My Indian Items as well as some Questions

[itzyoboyandrew]

Ive mentioned in posts before (not in this sub fourm though) that i have permission to hunt on a 74 acre farm that has indian items on it. If your not familiar heres a brief recap: When they bought the farm back in the 70s they had the trees removed/land smoothed out and such, but after the bulldozer went by they could see (scattered throughout) the left overs of smashed bowls and vases... they said if we would of just saved the pieces, we could of glued them back together and had the whole thing!

Now i have found flint (which is not native to southeast georgia, so the flint i find here, is most likely indian related, not to mention the chip marks on them.) from one end of the 74 acres (by a creek) all way to the other end of the 74 acres by the road... so seems like a big settlement... now my hunch is that the settlement didnt stop at the road, that it continued in the streets across (which i also have permission for, although its never been cleared, its just woods.) there may still be indian vases left.... now people have mentioned here elsewhere, that i should probe it, well i have a skinny metal probe.. only problem is... its hard clay through out the farm so i cant easily probe it... Some also have mentioned to probe the peanut/soybean field.. but theres soybeans there now... so ill have to wait till fall/winter.. The woods across the street is easy to probe... but another problem arises; the forest is huge.. so its completely impractical to probe it. I guess if i had enough determination i could :/ So what should i look for as a way to narrow down the areas the pots would most likely be?

My current plan is to rake away the leaves in select areas across the street and do sifter test holes... and see where the most flint is, and probe those areas. But what are some landscape clues to look for? dips in the ground like for privies or?

Heres some of the items i personally have found at the farm, i keep the flint because i think the colors are neat. (mainly i keep the big pieces though)



One of the pieces i believe to be a broken knife (the one with the serated bottom edge)

 

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[jmaschal]

Do you have permission to dig(sounds like it). I would be curious what you would find closer to the creek if you dug some test STP's there. If truly a settlement plowing should still turn up some goodies. Any luck in the creek? Why do you think it was a large settlement- because of the comments on the pottery? Any documentation about the site or nearby? Keep us posted.

 

[itzyoboyandrew]

Do you have permission to dig(sounds like it). I would be curious what you would find closer to the creek if you dug some test STP's there. If truly a settlement plowing should still turn up some goodies. Any luck in the creek? Why do you think it was a large settlement- because of the comments on the pottery? Any documentation about the site or nearby? Keep us posted.

Yes i have permission, I have not dug near the creek due to the TONS of mosquitos, i think the reason they liked this area is because the creek is down low, but the land right next to it is high up, so they coudl be right next to water but away from mosquitos. I will try going near the creek and see what i find. I think it was a large settlement
Because ive found items all across the 74 acres, which 74acres.. isnt exactly small xD... The only possible documentation i have found on the area is that there is a town nearby that was built on indian trails... and one of the trails leads in the direction of this settlement, so it may be related.. but other than nothing...

 

[itzyoboyandrew]

After looking at topography maps of the settlement, i have concluded that there may not be items across the street, but rather, further back into the woods behind the farm.. The reason i think this is because the settlement was elevated on 3 of 4 sides, the ledge of elevation stops across the street, but the ledge continues into the forest... I may take a screenshot to show what i mean, but ill cross out the names...

EDIT:


The red box is where i have found indian items... The pale blue line is where (generally) the property ends... the yellow arrow is pointing to the ledge where the elevation is... Now, across the street (cant really see it will because i had to cross out alot) theres no ledge.. but further past the light blue line you can see theres still a ledge.. so it would still be a good spot to have a settlement being it was elevated on 3 of 4 sides...

Thoughts on this?

 

[jmaschal]

I would hit along the high ridge looking at the creek especially around the confluence of both creeks. But all looks good. Next time out take some pics. Happy hunting you have a lot of ground to cover.

 

[itzyoboyandrew]

I would hit along the high ridge looking at the creek especially around the confluence of both creeks. But all looks good. Next time out take some pics. Happy hunting you have a lot of ground to cover.

Mind marking (if you dont mind/can) marking where the ridge in specific you were talking about is? Do you mean the ridge on the oppisite side of creek of the farm, or next to the blue line?

 

[releventchair]

I would focus on the tributaries , starting where they fork if looking for sites.
One pottery making site kinda near me..is on high ground overlooking water.
Air travels uphill most days as heat builds ,taking smoke with it.
Starting raw pottery drying, then eventually firing takes time and firewood. A charcoal layer should exist ,both in campsites and pottery making sites ,if separate.
Research may determine what tempering materials ..and clay types were used in your area.
Pottery that did not pass quality desired could be crumbled as tempering material , or simply discarded.

With water eroding layers , a bend in a creek could give clues to depth of previous habitation if surface finds do not exist.
Fields after harvesting and following heavy rains should have more to find ,and risk equipment damage.
Still, worked flint should turn up there eventually.
Intact pottery outside of (to me by law and by choice) off limit burial sites is a low odds proposition.
The effects of time and nature takes a toll.
Too ,a woman takes her good china when she moves,usually.

