I got Hammered again...1562 Sixpence

[HomeGuardDan]

Got out with my good bud Bill D again today for a full day of digging. We are continuing to explore the new site we recently located. We have not been back since last weekend (I dug the Hammered Shilling and 1/4 reale, and Bill the Cromwell penny and cob).

It was perfect digging weather and the day did not disappoint. It started off a little slow at first as we hit the same area we had last weekend. However Bill located a nice coin (will let him share) and then just like the last time we dug here, I immediately followed with a coin of my own. First was the cut hispania silver, no date showing on it, but it is early to mid 1700s. After a while and a few more targets we decided to go back to section where the cob and the hammered coins were dug last weekend. Working slowly, I managed to pop out this sixpence that we had somehow missed. This one was a tower mint sixpence with a 1562 date and I must say, it made my day.

We grabbed some grub and then decided to get back at it, and I picked right up where we left off, digging the 23mm early militia button. (need some button help here, I know it is an early 1800s US militia, but I have never seen this exact style (with the extra large rim) no backmark).

Towards the end of the day we hit another spot on the property and dug a few more buttons, including my two piece Navy, and perhaps my most unique find of the day, the early matrix "wax" seal with the blue glass stone still embedded. This is an early one most likely from the 1700s, and it is too bad that the stone was broken. I can make out what looks to be the design of a castle or guard tower with a script letter. THis site has not just produced some early coins, there are some early buttons that have been found, and here are three that I dug today. My total take for the day was 26 buttons, 2 coins, a few bullets, and plenty of other colonial and early brass (broken shoe buckles, etc.)

Bill ended the day with a second nice coin, but again will let him post up what they are. We are having a blast at this site watching our research and willingness to explore pay off.

HH

Dan

 

Amazon Forum Fav 👍

Upgraded Night Vision Monocular Digital Infrared Monocular Telescope for 100% Darkness with 8X Zoom - Grab it through Amazon!

[matt092079]

Awesome hunt! Is it pretty rare to find a hammered coin here in the states or is it more "common" than I am thinking? I wouldn't know I just never see people finding a hammered coin here in the states, at least I haven't witnessed it yet on the board other than yours.

 

Amazon Forum Fav 👍

A Handbook of Civil War Bullets and Cartridges - Grab it through Amazon!

[HomeGuardDan]

Awesome hunt! Is it pretty rare to find a hammered coin here in the states or is it more "common" than I am thinking? I wouldn't know I just never see people finding a hammered coin here in the states, at least I haven't witnessed it yet on the board other than yours.

Matt, they are less common in my opinion than most ultra rare CS buttons and perhaps plates. i.e. I have been doing this since I was 13, have dug hundreds of period coins, and these were my first two hammered coins. I dug a CS tongue before I dug one of these gems. Not too rare over seas, but here in the states they are not easy to come by.

Dan

 

[screwynewy]

Congrats on another amazing hunt. I can imagine the excitement of just having the opportunity to hunt a site that gives up coins and relics of that quality. I hope you and Bill realize just how lucky you are. Not that research didn't have something to do with it.

 

[matt092079]

Matt, they are less common in my opinion than most ultra rare CS buttons and perhaps plates. i.e. I have been doing this since I was 13, have dug hundreds of period coins, and these were my first two hammered coins. I dug a CS tongue before I dug one of these gems. Not too rare over seas, but here in the states they are not easy to come by.

Dan

Thanks, Dan. That's what I thought. I'd be hitting that site HARD, as I'm sure you guys are. Congrats again.

 

[HISPAN]

Good Hammered and half Reale ...congrats !

 

[Steve in PA]

Great hunt Dan! Congrats on your second hammered silver, it's nicer than your first. I also like that early militia button, and of course the cut piece.

 

[joeyfresh]

Awesome job on another hammered. I am very intrigued by that wax seal. Do you have a link to read more on it??

 

[HomeGuardDan]

Awesome job on another hammered. I am very intrigued by that wax seal. Do you have a link to read more on it??

Joey,
Dont have a link on them, but am sure there are plenty out there. The stone is broken in half, not much more I can make off of it. I dug one years ago in NC that had an early crude bull on it and script letters.

Dan

 

[Sooper Dave]

That's an Amazing Hunt with some Incredible finds! There is a lot of history at that site, Great job on the recoveries!

 

[HomeGuardDan]

Great hunt Dan! Congrats on your second hammered silver, it's nicer than your first. I also like that early militia button, and of course the cut piece.

Thanks Steve,
I am glad this one has a date, and it looks like a 4pence (groat) actually after comparing it to the 6pence. The front is toast, can't make out a bust or anything, very worn as the last was, but will take it. The funny thing again was how it all occured. Just like the last time we took turns. Bill popped the copper out, and I was alongside him about 10' away and while talking to him about what he was digging while at the same time I was checking an iffy signal, out popped the cut coin. The hammered popped out just like the first one, stuck in the plug just looking back at me.

