How old are these?

[NGE]

I found these back in 1989 when I was hunting near the "Miller" cornfield, in Williamsport, Maryland. I know what they are for, but can these be from CW era? Or are they much more common than that? The shot size is roughly 5/16" diameter, there is a number 120 on the inside surface of one of the handles. It would seem to me that those handles would heat up rather quickly. They were approximately 6" deep in the red dirt (clay) Thanks for looking.......NGE

 

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[NGE]

One more.........NGE

 

[Baggins]

Bullet mold...pour in the hot lead, and out comes a ball...
Baggins

 

[dcinffxva]

I'd guess that it is either a .31, or .36 cal. roundball pistol mold. Best guess on age would be 1850-1860 vintage from the manufacturing style.

 

[trikikiwi]

It looks like a bloody good find to me NGE (T)

The handles weren't heated, so they wouldn't get too hot,
the lead was melted in another pot,
then poured into the mould.

Cheers, Mike

 

[NGE]

I know that the handles were not directly heated. But, my experience making jig heads for fishing or just melting spare lead into bars, I had to heat the mold to release the object being molded. Wouldn't the handles (being thin) heat up rather quickly also? Therefore resulting in hot hands, unless gloves were worn? Just my observation. I was, at one time going to try these out, but said myself.....NAW, leave 'em alone!.......NGE

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

Nice find. The mold looks kinda small. 5/16" diameter would convert to .31 caliber. I found an old mold about .36 caliber with shorter handles to get hot. It was suggested I melt something in it to measure the ball exactly. I never did figure out what the square end is for. http://forum.treasurenet.com/index.php/topic,65881.0.html

 

[Monty]

notgittenanny is correct, the molds were heated also. Otherwise the ball would shrink when it met the cold mold and would come out undersize. The mold also had to be completely grease or lubricant free or it would "pop" and spray molten lead all over the pourer. I would imagine they wore heavy leather gloves much like a blacksmith might wear. I can't imagine anyone carelessly pouring a molten metal without some kind of hand protection. If you don't want to pour hot lead into the mold, use plaster of paris and be sure to lube the mold so it won't stick. And conversly be sure to degrease the mold if you decide to pour hot lead! Monty

 

[ivan salis]

31 and 36 cal were both blackpowder era round ball pistol shot sizes -- once self contained 32 and 38 cal pistol cartridges came on the market after the civil war the 31 and 36 blackpowder pistols rapidly became a "thing of the past" -- so I'd say civil war era or close to it most likely .

most 31 and 36 cal cap and ball guns were drilled out and converted to 32 / 38 cartridge use in the 1870 / 1880 ish time frame --the 38 colt short is just one of the "switch over" cartridges used to convert - colts civil war era navy 36 cal cap and ball gun to a 38 cal "rimfire" cartridge weapon .-- boxer primer type centerfire type cartridges caught on a bit later on.

funny part is the gun barrels stayed the same and the bullet size was the same dia of course --- but due to the fact the shell casing holding made it larger in overall diameter the chambers had to be redrilled for the shells to "fit" in the cylinder -- its due to these shell casingsthat the 36 became the 38 and the 31 the 32. --- both which are still commonly used rounds today .

 

[Ray S S]

Hello NGE

You could also melt candle wax into the mold without heating the mold. Then heat the mold slightly to get it out if
you can do it without shrinking the size of the ball. With it greased it might not even have to be heated to get the ball out full size. It would be safer with the wax without the necessary precautions or expense of the alternatives.

Just a thought.

Bigcypresshunter,

On that mold of yours. Maybe they were used in pairs or more. That square end looks like it might be used to gently tap on another mold to help loosen the ball when it was ready to come out. Again just a thought.

Ray

 

[Charlie P. (NY)]

The "120" refers to the number of balls to the pound. That's an older way to measure bore size (12 gauge = 12 balls to the pound, 20 gauge = 20 balls to the pound, etc.). Liver Eating Johnson, in his autobiography "Crow Killer", states he carried a "thirty caliber"; that was actually thirty balls to the pound - 0.54" or 54 caliber in today's usage. In rifles 120 balls at 7,000 grains to the pound works out to 58.3 grains, which in pure lead gives a 0.339" ball, or 34 caliber. On odd size for sure. Could have been a rifle (aka "Squirrel Rifle" or Pennsylvania longrifle, Kentucky rifle, Tennessee rifle, etc.). A worn out 32 caliber would have been freshened and might have ebded up at that size. Barrels were soft iron and a new mold is a lot easier to make than a new barrel. Could also have been to cast "Swan Drops" for tossing nine to 12 at a time in a larger shotgun, or three in addition to a musket ball for a "Buck & Ball" load - used by pickets & sentrys in the Revolution and Civil War.

A company called "Rapine" was making molds identical to that one, side nipper and all, up to last year. That style has been in continual production somewhere from Colonial days to last year. Be very tough to date.

PS - I know fellows who use them - called "bag molds" as they are small enough to carry in the hunting bag - and they wrap the handles with leather lace to propect their hands. After a dozen balls cast they are way too uncomfortable to hold otherwise.

http://www.lasc.us/Brennan_GaugeWeight.htm

 

[NGE]

Well, I did what KarenRay suggested and poured some balls with red candle wax. I added some standard Daisy match BB's for size comparison, have a look-see...........NGE And if these are CW era, then that's what they would be, because I found them on the property of Springfield Farm in Williamsport, Maryland (Washington County) Where there were many skirmishes and battles fought all across their original 600 acres..........NGE

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

Well, I did what KarenRay suggested and poured some balls with red candle wax. I added some standard Daisy match BB's for size comparison, have a look-see...........NGE And if these are CW era, then that's what they would be, because I found them on the property of Springfield Farm in Williamsport, Maryland (Washington County) Where there were many skirmishes and battles fought all across their original 600 acres..........NGE

Do you have a caliper to measure the diameter?

 

[NGE]

Nope, but when cavity in mold was measured for dia. it was roughly 5/16th's of an inch. And there is a number 120 stamped into one of the handles........NGE

 

[ivan salis]

with the caliber and the area being civil war battlefield type area -- most likely CW era item.

 

[Woodland Detectors]

outstanding! I love how you used the wax for example...great history lesson

 

[BuckleBoy]

so this bullet mold was a barn find, then?


I am assuming that the mold is made of iron.

 

[ivan salis]

found in a cornfeild you say ? -- lost as they "broke camp" or ran into battle maybe ? what other items if any did you find near it?

 

[BuckleBoy]

"found in a CW area" does not a CW find make.  All sorts of small shot were used in the mid 19th c. for game hunting.  I have found many related items myself.  But this item is not a CW find.  Could be, but no way to know. And likely it is not. The piece is not marked or identified as USG or CSA.

 

[ivan salis]

the csa used lots of civilan items -- they were irregular troops after all for the most part * and used whatever they had on hand -- agreed with out a it being found in the grasp of a dead confederate soldier still in the remains of his tattered uniform --no way to "prove" it was civil war used. -- but it being FOUND on a civil war battlefield area and being of the type of item used to make shot for weapons of the time -- I feel safe it saying --it COULD have been civil war related * --BUT NOT 100 % SURE --YOU NEVER REALLY CAN BE -- UNLESS ITS A MARKED US / CSA ITEM. -- even then it could have been lost there "post war" -- as a military surplus item.