Input wanted from GPX and GPZ owners

[bcfromfl]

Hi everyone --

A few weeks ago, I purchased a used GPX4500. Because of a few, minor missing parts, I wasn't able to test it out stock before I sent it to Woody for his mods. I also ordered his signal booster/enhancer and compact batteries. I've got the machine back now, and trying to understand how to use it, and all the settings. I've got hundreds of hours under my belt with VLFs, but, as you know, this is COMPLETELY different. To say I'm a bit overwhelmed would be putting it mildly! I've read through the manual a few times, watched the DVD, and copied as much additional info off the web as I can find, including Steve H's instructions.

Anyway, if I could get a bit of input on the depth I'm getting on an air test, that would be helpful in at least letting me know I'm on the right track. With a Jefferson nickel and a Coiltek Elite 18" mono coil, I'm getting 24" with it basically on Deep and Normal. How does that compare with what you all can get with a large coil?

Also, I'm limited right now to testing in my yard as I learn how to use it. I've got nearby power lines giving me fits. In one direction they're about 50 yards away, and the other direction, about 100 yards. I can get it tuned and get repeatable signals, but what I'm wondering is if the electrical interference might actually overwhelm the potential of the circuitry to be as sensitive as it normally could be? I know it makes detecting faint signals challenging just because of the audio problem, but is there also a circuitry issue?

Thanks loads!

 

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[Chilli]

Could either of you explain to me exactly what you mean by "flat wound coils?" If I try to search, I can't come up with any satisfactory discussions, and no mention that I can find on manufacturer's websites. Above, I was just assuming you meant a mono coil, but now I'm not so sure.

Thanks!

Previously coils were winded bunched up. Like a round sausage style.
Late Nugget Finder did them a bit flattened like say a sausage that you pushed down on with a spatula. They were good.
Then both Nugget Finder and Coiltek got some info from a great guy here in OZ for doing fully flat winds, spiral winds. That guy is and was then deceased. All I can say is as a legacy his experiments were released.
He was not the pioneer of that type of coil but it was his info that lead to Coiltek and Nugget Finder making the Flat Wind coils. Detech followed suit.
Again, others experimented with them on the quiet doing real well.
The guy I say was not the founder of them with PIs but his rocked. He was a good friend.
They are absolutely awesome.

 

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[bcfromfl]

Thanks for the additional info, Chilli. I've watched all sorts of comparison videos of these coils. Do you have a favorite of the three, that stands out from the bunch?

 

[minerjosh]

OK...so, this is the description for the coil I purchased:

Description​

The Coiltek 18″ Mono Elite coil is compatible with the Minelab SD, GP and GPX series of metal detectors and has a new innovative mono configuration using LITZ wire and is super sensitive with excellent stability providing you with more depth!
This coil will give you maximum depth as it’s the largest of Elite Series Searchcoils.

• New innovative Mono size 18″ round (455mm) in diameter
• Suits the Minelab SD / GP / GPX detectors.
• Extremely sensitive and quiet in operation Sharp and bright response to targets
• Optimizes the SD, GP and GPX Minelab Metal Detector performance

I've had this coil and it's definitely for certain areas. I used it in areas with deeper ground and detected to death. (Not much trash left) And it will show you some deep bullets. you are going to scratch your head...how the hell did that get down there? Hope you have a nice big pick and a strong back

 

[bcfromfl]

Haha -- yeah, I bought one of those nice Apex ones with the three supermagnets! You're right, though, finding the best place to use it is a challenge, especially since I live in Florida and can't do very good research from a distance. I've already conceded that I'm going to have to "pay-to-play" on proven ground with a history of good targets...

 

[Chilli]

Thanks for the additional info, Chilli. I've watched all sorts of comparison videos of these coils. Do you have a favorite of the three, that stands out from the bunch?

My favourite was the NF 15 inch. Amazing all rounder. Deep on big targets and yet still ultra sensitive on small ones. It never ceased to amaze me at times. Like Minerjosh said, you scratch your head at times with some targets. I used to be able to go to totally flogged areas here in our Golden Triangle region with that 15" and still pull gold from them.