Dan

 

[CRUSADER]

Thanks Steve,
I am glad this one has a date, and it looks like a 4pence (groat) actually after comparing it to the 6pence. The front is toast, can't make out a bust or anything, very worn as the last was, but will take it. The funny thing again was how it all occured. Just like the last time we took turns. Bill popped the copper out, and I was alongside him about 10' away and while talking to him about what he was digging while at the same time I was checking an iffy signal, out popped the cut coin. The hammered popped out just like the first one, stuck in the plug just looking back at me.

Dan

There seems to be some confusion, you stated at the first post that the last coin was a Shilling, Bill stated you found a Sixpence. Now your not sure whether you have a groat or not. (some are heavily clipped)
Please provide pictures of them side by side & the diameter? I will clear it up.

 

[HomeGuardDan]

There seems to be some confusion, you stated at the first post that the last coin was a Shilling, Bill stated you found a Sixpence. Now your not sure whether you have a groat or not. (some are heavily clipped)
Please provide pictures of them side by side & the diameter? I will clear it up.

Sure...will take a pic today and post them up. Initially we thought the first one was a sixpence...then this one a groat...Bill did mention that the first one could be a shilling though heavily clipped. Thanks for the help. I will just post it to this thread.

 

[CRUSADER]

Sure...will take a pic today and post them up. Initially we thought the first one was a sixpence...then this one a groat...Bill did mention that the first one could be a shilling though heavily clipped. Thanks for the help. I will just post it to this thread.

Well, as far as I know there was no 1562 Groats, so its most likely a sixpence & so is the other unless its a cut down shilling (but these are thicker so should be easy to spot).

 

[Bill D. (VA)]

Well, as far as I know there was no 1562 Groats, so its most likely a sixpence & so is the other unless its a cut down shilling (but these are thicker so should be easy to spot).

I'm no expert by any means, but based on my experience it appears that both of Dan's coins are sixpences. The first coin is just too small (even with some clipping) to be a shilling. And like you said, no 1562 groats so the 2nd coin has to be a sixpence as well. Dan - you need to come check some of mine out as I think it would be very helpful to see your coins side-by-side some of mine.

 

[HomeGuardDan]

There seems to be some confusion, you stated at the first post that the last coin was a Shilling, Bill stated you found a Sixpence. Now your not sure whether you have a groat or not. (some are heavily clipped)
Please provide pictures of them side by side & the diameter? I will clear it up.

Here they are. The latest one is in the middle. I included a US quarter for size comparison. The one I dug Saturday is a little smaller than the quarter, the one I dug last week is a little bigger. Aside from the clipping around the edges, the inner rim and shield is significantly smaller. Thanks for any help, these are simply new to me over here.

Dan

 

[Bill D. (VA)]

View attachment 725764

Here they are. The latest one is in the middle. I included a US quarter for size comparison. The one I dug Saturday is a little smaller than the quarter, the one I dug last week is a little bigger. Aside from the clipping around the edges, the inner rim and shield is significantly smaller. Thanks for any help, these are simply new to me over here.

Dan

Wow - those do look quite a bit different when viewed together. I just looked at some of mine, and even though I do not have an Elizabeth I shilling I do have 3 from Charles I and they are much bigger than either of yours. But I'm not sure if that's a valid comparison or not. I was also looking in my book "English Hammered Coinage Vol 2" by North and saw where there was a 1st coinage (1558-61), a 2nd coinage (1561-82), and a 3rd (1583-1603). I'm wondering if the coin diameters varied slightly between these different coinages. Or could the smaller one be a silver 3 pence which my book shows as being minted during the 2nd coinage which matches up with the 1562 date.

 

[Bill D. (VA)]

I just pulled out all my Elizabeth I sixpences (7 of them), and measured the diameters. Four of them were unclipped and were all 26mm. Two others were 24mm and one was 25mm. I was reading in Wikipedia that 3 pence silver coins made after 1561 were all 19mm. So that might be the answer to your smaller coin. Check yours Dan and then maybe we can draw a conclusion. I'm also pasting some interesting info below from the same website that indicates the diameter of these coins varied.

"In later history, in order to increase the production of coins, hammered coins were sometimes produced from strips of metal of the correct thickness, from which the coins were subsequently cut out. Both methods of producing hammered coins meant that it was difficult to produce coins of a regular diameter. Coins were liable to suffer from "clipping" where unscrupulous people would remove slivers of precious metal since it was difficult to determine the correct diameter of the coin."

I found a pic comparing a Lizzie sixpence and a Charles I shilling that I dug, and there's a huge difference especially with the weight. The sixpence is 25mm in diameter and the shilling is 32mm. I can guarantee that neither of your coins is a shilling.

 

[JT1080]

Beautiful! Congrats!

 

[HomeGuardDan]

Bill,
Awesome stuff. I think we knew that the first coin was a sixpence...it is when I dug the last coin and saw the difference in size that I think the question came up. Will wait for Crusader to chime in. Either way still awesome coins!

Dan

 

[BuckleBoy]

Awesome hunt! Is it pretty rare to find a hammered coin here in the states or is it more "common" than I am thinking? I wouldn't know I just never see people finding a hammered coin here in the states, at least I haven't witnessed it yet on the board other than yours.

They are the rarest of the rare to find in the states. And just about the only place to find 'em is in Eastern Virginia.