 

[itzyoboyandrew]

If fire is used in making pottery, then they would most likely want these fire pits aimed so that the smoke would blow away from the settlement. Now taking into account the jetstream/cloud movements, they generaly move north/east of the location... So the fire pits (which may hold the vases and pots) should be in the yellow circled area. Because its the farthest north/east of the raised area.. Could this be true?

 

[rock]

Sounds like a good prospect on your part but you might want to read up on some laws about digging in GA. I only surface hunt and there is a reason for that. If it were me while the creek was low I would be in it having a look to see what might be there. If it is a private creek you wont be in trouble for looking. I think you have critters in the creeks in south GA so be on the lookout for them while splashing around. We dont have alligators here I am to far north just Copperheads and Rattlesnakes to worry about. Good luck, rock

 

[releventchair]

View attachment 1334537

If fire is used in making pottery, then they would most likely want these fire pits aimed so that the smoke would blow away from the settlement. Now taking into account the jetstream/cloud movements, they generaly move north/east of the location... So the fire pits (whi7ch may hold the vases and pots) should be in the yellow circled area. Because its the farthest north/east of the raised area.. Could this be true?

It could. Once a fire is going well and dry quality hardwood is used smoke is not real bad. Heat helps dry clay before firing,either by the weather or placing goods near heat to dry gently.
So heat on a hot day would annoy perhaps..but fuel consumption factors too.
By not hauling wood and clay and water ect to camp unless camp is on a site with all needed materials,a site near camp had some appeal.


Who , in the culture worked clay?
If a guild they may have used a segregated site with available materials of clay,temper,wood.
If anyone then in the campsites a possibility.
Did the culture make their own pottery or trade for it?

Wood can get cleared out of a long used site even if only seasonal.
Labor is less when smaller stuff is used vs working large stuff.
I imagine a "factory" setting more than a campsite but that does not mean your area did not have both combined.
With debris trail from river across acreage it's on you to figure where shards originated.
My vote is only my own ,but water side. With it's attendant resources and cooler breeze at times ,appeals more than inland.

 

[jmaschal]

Ridge I was talking about... According to topographic map looks like higher elevation along red line by creek. Left of the yellow circle.

 

[jmaschal]

Would try STP's here

 

[itzyoboyandrew]

View attachment 1334621

Would try STP's here

STPs what does that stand for?

 

[catherine1]

I would check above the creek first. Walk from the top of the property where the pateau ends and you are looking down at the water source. Then turn around and start probing right behind you and continue for around a 50x50 feet area. If you hit any large rocks, dig a test hole around them say 2x2'. Also look for any high spots in the ground in this area around a foot or so in elevation. Bet you find some artifacts. Good luck. And let us know what you find............

 

[jmaschal]

Shovel Test Pit

 

[monsterrack]

1st make sure of your laws in your state, 2nd have written permission on you from land owner to dig. For a test pit don't just jump in with a shovel and dig a hole, to narrow a spot down try using post hole diggers and look at the changes in the soil has you dig with the post hole diggers. Any sign of pottery, flint and charcoal is where I would start a test pit. Also at the creek you can go to the bank and dig a straight down face into it and that will show you different time layers. I would try to do all of this in a controlled like manner, keeping records of where and what was found. Later on has you do this a clear picture will come to you on how the area was used. This is just my own take on the subject, but smoke was an everyday part of life and I think some NA hunted, some made pottery, some cooked and they did it all for the good of the camp, not for there gain. Good luck

 

[itzyoboyandrew]

1st make sure of your laws in your state, 2nd have written permission on you from land owner to dig. For a test pit don't just jump in with a shovel and dig a hole, to narrow a spot down try using post hole diggers and look at the changes in the soil has you dig with the post hole diggers. Any sign of pottery, flint and charcoal is where I would start a test pit. Also at the creek you can go to the bank and dig a straight down face into it and that will show you different time layers. I would try to do all of this in a controlled like manner, keeping records of where and what was found. Later on has you do this a clear picture will come to you on how the area was used. This is just my own take on the subject, but smoke was an everyday part of life and I think some NA hunted, some made pottery, some cooked and they did it all for the good of the camp, not for there gain. Good luck

Will do, i would of gone over there today, but the man had company today. For the most part, he enjoys me going over there.

Should i do the post holes where its already been bulldozed? or should i do it in woods, By the edge of the property theres a spot where the grass is gone, it stretches along the side of the property (the grass is gone due to runoff water from the forest next to it) I always find flint on this stretch, should i do post holes there?

 

[itzyoboyandrew]

I refound another piece of pottery i had lost amidst my bags of finds... And after doing more research, the pottery i find is sand tempered.

 

[Tnmountains]

Agree with Monster Rack on the laws before you start running around with a probe digging for"Indian Vases'. A lot of the pottery technology came out of Ga they say. I would look for areas that have the most pottery then test hole and sift. I lease land in a valley that is about 10 miles long and every field is full of knapped flint. What you want is the high concentrations of pottery around old springs. Creeks drift this way and that over time but a spring can be very old.
Good luck!

 

[itzyoboyandrew]

Minor set back - due to the crazy heat, the man wants me to wait for a lil bit for tempature to go down a little, but he says he still wants me to keep coming.