 

[bcfromfl]

Thanks again, Chilli, for your input. I checked several aftermarket coils, and the 15" NF you mentioned is the only one that mentioned "flat wound," even among the other Evolution coils in the line...which specifically say "spiral wound." That seems odd to me, why they would take one coil with a superior design and not replicate it to others.

 

[beekbuster]

I knew about the advantages of mono over DD, but you all talking about a flat-wound coil threw me for a loop. Do I just assume that all newer mono coils are flat-wound? Thanks!

Definitely gotta use the bungie for this coil! ;-)

Any of the new coils will likely have some advantage over 'old' coils. If theyre flat wound or not, I dont know. I have come to find it matters more how you use your detector than what detector you have in your hand. A guy with a gm1000 raided my spot that I cleaned out well enough to write it off. I decided to knock down a pile that was stacked but never processed. My last idea to squeeze a few more out before I write it off completely. Dude beat me to it, and Im sure he did well. I found 1 target and it was not gold.

 

[beekbuster]

My favourite was the NF 15 inch. Amazing all rounder. Deep on big targets and yet still ultra sensitive on small ones. It never ceased to amaze me at times. Like Minerjosh said, you scratch your head at times with some targets. I used to be able to go to totally flogged areas here in our Golden Triangle region with that 15" and still pull gold from them.

sdc is the same way. I can go to any 'cleaned out' spot and scratch gold for days, if it has never been covered with an sdc. My favorite machine by far.

 

[Chilli]

sdc is the same way. I can go to any 'cleaned out' spot and scratch gold for days, if it has never been covered with an sdc. My favorite machine by far.

Its great and I get you 100%. Know your detector, know your place, do It all right and you are in the drivers seat.
Good luck mate, 100% the right head space 😀👍

 

[oneguy]

sdc is the same way. I can go to any 'cleaned out' spot and scratch gold for days, if it has never been covered with an sdc. My favorite machine by far.

Ahhh....the SDC. When I got my 6000 and used it enough to see it's capabilities I was VERY impressed. The 6(000) will outperform the SDC in getting more depth and even smaller gold, fantastic ergonomics and it's one sensitive sob, period. So I was thinking I'll sell the SDC and put it up for sale but nobody wanted to pay my price and everyone was hyped up on the 6 at that time. What I'm getting at is as impressive as the 6 is, and it is, it can be a wild sob that needs a lot of noise cancels and extra coil control and even then the machine can get unstable. One day I was ready to head out to my spot(s) and just didn't feel like "fighting" with my 6 and basically just wanted to enjoy some sun and an easy pleasurable hunt. I KNEW my old SDC runs very stable in this particular ground so I took it out and talk about a nice STABLE no dickin around hunt and came home with 3 nuggies. So my SDC isn't going anywhere anytime soon. It'll be there when I decide I just want a nice enjoyable hunt instead of being way too serious and doing battle with the 6000 in the process. Like BB mentioned, I like my SDC, it ALWAYS runs stable. I also like the 6, it's very impressive. Both have their place in my arsenal........JMO

 

[bcfromfl]

oneguy -- you just confirmed my impression of the 6000 in the videos I've watched of it in operation...that it seems very unstable and difficult to tune correctly. I think Minelab is making a mistake moving towards the "consumer" end of the business, away from the serious hobbyist. Nothing wrong with that, but at least continue to offer a machine that offers the multitude of controls and coils like the earlier GPX's.

 

[oneguy]

oneguy -- you just confirmed my impression of the 6000 in the videos I've watched of it in operation...that it seems very unstable and difficult to tune correctly. I think Minelab is making a mistake moving towards the "consumer" end of the business, away from the serious hobbyist. Nothing wrong with that, but at least continue to offer a machine that offers the multitude of controls and coils like the earlier GPX's.

