Knights Templar Sword..

[BISHOP]

I was wondering if anyone could tell me more about this sword?? I recovered it from an old farm house I had obtained permission to go through before it was to be demolished. I know it was made by the Henderson Ames CO. in Kalamazoo Mich. in the between the 1880-1920. I have been assured that it is authentic but as far as details and value I haven't been had much luck in finding any info. The blade of the sword had very detailed engraving and the sheath is also very detailed.

 

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[villazon]

Wow That's an incredible find! HH
Villazon

 

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[BISHOP]

Thanks villazon, I've been trying my best to get the sword back to the rightfull owners and I haven't had a whole lot of luck. I have several good Leeds I'm working on, but I'll be In the Ozarks all week. Hopefully I can get away and get back on track and get this thing nailed down. I'll update as soon as I learn something...

 

[texan connection]

Beautiful sword keep it, (if no one claims it) and include this tread to hand down, if someone ID'S it and claims it, still include this post as part of its legacy. This will make banner if identified. Count on that!!

 

[Montana Jim]

Outlaw... at some point - it'll be fair to admit to yourself you tried your best, and then just keep it if you want to.

 

[BuckleBoy]

Well back to Square one. I spoke with the Daughter of the Robert M. Johns in Indiana and she had talked to her Mother Whose 92 and sharp as a tack and it didn't belong to them. Their Father was a Master Mason but had never a Knight. Well I'm Ready to start again. Thanks to all that helped me on my first leed..

Do you think he kept it secret from them?  I mean, the coincidence is pretty odd...this found with stolen goods...and them having had a burglary. Any possibility of finding out from the burglar where he picked the sword up, or whether or not he ever did a "job" in their area?

-Buckleboy

 

[possumheaded]

Well back to Square one. I spoke with the Daughter of the Robert M. Johns in Indiana and she had talked to her Mother Whose 92 and sharp as a tack and it didn't belong to them. Their Father was a Master Mason but had never a Knight. Well I'm Ready to start again. Thanks to all that helped me on my first leed..

Do you think he kept it secret from them? I mean, the coincidence is pretty odd...this found with stolen goods...and them having had a burglary. Any possibility of finding out from the burglar where he picked the sword up, or whether or not he ever did a "job" in their area?

-Buckleboy

The chances are high that the family did not know. Also you may want to inquire about the man being in the Scottish Rite of Freemasons instead of the York Rite as swords such as this one are used depicting the Knights Templar in the Scottish Rite. In reference to it being one used by the Tyler, I could be wrong(and have been before,Ha!) but most swords used by the Tyler are not as ornate and generally are made of wood symbolic of a sword.

Good Luck in finding what you are searching for.

Ed

P.S. 2B1ASK1

 

[possumheaded]

Here's some local links that might be helpful and may help guide you down the Rite path.

http://www.moyorkrite.org/

http://www.scottishrite-kcmo.org/

 

[jonnyrebel00]

Well back to Square one. I spoke with the Daughter of the Robert M. Johns in Indiana and she had talked to her Mother Whose 92 and sharp as a tack and it didn't belong to them. Their Father was a Master Mason but had never a Knight. Well I'm Ready to start again. Thanks to all that helped me on my first leed..

Do you think he kept it secret from them? I mean, the coincidence is pretty odd...this found with stolen goods...and them having had a burglary. Any possibility of finding out from the burglar where he picked the sword up, or whether or not he ever did a "job" in their area?

-Buckleboy

The chances are high that the family did not know. Also you may want to inquire about the man being in the Scottish Rite of Freemasons instead of the York Rite as swords such as this one are used depicting the Knights Templar in the Scottish Rite. In reference to it being one used by the Tyler, I could be wrong(and have been before,Ha!) but most swords used by the Tyler are not as ornate and generally are made of wood symbolic of a sword.

Good Luck in finding what you are searching for.

