I had to present a best guess scenario as to what the design means, my current guess would be ...

(To be continued)

I really need to give this some more thought because I'm currently conflicted as to which possibility even comes close)

 

[Shortfinger]

So, now my questions become: 1. How did the railroad spikes come to be under the rock? That would imply that the rock was moved. and 2. If those particular sharpened spikes were used to carve the rock, why move the rock on top of them? A definite mystery here. I don't know. I think maybe the highway worker theory better explains it? Maybe?

 

[unclemac]

perhaps it is time to stop your amateur digging and let archaeologists take over. the ground you have already disturbed may have yielded clues to the trained eye.

 

[Sodabob]

Here's a list of the ideas presented so far regarding the design itself. It addresses the design only and not who, when, or how it was done. Those aspects are still a mystery that may or may not ever be determined. The list is compiled in the order they were posted and includes most if not all of the various ideas without duplicating those that are similar to one another. I tried my best to include every idea that's been presented, and apologize for any that I might have overlooked.

Alien design
Profile of face
Totem Pole
Native American (Kumeyaay and Others)
Trail Marker (Ancient and/or Modern)
Flux Capacitor
Water symbol
Ancient alphabet
Asian connection
Y used as a mold
Magic / Occult / Angelic
Coin-script (Ancient)
Owl
Doodle / Random without meaning
Zodiac
Virtual Geocashe
Hobo Symbols / Signs
Picasso
Outline of hills / mountains
Baboon
Aztec / Mayan
Female representation
Map
Anti-art
Petroglyphs / Pictographs
Survey related
Rotational Art
Bigfoot

 

[Sodabob]

So, now my questions become: 1. How did the railroad spikes come to be under the rock? That would imply that the rock was moved. and 2. If those particular sharpened spikes were used to carve the rock, why move the rock on top of them? A definite mystery here. I don't know. I think maybe the highway worker theory better explains it? Maybe?

1. I suspect it would have been just as easy to scoop out an area to put the spikes under the rock as it was for me to scoop out an area to find them.
2. I could be wrong, but I seriously doubt the rock was ever moved. If it was moved, it would require heavy equipment like a tractor or backhoe.

 

[Sodabob]

perhaps it is time to stop your amateur digging and let archaeologists take over. the ground you have already disturbed may have yielded clues to the trained eye.

I agree, my poking around has been somewhat amateurish. But with all do respect, I doubt that my three Gopher-like holes disturbed anything. As far as having a team of archaeologist take over, that has already been discussed by the Historical Society board and is being considered. However, because we are an extremely small community that relies on donations to keep the museum open, any major expenditures are likely out of the question. If/when the rock is ever moved to the museum, that will likely be on a volunteer basis. I know the heavy equipment operator who will likely do the lifting and, other than paying for his fuel, I have no doubt that he will gladly devote as much time as necessary without charging a cent.

 

[Shortfinger]

1. I suspect it would have been just as easy to scoop out an area to put the spikes under the rock as it was for me to scoop out an area to find them.
2. I could be wrong, but I seriously doubt the rock was ever moved. If it was moved, it would require heavy equipment like a tractor or backhoe.

1. But why? If you wanted to hide them, why not just carry them off or just dig a hole that was not under the rock?

2. Not necessarily. Before tractors and backhoes, heavy objects were routinely moved using rollers and levers. Also, if we go with the highway crew theory for the who, they would have had access to all kinds of heavy equipment.

 

[Sodabob]

1. But why? If you wanted to hide them, why not just carry them off or just dig a hole that was not under the rock?

2. Not necessarily. Before tractors and backhoes, heavy objects were routinely moved using rollers and levers. Also, if we go with the highway crew theory for the who, they would have had access to all kinds of heavy equipment.

I totally understand your questions and observations but do not know how to answer them. I suppose that's why I titled this thread "Mystery Rock." The question I have is, how does someone prove what took place there no matter how outlandish their theory or idea might be? Even though I am of the opinion that the rock has never been moved and that it is in its natural, original location, how do I prove it? I can't!

 

[Sodabob]

I don't think its so much a question / observation of WHO, HOW, or WHEN, but more a question / observation of ...


WHY?

(Pun intended)

 

[Sodabob]

Last Clue? or Clueless?


Like I said recently, I have just about run out of places to look for an answer that will solve this mystery. I started this thread almost two months ago (January 14, 2019) and don't think its any closer to being solved than it was on day one. I'm not ready to throw in the towel just yet, but getting close to doing that. The only other thing I can think of that might provide a connection involves the ...

Pacific Crest Trail

The PCT runs just south of the area where the rock is located and I'm thinking a hiker might have carved the rock. They start their trek at the U.S./Mexico border that is about two miles south of the rock and then head north from there. And please don't think that hikers don't hang around for extended lengths of time, because some of them do. Some of the ones I've met and visited with will hang around for a week or more in preparation for the hike that typically takes about five months to complete from the Mexico border to the Canadian border. There are more and more hikers every year and I believe last year there were about 1,000 of them that passed through this area. I was living in the area when they built the trail through here, which I believe was in 1972 or 1973. Some of my friends hired on to help build the trail. I didn't because I was working elsewhere at the time. Anyway, this link to the best history I can find on the PCT ...

https://thetrek.co/pacific-crest-trail/history-pacific-crest-trail/


I read it but didn't find anything specific in the way of a clue - but I could have missed something. Check it out and see if anything jumps out at you. Maybe, just maybe the carving on the Mystery Rock is in some way connected to a PCT map or a PCT hiker.

 

[Sodabob]

LAST CLUE!

Please notice this post has an exclamation mark instead of a question mark. I did that to indicate ...

1. I have run out of clues to research.
2. Other than the sharpened railroad spike experiment I intend to perform, this is likely one of my last post.

Of course I will gladly respond to any additional comments that might follow, but other than that I'm pretty much done with a regular, active participation in this discussion. It was a fun ride while it lasted, but unfortunately the mystery is still unsolved and might never be figured out. Maybe after the rock is relocated and gets more exposure to the general public, someone will come along and be able unravel the riddle. If/when that occurs, I will be sure and share it. In the meantime, here is my last clue for your consideration. As you will see, it involves the Pacific Crest Trail possibility I spoke of in my last post. All three images are situated with North at the top, and the area circled in yellow is the general vicinity where the Mystery Rock is located. At one point I even thought the design on the rock might be a replication map of Campo, but have given up on that idea because not enough of the pieces fit the puzzle. I almost hate to admit it, but at this stage of the game if I absolutely had to vote on which of the observations from the recent list best describes the design, I would have to vote for those posted by members ...

Icewing = Head scratcher
unclemac = Doodle without meaning


I hate to end this thread on that note, but unfortunately I can't come up with anything better at this point to describe the enigma. With that said, here are my last clues ...

 

[Sodabob]

And to everyone who participated and/or took an interest in this discussion, I would like to express a hardy ...


THANK YOU

 

[Sodabob]

Oops / P.S.

I forgot this other so called clue that has never been fully explored or discussed. Notice the groove the red arrow is pointing to. I have always wondered why the original carver found it necessary to box in that portion of the design? Not to mention why it extends over the top edge of the rock and is located on the side? The triangle below the long-end of the Y is also on the side.

 

[Sodabob]

Sorry - I just couldn't resist this ...

 

[HuntinDog]

Well Sodabob
With over 200 posts I think you and everyone else that contributated here have given it a good run for the money.
I hope somewhere in the near future you can find the ID of when, how and why this rock was done.