whoa.... apparently I gave you the wrong impression? The 6 is a VERY serious machine and really doesn't need a bunch of controls (geo sense whatever the hell that is...it works). It is a high strung machine but that is also why it is so good at what it was designed to do. I swung a gpx5000 and hated it from the first time I strapped myself onto the thing, headphone cords, battery cords, harness, bungee and all that crap getting hung up in the brush, etc. Sold that 5000 imediately. How many lifetimes would it take to actually LEARN and KNOW and EFFECTIVELY use all the different timings/settings on the 5000 to honestly get THE MOST performance outta it I'm 68, I don't have time for that crap at this stage? The 6000 ergonomics, along with the capabilities alone make the 6 a winner. It'll wake up old beat patches...no sheet! The 6 ergonomics will ad time to your hunt at the end of the day. It is a high strung touchy machine at times but you learn to deal with it, or put up with it, because the thing is so good at what it does. Sometimes I just want to hunt and not deal with stability issues, that's why I've decided to hang on to the SDC for those couple hunts where I don't feel like taking things so serious on that particular day? If you like simplicity (I do) both the SDC and the 6 are winners. Not a huge fan of PI's in general but to be fully rounded you need a PI and VLF. With that said, my beloved Goldmonster is my main weapon of choice that gets me most my gold......

 

[Lanny in AB]

whoa.... apparently I gave you the wrong impression? The 6 is a VERY serious machine and really doesn't need a bunch of controls (geo sense whatever the hell that is...it works). It is a high strung machine but that is also why it is so good at what it was designed to do. I swung a gpx5000 and hated it from the first time I strapped myself onto the thing, headphone cords, battery cords, harness, bungee and all that crap getting hung up in the brush, etc. Sold that 5000 imediately. How many lifetimes would it take to actually LEARN and KNOW and EFFECTIVELY use all the different timings/settings on the 5000 to honestly get THE MOST performance outta it I'm 68, I don't have time for that crap at this stage? The 6000 ergonomics, along with the capabilities alone make the 6 a winner. It'll wake up old beat patches...no sheet! The 6 ergonomics will ad time to your hunt at the end of the day. It is a high strung touchy machine at times but you learn to deal with it, or put up with it, because the thing is so good at what it does. Sometimes I just want to hunt and not deal with stability issues, that's why I've decided to hang on to the SDC for those couple hunts where I don't feel like taking things so serious on that particular day? If you like simplicity (I do) both the SDC and the 6 are winners. Not a huge fan of PI's in general but to be fully rounded you need a PI and VLF. With that said, my beloved Goldmonster is my main weapon of choice that gets me most my gold......

Oneguy, Sounds like you've run the 6000 enough to know its quirks/cons and its strengths. Seems like a winner from what you've said.

Glad to know you're still going to chase the gold.

Bcfromfl: Good luck with whatever you choose as I see you've had some good responses so far. I can't comment on the 6000, wish I could help.

All the best,

Lanny

 

[bcfromfl]

Thanks, Lanny. I wish I could accompany you on one of your adventures to the north! I've learned much from reading your stories over the years.

For now, I've conceded that I'll have to pay a pretty penny to have access to rare ground in Arizona. Unfortunately, I can't test my 4500 to my satisfaction anywhere near where I live (powerlines everywhere), so I'm going to have to learn fine-tuning in the field. It'll require four days total there and back in the car, too! The lengths I'm willing to go through to find something shiny I can roll around in the palm of my hand!

 

[oneguy]

I now see you have a 4500 and a Bug? That's a pretty solid combo and you'll have most all the bases covered. What little I used my 5000 my first impression was that the default settings worked pretty good, I just re-adjusted the threshold to my liking.

 

[oneguy]

Oneguy, Sounds like you've run the 6000 enough to know its quirks/cons and its strengths. Seems like a winner from what you've said.

Glad to know you're still going to chase the gold.

Bcfromfl: Good luck with whatever you choose as I see you've had some good responses so far. I can't comment on the 6000, wish I could help.

All the best,

Lanny

Lanny.... Hope you can get out this season? I should be able, hopefully, to get out in maybe 2 weeks? Right towards the end of last season with the 6 is when I really warmed up to the 6 once I started to understand it better from reading posts from other 6 users. Still got more to learn as I've only dug exactly 100 bits with the 6.....more to come this season. Towards the end of last season I got the machine to settle down pretty good but it does have it's moments....
Enough about the 6..... looks like BC has the bases covered pretty good already imo?
Take care Lanny and good luck in the upcoming...... and hope the fires aren't an issue AGAIN? Lost 10 days hunt time last season from fires but still had a good season although smokey.
S

 

[Lanny in AB]

Thanks, Lanny. I wish I could accompany you on one of your adventures to the north! I've learned much from reading your stories over the years.