Ed

P.S. 2B1ASK1

The one our Tyler uses is not that pretty, but it is real and not wood. I have never paid any attention to any of the markings on it, but next meeting i will. So i would have to say it very well could have been used by the Tyler.

 

[possumheaded]

The one our Tyler uses is not that pretty, but it is real and not wood. I have never paid any attention to any of the markings on it, but next meeting i will. So i would have to say it very well could have been used by the Tyler.

It's nice to know that there are still Lodges that practice the old traditional ways. I think all should. Heck, in our Lodge and most that I have visited the Tyler doesn't bother with the sword let alone a wooden one unless something special is going on or they doing Degree work. I have been to a couple that still use a real sword but just as you said, they're weren't as pretty as this one and I've been to a few that use a wood one also.
I may come and visit your Lodge one day just to see how folks in ND do it. It's always interesting to visit other Lodges.
Anyway, it is possible it was used by a Tyler but the Tyler of a Blue Lodge would not have those particular symbols on it.
I'm sure if this guy had a son or grandson who was into Masonry they would love to have it. Good luck.

 

[SamN]

This is a great thread. Makes me want to talk to my grandpa.

 

[jonnyrebel00]

Hey Possum, let me know if you want to come up here and when. I have an extra room set up for company that you could use. We would be more than happy to have ya, even if just for a night. If you are into staying longer and your wife, if you are married, is in Star my wife could help out there. I am from Alabama, but have never gone there, so i dont know how things are done. But from what my father in law says Alabama is a real lax state from what he is used to. He was raised in Indiana and when he got to Alabama he was appalled at people wearing blue jeans and work boots. I dont now how yall are but i would be surprised to see that here myself. If you want to talk more shoot me a pm so we dont steal this persons thread.

Clay

 

[DJ_Quinn]

That's a great find, Masonic memoribilia is very collectable, (I have some myself). I think, for historical accuracy, that a few members have confsused the Midieval oder of the Knights Templar with the Masonic rank of Knight Templar. Although Feemasonery credits a connection to the Templars and the midieval caft guilds of Europe who built the Gothic cathedrals, the sword is from the Templar rank of speculative Freemasonery. BTW outlaw, although I live in Ireland, coincidentily a stones throw from an old (midieval, original) Knights Templar priori, I was born in Detroit, which has the largest Masonic hall in the US. My grandfather was a 33rd degree mason, a Shriner, who belonged to (the Detroit lodge. How's the detecting in Kzoo? All the best to you, that's a great find, and welcome to TNet!

 

[Rawhide]

Hi All,

Bringing a old thread to life. Hope some of you guys are still out there.

I may have found a old piece of a sword that matched a painting of a Templar. Now I its only a piece, its in bad shape and did not remove it.

Anyone have a pic of a 400 year old Sword? Thanks.

 

[bigjohn835]

Hi Bishop, I dont know how you ever made out with the sword, but I can tell you it is a Knights Templar sword. I'm not sure of the state, but the black handle is state specific as well as the shape of the guards. In Pa. the guards have triangles as well as the Malties Cross. Our handles are white. A silver scabbard is a general sword, where as a gold scabbard is a commanders sword. Good luck in your search. If you cant find the family, keep it. They aren't worth a whole lot, but do sell new for close to $600.00. Used about $100-$200. If you dont want it, donate it to your local Knights Templar Commandry. Most Masons can tell you where to find one.

 

[ShadowMKT]

Hi Bishop.
I read through this thread, never heard the final outcome though.
You should be commended for your efforts to return the sword to the family. While others are correct that they don't hold a lot of monetary value, the value of having a family members sword to a Masonic Knights Templar is immeasurable.
I would be happy to help you find more info. I have no problem saying I am a Master Mason and Masonic Knights Templar in the York Rite. As we are fond of explaining, we are a society with secrets, not a secret society.
Please reply if you still desire to search for the family of the Sir Knights sword you possess.
Thank you
Daniel