For now, I've conceded that I'll have to pay a pretty penny to have access to rare ground in Arizona. Unfortunately, I can't test my 4500 to my satisfaction anywhere near where I live (powerlines everywhere), so I'm going to have to learn fine-tuning in the field. It'll require four days total there and back in the car, too! The lengths I'm willing to go through to find something shiny I can roll around in the palm of my hand!

A smaller coil should help with the EMI I'd think, and if not that, I think I recall some people using salt/anti-interference coils to help with bad EMI? I've not used them myself, but someone else can jump in if they have.

Four days travel to get to a sweet zone is some serious detecting dedication. I've not gone that far yet, only a couple of days travel in my outings, except for Alaska, but I flew to get there, and then took ground transport to get to the gold.

Here's wishing you the best and lots of success as you learn to tame your detector while you get it over some sassy gold,

Lanny

 

[bcfromfl]

I now see you have a 4500 and a Bug? That's a pretty solid combo and you'll have most all the bases covered. What little I used my 5000 my first impression was that the default settings worked pretty good, I just re-adjusted the threshold to my liking.

I purchased the GBP to use it in the Klamath River area, as I'm a member of The New 49ers. That was a massive failure...as the GBP was COMPLETELY unable to deal with the mineralization there. The best I was able to do was to take it out of all-metal and operate in discrimination mode, which was, frankly, pitiful. I think if I was in a more arid, desert setting, for example, it would have operated better.

That "education" was part of what convinced me to go PI. As I mentioned earlier in this thread, I'm totally OK with walking over crumbs, say, under 0.2 grams. It's entirely possible that the lower limit of the 18" Elite is about 0.5g, but I expect it should do a little better than that. I read a very interesting article comparing the SDC, GPX's, and the GPZ in an Aussie goldfield, over a weekend, and tallying the results. The SDC's gathered the most pieces, but the highest weight totals were recorded by the GPX and GPZ machines because they pulled up the deeper targets.

I wish I could test more, and, again, as I mentioned earlier, I didn't have a complete machine to test stock before I sent it off to Woody. So, I don't have a basis for comparison. I'm a little concerned about the lack of sensitivity for sub-gram targets, but Woody seems to think the circuitry is being overwhelmed by the powerlines, even though I seem to be able to get it reasonably tuned to a threshhold, albeit warbly. I'll just have to see how it does when I get to Arizona. Definitely not how I wanted to do things, but, oh well.

 

[leadnugget]

i had the 5000 (very similar to the 4500) for about a year and was just getting used to it and somewhat familiar
with most of the setting. i did some testing. i cant say for sure that i had all the setting at there best, but with the small sadie coil
i could hear a 2 to 3 grain bit. the Commander 10 inch? stock coil i think 4 grains.
i read on other detecting fourms of some guys getting smaller ones with the sadie but i couldn't do it with mine.
one thing i can think of is if you are using a mono coil make sure you dont have the rx cancel switch on.
i bumped mine on cancel somehow and was hunting for over an hour wondering how come there were no targets.
also get the bungee cord setup if you don't already have it, you will want it.
should be a good setup for finding .5 gram and up nuggets.
its just starting to get warm here, 94 tomorrow. if your going any time soon, make sure to have a LOT of water.
also the snakes are out of hibernation. saw the first one of the year last Sunday.

good luck out there.

 

[bcfromfl]

Thanks so much for your input, leadnugget! Very, very helpful to have that baseline info! Exactly the kind of info I was looking for!

I also have the 8" mono and 11" DD coil. The DD allowed me to practice a bit more, because I could switch into Cancel. Good tip about the Rx cancel! (Is that the same thing as the "Cancel" switch?)

Yeah, I've got the bungie...for sure! The smaller coils you can get away without it, but not that 18" beast!

Also, good tips about AZ! I've had multiple bouts with skin cancer, and am accustomed to dressing like an arab in the hot/humid Florida weather.

The coil is an automatic snake stick! ;-) I got an external speaker so I can hear surroundings better.